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Self-confidence - is there a magic pill?

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#1 Andrey_81

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 02:46 PM


Is there a 'magic' supplement or pill that is safe to be used rarely, just in some situations when you need quick boost of self-confidence?

I'm working in sales department and sometimes I need to have stressful meetings or some presentations. I suffer from lack of self-confidence and during the meeting have experienced hi stress and panic attacks.

Strange, but coffee or guarana used to help me before. I became more talkative, happy and confident. However, for the past 3 months I have terrible anxiety when visiting the customer and it's hard for me to speak during presentations or during important meetings, I feel like I will start to cry. Totally without self confidence and I feel like my heart will jump from my chest. It beats extremely fast and I sweat a lot. Yes, I stopped drinking coffee or green tea 2 months ago in order to reduce anxiety but it didn't help.

All I need is something strong enough that I can take half hour before the meeting of presentation to make me calm enough without having an impact on the speech skills. I can say that I'm optimistic and happy person with nice life. I don't need something for long-term use, I just need something for special situations.

What do you think about Valerian? Will try.


I also heard about beta-blockers but I'm not able to get these without prescription.

Is there something else (don't day alcohol :))? I'm taking brahmi and ashwgandha. They are great but not strong enough for the situations that make me panic. I also tried Rhodiola, but I had opposite reaction (total anxiety).

Please...Thank you so much!

Edited by Andrey_81, 23 March 2012 - 02:47 PM.

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#2 Logan

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 06:54 PM

No magic pill. You could benefit from Lexapro or Zoloft. But, the only real fix is to get your ass into psychodynamic therapy, and hopefully find a good psychodynamic/interpersonal therapy group run by two very qualified professionals. Your problems are rooted in your parents falling far short of being able to provide you the right amount and the right kind of love and nurture so that you could love your self the way you needed to allow you to thrive in the world. Most people are in complete denial of this.
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#3 Nooby

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 07:35 AM

Lexapro is great for panic and has totally improved my life in respect to confidence. But play around with the dose, too much and you may a well not even be alive it is that crippling.
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#4 smithx

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 11:34 AM

You could try propranolol. It's commonly used by musicians who have stage fright:

http://www.nytimes.c...?pagewanted=all
http://www.violinist...nse.cfm?ID=4816

It does have side effects which can include impotence (if you are male).
But you may not have to use it for long. Some research indicates that it may rewire your brain so you become less afraid of the situations which previously caused anxiety.

http://www.scienceda...90311103611.htm
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#5 kevinseven11

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 05:47 PM

Testosterone and dopamine have effects on self confidence,
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#6 Logan

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 10:00 PM

Again, let's stop being scared and looking for a quick fix. Therapy is the only way to genuinely transform yourself from the inside out.
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#7 Brainfogged

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 04:02 AM

Again, let's stop being scared and looking for a quick fix. Therapy is the only way to genuinely transform yourself from the inside out.


How would talking make one confident? I dont think that anything can make a person confident if he didn´t have it from the start!

Personally I don´t believe that one can get confident through therapy. I know guy´s who´s always had it rough but still managed to pull it through. I know people who are butt ugly, who still always have a certain swagger. I know people who always hear shit flying their direction but they don´t give a shit, it just bounces off. I know guy´s who would fight off anyone despite their opponents size, number or whatever. These people were born confident. Same with girls. Some know how to melt girls with the palms of their hands, others aren´t able to make a connection even if the girl comes with a manual. Some people are born to be confident, some aren´t.

Then there´s the ultimate losers, people who whine and go to therapy and basically don´t ever change. I know people who have had anxiety and been medicating their whole lives and nothing ever helps. They read self help shit, try to find the ultimate cure and are always on the look for something that will fix them. The truth is that there is nothing wrong with them, this is just the way they operate.

I know this will get to some personally and make some people angry, no offence though.This is just the way things are, sadly though. I wish it wasn´t.

Edited by Brainfogged, 25 March 2012 - 04:05 AM.

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#8 Logan

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 04:39 AM

Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like you understand what takes place when someone does real work with a good therapist. Its not just about talking, lol. I dont even feel like wasting my time explaining it to you, if you have half a brain, you should be able to figure it out. Also, I believe my first post mentioned group therapy. When I was in group, I saw two members make huge strides in their ability to speak up and feel good about themselves within Just a few months. Granted, they had already been doing some hard work on loving themselves more in one on one beforehand, still, it was obvious the impact group was having.

To think someone is simply born with a lack of confidence is a sign of a real deficit of deeper thinking and understanding of the complexity of the human psyche.
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#9 niner

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 04:41 AM

I also heard about beta-blockers but I'm not able to get these without prescription.


Better see the doctor then, because that sounds like exactly what you're looking for.
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#10 Brainfogged

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:26 AM

Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like you understand what takes place when someone does real work with a good therapist. Its not just about talking, lol. I dont even feel like wasting my time explaining it to you, if you have half a brain, you should be able to figure it out. Also, I believe my first post mentioned group therapy. When I was in group, I saw two members make huge strides in their ability to speak up and feel good about themselves within Just a few months. Granted, they had already been doing some hard work on loving themselves more in one on one beforehand, still, it was obvious the impact group was having.

To think someone is simply born with a lack of confidence is a sign of a real deficit of deeper thinking and understanding of the complexity of the human psyche.


What´s up with the insults? My intention wasn´t to ridicule or put people down. It´s just the way I see it. My take is that biological factors is what determines our social role in life. Sure one can get deluded through group empowerment and brainwash. But when it comes to terms, only one is fit for fight. I am sorry if I struck a nerve, I can understand that this is a very sensitive subject and why someone can take things personally. My intention wasn´t to hurt your feelings Logan.

From what I´ve seen, people who go to therapy once, end up going there several times. Sure they get somewhat better when someone comes along, gives them a plan and a scheme on what to do. After they are done with their therapy and are feeling better... Well, after a few months, they are back to square one. Sometimes even a few years goes by and they don´t even acknowledge that they aren't feeling well when in fact they are miserable. But often enough, they end up back there! So question is, is it the actual therapy that works? Or the fact that someone is giving them an alternative which they believe in. Is it the mere assumption that something is happening, "a plan" that gives them a contemporary relief for the moment? Rather than the actual therapy working!?

I believe that therapy works for a short term looking from a clinical perspective. Looking more long- term, I doubt that it works.

Iv´e been to therapy. It was just a waste of time! So clearly I didn´t understand it. Enlighten me!

My take is, pills are the way to go!
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#11 Luminosity

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:51 AM

There's no pill.
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#12 Logan

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 06:53 AM

There's no pill.


Thank you
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#13 Logan

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 07:07 AM


Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like you understand what takes place when someone does real work with a good therapist. Its not just about talking, lol. I dont even feel like wasting my time explaining it to you, if you have half a brain, you should be able to figure it out. Also, I believe my first post mentioned group therapy. When I was in group, I saw two members make huge strides in their ability to speak up and feel good about themselves within Just a few months. Granted, they had already been doing some hard work on loving themselves more in one on one beforehand, still, it was obvious the impact group was having.

To think someone is simply born with a lack of confidence is a sign of a real deficit of deeper thinking and understanding of the complexity of the human psyche.


What´s up with the insults? My intention wasn´t to ridicule or put people down. It´s just the way I see it. My take is that biological factors is what determines our social role in life. Sure one can get deluded through group empowerment and brainwash. But when it comes to terms, only one is fit for fight. I am sorry if I struck a nerve, I can understand that this is a very sensitive subject and why someone can take things personally. My intention wasn´t to hurt your feelings Logan.

From what I´ve seen, people who go to therapy once, end up going there several times. Sure they get somewhat better when someone comes along, gives them a plan and a scheme on what to do. After they are done with their therapy and are feeling better... Well, after a few months, they are back to square one. Sometimes even a few years goes by and they don´t even acknowledge that they aren't feeling well when in fact they are miserable. But often enough, they end up back there! So question is, is it the actual therapy that works? Or the fact that someone is giving them an alternative which they believe in. Is it the mere assumption that something is happening, "a plan" that gives them a contemporary relief for the moment? Rather than the actual therapy working!?

I believe that therapy works for a short term looking from a clinical perspective. Looking more long- term, I doubt that it works.

Iv´e been to therapy. It was just a waste of time! So clearly I didn´t understand it. Enlighten me!

My take is, pills are the way to go!


Please research psychodynamic therapy and learn a little about what is really supposed to take place when one actually does the work they are supposed to. Growth is a life long process. It never happends as fast as we want it to. Unfortunately, most of us did not get the love and nurture we needed to develop properly and love ourselves the way we need to. How do you link we end up loving ourselves and learn to be confident with what we have? We learn it from our parents. Man, it just seems so glaringly obvious to me. When you are loved and you feel loved-I mean truly loved with physical affection, no criticism, and encouragement-you end up feeling goo about yourself. This allows healthy connections to be made in our brain when it is developing. Dude, there is plenty of research to back these ideas up. There was just a study done linking the amount of hugging a child gets to the chance they have issues with addiction. It was found that the children that recieved a healthy amount of hugging and physical touch were far less likely to have issues with addiction.

I think you're problem is the same as many, you do not want to face reality. The easy-but nevery successful in the long term-way is to simply think we are born the way we are and that is it. It's not about brainwashing or group deluded empowerment-LOL-things are much more complex and run far deeper than these things.

I wasn't upset. My feelings were not hurt. I just don't like this kind of ignorance, it pisses me off. It is exactly what keeps this world from progressing and evolving. Shit, you're the one that calls yourself "Brainfogged". You should be the first to admit that there might be something interfering with your ability to see and understand the complexity of what is going on within you and the world around you.

Sorry for not being more tactful. I have my moments when I just don't have the patience to filter my feelings.
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#14 Logan

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 07:09 AM

Two reasons why people do not succeed in therapy; they do not have a really good therapist, and they do not have the intelligence or strength to face the truth and begin to do the heavy lifting to eventually get better.
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#15 Logan

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 07:10 AM

OOps, forgot one other major reason; Not enough support
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#16 Andrey_81

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:39 AM

You could try propranolol. It's commonly used by musicians who have stage fright:

http://www.nytimes.c...?pagewanted=all
http://www.violinist...nse.cfm?ID=4816

It does have side effects which can include impotence (if you are male).
But you may not have to use it for long. Some research indicates that it may rewire your brain so you become less afraid of the situations which previously caused anxiety.

http://www.scienceda...90311103611.htm


Thank you for this and all you guys for the comments. I will try with propranolol. According to the articles about musicians (link above) I can say that I have the same problems during meetings or presentation. It's like a boost of adrenaline and my heart beats like crazy. With this beta blockers I could stop this strong hart beats and calm myself. I will use beta blockers just before this 'situations', and not on regular basis.

How much mg should I take? I don't want to take to much. What is the normal dosage to start with? Thnx.
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#17 Brainfogged

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:44 AM



Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like you understand what takes place when someone does real work with a good therapist. Its not just about talking, lol. I dont even feel like wasting my time explaining it to you, if you have half a brain, you should be able to figure it out. Also, I believe my first post mentioned group therapy. When I was in group, I saw two members make huge strides in their ability to speak up and feel good about themselves within Just a few months. Granted, they had already been doing some hard work on loving themselves more in one on one beforehand, still, it was obvious the impact group was having.

To think someone is simply born with a lack of confidence is a sign of a real deficit of deeper thinking and understanding of the complexity of the human psyche.


What´s up with the insults? My intention wasn´t to ridicule or put people down. It´s just the way I see it. My take is that biological factors is what determines our social role in life. Sure one can get deluded through group empowerment and brainwash. But when it comes to terms, only one is fit for fight. I am sorry if I struck a nerve, I can understand that this is a very sensitive subject and why someone can take things personally. My intention wasn´t to hurt your feelings Logan.

From what I´ve seen, people who go to therapy once, end up going there several times. Sure they get somewhat better when someone comes along, gives them a plan and a scheme on what to do. After they are done with their therapy and are feeling better... Well, after a few months, they are back to square one. Sometimes even a few years goes by and they don´t even acknowledge that they aren't feeling well when in fact they are miserable. But often enough, they end up back there! So question is, is it the actual therapy that works? Or the fact that someone is giving them an alternative which they believe in. Is it the mere assumption that something is happening, "a plan" that gives them a contemporary relief for the moment? Rather than the actual therapy working!?

I believe that therapy works for a short term looking from a clinical perspective. Looking more long- term, I doubt that it works.

Iv´e been to therapy. It was just a waste of time! So clearly I didn´t understand it. Enlighten me!

My take is, pills are the way to go!


Please research psychodynamic therapy and learn a little about what is really supposed to take place when one actually does the work they are supposed to. Growth is a life long process. It never happends as fast as we want it to. Unfortunately, most of us did not get the love and nurture we needed to develop properly and love ourselves the way we need to. How do you link we end up loving ourselves and learn to be confident with what we have? We learn it from our parents. Man, it just seems so glaringly obvious to me. When you are loved and you feel loved-I mean truly loved with physical affection, no criticism, and encouragement-you end up feeling goo about yourself. This allows healthy connections to be made in our brain when it is developing. Dude, there is plenty of research to back these ideas up. There was just a study done linking the amount of hugging a child gets to the chance they have issues with addiction. It was found that the children that recieved a healthy amount of hugging and physical touch were far less likely to have issues with addiction.

I think you're problem is the same as many, you do not want to face reality. The easy-but nevery successful in the long term-way is to simply think we are born the way we are and that is it. It's not about brainwashing or group deluded empowerment-LOL-things are much more complex and run far deeper than these things.

I wasn't upset. My feelings were not hurt. I just don't like this kind of ignorance, it pisses me off. It is exactly what keeps this world from progressing and evolving. Shit, you're the one that calls yourself "Brainfogged". You should be the first to admit that there might be something interfering with your ability to see and understand the complexity of what is going on within you and the world around you.

Sorry for not being more tactful. I have my moments when I just don't have the patience to filter my feelings.


This is an interesting subject. Try to discuss it in a fashionable level so we can come to a few conclusions. You need to grasp the idea that we are not children any more. And that those loving connections you speak of are for those who deserve love. Sure, we can say that it includes all, but when it comes to nature, that is not the case.

As I see it, we are adult´s and who we are and how we function is mainly a reflection of which biological standard we own, this is nothing that can be influenced by psychology so a person can adapt himself or to be fit for fight in the long run without suffering. The social value we exhibit is a reflection from that. The world is a harsh place and it is getting harder, this reflects in how we socialize, the next man conquers the other. This happens because one isn´t biologically strong enough to become socially intelligent to conquer the other and therefore he loses, he becomes weak and depressed which is a way for nature to weed out the bad genes. The stronger becomes happy because he surpassed and get´s an affirmation that he is better, this of course reflects in his state, he is confident and he is happy! Socially others acknowledge this which gives him a further sociability which improves the chances for his genes to spread.

What I am saying is that psychology gives a person a false belief that he is something he is not, when that person returns to the real world he is broken down, it might take some time but this happens instinctively. Mainly because of being the weaker and he can´t socially cope. This doesn´t happen in a state of awareness in the social realm, it´s just the way the pecking order works. People do this to each other with unaware means, although there are some jerks out there who deliberately try to make other people feel bad.

That´s what I am stating, confidence is just a mere reflection of how well one is surviving in this cruel world. Psychology is a false realm where one is nurtured in a "bubble" for a while. A lot of the psychological nurturing is just an after effect that one get´s from placebo and hope.

I believe that pills will be of aid in the future, as for now there are not so many alternatives. We have to experiment with the ones we have. Although there is the placebo problem there also...

My opinion is that psychology is based on loose theory and pseudo- science. Sure, there´s some truth´s there also, but too much is bs.

Forgive my ignorance. Hopefully I will get educated soon enough.
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#18 Logan

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:35 AM

You are underestimating the impact of parenting and our need as humans for love. There are scientific studies showing that nurture has a long term impact on brain development. Again, I believe you are looking for an easy answer, instead of facing the truth. Why would you and so many others want to think as you do? Because, it's difficult to confront inner conflicts that are painful. Sorry bro, whatever negatively affected you and whatever you did not get that you needed, as we all need, in your crucial developmental years and throughout childhood and adolescence, is still having an impact on you. There was a permanent impact that can only be influenced if you can open your mind and find the strength to confront and deal with the reality that is inside you. This is the truth.

Biology plays a major role, yes it does. But, nurture is what dictates how biology will develop. In the case of someone that is bipolar, episodes will be less likely and less severe if a child gets most of what they need.

If you want this world to stop being as cruel as it is, you will try as hard as you can to have an open mind, and see that the reasons for how we turn out in childhood, adolescence, and adulthood are far more complex than you now realize. I hope this all starts to make sense to you soon, it will only be of your benefit.
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#19 Logan

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:39 AM

Btw, there is a place for everyone in this world to feel good about themselves and confident.

I bet you are a pretty young dude. It would make sense that you are given the way you see the the world and the people in it. When we are young, it's much harder to face some things. And, we usually have not had enough time to experience those things which help to open our eyes and our hearts.
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#20 Blink

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 01:02 PM

Logan is right. Ones personality is formed through experience, and as a child you're a lot more susceptible to whatever behaviors and situations you're being exposed to. Take language for example - if the way you speak is so dependent on your upbringing, why wouldn't the rest of your personality be as well?

However I don't think that conventional therapy is very effective at dealing with some of these deeply rooted problems. Sure, talking can help you process the problems and their causes on an intellectual level, but that's often not enough. You need to be able process them on a deep emotional level too, otherwise you won't make any real change and might just fall back into your old patterns even after years of therapy.

So how does one reach these deeper levels of the psyche? For me the answer is Ayahuasca.
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#21 smithx

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 01:29 PM

How much mg should I take? I don't want to take to much. What is the normal dosage to start with? Thnx.


Wikipedia has a reference:

Performance anxiety
  • 5–10 mg 30min or 1.5hrs before and after performance, optionally 5–10 mg night before. Up to 40 mg if necessary, but side-effects may present.
See: http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/1686251

As an alternative to or in addition to drug therapy, I'd recommend learning relaxation techniques. Meditation may be helpful.

If you do psychotherapy, Cognitive Behavioral Therapy is the best short-term therapy according to studies. It can help you reframe the thoughts which may be making you anxious.

Edited by smithx, 25 March 2012 - 01:45 PM.

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#22 Nooby

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:04 PM

There's no pill.


Well.... There is.

I'll tell you what you have to do. Never stop trying and always believe that their might be something out there to suit your physiology.

Without Lexapro I am a timid little pussy. With it, people can throw whatever crap they like at me and I don't give a toss. I smile back at them and get on with my day and trust me, if people can't get to you they're fucked. You can see it in their faces that they don't stand a chance and in all honestly, disgusting human beings like this deserve to be belittled and put down.

Every majorly depressed human being should consider this route. It has done wonders for my life, especially with girls. Girls are attracted to confidence not weepy guys that are in touch with their feelings.

Lexapro is highly efficient for panic. I am at ease with the world, even around girls where normally I am pretty nervous. My mind races, I sweat, I stutter, I turn into a mess.

I'm not saying Lex is for everyone as it has taken me time to find the right dose but now I have and my brain has settled there's no going back for me. I don't have interest in being 'clean' and taking the crap that this modern day world throws at me. Human beings are cunts and it's dog eat dog. I wish the world was a nice place but it isn't. I'll do whatever is necessary to try and reach happiness in my life and thanks to Lex I actually have a genuine chance of that. I've been on it for almost a year now and don't ever plan to stop until modern day science comes up with a cure.

Edited by Nooby, 25 March 2012 - 09:08 PM.

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#23 Brainfogged

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:15 PM

You are underestimating the impact of parenting and our need as humans for love. There are scientific studies showing that nurture has a long term impact on brain development. Again, I believe you are looking for an easy answer, instead of facing the truth. Why would you and so many others want to think as you do? Because, it's difficult to confront inner conflicts that are painful. Sorry bro, whatever negatively affected you and whatever you did not get that you needed, as we all need, in your crucial developmental years and throughout childhood and adolescence, is still having an impact on you. There was a permanent impact that can only be influenced if you can open your mind and find the strength to confront and deal with the reality that is inside you. This is the truth.

Biology plays a major role, yes it does. But, nurture is what dictates how biology will develop. In the case of someone that is bipolar, episodes will be less likely and less severe if a child gets most of what they need.

If you want this world to stop being as cruel as it is, you will try as hard as you can to have an open mind, and see that the reasons for how we turn out in childhood, adolescence, and adulthood are far more complex than you now realize. I hope this all starts to make sense to you soon, it will only be of your benefit.

Btw, there is a place for everyone in this world to feel good about themselves and confident.

I bet you are a pretty young dude. It would make sense that you are given the way you see the the world and the people in it. When we are young, it's much harder to face some things. And, we usually have not had enough time to experience those things which help to open our eyes and our hearts.

Logan is right. Ones personality is formed through experience, and as a child you're a lot more susceptible to whatever behaviors and situations you're being exposed to. Take language for example - if the way you speak is so dependent on your upbringing, why wouldn't the rest of your personality be as well?

However I don't think that conventional therapy is very effective at dealing with some of these deeply rooted problems. Sure, talking can help you process the problems and their causes on an intellectual level, but that's often not enough. You need to be able process them on a deep emotional level too, otherwise you won't make any real change and might just fall back into your old patterns even after years of therapy.

So how does one reach these deeper levels of the psyche? For me the answer is Ayahuasca.


I´ve been around for a while. Sure one can go to psychology if he was socially wounded and try to make his amends with himself. But from all the psychology I have read, and experienced personally. I haven´t seen that there isn´t any real scientific data backing it up on a long term basis. As for the teaching, and then I am mainly talking about talk- group therapy is, that I don´t believe it works. I haven´t seen a real clinical approach to how it should work or how it is done. Actually the contrary, a lot of it is based on loose ends, old theories and approaches that really isn´t backed up by science.

I am just stating the fact of the world. It is the survival of the fittest, not everyone is fit for fight. Take a clinical shy kid for instance, he can go to therapy, do all the hard work and seemingly get better. I am talking about shyness from a biological perspective here, anxiety, low confidence, esteem etc. He doesn´t have any childhood issues so no idea in digging further there. He does the hard work as you say and works his way through as you point out, he appears to be better. Question is if he is actually better? Or if he just has learned to do a behavioural change, mask his symptoms to act out in his sociability without reflecting that he is actually shy at the moment. We humans are actually very good at being in a state without realising how we feel, it´s when we do improve when we understand how we felt. This is the delusion I was talking about.

Let´s get on with the story...

Then there the other guy, he has always been confident, he likes being in the centre of attention, is very good socially and has never had any issues with being who he is, or where he comes from, he is also low on empathy. He has had it rough but doesn't get down by it, actually it has made him stronger in his skills to cope. This is also mainly due to biological reasons.

In a scenario where these two meet. E.g if both were up for leadership position and had to argue with each other, prove their sociability in a social area. Which one would win do you think? Who would gradually be degraded in the social hierarchy do you think? I'm betting the shy kid would.

My viewpoint on therapy is based on as with everything else, I see it through a critical eye. I know a girl who went to therapy for three years, she popped pills and did everything she could. Well after they/she concluded that she was better and started ending her sessions, a few months passed. She tapered down her pills and a few months later. She was back there, she became the very person she was when she got there initially. This is not the only time I have seen it happen. I have seen it happen on several times. Countless of people coming out of therapy believing that they are better when in fact, they were not. And the only one´s who gained anything from it was their therapists.

Now I don't know what was up or going on in their heads, if they weren't open enough to see "the truth" whatever that means! Or that they weren´t intelligent enough to lift their heavy weights which means that they were weak. Just as you point out, and therefore will never surpass if nature doesn´t allow them to. Sadly though.

What bothers me is that these therapist´s are given a lot of money to take care of people and seemingly, they can´t prove that their work is actually helping. Why is psychotherapy perceived being a profession of science and is facilitated on clinical basis when in fact, there is no such thing going on. What if other professions worked like this, it would make the whole system collapse.What if we had a similar approach on phsysical sickness?

What I am propagating is no bullshit therapy. I think that the only reason we have these old therapies is because it´s so grained in the classic educational system which includes professors, teachers, clinicians and so fort. And it all hangs on a presumption that what they are doing, is actually giving people a good stable mental health which I don´t think happens so often that we can call it it´s well worth. They all are backing up each other but if anything, they deserve more criticism so better alternatives will take shape. It´s like it all hangs on a presumption that it works.

If you are going to therapy, have a goal, have a plan and be confident enough to criticise the therapist if you aren´t getting the help that you deserve, they do make a lot of money.
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#24 dasheenster

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 10:35 PM

What is being described sounds a lot like what I have experienced. Sadly, I do not think anything known can full my resolve these kinds of problems.

I believe it's due to a dysfunction of the SNS and CNS. Certain supplements probably ease your heart (hawthorn, coq10, fish oil, & others), and other supplements can promote GABA, which will relax you (rosmarinic acid, valerenic acid, gotu kola, ashwaganda, picamilon, theanine, and others). I wouldn't recommend using these or pharmaceuticals daily, if possible. This isn't going to fix the underlying dysfunction...the supplements will only mask the symptoms. Also, I think CBT is good for reducing stress/anxiety and perhaps even neurosis/racing heart...but it STILL doesn't correct the underlying problem. There is no miracle drug. Let's not pretend therapists or therapy groups are miracle workers either.

Edited by dasheenster, 25 March 2012 - 10:36 PM.

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#25 niner

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 03:33 AM

Wow, were having a nature vs. nurture debate in 2012? Logan is saying it's part nature, part nurture, and nurture can help some when nature's not quite right. Brainfogged seems to be saying that it's all nature. Brainfogged said:

And that those loving connections you speak of are for those who deserve love. Sure, we can say that it includes all, but when it comes to nature, that is not the case.


Uh, do you mean that the kid with the cold mother just "didn't deserve" love? Or do you mean that the shy kid doesn't deserve to procreate? I hope you don't mean the former, and if you mean the latter, well, humans have societies now. We aren't apes any more.

The science is on Logan's side.
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#26 Andrey_81

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 06:13 AM


How much mg should I take? I don't want to take to much. What is the normal dosage to start with? Thnx.


Wikipedia has a reference:

Performance anxiety
  • 5–10 mg 30min or 1.5hrs before and after performance, optionally 5–10 mg night before. Up to 40 mg if necessary, but side-effects may present.


Thanks for this. I've manged to get propranolol. I will have a chance to try it next week (meeting that usually makes me very anxious and my heart beats like it will jump out). I will try as you sad, 10 mg 30 min before the 'performance'. Wish me luck :)

Btw, what do you think about bromazepam? This should also reduce my fear and make be fearless and insensitive.
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#27 Andrey_81

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 06:59 AM

.. I know guy´s who´s always had it rough but still managed to pull it through. I know people who are butt ugly, who still always have a certain swagger. I know people who always hear shit flying their direction but they don´t give a shit, it just bounces off. I know guy´s who would fight off anyone despite their opponents size, number or whatever. These people were born confident. Same with girls. Some know how to melt girls with the palms of their hands, others aren´t able to make a connection even if the girl comes with a manual. Some people are born to be confident, some aren´t...


I second this. Some people are born with 'invisible shield' around them. I never understood why some people I know are so full of confidence even then when they speak about something they don't know a shit about. You just can't make them feel ashamed. For example, some people don't know how to speak foreign languages (this is the usual situation with politicians in my country) but they will speak pigeon English with US president on TV and the whole world will make fun of them, but they will remain calm, without hot flashes and redness. I can speak English, German and Spanish but it's very hard for me to communicate in my office surrounded with many people. I feel afraid...''what will happen if I say something wrong, wrong grammar or expression, I will be so ashamed''... Just can't believe how some people can be so resistant to everything. I'm so jealous. I would give everything to be like them.

Other example... When boss of the company is sitting in front of me I get anxious and restless. I afraid that we will ask me something I don't know, and I will again be ashamed. When I was young they used to teach me to respect the adults, and this is something I'm doing, but sometimes this 'respect' is to strong, and I'm blocked in front of strong personalities. Some people I know are so phlegmatic. It doesn't meter who is sitting opposite of them. They are calm and confident, surrounded with this invisible shield. Why can't I be like them? Why? I'm also smart and capable. It seams that I'm just born this way. There must be something in the genes. My mother is just like me, so sensitive but good as angel. There is expression here in Croatia that says ''A good person is a stupid person''. It means that if you are good by nature everybody around you will use your personality and they will trample you whenever they can, and you will loose your confidence. Maybe this happened to me, I was just too good to everybody...

Edited by Andrey_81, 26 March 2012 - 07:03 AM.

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#28 Brainfogged

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 07:22 AM

Wow, were having a nature vs. nurture debate in 2012? Logan is saying it's part nature, part nurture, and nurture can help some when nature's not quite right. Brainfogged seems to be saying that it's all nature. Brainfogged said:

And that those loving connections you speak of are for those who deserve love. Sure, we can say that it includes all, but when it comes to nature, that is not the case.


Uh, do you mean that the kid with the cold mother just "didn't deserve" love? Or do you mean that the shy kid doesn't deserve to procreate? I hope you don't mean the former, and if you mean the latter, well, humans have societies now. We aren't apes any more.

The science is on Logan's side.


Sure psychology can help if there was psychological problems in someones childhood. But the factor l am talking about is that some are more proned to anxiety, depression and other problem because their biology is just built that way. Yes we live more civilized nowadays, that doesnt mean that we are civil, human testing still occurs.

I am not saying that things are merely biological, what I am saying that if one has both a system that responds badly to stress, and has had it hard socially. Then I dont believe in talk therapy. These people will soon enough be vulnerable because they are getting the wrong kind of therapy, therapy that doesnt build real reciliance. Although psychological reciliance lasts only so long, one needs to be fit also otherwise the stressresponse gets too much to handle if the situation gets out of hand. Not all can be fighters, not all can be leaders. Thats the way things are!
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#29 hippocampus

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 07:26 PM

Cognitive-behavioral therapy would be better than psychodynamic if you ask me (I study psychology) - progressive desensitization is very science-based, however in case of stage-fright it is difficult to perform. But, if we're talking about self-confidence, that's completely different story, that means that you actually feel bad about yourself and not only that you have strong fight-or-flight response.
Vitamin C (up to 1 gram) can help with adrenaline, kava-kava is good short-term solution. However, I think that long-term solutions are better, because your fear may only be a symptom of something larger. Zinc may also help you (long-term) - it's good against anxiety, depression and boosts testosterone (which is important for self-confidence). Aniracetam and piracetam (short-term solution) are effective for some people, but piracetam may worsen your anxiety. Also, magnesium is good against anxiety, but if you don't get it enough from your diet you should supplement it every day. Also methylfolate makes me very calm - I do not take it every day, but on the days I do I feel better (I take 400 mcg, but if you're only planning to take it occasionally, larger doses may be ok).

Edited by hippocampus, 26 March 2012 - 07:27 PM.

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#30 Logan

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 08:51 PM

Cognitive-behavioral therapy would be better than psychodynamic if you ask me (I study psychology) - progressive desensitization is very science-based, however in case of stage-fright it is difficult to perform. But, if we're talking about self-confidence, that's completely different story, that means that you actually feel bad about yourself and not only that you have strong fight-or-flight response.
Vitamin C (up to 1 gram) can help with adrenaline, kava-kava is good short-term solution. However, I think that long-term solutions are better, because your fear may only be a symptom of something larger. Zinc may also help you (long-term) - it's good against anxiety, depression and boosts testosterone (which is important for self-confidence). Aniracetam and piracetam (short-term solution) are effective for some people, but piracetam may worsen your anxiety. Also, magnesium is good against anxiety, but if you don't get it enough from your diet you should supplement it every day. Also methylfolate makes me very calm - I do not take it every day, but on the days I do I feel better (I take 400 mcg, but if you're only planning to take it occasionally, larger doses may be ok).


You study psychology, don't you think that if you have developed a flight/fright reaction to certain situations, you likely also do not have a good self esteem or strong self confidence based on healthy aspects of persona??? I believe CBT is very valuable, but psychodynamic therapy is the only true way to get us to heal from the inside out more permanently.

I do think the OP would benefit greatly from a 2.5 to 5 mg dose of Lexapro. And, if they are strong enough, insightful enough, and willing to do the work, they will benefit from seeing a good therapist. This will be what really makes a significant life long positive impact on succeeding in having healthy relationships-with family, friends, romantic interests, and yourself.
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