20 replies to this topic

[beez]

Hi folks,

I'm considering lyrica against anxiety. But lyrica has a real bad rep for dumbing you down and messing

with your memory. What do you guys say about this?

 

And how safe is lyrica? I read it can cause convulsions if you forget to take it.

 

And does it cause dependence,withdrawal or do you get used to the dose and then have to increase all the time?

 

If lyrica in fact dumbs you down then how quickly do you notice this? And how quickly does it wear off when you go off it?

 

Could you avoid this side effect by taking low doses of lyrica?

 

What's the smallest effective lyrica dose?

 

Lyrica is pretty intimidating.

 

 

Edited by beez, 01 May 2014 - 04:40 PM.

[adamh]

It is a stronger version of neurontin, often called morontin for the effects it has. I don't recommend it for anxiety unless you like the zombie effect during the day. You can get hooked on it I've heard though I only used it on occasion and had no problem. I would look into calming herbs, benzos are even worse in terms of addictiveness and long term side effects.

[beez]

Hello, that's not good. Does lyrica even work when you take it PRN? My doc said it needs to be taken all the time and also requires time to even start working. What kind of calming herbs do you mean? And isn't it a problem when you're taking herbs and at the same time also prescription antidepressants or benzos? Then you probably won't know if you can mix them or not.

[adamh]

There are lots of calming herbs such as kava, valerian root, ashwaghanda and others. They may interact with prescription meds. You could google something like "valerian plus lyrica" and see if anyone has reported bad effects from taking both together.

[beez]

I could try that but I'm not sure if not finding anything on google means it's safe to combine.

 

Are there no people who take lyrica and do well on it?

[Al Capacino]

I started Lyrica a month and a half ago.  Started on 150mg twice a day.  Just been put upto 225mg twice a day.  The purpose was to help control my anxiety along with initially mirtazapine which I stopped and subsequently made a few bad choices like quitting my job, then the downward spiral started as I thought I could live without anti-depressants.  It appears I cant.  Psychiatrist then put me on Trazodone and like I said upped the lyrica to 225mg twice a day.

 

Long story short there is an initial calming effect I get from Lyrica but within the hour I just feel calm and anxious at the same time which is a strange feeling!  I don't get much from it to be honest on its own.  Paired with Mirtazapine I did feel it had a more calming effect than taking Lyrica on its own.  It worked well for keeping the pain away when I had the motivation to go to the gym and play sports. 

 

So all in all its ok as I don't feel any side effects really or withdrawals when I don't take it.  I don't feel it causes any dependence on me because I have gone days without taking it and to be honest I'm not that bothered if I ran out tomorrow and didn't take it again.

 

[beez]

This sounds bad. Do you get any other side effects?

Are you going to get off it now?

[Al Capacino]

I don't seem to have any side effects that I notice anyway so in that regard if you fancy trying it you really have nothing to lose as there isn't any dependence or withdrawals that I have felt on and off it.  At the moment my Psych wants to keep me on it.  To be honest with the Trazodone I'm taking that i'm having a hard time with, the Lyrica is actually helping to stabilize my mood and anxiety a little bit from nosediving as I try to get used to Trazodone. Took some Kratom today though and its such a nice break it gives me from the negativity I normally feel.  Don't know what the consensus around here is on Kratom as I'm new to the forums but personally its a lifesaver when i'm struggling to get into gear with my meds!

[beez]

Is kratom safe when you're on prescription drugs?

[Al Capacino]

Never had a problem myself.  I think the only risks to kratom that are known is that it can affect the liver.  But what substance doesn't.  Even anti-depressants have that warning.  Just don't overdo the dosage, try to have a break every now and again from it for a few days and buy from a reputable place.  Cannibidoil, don't know if that's spelt right, also has a good calming effect but the only place I've found it for sale in the UK charge a fortune and it isn't pure.  So I don't buy it often due to the cost. 

[beez]

I'd be too afraid to mix herbs like kratom with prescription drugs. I'd not even dare to take kratom alone.

I mean who knows what kind of side effects herbs can have if they haven't been studied. That's the advantage of prescription drugs

they have at least been studied.

[Al Capacino]

Well I cant vouch for any scientific studies as there have not been many to my knowledge.  Although despite being native and illegal in Thailand in the south 70% of men chew on the leaf!  Also in that neck of the woods and parts of Indonesia its common to find people chewing on it to keep them going through the working day.  There doesn't seem to be any recorded deaths from it directly.  Only when combined with other substances.  I would hope some studies come out on it as I would be interested to hear what they say.  For all the studies of prescription anti-depressants they come with a list of side-effects as long as the arm and have caused more deaths than have been recorded with un-researched substances such as Kratom or even cannabis.  That's the way I look at things.  I am speaking as someone who has been on the magic "pill" round about for nearly 10 years.  Slowly moving into the realm of self-medication and giving up hope in the pharmaceutical/health industry providing me with relief as sad as it may sound.

[beez]

You mean you use kratom against depression and it cured it?

 

The problem which I see is what do you do for example if you self-medicate with unknown herbs like kratom and then you

need to take other drugs like betablockers,antibiotics and so on? then it's basically impossible to know if they can be combined or if there are interactions.

I'd be way too afraid to self-medicate with unstudied substances.

[Al Capacino]

Definitely not cured it. It's just relief from it that I use from time to time. Good for when times get too difficult or stressful to just knock me out of my mood and restabilize me. That's a point I never considered though about interactions with other meds should I ever need them one day, which am sure I will with the amount of heart disease in the family!!

[beez]

Where do you buy kratom? I mean can you even be sure that you get a pure and good quality?

 

For example if it's an extract how do you know if it's standarized so that you get the same amount every time?

[Al Capacino]

I buy from perfectkratom.co.uk
The link below is off their website explaining how kratom works and it's historic studies etc.

http://www.perfectkratom.co.uk/kratom-a-closer-look/[/url]

The fact of the matter is I don't know how pure the product is. I just go by who is known as a good reputable trader. These guys have always thrown in a sample or two with my orders.
As for extract, I don't touch them. That's where the biggest risk is when it comes to kratom. The pure leaf, maybe much harder work to take but it's much safer for long term use.
I've tried other vendors and the product has a similar effect each time.

It's a risk I take for a relief of sometimes crippling depression and anxiety where my prescription medication is not being effective. I don't have to worry about it's legality as it's perfectly legal. So if the pharmaceutical industry want to sit on the same types of medication of the last 50 years rather than bring out newer more effective treatments then more people will look elsewhere for relief, like I do.

Edited by Al Capacino, 23 May 2014 - 08:02 AM.

[Cal18]

This is an old post so I hope someone sees it... I have pretty bad tinnitus and hyperacusis and after trying many natural alternatives as well as prescription meds, I figured I would give this a try after some hesitation. Only took 25mg today (first dose) which gives me a slight grogginess. Would like to give it a fair try by moving up to 50mg over the next few days. My question is, what about Selegiline to counter some of the grogginess and improve concentration? I feel like they we would be a good match in terms of evening each other out - and the Lyrica would help with potential Selegiline insomnia. Let me know if anyone has any thoughts/comments on this. Thanks people.  

[Mind_Paralysis]

This is an old post so I hope someone sees it... I have pretty bad tinnitus and hyperacusis and after trying many natural alternatives as well as prescription meds, I figured I would give this a try after some hesitation. Only took 25mg today (first dose) which gives me a slight grogginess. Would like to give it a fair try by moving up to 50mg over the next few days. My question is, what about Selegiline to counter some of the grogginess and improve concentration? I feel like they we would be a good match in terms of evening each other out - and the Lyrica would help with potential Selegiline insomnia. Let me know if anyone has any thoughts/comments on this. Thanks people.  

 

Pregabalin (lyrica), against TINNITUS?

 

I honestly DON'T think it's a good idea to add Selegiline to counter the cognitive effects of Lyrica - I'd recommend you simply use an anxiolytic drug that DOESN'T f*ck with your cognition to the same extent.

 

On the other hand, you're using Pregabalin for Tinnitus? Never heard of this... it's not something I'm familiar with - what's the basis for this? What effects does it have? Is it simply similar to the effects on chronic neural pain? I.e it generally slows down every single type of signal, eventually slowing down the faulty aural signalling as well? Now that I think about it... I guess that's it - it's essentially the same thing as with chronic pain from nerve-damage.

 

I'd recommend you try Memantine instead - NMDA-antagonists have been proven to both have anxiolytic effects, but also effects on tinnitus.

 

Of course, Memantine will cause somewhat similar negative effects as Pregabalin at first - BUT... unlike gabapentinoids, it's not habit-forming, and the negative effects on cognition will go away after a while.

 

 

Another idea, after a quick look at hyperacusis - is that there's at least one theory which believes it's connected to errors within serotonergic networks - well, SNRI's have been dubbed as the most effective long-term treatment of Anxiety, and they also have an effect on chronic pain - so yeah, might want to consider DULOXETINE, yes?

 

Here's actually a random guy on a tinnitus-forum whom sings its praises:

 

https://www.tinnitus...sis.7189/page-2

[Cal18]

Pregabalin (lyrica), against TINNITUS?

 

I honestly DON'T think it's a good idea to add Selegiline to counter the cognitive effects of Lyrica - I'd recommend you simply use an anxiolytic drug that DOESN'T f*ck with your cognition to the same extent.

 

On the other hand, you're using Pregabalin for Tinnitus? Never heard of this... it's not something I'm familiar with - what's the basis for this? What effects does it have? Is it simply similar to the effects on chronic neural pain? I.e it generally slows down every single type of signal, eventually slowing down the faulty aural signalling as well? Now that I think about it... I guess that's it - it's essentially the same thing as with chronic pain from nerve-damage.

 

I'd recommend you try Memantine instead - NMDA-antagonists have been proven to both have anxiolytic effects, but also effects on tinnitus.

 

Of course, Memantine will cause somewhat similar negative effects as Pregabalin at first - BUT... unlike gabapentinoids, it's not habit-forming, and the negative effects on cognition will go away after a while.

 

 

Another idea, after a quick look at hyperacusis - is that there's at least one theory which believes it's connected to errors within serotonergic networks - well, SNRI's have been dubbed as the most effective long-term treatment of Anxiety, and they also have an effect on chronic pain - so yeah, might want to consider DULOXETINE, yes?

 

Here's actually a random guy on a tinnitus-forum whom sings its praises:

 

https://www.tinnitus...sis.7189/page-2

Thank you for your reply and taking the time to read my post. 

 

Agreed. Serotonin certainly plays a role and in my case and I got tinnitus from Celexa after tapering off and trying to reinstate after several months (the tinnitus came after a 2 month bout of horrible akathisia caused by the SSRI). Akathisia is dopamine blockade and dopamine also plays a role in tinnitus (how fun) - this is why I brought up Selegiline. It's something I've been considering for a while.

 

So serotogenics are off the table for me unfortunately. If anything, I will allow my brain some more time for receptors to recover and perhaps try nortriptyline. The reason I'm trying Pregabalin precisely with your reasoning above and because according a recent hyperacusis survey it was listed as being the most helpful (aside from Clonazapam). My tinnitus is also extremely reactive, the reactivity is "said" to be form of hyperacusis and I'm looking to tame this along with the electrical buzzing in my brain. Gabapentin, similar to Pregabalin is also commonly used for tinnitus (with varying results - as of course since nothing seems to work for the majority).

 

In addition, I recently had a qEEG reading performed which showed a thalamacortical dysrythmia in pain regions of my brain which might be fueling the tinnitus. So just another reason why I'm trying the Pregabalin - although a Calcium T-Channel blocker might be a better approach. 

 

I also agree with the NMDA approach which is why I recently went for a Ketamine infusion (yes, I'm pretty desperate). I'd rather be dumb than have tinnitus at this insane level. Since I might be sensitive, I started with a lower dose (a little less than half of a normal infusion). It had no impact but I'm open to trying it again at a higher dose - just wanted to test the waters first. I was starting to try Memantine at a very low dose with the intention of titrating up but stopped. I was feeling kind of weird and depressed but I'm not sure if it was from that which is why I opted for Ketamine instead.

 

I only took 25mg of Pregabalin and was considering only going up to 50mg and that's it. So far, I don't think it impacted my cognition too much or at all perhaps because the dose is so low. I am however concerned about its habit forming potential... So with all that background info I really thought the low dose Pregabalin and Selegiline might make good friends.   Any more info/insight is always appreciated. Thanks!

Edited by Cal18, 10 June 2018 - 02:10 AM.

[BlueCloud]

I take Pregabalin on and off for anxiety and insomnia. At the lower doses that you're taking, the impact on cognition can be very low indeed, and in fact quite a few people find themselves thinking better ( heard many programmers with anxiety say this ) not worse. This tends to reverse as you up the dosage, as well as introduce  possible sleepiness.

About the habit forming potential, there seems to be a certain risk as reported anecdotally, although , if the dosages used are not super high, it seems easy to get off it by lowering gradually over the course of a month.

I personally didn't find it habit forming but I did find tolerance building very quickly, sometimes over the course of 2 or 3 days. I always cycle it, I usually take a break of a couple of days after 3 days or so of use, and that solves the tolerance issue for me.

Another possible side-effect is severe constipation, although unlikely at the dosage you're taking ( I take up tp 350 mg a day at times )

Edited by BlueCloud, 11 June 2018 - 12:03 PM.

[Cal18]

I take Pregabalin on and off for anxiety and insomnia. At the lower doses that you're taking, the impact on cognition can be very low indeed, and in fact quite a few people find themselves thinking better ( heard many programmers with anxiety say this ) not worse. This tends to reverse as you up the dosage, as well as introduce  possible sleepiness.

About the habit forming potential, there seems to be a certain risk as reported anecdotally, although , if the dosages used are not super high, it seems easy to get off it by lowering gradually over the course of a month.

I personally didn't find it habit forming but I did find tolerance building very quickly, sometimes over the course of 2 or 3 days. I always cycle it, I usually take a break of a couple of days after 3 days or so of use, and that solves the tolerance issue for me.

Another possible side-effect is severe constipation, although unlikely at the dosage you're taking ( I take up tp 350 mg a day at times )

 

Thanks. I thought it was just me but I did find myself thinking clearer and in a more "linear" fashion. I'm also a designer/developer, - weird that you pointed that out that specific profession! I will probably go up to 50mgs (25mg in the AM and 25mg at night). Great info, thanks again.