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Please help me figure out my brain (DNA testing results included)

depression dysthymia adhd social anxiety motivation

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#1 stewedsauerkraut

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Posted 12 March 2018 - 03:56 PM


Longecity seems to have a reputation for having smart people on here and so I turn to you to ask for help in figuring out what's wrong with my brain. I value your time so I'll try to be as brief as possible.

 

Problem: Low-ish mood (not persistent, comes and goes), irritability, lack of motivation, lack of interest in socializing (I want to be social but can't bring myself to care), and I find it challenging to stick with a task for a long time - I used to get very average grades in school, got easily bored in class and left homework for last minute and then did the bare minimum.

 

I've been evaluated by a psychiatrist who found mild social anxiety but I could've told him that and that's not something I'm concerned with right now. Family physician had me do a quiz on ADHD and depression and at best she said I could have low grade depression/dysthymia.

 

Things tried:

 

Ongoing: Weightlifting at least 3x a week, 2000 IU/daily vitamin D, meditation when I can bring myself to do it. Last annual physical came back clear.

 

20mg Paxil for about 9 months - first few weeks were great but my psychiatrist called it the honeymoon period. Felt very empathetic which is unlike me, social, and generally happy. That subsided and I was left feeling just content. Decided to go off it because of sexual side effects.

 

50mg Zoloft for a few months - can't say I noticed much of a difference except for sexual side effects.

 

2x600mg NAC - felt mood stabilizing effects but developed a bad case of heartburn which lasted for 3 or 4 days so I dropped it.

 

2x1600mg Piracetam - slight reduction in overall anxiety and a decent energy boost for a few hours after administration.

 

300mg KSM66 Ashwagandha (tried 2x300mg as well but a few weeks later I started noticing intermittent thyroid discomfort/pain so I lowered the dose to 300mg) - helps with stress and anxiety but nothing earth shattering.

 

250mg L-theanine with a cup of coffee - temporarily removes coffee jitters and lowers anxiety.

 

High dose EPA/DHA omega 3 - didn't notice any difference except for maybe a feeling of "brain fog".

 

3.5g Psilocybin trip - no profound effects, mainly just made me appreciate "sanity".

 

 

What to make of all this? I have a steady job, I exercise, but unless something dramatically changes I feel like I'll just coast through life never amounting to much. For the life of me I can't find the motivation to improve myself - to socialize, to read a lot, learn programming, etc.

 

I've attached genetic genie and nutrahacker results in case anyone's interested. Thank you for reading this wall of text!



#2 hydrus

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Posted 12 March 2018 - 07:54 PM

have you checked low T and thyroid?

 

dysthymia/ADHD can be due to low dopamine. You could try Wellbutrin or Tyrosine for that.


Edited by hydrus, 12 March 2018 - 07:57 PM.


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#3 stewedsauerkraut

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Posted 12 March 2018 - 07:55 PM

have you checked low T and thyroid?

Hey hydrus! Thanks for the reply. And yes, thyroid is supposedly in normal ranges and testosterone on the high end.



#4 jack black

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 10:32 PM

Have you considered cyclothymia or bipolar 2?

That reaction to Paxil could have been hypomania episode. research those and come back.



#5 hydrus

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Posted 14 March 2018 - 09:07 AM

Have you considered cyclothymia or bipolar 2?

That reaction to Paxil could have been hypomania episode. research those and come back.

 

these days it seems everything that is not explained by depression is hypomania. It is very common that people self-diagnose with hypomania, because they are bit euphoric, aggressive,moody or perhaps not depressed. Everyone claims to experience periods of "hypomania" these days. 

 

I do not think that mood instability and bipolar are the same thing as least they used not to historically. That does not mean that mood stabilizers can not help.

 

I think normally hypomania is not just feeling good but having very rapid speech so that others are unable to follow your train of thought, no or very little need for sleep,, disinhibition, tons of unusually high energy etc. Generally very abnormal behaviour that is obvious to outside observers.

 

Mania is more like you think you are the next Jesus and you hear god talking to you.

 

 

20mg Paxil for about 9 months - first few weeks were great but my psychiatrist called it the honeymoon period. Felt very empathetic which is unlike me, social, and generally happy. That subsided and I was left feeling just content. Decided to go off it because of sexual side effects.

 


Edited by hydrus, 14 March 2018 - 09:09 AM.

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#6 stewedsauerkraut

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Posted 14 March 2018 - 01:45 PM

Have you considered cyclothymia or bipolar 2?

That reaction to Paxil could have been hypomania episode. research those and come back.

I've done a bit of research on mental illnesses, including bipolar, and I doubt it. My psych asked me questions along the lines of spending habits and grandiose thoughts (bipolar signs), after I told her I felt way more social and just happier in general for the first 2 weeks on Paxil. But then she dismissed the thought and called it an SSRI honeymoon period, where my brain got flooded with seratonin. I don't have crazy mood swings or other symptoms that would fit bipolar.


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#7 Boopy!

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Posted 20 March 2018 - 09:02 PM

I used to think it was all  black and white with hypomania.   I was taught that it is the exact opposite of what you say above -- that it is obvious.   Mania can appear all along a spectrum,   and here are some examples that are not extreme:

 

Brief surges of anger at small things

Going from very sad to very happy rather quickly,  although it may not be noticable or obvious

Temper tantrums

 

You may not have the kind of mania where you think the President is intelligent or that he is your daddy,   but you still can have turbulent mood swings that are considered "bipolar."   This is why Lamictal --  which stabilizes moods -- is sometimes added to an SSRI.   Supplements have NEVER done a damn thing for me,  but I'm still hoping and waiting for all these years of high priced powders will kick in.   You're at least lucky to notice some effect,  ANY effect at all.


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#8 hydrus

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Posted 20 March 2018 - 09:21 PM

I used to think it was all  black and white with hypomania.   I was taught that it is the exact opposite of what you say above -- that it is obvious.   Mania can appear all along a spectrum,   and here are some examples that are not extreme:

 

Brief surges of anger at small things

Going from very sad to very happy rather quickly,  although it may not be noticable or obvious

Temper tantrums

 

You may not have the kind of mania where you think the President is intelligent or that he is your daddy,   but you still can have turbulent mood swings that are considered "bipolar."   This is why Lamictal --  which stabilizes moods -- is sometimes added to an SSRI.   Supplements have NEVER done a damn thing for me,  but I'm still hoping and waiting for all these years of high priced powders will kick in.   You're at least lucky to notice some effect,  ANY effect at all.

 

sounds more like mood instability or mood swings than bipolar, of course mood stabilzers do not care what your diagnosis is.

 

mood regulation problems do not just happen in bipolar, they can be  a feature of borderline, schizo-affective disorder, autism, personality disorders etc.


Edited by hydrus, 20 March 2018 - 09:24 PM.

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#9 Boopy!

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Posted 20 March 2018 - 10:36 PM

sorry I meant just mania  (hypo mania means low and hyper means HIGH.)   There are different kinds and manifestations of bipolar,  but you do not have to be extreme to be considered bipolar.   There is a great study conducted by Nora Volkow at U of Penn I remember reading years and years ago.  One kind of bipolar does indeed have certain attributes of schizophrenia  --  while another is barely discernible (to me anyway)  from most depression.   These are all just labels of course,  but I always wanted to be specifically diagnosed in order to figure out a cure.   Never did get a real answer.   Hopefully you can.

 

That being said,   you sound right when you say it's the initial reaction to an SSRI.   I only WISH I could have had that!   One friend said she almost felt she was on ecstacy.   Oh well.



#10 Jason Burns

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Posted 21 March 2018 - 05:33 AM

First I guess is to clearly identify what is the problems.  From the sounds of it you don't have much motivation(in terms of the state where you want something badly and sitting doing nothing is harder than working towards what you want - not in terms of some bs stuff about trying to change your thoughts.. I am talking on a biological/chemical level here, where we can cause actual change can happen).  In addition you seem to lack the reward mechanisms the releases upon hitting minor objectives towards goals you have.  This makes it so you are not able to become addicted to whatever it is you want to get into.  For example, learning programming.

 

When you start doing something like reading a book you want to, are you able to 'get into' reading the book.  Like do you remember as a kid when you got into a video game or something, how you could sort of fall into it and not realize the time going by?

 

Also what is your concentration like on things you have to do.  Like while writing a test do you have problems focusing on the questions.

 

 



#11 stewedsauerkraut

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Posted 21 March 2018 - 12:57 PM

First I guess is to clearly identify what is the problems.  From the sounds of it you don't have much motivation(in terms of the state where you want something badly and sitting doing nothing is harder than working towards what you want - not in terms of some bs stuff about trying to change your thoughts.. I am talking on a biological/chemical level here, where we can cause actual change can happen).  In addition you seem to lack the reward mechanisms the releases upon hitting minor objectives towards goals you have.  This makes it so you are not able to become addicted to whatever it is you want to get into.  For example, learning programming.

 

When you start doing something like reading a book you want to, are you able to 'get into' reading the book.  Like do you remember as a kid when you got into a video game or something, how you could sort of fall into it and not realize the time going by?

 

Also what is your concentration like on things you have to do.  Like while writing a test do you have problems focusing on the questions.

My concentration.. could be better but I'd say it's decent? Don't think I have issues writing tests (been a few years), but I'll give you a couple of other examples.

 

If I'm REALLY into a great book, I can read about 40-50 pages before getting tired. Not because the story isn't interesting, but because I start getting fatigued and want to do something else. Boring books on the other hand are like pulling teeth. Maybe 10 pages before I start losing focus and sometimes have to reread the same page. But either way my recall isn't the greatest.

 

Conversation wise I've been told I'm a good listener and I think my focus is good but I'm rarely if ever able to have long conversations. The length varies but there pretty much always comes a point where I start to get tired and want to do something else.

 

Edit:

 

 

That being said,   you sound right when you say it's the initial reaction to an SSRI.   I only WISH I could have had that!   One friend said she almost felt she was on ecstacy.   Oh well.

 

Your friend she felt like she's on ecstasy from an SSRI? Never taken MDMA but my first 2 weeks weren't THAT great lol. Just imagine being happy and very social and empathetic. That's how I felt before dipping down to a little above what was my baseline was, minus social anxiety. There was no depression after the initial effects wore off 2 weeks later, like you'd find in bipolar.


Edited by stewedsauerkraut, 21 March 2018 - 01:01 PM.


#12 Nate-2004

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Posted 21 March 2018 - 06:07 PM

The three main things are regular exercise, nutrition (high fiber from nuts, seeds, lentils, greens, apple pectin, berries) and especially last but not least, sleep quality.  If you need help see my guide.

 

Aside from that try boosting your BDNF by adding 20 mins in an 80c sauna 4 to 5 times per week, try adding more aerobic exercise, a longer bout of low intensity endurance exercise especially boosts BDNF.


Edited by Nate-2004, 21 March 2018 - 06:09 PM.

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#13 stewedsauerkraut

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Posted 21 March 2018 - 06:37 PM

Thanks to everyone who's contributed so far! I was going through my promotheus results today and these genes stood out:

 

rs4680(G;G) (warrior) multiple associations, see details
rs6323(T;T) reduced MAOA activity
 
I might be reading too much into this and these are obviously just select few genes that are a part of a much, much bigger puzzle, but maybe low dopamine is to blame. 


#14 Nate-2004

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Posted 21 March 2018 - 07:51 PM

Yeah rs4680 G;G means high COMT and thus lower dopamine levels. You may want to add some EGCG in the morning on an empty stomach, 600mg chocolate extract to your morning coffee, get some vitamin B6 and also add some lithium orotate. This will at least create a situation where optimal dopamine levels can be produced. Outside of that, rhodiola helps a little.  Take a B-Complex (Doctor's Best is the best formulation) 3 days a week perhaps.

 

Try 200mg modafinil every 4 days.

 

Also, again, add the sauna and increased aerobic activity.


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#15 stewedsauerkraut

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 12:44 PM

Yeah rs4680 G;G means high COMT and thus lower dopamine levels. You may want to add some EGCG in the morning on an empty stomach, 600mg chocolate extract to your morning coffee, get some vitamin B6 and also add some lithium orotate. This will at least create a situation where optimal dopamine levels can be produced. Outside of that, rhodiola helps a little.  Take a B-Complex (Doctor's Best is the best formulation) 3 days a week perhaps.

 

Try 200mg modafinil every 4 days.

 

Also, again, add the sauna and increased aerobic activity.

I looked into EGCG but it appears that there isn't any conclusive evidence that it actually inhibits COMT in vivo studies. Might still give it a shot but in the meantime I'll just drink organic green tea twice a day. Haven't looked into research behind dark chocolate but it's supposed to be good for you so maybe it's time to stock up.

 

Recently ordered methylated b9/b12 which also has a small amount of b6 so it'll be interesting to see if I notice any difference in my moods. Lithium orotate is on my "maybe I should give this a try" list too.

 

Definitely adding cardio to my workouts and I'll see if I can get access to a sauna. There's SOME around town but it's not like in Europe.

 

As for modafinil, I actually recently gave it a try, both 100mg and 200mg, and all they did were ruin my day. I felt tired, irritated and just cranky in general. I don't know if it's a bad batch or it's just simply not for me but I'm hoping to give another generic brand a shot soon to see if it's really me or just the brand I tried.

 

Thanks again!

 

Edit: Forgot to mention, I had tried rhodiola in 250 and 500mg doses, 250mg not doing anything and 500mg making me feel super out of it. I couldn't really place my finger on it but it felt like something was wrong. Maybe spacey, I think there was slight nausea too. I was also taking ashwagandha at the time too so maybe there was an interaction between the 2.


Edited by stewedsauerkraut, 22 March 2018 - 12:51 PM.


#16 world33

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 03:30 AM

For the rs1801131 (MTHFR A1298C) mutation you might consider methylfolate.

Read this https://www.selfhack...ealth-benefits/

You might consider to try the full version of nutrahacker and, even better, the selfhacked platform to interpret your 23andmme.com raw data. Livewello is also worth considering.


Edited by world33, 30 March 2018 - 03:44 AM.


#17 Clavius

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Posted 09 February 2019 - 06:04 AM

Yeah rs4680 G;G means high COMT and thus lower dopamine levels. You may want to add some EGCG in the morning on an empty stomach, 600mg chocolate extract to your morning coffee, get some vitamin B6 and also add some lithium orotate. This will at least create a situation where optimal dopamine levels can be produced. Outside of that, rhodiola helps a little.  Take a B-Complex (Doctor's Best is the best formulation) 3 days a week perhaps.

 

Try 200mg modafinil every 4 days.

 

Also, again, add the sauna and increased aerobic activity.

 

Why was the above post marked as dangerous and irresponsible? I'm interested because I have the exact same combination as the OP:

 

rs4680(G;G) (warrior) multiple associations, 3 repeats
rs6323(T;T) reduced MAOA activity
 
I've been suffering from major procrastination and bad motivation for all of my life. Which only worsens when circumstance aren't completely the way I love them. I think raising a possible low dopamine level could help. But the rs6323(T;T) has me confused.


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#18 Hip

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:03 AM

In terms of a possible explanation of the low-ish mood, irritability, lack of motivation, lack of interest in socializing, there is a persistent virus going around which affects the brain and can cause these symptoms. Myself and over 30 friends and family caught this virus back in around 2003. The general chronic mental symptoms caused by the virus are:

 

mild anhedonia

emotional blunting

people  become less inclined to socialize

 

For further details, please see the section entitled "What permanent symptoms does this virus precipitate in most people?" of my website which describes this virus. 

 

I've written to numerous virologists to try to alert them to this virus, but unfortunately it is hard to convince people.

 

My virus has very similar symptoms to the new Chinese HIV-like virus.


Edited by Hip, 10 February 2019 - 05:06 AM.






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