49 replies to this topic

[mikeinnaples]

500mg dosage is my personal tolerance limit.

Above that limit, I get dizzy, occasional headaches, and have difficulty concentrating and focusing on work. The headaches and dizzy spells are much worse if I accompany dosages over 500mg with exercise shortly after.

[kilgoretrout]

I find the reports of getting dizzy etc on more than 250mg ALCAR hard to believe and frankly a bit bizarre, possibly psychosomatic in nature... but a personal report is a personal report and so should be respected... I guess there are always idiosyncratic reactions.

2g for me is not stimulating in any way, though it does cause a high-level feeling of CALM mental CLARITY, and also is good at erasing feelings of fatigue from lack of sleep or overwork.  Thats about it.  People saying it makes them feel like they are jittery or bouncing off the walls, sorry, I just dont buy it... something else has gotta be going on... ALCAR just does NOT typically do anything like that... look up the research, such claims seem very odd to me.

It is most definitely NOT a "CNS stimulant" in any way shape or form according to the definition of that term, that's just a totally off the wall claim and is WRONG!  It does not trigger large immediate release of NE or D whatsoever, which is what a "stimulant" does.  If you are reacting that way to ALCAR it is really weird, something is wrong... are you on any medications or suffering from any conditions like mania or bipolar or something else???

[mikeinnaples]

 kilgoretrout, on 09 August 2010 - 03:25 PM, said:

I find the reports of getting dizzy etc on more than 250mg ALCAR hard to believe and frankly a bit bizarre, possibly psychosomatic in nature... but a personal report is a personal report and so should be respected... I guess there are always idiosyncratic reactions.

2g for me is not stimulating in any way, though it does cause a high-level feeling of CALM mental CLARITY, and also is good at erasing feelings of fatigue from lack of sleep or overwork.  Thats about it.  People saying it makes them feel like they are jittery or bouncing off the walls, sorry, I just dont buy it... something else has gotta be going on... ALCAR just does NOT typically do anything like that... look up the research, such claims seem very odd to me.

It is most definitely NOT a "CNS stimulant" in any way shape or form according to the definition of that term, that's just a totally off the wall claim and is WRONG!  It does not trigger large immediate release of NE or D whatsoever, which is what a "stimulant" does.  If you are reacting that way to ALCAR it is really weird, something is wrong... are you on any medications or suffering from any conditions like mania or bipolar or something else???

Despite you demeaning attitude, I will respond nicely for now.

I know ALCAR has the effect on me that I mentioned because I took the time to isolate it in my stack as the cause through very careful testing. Not only did I do that, but once I isolated it as the cause, I began reducing dosage until the symptoms went away. Given that I was able to reproduce the effect in myself 100% of the time using three different brands (NOW, BAC powder, and Jarrow) at an incremental step up in dosage over 500mg. Not only that, I can reproduce the effects at will since my initial testing over a year ago.

If you have another theory as to why I 'believe' ALCAR has this effect on me, I would be willing to consider it.... but given that I thoroughly tested it and can reproduce it over a year later, your theory had better be a good one for me to consider it.

Edit: And no ...I am not bipolar, autistic, manic, depressed, senile, suffering from down's syndrome, nor am I suffering from dementia. I am slightly ADHD though.

Edited by mikeinnaples, 09 August 2010 - 04:30 PM.

[chrono]

^^I think most of kilgore's post about CNS stimulation was in response to something much earlier in the thread. It is indeed not a stimulant. It does increase the release of acetylcholine, though, so some people may react in the way you do, without it needing to be a stimulant.

If it makes you feel any better, I made a similar post recently about his experience of taking L-tyrosine for 20 years without any tolerance; it isn't in line with what most people say. Such idiosyncratic reactions allow us to articulate a supplement's mechanisms, and how people experience them.

[ikaros]

I believe ALCAR's anxiogenic effect seems to be related to baseline serotonergic activity. When I took it while on SSRIs it did not cause anxiety, rather it was uniquely stimulating. Now years later when off SSRIs it makes me anxious and apprehensive. The effect is reproducible in my case aswell. It's funny there is so much debate on this substance's effects. Nobody ever considers their neurogenetic make-up.
However there are studies suggesting that ALCAR despite being acutely anxiogenic has anxiolytic properties long-term (look-up the references yourself).

[RJ100]

I’m relatively new to nootropics, and decided that ALCAR would be a simple, safe place to start. However, after just 2 weeks I’m going to drop it because it’s making me anxious.

I take it in the morning on an empty stomach and by mid afternoon I can feel a rising anxiety out of nowhere. I'm not taking any new supplements and there is no external stimulous to cause the anxiety.

I began with 750mg and was on this dosage for nearly a week before I identified ALCAR as the source of the problem. I dropped to 500mg but still felt anxious. I'm now at 250mg and having no negative side effects, but I’m wondering if taking this low of a dose is even worth it.

Also I wondering what this reaction is indicitive of..

[nowayout]

 RJ100, on 31 August 2012 - 01:56 PM, said:

I began with 750mg and was on this dosage for nearly a week before I identified ALCAR as the source of the problem. I dropped to 500mg but still felt anxious. I'm now at 250mg and having no negative side effects, but I’m wondering if taking this low of a dose is even worth it.

What makes you characterize this dose as low?

[RJ100]

 viveutvivas, on 31 August 2012 - 03:04 PM, said:

 RJ100, on 31 August 2012 - 01:56 PM, said:

I began with 750mg and was on this dosage for nearly a week before I identified ALCAR as the source of the problem. I dropped to 500mg but still felt anxious. I'm now at 250mg and having no negative side effects, but I’m wondering if taking this low of a dose is even worth it.

What makes you characterize this dose as low?

Info on this site. Most of what I've read here in the forums points to 500mg-1g daily.

[nowayout]

 RJ100, on 31 August 2012 - 03:37 PM, said:

 viveutvivas, on 31 August 2012 - 03:04 PM, said:

 RJ100, on 31 August 2012 - 01:56 PM, said:

I began with 750mg and was on this dosage for nearly a week before I identified ALCAR as the source of the problem. I dropped to 500mg but still felt anxious. I'm now at 250mg and having no negative side effects, but I’m wondering if taking this low of a dose is even worth it.

What makes you characterize this dose as low?

Info on this site. Most of what I've read here in the forums points to 500mg-1g daily.

Yes, but that is not really based on any good scientific reason.  In fact, Ames et al. did a dose-ranging study on rodents and found that lower doses were more effective than the higher doses (which in addition to being less effective caused oxidative damage).  If I remember correctly, the optimal dose, when metabolically scaled for humans, would correspond to about 250 mg.

There is a thread on this forum about this from a few years ago.

[RJ100]

viveutvivas said:

Yes, but that is not really based on any good scientific reason.

lol I'm too new to know if you're intentionally or unintentionally bashing forum members..

Based on others' anecdotes my reaction to 500mg seemed idiosyncratic, but I'll look into the study you mention plus try to find the older thread.

Thanks.

[niner]

 RJ100, on 31 August 2012 - 05:26 PM, said:

viveutvivas said:

Yes, but that is not really based on any good scientific reason.

lol I'm too new to know if you're intentionally or unintentionally bashing forum members..

People here often do things that are not supported by evidence, and when others take note of it, we don't consider it "bashing".  In general, we try to be evidence based around here, and we try to get things right.  If someone points out when we go astray, particularly when it's as polite as above, I think it's constructive criticism.  Many of us actively seek out critiques of our regimens, and appreciate the information.

[RJ100]

 niner, on 31 August 2012 - 05:48 PM, said:

 RJ100, on 31 August 2012 - 05:26 PM, said:

viveutvivas said:

Yes, but that is not really based on any good scientific reason.

lol I'm too new to know if you're intentionally or unintentionally bashing forum members..

People here often do things that are not supported by evidence, and when others take note of it, we don't consider it "bashing".  In general, we try to be evidence based around here, and we try to get things right.  If someone points out when we go astray, particularly when it's as polite as above, I think it's constructive criticism.  Many of us actively seek out critiques of our regimens, and appreciate the information.

Excellent niner - glad to hear that.

I hope to eventually have a solid regimen based on evidence and critique from more experienced members.

I have to say though, I've had to deal with some non-normal reactions to foods & drugs, so I'm perhaps more open to anecdotes than some.

[MrSpud]

A lot of people get side effects from different types of carnitine. Stomach upset, nausea, diarrhea. Some people are more sensitive than others. I saw one person have to run to the bathroom with diarrhea few minutes after driking just a sip of a liquid carnitine product. If you google acetyl l-carntitine side effects the very first hit is webmd that lists the following:
Acetyl-L-carnitine is LIKELY SAFE for most adults. It can cause some side effects including stomach upset, nausea, vomiting, and restlessness. It can cause a "fishy" odor of the urine, breath, and sweat.

Sort of sounds similar to the side effects listed in the first post that started this thread.

[greekpsychonaut]

I take about 5 grams per day with no I'll effects that I'm aware of.

[victortsoi]

for what its worth, i usually get great effects from 500-1200 mg of alcar, but other times it will make me anxious, crash, or have to pee all the time/ uncomfortable peeing. It could be that I sometimes stack alcar with L-tyrosine, though.

[Raza]

OP's problem is most likely that they're taking their second dose of ALCAR in the late afternoon. ALCAR has an excitant all-round effect on the nervous system, which can lead to insomnia/poor quality sleep if it's taken later in the day. The OP notes poor sleep during their time on ALCAR, and that in turn could well have caused the other symptoms.

Not that it matters anymore, but since this thread got ressed someone else might benefit from knowing...

Edited by Raza, 06 September 2012 - 11:16 PM.

[ecglsd]

Any more information on that ALCAR may cause hair loss?
I'm interested in ALCAR but that would be a prohibitive factor I'm afraid, since I'm already having problems with hair loss.

Does Alpha-GPC also cause hair loss, as someone asked previously in this thread?

[renfr]

A negative side effect that occured to me is heavy spasms as if I was going to convulse. Probably it is reducing the seizure thresold.

[norepinephrine]

When I first started taking ALCAR, I'd take 1.5-2g at a time and my effects were such: increased energy/focus in a non-stimulant way, increased perceived ability to retain information, vastly decreased appetite, leaner body (probably as a result of the decreased appetite). However, in time some side effects begun creeping up: neck tension and a headache if I exceeded the acute dosage, but more alarmingly, the same endogenous depression symptoms I'd get from too much choline (which leads me to believe that excess acetylcholine is my problem).

Since then, I went down to taking 500g at a time, 1-2x daily. Very subtle effects on learning/memory, appetite suppression effect disappeared and not so stimulating, but the theoretical benefits behind the supplement are worth targeting in my view. However, I still noticed a creeping depression that'd kick in 5-10 minutes after supplementing, and that was getting in the way of everyday life.

Thus, I've taken a break since Fall term ended and plan to resume at 500g a day when the upcoming term starts, but will be more diligent with immediately discontinuing/taking a break if the depressive symptoms return.

[anon123457]

After only 2-3 weeks of taking Alcar stacked with RLA, I noticed my hair become SIGNIFICANTLY thinner. Girlfriend was not impressed. While hair was falling out of my head in the shower, my beard started to get random spots of super increased hair growth. The left side of my chin was all of the sudden significantly longer and bushier than the rest of my face.

I just recently stopped and buzzed off all my hair and stopped taking both. I don't know if it was the alcar or na-rala, but I am holding off till my hair grows back. To counter, I've started taking apple cider vinegar (1tsp 2x daily), stinging nettle, green tea, and will be snagging some biotin when I get the chance.

edit: I've read that ALA (also RLA and na-rala) compete with biotin or use up all biotin: a B vitamin that is crucial for hair health. So, that could have been the cause. I should have been stacking biotin or not taking ALA at all. In a couple months, I'll try just ALCAR again and post results.

Edited by anon123457, 03 January 2013 - 04:15 PM.