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Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil


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14 replies to this topic

#1 hippo

Posted 12 May 2007 - 12:23 AM


I just like to give a help to my otherwise poor learning focus, that helps my language learning.

I ordered Modafinil (not received yet, never tested), and yesterday I bought Piracetam in a shop. The former one is sort of controlled substance, the 2nd one is just a food supplement which may can be bought in a supermarket.

Both are supposed to have a positive affect on learning (I am aware that Modafinil is primarily designed as a anti sleeping pill). Has anyone tested both? How do they differ?

#2 luv2increase Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

  • Location:Ohio

Posted 12 May 2007 - 02:21 AM

I am studying spanish right now pretty intensely, and piracetam one of many among my supplement arsenal. I can tell you that it is much easier for me to memorize vocab and verbs. Also, I am becoming more and more fluent by the day. I believe that piracetam is enabling me comprehend and conversate in spanish very well. Granted, I took 3 years in high school and 3 quarters in college, but now that I am self-learning "the rest", it is all coming together quite nicely. I attribute this to piracetam and its inter-hemispheric effects. I have never tried modafinil. Piracetam provides me with extreme focus and an unreal ability to memorize though. I can rule out the effects of other supplements because last year I did a stint with only piracetam and alcar and the same results.

Just experiment with them both and see what you think.

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#3 hippo Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

Posted 12 May 2007 - 06:21 AM

luv2increase
Thanks for the feedback. My situation is nearly identical, only that I try to tackle Mandarin Chinese.

What doses you take and how often? You take it reguarly or just when you learn?

#4 ikaros Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

Posted 12 May 2007 - 10:06 AM

IMO piracetam works only if you have some underlying issue clouding your cognition. Suprahuman memory - no, not really, actually not at all. And watch out, it can make some people grumpy.

#5 luv2increase Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

  • Location:Ohio

Posted 12 May 2007 - 03:26 PM

IMO piracetam works only if you have some underlying issue clouding your cognition. Suprahuman memory - no, not really, actually not at all. And watch out, it can make some people grumpy.


That is exactly right IYO. Are you trying to say that what I experience is an illusion of my imagination? I am assuming that you are one that didn't get much results out of piracetam. You attribute this to not having "some underlying issue clouding your cognition". You finally conclude that it is junk to those without any amoralities of the brain. Save it for a rainy day. I am saying that it works just as many others have stated. I am not saying that it works for everyone though. You may just be an unfortunate case. Also, you may not have taken the right doses with the right amount of choline for a long enough period of time.


To the thread starter,

I take 1.2-1.6 g of piracetam 3 times a day 4-5 hours spaced out between dosages. I take around 1.5-2.1g of choline bitartrate with my breakfast. I would also add some acetyl-l-carnitine to the mix, around 1-3 g a day.
The main thing is, as I tell everyone, that you will have to adjust the dosages. The dosage, I believe, have a whole lot to do with the end-product you will experience. Ikaros may not have put enought time and dedication into the situation, thus receiving nill results. I have yet to experience any signs of grumpiness whatsoever also. Superhuman memory? Well, just as a little marker of results, I've been periodically tested my digit span on the braingle site. I'm up to 14 now. That would equate me will twice the average of your average joe.

Good luck!

#6 wild2side Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

Posted 12 May 2007 - 09:46 PM

I've struggled with piracetam for almost a year now.. trying all sorts of doses, by itself or with other noots, morning or night, and in the end, i have to say that piracetam did NOT improve my cognition. It mostly gave me a headache and made me feel agitated.

however... for me, modafinil (Modiodal brand) works!!! Even with a 50mg dose.

#7 luv2increase Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

  • Location:Ohio

Posted 12 May 2007 - 10:14 PM

I've struggled with piracetam for almost a year now.. trying all sorts of doses, by itself or with other noots, morning or night, and in the end, i have to say that piracetam did NOT improve my cognition. It mostly gave me a headache and made me feel agitated.

however... for me, modafinil (Modiodal brand) works!!! Even with a 50mg dose.



I must say that I am amazed that you tried different dosages for a whole year to no avail! That may be the definition of insanity???

#8 sentinel Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

  • Location:London (ish)

Posted 12 May 2007 - 10:30 PM

You're comparing apples with oranges. Mod is a selective impact stimulant that makes people feel edgy through to focused, immediate effect with either consistent or diminishing returns.

Pir is in 95% of cases subtle and background (many notice nothing from 800mg to 8 grams a day), helps with lateral thinking and overall cog function and some aspects of short and long term memory. Very individual.

Modafinil - stimulant that all notice the effects from, some like some don't.

Piracetam - Subtle cog enhancer that some notice some don't (I do as it happens).

#9 wild2side Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

Posted 12 May 2007 - 10:34 PM

luv2increase: well.. at first i used 2400mg a day.. that didnt work, so i stopped. Then a couple of months later, i tried a smaller does. Didn't work again, put it aside for a month or two, then tried smaller dose. ANyway, you get the point. I'm a researcher at heart, so i don't stop abruptly when i don't find the result i had hoped for.. i keep trying.

However, your remark, that is, associating me with being insane, and your general attitude to anyone who's view differs from yours, is quite childish.

Take care [thumb]

#10 luv2increase Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

  • Location:Ohio

Posted 12 May 2007 - 10:53 PM

I said your action of taking piracetam for a year expecting a different results is insane. You didn't specify that you had periods of abstinence from piracetam in your post. Next time, be more specific. If you would look-up the definition of insanity, you will see that what you had "first" written with regards to your piracetam experience would most definitely fit the criteria of insanity.

Since your first post was not the whole truth, how many consecutive days of use have you accomplished in your longest stretch with piracetam? Also, since you are "a researcher at heart", why hadn't you used a higher dose than only 2400mg?


edit: I found this on one of your previous posts.

Im experiencing a bit of a dilema. I've recently began supplementing with Piracetam (using pharmacutical grade Nootropil) and Alpha GPC (AOR). I started 1.6g twice a day and quickly moved down to 1.2g twice a day. My frist 6 or 7 days on this regime was great! I felt very talkative and focused.
However, due to certian circumstances, i didnt take my daily doses of piracetam and choline for 2 days. After those 2 days, i returned to supplementing, but the effects are nothing like they were before. Now i find talking to be difficult, my concentration is very poor, and generally i just feel "weird".


Why didn't you explain that "at first" everything was great with piracetam, had a 2 day break, went back to it and felt "weird"? Instead, you wrote that you got nothing from piracetam, when in fact, at first it was great and then you felt weird after a 2 day break. Try to be honest when you post.

On a more serious note. How is your cognitive decline? Are you still noticing it? Did you see a doctor about it? If you are not experiencing it anymore, how did you go about combating it?

Thanks.

Edited by luv2increase, 12 May 2007 - 11:25 PM.


#11 wild2side Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

Posted 13 May 2007 - 02:06 AM

your first post was not the whole truth


i apologize, you are right about the initial benefit. However, please don't try to discredit my words by claiming that im a liar simply because i hadn't mentioned that piracetam "felt" like it was doing something the first week. That was a long time ago and the only time i felt any benefit. Ever since then, taking it would create more problems than improvement. So in general, and I say this in confidence and without any prejudice towards the drug, piracetam did NOT improve my cognition. Whether its because one shouldn't abstain from it once on it, I really don't know.

why hadn't you used a higher dose than only 2400mg?


It made no sense for me to try a higher does if a lower one resulted in so many negative side effects. The only time i could stand it for longer than 3 days is on a 400 mg/day dose.


How is your cognitive decline? Are you still noticing it? Did you see a doctor about it?


My doctor was not even willing to help, for he claimed he did not see any marked deficits in my cognition. All he could suggest was an SSRI.

In the end, the only thing that is able to help on a consistent basis is modafinil.

#12 hippo Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

Posted 31 May 2007 - 05:15 AM

Just an update on the learning issue:

I still take some Piracetam. I don't feel any effect when it comes to learning. 3x800mg per day is a bit much, specially the last one makes me dizzy. If I cut down to 400mg for the last dose it's still ok.

Anyway, in the meantime my Modafinil (Modalert) arrived. It's the 200mg version.

I cut them into 4. A 50mg dose works very well to remove the afternoon brain fog. Here some notes:

50mg seem to be fully sufficient for me to keep me alert.
50mg in the late morning still make me a bit too alert at night in bed, it's harder to get to sleep.
100mg give me a slight headache (tried only once), but since 50mg work well I see no need to increase dose
As a learning aid I can't see much improvement.

Is there any special way to use Modafinil as a learning aid? Or is my dose too low?

#13 luv2increase Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

  • Location:Ohio

Posted 31 May 2007 - 05:33 AM

Dizzy? Are you forgetting to supplement with a choline source along with your piracetam? Which brand is it?

#14 hippo Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

Posted 31 May 2007 - 06:22 AM

It's some sort of local brand from China. So what's a choline source?

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#15 rebuild101 Re: Learning aid: Piracetam vs. Modafinil

Posted 31 May 2007 - 03:40 PM

hippo, Choline is usually taken along with piracetam. This is especially recommended for people that get tired or dizzy on pira. Sources of choline include:

Choline Citrate
Choline Bitrarate
Lecithin
Alpha GPC
CDP Choline

and of course more... I've been experimenting with piracetam myself. And while I haven't seen any results I attribute this to
a) poor/inadequate choline or
b) I'm just a "non-responder.

Good luck!




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