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A, E and Beta Carotene


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9 replies to this topic

#1 lunarsolarpower

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Posted 06 November 2009 - 08:19 AM


OK, maybe that's a bit strong, but given that research has shown all three to negatively impact lifespan I think we should consider adding these to the mix with extreme caution.

From my post in the original Vitamin A poll:

Quoted from Science Daily:

Among low-bias trials, use of beta carotene, vitamin A, and vitamin E was associated with 7 percent, 16 percent and 4 percent, respectively, increased risk of mortality, whereas there was no increased mortality risk associated with vitamin C or selenium use.


Remember, this is the Immortality Institute formulation we're talking about here. If there's one thing we don't want to be selling it's increased risk of mortality.

#2 shazam

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Posted 06 November 2009 - 08:40 AM

OK, maybe that's a bit strong, but given that research has shown all three to negatively impact lifespan I think we should consider adding these to the mix with extreme caution.

From my post in the original Vitamin A poll:

Quoted from Science Daily:

Among low-bias trials, use of beta carotene, vitamin A, and vitamin E was associated with 7 percent, 16 percent and 4 percent, respectively, increased risk of mortality, whereas there was no increased mortality risk associated with vitamin C or selenium use.


Remember, this is the Immortality Institute formulation we're talking about here. If there's one thing we don't want to be selling it's increased risk of mortality.


What were their diets? What were the forms? What were the dosages/frequency? Any predominant conditions with them? How did they die?

Such a vague study.

#3 pamojja

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Posted 06 November 2009 - 10:40 AM

Such a vague study.

Here a review of this 'vague' Meta-analysis JAMA

Professor Balz Frei, Linus Pauling Institut Oregon State University

The "meta-analysis" published in JAMA, which is a statistical analysis of previously published data, looked at 815 antioxidant trials but included only 68 of them in its analysis, and two of the studies excluded – which were published in the Journal of the National Cancer Institute and the prominent British medical journal Lancet – found substantial benefits and reduced mortality from intake of antioxidant supplements.
If these two large studies had been included, none of the reported effects on increased mortality would have been significant, with the exception of the effects of beta carotene. And the research showing a higher incidence of lung cancer in smokers who take supplements of beta carotene or vitamin A is old news, that's been known for many years. Very high doses of vitamin A are known to have multiple adverse health effects

Regards..

#4 pamojja

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Posted 06 November 2009 - 11:41 AM

Among low-bias trials, use of beta carotene, vitamin A, and vitamin E was associated with 7 percent, 16 percent and 4 percent, respectively, increased risk of mortality, whereas there was no increased mortality risk associated with vitamin C or selenium use.

Also note, that meta-analysis often use relative mortality instead of the absolute rates. An important difference to recognize how such high percentages were 'calculated':

(freely translated from the German thread)

If we look at the world-famous ATBC-study, which showed that beta-carotene raises the risk of lung cancer, this is how it looks:
http://annonc.oxford...2/185/MDH051TB2

Treatment: 14 560 patients
Placebo: 14 573 patients

No. of lung cancers
Treatment: 474
Placebo: 402

The relative difference in this case is 18%, but the absolute is smaller than 1%



#5 EmbraceUnity

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Posted 06 November 2009 - 05:58 PM

d-alpha-tocopherol Vitamin E, as opposed to dl-alpha-tocopherol has not shown such effects, especially when paired with gamma-tocopherol and tocotrienols. Considering that is the case, vitamin E should definitely be included.

#6 ajnast4r

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Posted 06 November 2009 - 06:31 PM

3 things:

the vitamin E & beta carotene used were synthetic...
they were also used without their naturally occuring co-factors... other tocopherols, other carotenoids.
they were used in huge huge doses... 400-1000iu for E, 25,000iu for betacarotene.


proper ingredients in proper amounts pose no danger... there has been huge discussions and explanations of this here, please do a search.

#7 Mind

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Posted 17 November 2009 - 06:38 PM

Yes, the proper forms would be essential to this formulation, but I do agree with lunar to some degree, in that we could probably stay on the light side with these.

#8 OneScrewLoose

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Posted 30 December 2009 - 05:22 PM

Something like 2500IU of natural beta carotene and a conservative blend of mixed tocopherols should do the trick.

#9 Tithonus

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Posted 11 September 2011 - 05:58 PM

The recent research into the benefits of ALPHA carotene VS Beta seem to warrant a switch

http://tuftshealthle....aspx?rowId=928

#10 Anthony_Loera

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Posted 20 October 2011 - 05:06 PM

Form of Vitamin E I suggest:


D-alpha-toccopheryl succinate.
This form has been shown to cause cell death in cultered cancer cells at non-toxic concentrations while other forms of vitamin E failed. (thanks Sven!)

Prasad KN, Kumar B, Yan XD, Hanson AJ, and Cole WC. Alpha-tocopheryl succinate, the most effective form of vitamin E for adjuvant cancer treatment: a review. J Am Coll Nutr, 2003, 22(2): 108-117.


Wang XF, Xie Y, Wang HG, Zhang Y, Duan XC, and Lu ZJ. Α-tocopheryl succinate induces apoptosis in erbB2-expressing breast cancer cell via NF-κB pathway. Acta Pharmacol Sin, 2010, 31(12): 1604-1610.

Gu X, Song X, Dong Y, Cai H, Walters E, Zhang R, Pang X, Xie T, Guo Y, Sridhar R, and Califano JA. Vitamin E succinate induces ceramide-mediated apoptosis in head and neck squamous cell carcinoma in vitro and vivo. Clin Cancer Res, 2008, 14(6): 1840-1848.

Shiau CW, Huang JW, Wang DS, Weng JR, Yang CC, Lin CH, Li C, and Chen CS. α-tocopheryl succinate induces apoptosis in prostate cancer cells through inhibition of Bcl-xL/Bcl-2 function. J Biol Chem, 2006, 281(17): 11819-11825.

Swettenham E, Witting PK, Salvatore BA, and Neuzil J. Alpha-tocopheryl succinate selectively induces apoptosis in neuroblastoma cells: potential therapy of malignancies of the nervous system? J Neurochem, 2005, 94(5): 1448-1456.




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