72 replies to this topic

[chipdouglas35]

Hey, Chip. As to the porn issue, I'm going on personal observation as well as anecdotal reports and some realizations I came to. I think any guy who says he has "low libido" yet he still gets aroused by porn needs to turn it off and abstain for as long as possible. I'm willing to bet that many of the "low libido" complainers regularly watch porn and crank one out.

Masturbation is resulting from your libido! I believe that for healthy people pron generally increases libido, maybe through hormonal effects.

It's been shown that been around women (beautiful) as well as the sight of them increases LH--I've read this in Dr. Kevin Pezzi's book.

[chipdouglas35]

One anti-aging doc I consulted with said I'd adrenal fatigue, which we know has nothing to do with weakened adrenals per se.
Another said I'd both ADHD and dysthymia.
A psychiatrist I saw confirmed I'd ADHD and then added GAD to his Dx.

It seems common for those suffering with ADHD to have a higher stress threshold. Most of the time, moderate stress causes an individual to perform better and get focused--in me, this doesn't happen. Well, it does, but it requires a tremendous amount of stress to mount such a response, and then I'll get more focused and perform whatever action I need to without going to pieces, since most of the time stress causes me to go to pieces, where it should get me more organized.

I'm not sure whether this bear a connection to my issue though, however I think it might, as this involves catecholamines.

Edited by chipdouglas35, 13 November 2009 - 09:55 PM.

[tintinet]

Just in the news: November 13, 2009 — For the first time, researchers have tied workplace exposure to high levels of bisphenol A (BPA) to a variety of symptoms of male sexual dysfunction.

A new study has found that Chinese factory workers exposed to BPA had more than 7 times the rate of ejaculation difficulty than nonexposed workers. The exposed workers also had a rate of erectile difficulty that was more than 4 times greater, and a rate of reduced sexual desire and reduced satisfaction with sex life that was almost 4 times greater.

[Python49]

Can you post a detailed description of your diet?

When I'm eating healthy my diet consists of only lean meats, whole grains, vegetables, fruits, nothing with any added sugars. Basically the southbeach healthy living heart program, if you're famliar with that diet. For breakfast I'd often have something like oatmeal w/ 1% milk, eggs, whole grain toast and vegetarian sausage. Here's a list of what I eat in it's entirety for more detail, I basically chose for each meal from these options where everything involves whole grains only, no added sugar, lean meats, and vegetables:

Limits per day:

100 calories from sweets
2 Tbs of peanut butter or 15 cashews
2 Tbs of light mayonaise/Salad Dressing
2-3 Cups of Milk
2 TBs sour cream
2 TBs half and half


Breakfast(all fat free chease and whole grain breads):

Eggs
Whole grain wheat toast
Make your own French Toast
Turkey Bacon
Turkey Sausage
Vegetarian sausage
Southbeach Cereal/Wheaties
Grilled cheese Sandwhich
Grilled Cheese/Egg/Steak Sandwhich/Ham/Turkey
Steak/Egg/Cheese Sandwhich
Turkey/Mayo/Cheese/Egg sandwhich
Eat oatmeal with cinnamon and splenda
Toast with sugar free jelly/jam


Snacks:
Apples/Fruit
Jello
Peanuts/Cashews
Smoothies
Popcorn no butter

Vegetables:

Asparagus with olive oil and pepper
Yams with cinnamon and splenda
All other frozen/organic vegetables, no canned


Beverages:
Water
Crystal Light juice
Diet Sodas

Dinner/Lunch Dishes(everything whole grain or fat free cheese):

Tortilla quesidillas
Hamburgers w/ wheat rolls
Chili
Beef Tacos
Taco Salads
Shrimp Pasta / melted cheese and whole grain noodles
Sphaghetti and meatballs
Turkey sandwhiches
Deli/Tuna Fish sandwhiches
Salmon w/ veggies
Chicken Pizza
Chicken Caesar Salad
Chicken Parmesan
Crab Legs/Lobster
Fish w/ Hotsauce
Hamburger Helper/Beef Pasta
Chicken with Rice and melted cheese
Meatball sub
Philly CHeesesteak
quesidillas w/ eggs/cheese/chicken breast w/ fat free sour cream
steak quesidillas
Tuna melts
Steak w/ asparagus
Swedish meatball alfedo dishes
Shrimp/Steak/rice dish


When I'm not eating healthy I am often going out to restaurants and eating unhealthy fried foods and sweets. In the past year I would say that I spent 7 months of the year or so eating healthy then the other 5 eating unhealthy. My blood work that I got back though the doctor said my cholestrol and sugar levels were fine, but I'm going to post that to see what others say.

Edited by Python49, 15 November 2009 - 07:35 PM.

[Python49]

To the OP, what is your bodyfat percentage?

I'm not even sure exactly, I know that I'm overweight but I'm really tall and the doctor said that I didn't really look anything like what the information she was looking at would have her believe. I think I was in a range that was considered very overweight to obese, but I don't look it at all. I'm 6'4 250lbs. I have a gut that I have been unable to lose but if I lost my gut I'd look like I was in good shape. When I'm in my 'diet mode' however I often get down to like 220lbs or so and even when in my healthier phases I notice no difference in my libido.

Also as to the issue of porn, I do think it has a very negative impact on libido for those who use it as their sole means of sexual relief.(ex: no girlfriend) What the OP shared about getting aroused for porn but never imagination is a common problem. Normally your brain has to conjure the images of you f--king a girl in order for you to become aroused. Porn takes that normal internal process and turns it into simply input of other people f--king. I haven't studied evolutionary psychology so I can't speculate as to why arousal occurs from watching other people get off, but arousal from that source is skipping the normal processes that would require you to imagine yourself in that scenario. If there's anything we know about the brain it's that it is quick to atrophy areas that are not being used regularly. What would we expect to happen if our sexual imagination were never used, and instead all stimulus came in visually? It only makes sense that constant porn use would be deleterious to libido.

I also get aroused when with a woman and it seems like even if porn could be responsible for this that it would be more wide srpead since I don't watch any abnormal amount of porn compared to the average male so if it would have such drastic effects on my libido it would seem it would for others as well. I mean, for a 23 year old that watches some porn it still does not seem like a common or normal response to it that I have.

What's more, getting no morning woods points to something else other than porn watching.

Yeah this is how I feel as well. I mean, if solving my issue were really as simple as stop watching porn I'd do that in a heart beat. But as I've also said.. I've done this for months at a time already and not noticed anything. I've got months before with exercise, good diet, no porn, and not even thinking about my sex drive and then I'll notice at the end of those months that I didn't ejaculate once. I don't see how that can be normal.

I suggest anyone having persistent libido issues at least try abstaining from porn for as long as possible and observe the results. If your imagination needs a boost try erotic literature.

How long though? I've been asking a few times for those that say this worked for them to mention how long they waited because as I mentioned I've gone months before looking at no porn and the result I observed was that I simply never got horny or an erection.

Masturbation is resulting from your libido! I believe that for healthy people pron generally increases libido, maybe through hormonal effects.

Such a hard topic to get info on because there seems to be a lot of conflicting advice, heh.

Just in the news: November 13, 2009 — For the first time, researchers have tied workplace exposure to high levels of bisphenol A (BPA) to a variety of symptoms of male sexual dysfunction.

A new study has found that Chinese factory workers exposed to BPA had more than 7 times the rate of ejaculation difficulty than nonexposed workers. The exposed workers also had a rate of erectile difficulty that was more than 4 times greater, and a rate of reduced sexual desire and reduced satisfaction with sex life that was almost 4 times greater.

If I'm understanding this correctly it's saying that exposure to the work place was found to be correlated to ED/libido issues? That's kind of confusing to me.. I'm self employed through working at home and haven't had an after college job at any point since graduating.

Edited by Python49, 15 November 2009 - 07:33 PM.

[Python49]

Just to organize everything since the threads getting kind of big.

The things I've tried:

No porn for months, healthy lifestyle, lots of supplements, checking T-levels

The things that have been recommended to try:

ginger - haven't tried but will
less porn - have done this for months, how long does it need to be done? is it normal to have to do without for a year+ to notice change in libido? also seems some people believe porn and masturbation increase libido which is conflicting information :(
vitamin E, 400IE, Mucuna pruriens and Ashwagandha
Stop worrying about it so much - Have gone months without worrying about it and decided to just let things happen naturally and noticed no libido. I assumed a healthy sex drive is one that tells you to go have sex with females if you aren't. This didn't happen for me.

L-arginine
zinc picolinate
Saw palmetto
Perika brand st. johns wort - All these supps people have noted could potetnially cause more damage than good except for SJW.

So at this point, should I consider seeing a urologist? Sounds a bit extreme but keep in mind that me just trying to go on about a healthy life without worry about it did nothing and the libido wasn't there.
Also, I'm unsure of what to post from my blood work.... should I post everything?

Looks like the following tests were done with the results:

Lipid Panel
- Cholestrol total: 140
- Triglycerides: 33
- HDL Cholestrol: 67
VLDL cholestrol cal: 7
LDL cholestrol Calc: 66
TSH: 1.66

Those are in mg/dl

Comp. Metabolic Panel
- Glucose, Serum- 84
BUN- 13
Creatinine, Serum- 1.09
eGFR- >59
Bun/Creatinine ratio- 12
Sdoium, Serum- 142
Potassium, serum- 4.1
chloride, serum- 105
carbon dioxide, total- 20
calcium, serum- 8.8
protein, total, serum- 6.9
albumin, serum- 4.4
globulin, total- 2.5
those are in mmol/l and g/l with calcium one being in mg/dl

There's some info on hee listed under "CBC with differential/platelet" which I'm not sure if I should post that has stuff like Lymphs, Monocytes, Lymphs, etc.

Also, possilble relevant information is that I've taken viagra and cialis on only a couple of occasions just to see if it would do anything and I noticed no effects at all. Not sure if it was because of the kind I got being fake or less potent or if it was because my body just doesn't respond to it. I mean, I thought it was unheard of for Viagra or Cialis to just do nothing?

Comments on bloodwork, urologist, things ive tried, things I should try, and viagra/cialis are appreciated. Thanks.

[Python49]

bah, am unable to edit post above but forgot a few other recommendations that were mentioned of low-dose clomiphene citrate and I got a PM recommending rhGH. I don't even know what these are but will research into it and just wanted to organize all the advice in a way I can reference it better.

[rwac]

What about adding some EVOO to your diet ?

Also, try stopping the saw palmetto for a few weeks and see if that helps.
It inhibits DHT, and perhaps it's not so good for libido.

[niner]

If I'm understanding this correctly it's saying that exposure to the work place was found to be correlated to ED/libido issues? That's kind of confusing to me.. I'm self employed through working at home and haven't had an after college job at any point since graduating.

Not exposure to a workplace, exposure to high levels of bisphenol A. There is a lot of concern that endocrine disruptors like BPA and other compounds are reducing mens' testosterone levels across the board. People are exposed to this stuff from certain kinds of plastics.

So at this point, should I consider seeing a urologist? Sounds a bit extreme but keep in mind that me just trying to go on about a healthy life without worry about it did nothing and the libido wasn't there.

Yes. You should see a urologist and get a complete hormone panel.

Also, possilble relevant information is that I've taken viagra and cialis on only a couple of occasions just to see if it would do anything and I noticed no effects at all. Not sure if it was because of the kind I got being fake or less potent or if it was because my body just doesn't respond to it. I mean, I thought it was unheard of for Viagra or Cialis to just do nothing?

This probably just means you don't have erectile dysfunction. Without sexual stimulation, these drugs usually don't do anything. The don't affect libido, except maybe through a placebo effect. I think you need to look at your hormone levels and make sure everything is ok there, or fix it if it's not. I agree with rwac that the Saw Palmetto is probably a bad idea.

[Python49]

What about adding some EVOO to your diet ?

Also, try stopping the saw palmetto for a few weeks and see if that helps.
It inhibits DHT, and perhaps it's not so good for libido.

rwac- have never taken saw palmetto, in my prior post I was listing out the things I've tried and then also listed out the things I was recommended to try but hadn't necessarily tried yet. I probably shoulda clarified that better but yeah I have never tried saw palmetto, only supps I've tried were those mentioned in the OP. Other than that have just tried diet, exercise, abstinence from porn and thinking about it, as well as cialis and viagara a couple of times. Also what is EWOO? Very new here.

This probably just means you don't have erectile dysfunction. Without sexual stimulation, these drugs usually don't do anything. The don't affect libido, except maybe through a placebo effect. I think you need to look at your hormone levels and make sure everything is ok there, or fix it if it's not. I agree with rwac that the Saw Palmetto is probably a bad idea.

niner- hmmm well, I've never had a problem getting hard when stimulated by getting sexual with a girl or looking at porn so on the occasion I took it I did take it prior to sexual activity and noticed no real effects. I still noticed same level of erection as well as somewhat loss of erection temporarily when changing positions or something, which is what usually happens. For the cialis/viagara to be working wouldn't that have meant it would keep me fully and more erect?

Yeah I'll schedule to see a urologist.... I don't see how it can hurt.

Edited by Python49, 16 November 2009 - 06:59 AM.

[rwac]

rwac- have never taken saw palmetto, in my prior post I was listing out the things I've tried and then also listed out the things I was recommended to try but hadn't necessarily tried yet. I probably shoulda clarified that better but yeah I have never tried saw palmetto, only supps I've tried were those mentioned in the OP. Other than that have just tried diet, exercise, abstinence from porn and thinking about it, as well as cialis and viagara a couple of times. Also what is EWOO? Very new here.

EVOO = Extra Virgin Olive Oil.

You could also try some Virgin Coconut Oil.

Some saturated/monounsaturated fats in your diet ought to boost your production of Testosterone somewhat.

[tintinet]

"Perika brand st. johns wort - All these supps people have noted could potetnially cause more damage than good except for SJW." - Python49

Maybe not?

[chris106]

Admitedly, I haven't read through the whole thread - but maybe this could be of use?

http://teamtlr.com/s...html#/amount-1g

There was mention of melancortin 4 receptors before in this thread, and there's another one:
'
'http://www.longecity...rtin-receptors/

yes, I posted there as well

Also pramipexole has a record of heightened sexuality, but as a side effect.It's probably hard to control and not really safe.
Reports of hypersexuality and gambling addiction don't sound good....