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Vince Guiliano Regime


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#1 Recortes

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Posted 15 April 2011 - 11:01 AM


With some many threads on useless anti-aging recommendations, here goes one to be considered seriously. This is the updated regime by Vincent Giuliano.
His blog is a nightmare as for surfing, but a unique gem for serious anti-aging information. I don't understand why he is not more commented here at imminst.

From here, a big thank to Vincent for the great work he is doing.
Best.




---------------- His new entry:-------------------------

http://anti-agingfir...rewall-regimen/


Revisions to my dietary supplement firewall regimen



An important part of my treatise ANTI-AGING FIREWALLS - THE SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY OF LONGEVITY drafted in May 2008 has been the dietary supplement regimen. This post announces a new set of revisions to that regimen based on recent research results, mainly changes with respect to folic acid, PQQ, glucosamine, and phosphatidylcholine.


The treatise and the dietary supplement regimen


The basic organizing concept followed in writing the treatise was: 1. To identify and characterize the major existing theories of what causes aging, accepting that those theories are far from independent of each other. 2. For each theory of aging, assuming that theory is correct to identify what can practically be done to slow, halt, or even possibly reverse aging according to that theory. Specifically to identify lifestyle patterns and dietary supplements that could be taken to combat aging according to that theory. For example, given the oxidative damage theory of aging, lifestyle patterns would include avoiding many toxic substances like heavy metals and the suggested dietary supplements would include antioxidants. Thus I introduced for each theory of aging the idea of a lifestyle firewall and a dietary supplement firewall. 3. Finally, I combined the lifestyle firewalls for all the theories of aging to get a combined lifestyle regimen, and I combined the dietary supplement firewalls for the different theories of aging to get a combined dietary supplement regimen.


I have revised, updated and expanded the treatise every few weeks since writing it. But this basic organization still exists. While I started out with 14 basic theories of aging, in the course of time I added 6 more to the treatise and have discussed several additional ones in this blog. The suggestions in the dietary supplement regimen are based on own independent reviews of research. That is, each supplement is in the regimen only because I have read specific independent research publications, usually multiple ones, that have convinced me that the supplement exercises credible health-producing or anti-aging effects based both on both solid theoretical grounds and demonstrable experimental results. Because the theories of aging are not independent of each other many of the suggested dietary supplements are protective of health and against aging according to multiple theories. My firewall approach to longevity is a simple and practical one. When I drafted the first version of this document in 2008, I saw this approach as appropriate for older people given the current state of knowledge and our relative ignorance compared to what will be known in coming decades. And I still see it that way. However, my views have been far from static. As I have learned more about the sciences of longevity and the overall state of knowledge has expanded, I have continued to revise the firewalls regimens. For example, by November of 2010 there was more published knowledge about telomerase biology and telomerase and the depth of my personal knowledge about this field had increased very significantly. Based on this knowledge I decided to discontinue use of cycloastragenol or any other specialized commercial “telomerase activator.” See the March 2011 blog entry The epigenetic regulation of telomeres.


I announce and explain the new changes here. My regular readers have possibly seen a few of these coming.


Folic acid


I am keeping this supplement in the regimen at a level of 900mcg a day but with a caution that a suggested daily dose of 1,200 mcg not be exceeded. This could happen, for example, by taking a folic acid supplement and two B-complex capsules daily, each of which contain 900mcg of folic acid. The research that has led me to this shift is detailed in the February 2011 blog entry The many faces of folic acid.


PQQ


On reflection after generating the April 2011 blog entry PQQ – activator of PGC-1alpha, SIRT3 and mitochondrial biogenesis, I have decided to commence supplementation with PQQ at a level of 10mg per day. The health and longevity-benefits research case for doing this are described in the blog entry.


Glucosamine


I am keeping this supplement in the regimen at level of 1,500 mg a day but with caution suggesting that daily dosage not exceed that level.


This decision is a consequence of a few quite-recent studies. The first was published in October 2010 which points out a couple if important negative consequences of consumption of glucosamine: decreased SIRT1 levels and apoptosis of pancreatic cells. The publication is Hexosamines stimulate apoptosis by altering Sirt1 action and levels in rodent pancreatic β-cells. “The activity and levels of Sirt1, which promotes cell survival in several models, are linked to glucose concentrations and cellular energy metabolism. The present study aimed at determining whether impaired Sirt1 activity is involved in the induction of apoptosis by the nutrient-sensing hexosamine biosynthesis pathway (HBP). Pancreatic Nit-1, Rinf-m5F and Min6 β-cells were acutely treated at different doses and times with glucosamine, which directly enters and stimulates the HBP. Sirt1 levels were genetically modulated by retroviral infection. Expression levels, cellular localization, and activity of apoptosis-related markers were determined by qPCR, immunoblotting and co-immunoprecipitation. Glucosamine dose- and time-dependently induced cell apoptosis in all cell lines studied. HBP stimulation time-dependently modified Sirt1 protein levels, notably in the cytoplasm. This was concomitant with increased E2F1 binding to the c-myc promoter. In both NIT-1 and min6 β-cells, genetic knockdown of Sirt1 expression resulted in higher susceptibility to HBP-stimulated apoptosis, whereas overexpression of Sirt1 had the opposite impact. These findings indicate that reduction of Sirt1 levels by hexosamines contributes to β-cell apoptosis.”



A discussion of the implications of this research can be found in the October 2010 Science Daily article Too Much Glucosamine Can Cause the Death of Pancreatic Cells, Increase Diabetes Risk, Researchers Find. “In vitro tests conducted by Professor Frédéric Picard and his team revealed that glucosamine exposure causes a significant increase in mortality in insulin-producing pancreatic cells, a phenomenon tied to the development of diabetes. Cell death rate increases with glucosamine dose and exposure time. “In our experiments, we used doses five to ten times higher than that recommended by most manufacturers, or 1,500 mg/day,” stressed Professor Picard. “Previous studies showed that a significant proportion of glucosamine users up the dose hoping to increase the effects,” he explained. — Picard and his team have shown that glucosamine triggers a mechanism intended to lower very high blood sugar levels. However, this reaction negatively affects SIRT1, a protein critical to cell survival. A high concentration of glucosamine diminishes the level of SIRT1, leading to cell death in the tissues where this protein is abundant, such as the pancreas. — Individuals who use large amounts of glucosamine, those who consume it for long periods, and those with little SIRT1 in their cells are therefore believed to be at greater risk of developing diabetes. In a number of mammal species, SIRT1 level diminishes with age. This phenomenon has not been shown in humans but if it were the case, the elderly — who constitute the target market for glucosamine — would be even more vulnerable. — “The key point of our work is that glucosamine can have effects that are far from harmless and should be used with great caution,” concluded Professor Picard.””

A December 2010 publication O-GlcNAc modification, insulin signaling and diabetic complications speaks to a form of glycation damage which could possibly be exacerbated by intake of dietary glucosamine. “O-GlcNAc glycosylation (O-GlcNAcylation) corresponds to the addition of N-acetylglucosamine on serine and threonine residues of cytosolic and nuclear proteins. O-GlcNAcylation is a dynamic post-translational modification, analogous to phosphorylation, that regulates the stability, the activity or the subcellular localisation of target proteins. This reversible modification depends on the availability of glucose and therefore constitutes a powerful mechanism by which cellular activities are regulated according to the nutritional environment of the cell. O-GlcNAcylation has been implicated in important human pathologies including Alzheimer disease and type-2 diabetes. Only two enzymes, OGT and O-GlcNAcase, control the O-GlcNAc level on proteins. Therefore, O-GlcNAcylations cannot organize in signaling cascades as observed for phosphorylations. O-GlcNAcylations should rather be considered as a “rheostat” that controls the intensity of the signals traveling through different pathways according to the nutritional status of the cell. Thus, OGT attenuates insulin signal by O-GlcNAcylation of proteins involved in proximal and distal steps in the PI-3 kinase signaling pathway. This negative feedback may be exacerbated when cells are chronically exposed to elevated glucose concentrations and could thereby contribute to alterations in insulin signaling observed in diabetic patients. O-GlcNAcylation also appears to contribute to the deleterious effects of hyperglycaemia on excessive glucose production by the liver and deterioration of β-cell pancreatic function, resulting in worsening of hyperglycaemia (glucotoxicity). Moreover, O-GlcNAcylations directly participate in several diabetic complications. O-GlcNAcylation of eNOS in endothelial cells have been involved in micro- and macrovascular complications. In addition, O-GlcNAcylations activate the expression of profibrotic and antifibrinolytic factors, contributing to vascular and renal dysfunctions.” Glycation is a serious issue in the aging process. The fourth theory of aging covered in my treatise is Tissue Glycation.

An April 2011 publication casts another dark shadow on the potential impact of glucosamine supplementation: Oral glucosamine increases expression of transforming growth factor β1 (TGF β 1) and connective tissue growth factor (CTGF) mRNA in rat cartilage and kidney: Implications for human efficacy and toxicity. “Lean Zucker rats were dosed orally for 6 weeks with glucosamine hydrochloride at doses (0 - 600 mg/kg/day) that produced peak serum concentrations of <1 - 35 μM, spanning the human exposure range. Relative expression of both TGFβ1 and CTGF mRNA were significantly increased up to 2.3-fold in liver, kidney and articular cartilage when evaluated 4 hours after final dose. Apparent threshold serum glucosamine (C(max)) concentration required to increase TGFβ1 expression in cartilage was 10 - 20 μM. These increases were associated with significant increases in UDP-N-acetylglucosamine concentrations suggesting increased hexosamine flux. Both TGFβ1 and CTGF are mediators of chondrocyte proliferation and cartilage repair. Study demonstrates that oral glucosamine doses that produce clinically relevant serum glucosamine concentrations can induce tissue TGFβ1 and CTGF expression in vivo and provides a mechanistic rationale for reported beneficial effects of glucosamine therapy. Induction of renal TGFβ1 and CTGF mRNA suggests that potential sclerotic side-effects may occur following consumption of potent glucosamine preparations.”

Together, these studies suggest that negative health and longevity effects could well result from the prolonged taking of large doses of glucosamine.

Efficacy of glucosamine for averting or treating osteoarthritis is another matter with some studies supporting its capability to address joint diseases and other studies suggesting that the existence of such a capability is questionable. The last study cited above suggests it may be efficacious. Also in that category is the work reported in the March 2011 publication Effects of glucosamine derivatives and uronic acids on the production of glycosaminoglycans by human synovial cells and chondrocytes. “Glucosamine (GlcN) has been widely used to treat osteoarthritis (OA) in humans. However, its chondroprotective action on the joint is poorly understood. In this study, to elucidate the chondroprotective action of GlcN, we examined the effects of GlcN-derivatives (GlcN and N-acetyl-D-glucosamine) and uronic acids (D-glucuronic acid and D-galacturonic acid) (0.1-1 mM) on the production of glycosaminoglycans (GAG), such as hyaluronic acid (HA), keratan sulfate and sulfated GAG by human synovial cells and chondrocytes. — Together these observations indicate that GlcN may exhibit chondroprotective action on joint diseases such as OA by modulating the expression of HA-synthesizing enzymes and inducing the production of HA (a major component of GAG contained in synovial fluid) especially by synovial cells.”



Phosphatidylcholine

I am discontinuing inclusion of phosphatidylcholine (lecithin) in the dietary supplement regimen.


“Phosphatidylcholine (PC) are a class of phospholipids that incorporate choline as a headgroup. They are a major component of biological membranes and can be easily obtained from a variety of readily available sources such as egg yolk or soy beans from which they are mechanically extracted or chemically extracted using hexane. They are also a member of the lecithin group of yellow-brownish fatty substances occurring in animal and plant tissues(ref).”


The proximate reason for eliminating phosphatidylcholine from the regimen are laid out in the April 2011 publication Gut flora metabolism of phosphatidylcholine promotes cardiovascular disease. “Metabolomics studies hold promise for the discovery of pathways linked to disease processes. Cardiovascular disease (CVD) represents the leading cause of death and morbidity worldwide. Here we used a metabolomics approach to generate unbiased small-molecule metabolic profiles in plasma that predict risk for CVD. Three metabolites of the dietary lipid phosphatidylcholine—choline, trimethylamine N-oxide (TMAO) and betaine—were identified and then shown to predict risk for CVD in an independent large clinical cohort. Dietary supplementation of mice with choline, TMAO or betaine promoted upregulation of multiple macrophage scavenger receptors linked to atherosclerosis, and supplementation with choline or TMAO promoted atherosclerosis. Studies using germ-free mice confirmed a critical role for dietary choline and gut flora in TMAO production, augmented macrophage cholesterol accumulation and foam cell formation. Suppression of intestinal microflora in atherosclerosis-prone mice inhibited dietary-choline-enhanced atherosclerosis. Genetic variations controlling expression of flavin monooxygenases, an enzymatic source of TMAO, segregated with atherosclerosis in hyperlipidaemic mice. Discovery of a relationship between gut-flora-dependent metabolism of dietary phosphatidylcholine and CVD pathogenesis provides opportunities for the development of new diagnostic tests and therapeutic approaches for atherosclerotic heart disease.”






A Eurekalert writeup of this research had to say: “A new pathway has been discovered that links a common dietary lipid and intestinal microflora with an increased risk of heart disease, according to a Cleveland Clinic study published in the latest issue of Nature. — The study shows that people who eat a diet containing a common nutrient found in animal products (such as eggs, liver and other meats, cheese and other diary products, fish, shellfish) are not predisposed to cardiovascular disease solely on their genetic make-up, but rather, how the micro-organisms that live in our digestive tracts metabolize a specific lipid — phosphatidyl choline (also called lecithin). Lecithin and its metabolite, choline, are also found in many commercial baked goods, dietary supplements, and even children’s vitamins. — The study examined clinical data from 1,875 patients who were referred for cardiac evaluation, as well as plasma samples from mice. When fed to mice, lecithin and choline were converted to a heart disease-forming product by the intestinal microbes, which promoted fatty plaque deposits to form within arteries (atherosclerosis); in humans, higher blood levels of choline and the heart disease forming microorganism products are strongly associated with increased cardiovascular disease risk. — “When two people both eat a similar diet but one gets heart disease and the other doesn’t, we currently think the cardiac disease develops because of their genetic differences; but our studies show that is only a part of the equation,” said Stanley Hazen, M.D., Ph.D., Staff in Lerner Research Institute’s Department of Cell Biology and the Heart and Vascular Institute’s Department of Cardiovascular Medicine and Section Head of Preventive Cardiology & Rehabilitation at Cleveland Clinic, and senior author of the study. “Actually, differences in gut flora metabolism of the diet from one person to another appear to have a big effect on whether one develops heart disease. Gut flora is a filter for our largest environmental exposure – what we eat.” — Dr. Hazen added, “Another remarkable finding is that choline – a natural semi-essential vitamin – when taken in excess, promoted atherosclerotic heart disease. Over the past few years we have seen a huge increase in the addition of choline into multi-vitamins - even in those marketed to our children - yet it is this same substance that our study shows the gut flora can convert into something that has a direct, negative impact on heart disease risk by forming an atherosclerosis-causing by-product.” — In studies of more than 2,000 subjects altogether, blood levels of three metabolites of the dietary lipid lecithin were shown to strongly predict risk for cardiovascular disease: choline (a B-complex vitamin), trimethylamine N-oxide (TMAO, a product that requires gut flora to be produced and is derived from the choline group of the lipid) and betaine (a metabolite of choline). — “The studies identify TMAO as a blood test that can be used in subjects to see who is especially at risk for cardiac disease, and in need of more strict dietary intervention to lower their cardiac risk,” Dr. Hazen said. — Healthy amounts of choline, betaine and TMAO are found in many fruits, vegetables and fish. These three metabolites are commonly marketed as direct-to-consumer supplements, supposedly offering increased brain health, weight loss and/or muscle growth. — These compounds also are commonly used as feed additives for cattle, poultry or fish because they may make muscle grow faster; whether muscle from such livestock have higher levels of these compounds remains unknown.”


Even prior to encountering this publication I had been uncomfortable with one aspect of phosphatidylcholine: phosphatidylcholine stimulates the expression of NF-kappaB(ref)(ref)(ref). My treatise discusses how aberrant NF-kappaB signaling appears to characterize many inflammatory disease processes. “They include promotion of angiogenesis, proliferation, metastasis and invasiveness in cancer tumors, autoimmune diseases, neurodegenerative diseases and contributing to the activation of human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) leading to AIDS. — There appears to be increasing evidence that inhibition of expression of NF-kB could be a key approach for fighting cancers, controlling inflammatory diseases, AIDS, neurodegenerative conditions like Parkinson’s Disease and a number of other significant age-related maladies.” So promotion of expression of NF-kappaB is the opposite of what is wanted. In this respect, phosphatidylcholine has behaved in an opposite manner to thirty-nine pluripotent substances in my dietary regimen which suppress the expression of NF-kappaB.


This information and the other information offered in this blog or in the associated treatise is not intended for diagnosis or treatment of any medical condition and should not be construed as medical advice. The information is not a substitute for a licensed physician’s medical advice. If any opinions or suggestions herein conflict with that of a treating licensed physician, defer to the opinion of the physician. This information is intended for people in good health. The dietary supplement regimen described herein is that used by the author and may not be appropriate for other people. It is the user’s responsibility to know his or her health and medical history and ensure that supplements he or she takes do not create an adverse reaction.

The author does not have nor has ever had any business relationship with any company that packages or markets any dietary supplement.




------ His current regime------------------------------------------------


http://www.vincegiul...gfirewalls.htm#
Vitamin C - 3gm
2gm morning, 1gm afternoon/eve

Vitamin D-3 – 2000 IU
Twice daily

Probiotic - 8 major strains
Morning

Curcumin extract – 1160 mg
Twice daily

B-50 complex - (50 mg for most)
Morning

Vitamin B-12 - 500mcg
Once daily

Benfotiamine – 80mg
Twice daily

Vitamin B-6 – 100mg
Twice daily

Pantothenic acid – 500mg
Twice daily

Mixed carotenes
Once daily

Folic acid – 900mcg included in B-50. Do not exceed
Once daily

Chelated copper 2.5mg
Once daily

Potassium gluconate 100mg
Once daily

Calcium (as carbonate, aspartate, citrate) 1 Gm
Twice daily

Magnesium (as oxide, aspartate, gluconate) – 500mg
Twice daily

Zink (as oxide, aspartate, gluconate) – 30mg
Twice daily

Selenium – 200 mcg
Once daily

R-alpha-lipoic acid 200 mg
Twice daily

Acetyl-l-carnitine 500mg
Twice daily

L-carnosine - 500mg
Before breakfast, before bed

Co-enzyme Q-10 – 300mg
Twice daily

Pycnogenol - 100 mg
Twice daily

Bromelain – 250mg
Twice daily

Lycopene – 10mg
Twice daily

Quercetin – 500mg
Twice daily

Ginkgo Biloba extract (stand. to contain 24% flavone glycosides and 6% terpene lactones) - 60 mg
Once daily

Saw palmetto (stand. to 85-95% fatty acids) – 200mg
Twice daily

Ashwagandah extract (stand. to 1.5% withanolides) - 470mg
Twice daily

Boswellia Seratta (stand. to 70% organic acids and 20% boswellic acid)extract - 300mg
Twice daily

Astragalus extract (stand. 0.5% astragalosides – .25gm
Twice daily

Extract containing 10 mg cycloastragenol. - DISCONTINUED Nov 15, 2010


Olive leaf extract (stand.to 20% oleuropein) - 750mg
Twice daily

Green tea extract (stand. to 60% polyphenols) – 1.5gm
Morning

OPC grape seed extract (stand. 120 seeds/mg)
Twice daily

Omega-3 oils: DHA - 400mg; EPA - 800mg
Three morning; one evening

Micronized resveratrol - 250mg
Twice daily

Avena Sativa 19:1 extract – 1,150mg
Twice daily

Allicin - 1gm
Twice daily

Stinging Nettle Each capsule supplies 250 mg of stand. nettle extract (1% silicic acid) and 270 mg of powdered root.
Twice daily

L-theanine 100mg
Twice daily

Phosphatidylcholine – 385mg -- Discontinued April 11, 2011


Glucosamine sulfate 750mg -- Do not exceed
Twice daily

Piracetam - 800 mg
Morning

Meclofenoxate (centrophenoxine) - 500mg
Morning

DHEA 50mg
Morning

Pregnenalone - 60mg
Morning

PQQ - 10mg
Morning

Melatonin - 3mg
Before bedtim

#2 Logan

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Posted 16 April 2011 - 04:24 AM

You would think that Vince would have added one of the cyanoastragenol supplements available. I'd be curious as to why he has not.

I am also even more surprised that he does not have any lithium in his regimen.

Edited by MorganM, 16 April 2011 - 06:35 AM.


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#3 Gerald W. Gaston

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Posted 16 April 2011 - 06:49 AM

You would think that Vince would have added one of the cyanoastragenol supplements available. I'd be curious as to why he has not.

I am also even more surprised that he does not have any lithium in his regimen.


Looks like he did and then stopped or reduced his use of it.

See comments section of:
http://anti-agingfir...-blog-comments/

Jeff says:
22. November 2010 at 09:33

I was wandering if you are still experiencing hair growth or thickening from Astragaloside 4?Which product are you using?I can only seem to find Cycloastragenol now thx


admin says:
22. November 2010 at 23:51

Jeff

I have stopped taking astrogaloside about a year ago and switched to a moderate dose of cycloastragenol. In revent months I have significantly cooled on taking this supplement as well and only do it some days now. What has cooled me is learning more and more about the incredible complexities connected with telomere lengths and how natural mechanisms are likely to override the effects of telomerase activation for normal non immune-comprimised people. See these October 2010 blog entries * Telomere lengths, Part 3: Selected current research on telomere-related signaling, * Telomere lengths, Part 2: Lifestyle, dietary, and other factors associated with telomere shortening and lengthening, * Telomere lengths, Part 1: Telomere lengths, cancers and disease processes,



#4 hamishm00

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Posted 16 April 2011 - 07:36 AM

If you are curious Morgan you can go to his website, there is extensive information on there about what he thinks about cycloastrogenol and telomerase activators generally.

#5 Sillewater

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Posted 16 April 2011 - 07:41 AM

Quoted here by Recortes: http://www.longecity...post__p__460214

#6 Mind

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Posted 17 November 2014 - 06:57 PM

Reason opines on Anti-aging firewalls - calling it more like slowing-aging-a-tiny-bit-fire-wall. A ton of effort and money, yet nothing to rejuvenate. Of course, older persons need to take steps to remain alive, even if those lifestyle/supplement changes do not truly rejuvenate.



#7 Kevnzworld

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 04:27 PM

Reason opines on Anti-aging firewalls - calling it more like slowing-aging-a-tiny-bit-fire-wall. A ton of effort and money, yet nothing to rejuvenate. Of course, older persons need to take steps to remain alive, even if those lifestyle/supplement changes do not truly rejuvenate.

I don't see it as an either/ or approach. I am 58, yes I think more money and research effort should be spent on radical life extension interventions ( Sens/ Reason ). Selfishly, I realize that such interventions may not be available within my lifetime and if some do become available, I had better be alive and healthy enough to take advantage of them.
Vince began his life extension quest late in life, and he is now in his early eighties. I applaud him for spending the last chapter in his life trying to extend his healthy lifespan by whatever means are currently available.
We don't really know what if any of the approaches discussed on Longecity will extend life and if so by how much. It's possible that many of the regimens debated will help some live longer than others. I think that many of the approaches I'm utilizing, similar to Vince's will lessen the probability that I will die earlier than I am genetically predisposed to, squaring the curve as they say. I can say unequivocally that my blood test parameters have improved significantly since beginning a lifestyle that includes aggressive supplementation.
Just in the last 12 months an entirely new , active discussion has begun about NAD, it's decline with age and the possible ways to maintain it. I doubt that any single approach will prove to be dramatically effective, yet the combination of them may be.
I guess it depends on how you define rejuvenation . If ones at deaths door, or in poor and declining health, many of the approaches we discussed may help said person modestly regain some health and a few extra years. What's that worth?
If the approaches I and many of us use are effective in preventing an early death, and allow us to live a healthy life well beyond 90, than it's certainly worth it.
Who knows, thirty years from now some of the approaches Reason espouses may be available. I hope that he employs some of the approaches Vince espouses now so that he has a better chance of benefiting from them in the future!

Edited by Kevnzworld, 19 November 2014 - 04:29 PM.

  • Agree x 1

#8 mike_nyc

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 12:28 PM

I think this supplement routine will shorten a person's life rather than extend it.

1.5 grams of green tea extract seems like enough to give yourself liver damage.

30 mgs of zinc twice a day (60 mgs total daily and 600% of the rda) is insane.

High dose vitamin C supplementation doubles your chance for getting kidney stones.

Edited by mike_nyc, 20 November 2014 - 12:44 PM.


#9 pamojja

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 12:50 PM

High dose vitamin C supplementation doubles your chance for getting kidney stones.

 

 

Kidney stones http://lpi.oregonsta...itaminC/#stone

 

Because oxalate is a metabolite of vitamin C, there is some concern that high vitamin C intake could increase the risk of calcium oxalate kidney stones. Some (7, 134, 135), but not all (136-138), studies have reported that supplemental vitamin C increases urinary oxalate levels. Whether any increase in oxalate levels would translate to an elevation in risk for kidney stones has been examined in several epidemiological studies. Two large prospective cohort studies, one following 45,251 men for 6 years and the other following 85,557 women for 14 years, reported that consumption of ≥1,500 mg of vitamin C daily did not increase the risk of kidney stone formation compared to those consuming <250 mg daily (139, 140). On the other hand, two other large prospective studies reported that a high intake of ascorbic acid was associated with an increased risk of kidney stone formation in men (141, 142). Specifically, in the Health Professionals Follow-Up Study, 45,619 male health professionals (aged 40-75 years) reported vitamin C intake from food and supplemental sources every four years (141). After 14 years of follow-up, men who consumed ≥1,000 mg/day of vitamin C had a 41% higher risk of kidney stones compared to men consuming <90 mg of vitamin C daily. In the Cohort of Swedish Men study, self-reported use of single-nutrient ascorbic acid supplements (taken 7 or more times per week) at baseline was associated with a 2-fold higher risk of incident kidney stones among 48,840 men (aged 45-79 years) followed for 11 years (142). Despite conflicting results, it may be prudent for individuals predisposed to oxalate kidney stone formation to avoid high-dose vitamin C supplementation.

 



#10 pamojja

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 01:07 PM

30 mgs of zinc twice a day (60 mgs total daily and 600% of the rda) is insane.

 

 

Adverse effects

The major consequence of long-term consumption of excessive zinc is copper deficiency. Total zinc intakes of 60 mg/day (50 mg supplemental and 10 mg dietary zinc) have been found to result in signs of copper deficiency. Copper deficiency has also been reported following chronic use of excessive amounts of zinc-containing denture creams (>2 tubes per week containing 17-34 mg/g of zinc; (100)). In order to prevent copper deficiency, the U.S. Food and Nutrition Board set the tolerable upper intake level (UL) for adults at 40 mg/day, including dietary and supplemental zinc (5).

I assume Vince monitors his copper and zinc blood levels, and that's the reason he additionally supplements 2.5mg of copper daily.

 

In my case supplementing 40 mg/d additional to 12 mg/d from diet for years still left me just at the lower limit for zinc in whole blood.

 

1.5 grams of green tea extract seems like enough to give yourself liver damage.

 

Don't you think he would know by now?


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#11 krillin

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Posted 21 November 2014 - 05:54 AM

There is no epidemiology that supports using zinc or copper at those levels, so I agree that it is insane. The top dietary intakes of zinc are always around 16-22 mg/day in those studies, and supplementation above 25 mg/day looks bad for prostate cancer.

 

Zinc and copper blood tests are useless for determining nutritional status.

 

What would be the justification for 1.5 g 60% green tea extract? That would be 900 mg polyphenols, or the equivalent of 15-30 cups per day. I usually see numbers on the order of 5 cups per day as being sufficient.



#12 mike_nyc

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Posted 21 November 2014 - 09:05 AM

http://ods.od.nih.go...thProfessional/

 

Health Risks from Excessive Zinc
 
"Reductions in a copper-containing enzyme, a marker of copper status, have been reported with even moderately high zinc intakes of approximately 60 mg/day for up to 10 weeks. The doses of zinc used in the AREDS study (80 mg per day of zinc in the form of zinc oxide for 6.3 years, on average) have been associated with a significant increase in hospitalizations for genitourinary causes, raising the possibility that chronically high intakes of zinc adversely affect some aspects of urinary physiology."
 
 
"Zinc intake of more than 50 mg from diet and supplements can lead to improper copper metabolism, altered iron function, a reduction of HDL’s (the good cholesterol) and reduced immune function. Research suggests that chronic and excessive zinc intake can cause neurological disorder and disease. There is also ongoing research related to iron, copper and zinc and their role in Alzheimer’s disease."
 
"Being exposed to more than 10 times the recommended amount of zinc can result in zinc poisoning. Neuropathy or nerve disorder has been seen in those that wear dentures due to suspected zinc poisoning."


#13 pamojja

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Posted 21 November 2014 - 11:42 AM

Zinc and copper blood tests are useless for determining nutritional status.

 

I beg to diver between simple serum - or whole blood zinc or copper tests, taken in context of present inflammation markers, hair tissue mineral analysis and symptoms of deficiency to determine nutritional status.
 

blood_serum.gif
 

 


Edited by pamojja, 21 November 2014 - 11:52 AM.


#14 Kevnzworld

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Posted 21 November 2014 - 03:09 PM

I think that one has to look at Vince's regimen in context with his advanced age and the research work that he put into it. We are all free to choose which study fits our point of view and interpret it accordingly. There are many studies that have conflicting results associated with design and analysis. It's important to do your own blood testing, read as much as possible and make your own informed decision about whatever supplementation regimen you want to pursue.

Re : prostate cancer and zinc supplementation
" Zinc Supplement Use and Risk of Prostate Cancer "
Quote : " Supplemental zinc intake at doses of up to 100 mg/day was NOT associated with prostate cancer risk "
http://jnci.oxfordjo...5/13/1004.short

Edited by Kevnzworld, 21 November 2014 - 03:10 PM.

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#15 krillin

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 02:54 AM

Re : prostate cancer and zinc supplementation
" Zinc Supplement Use and Risk of Prostate Cancer "
Quote : " Supplemental zinc intake at doses of up to 100 mg/day was NOT associated with prostate cancer risk "
http://jnci.oxfordjo...5/13/1004.short

 

Look at the advanced cancer RRs.

 

0 mg.............1.0

1-24 mg........0.81

25-74 mg......1.45

75-100 mg....1.39

>100 mg.......2.29
 

Zinc megadoses have been around long enough and used by enough people for a longevity benefit to have been noticed if there is one to be had. I have yet to find one.


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#16 to age or not to age

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 03:27 AM

I have known Vince for 5 years. I sometimes stay with him when filming in Boston.

We have been outlining an aging series together.  Vince does not use telomerase activators because he has come to believe that telomeres and telomerase 

in general are a downstream or midstream thing.

Vince just turned 85 and is as fit now (he says) as he was several years ago - in terms of

blood numbers.  I can attest to his mental and physical energy. 


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#17 Kevnzworld

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 06:33 AM

I have known Vince for 5 years. I sometimes stay with him when filming in Boston.
We have been outlining an aging series together. Vince does not use telomerase activators because he has come to believe that telomeres and telomerase
in general are a downstream or midstream thing.
Vince just turned 85 and is as fit now (he says) as he was several years ago - in terms of
blood numbers. I can attest to his mental and physical energy.


It's important to put his regimen in context to his age. If I was 85 I would supplement differently than I am now at 58, or if I was 35.
Only 1 out every 4 people that enter their 80's leave it alive. ....
His blog is great, and Dr James Watson is a great addition.
Go Vince!
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#18 follies

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 09:09 AM

I agree, his latest article on NAD+ is excellent.




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