64 replies to this topic

[skrmn]

Hi, I'd like to hear your input and explanations on my symptoms I've had for some time and possible approaches:

- I am pretty much unable to make a start on complex tasks (programming, studying). Instant blockade on thinking about them.
- Even if I get a start, no momentum develops
- Hard to get started on everyday's tasks, exercise
- No drive. Also no drive to get out (partying), low libido
- Generally tired, sleep is not refreshing (8 hours), foggy brain
- Generally in a good mood, stable (almost too stable, hard to get excited about anything really)
- Only starting into a completely new topic (e.g. new programming framework, some other topic) gets me somewhat excited for a few days but that fades away quickly

- Consuming coffee has no effect on motivation on me (1-2 liters/day). I enjoy it (good coffee), but no effect. Can quit drinking it without too much effort for a few days. Usually come back to it. Hardly react to it physically (sometimes a perception of warmth, but no jitters, etc). A few years ago it had the effect of making me go out and run.
- Smoked a few times in the past years (1 or 2 packs in a day or two, then no smoking for several months). Used it to fuel exam preparation). Had a motivating effect, but not anymore (no sensation of a high anymore). Not addictive to me.
- A few drinks sometimes, nothing serious, nothing regular
- Family history of Parkinson's Disease (starting at about age 65)
- I feel, I have a relatively low tolerance to exertion (sprinting, resistance exercise). No problem doing endurance exercise in the summer (27 km/h for a few hours on a bike).

I am in my late twenties and tried this in the last few weeks:
- L-Tyrosin: No effect. Maybe a little. But nothing helpful
- DLPA: No effect. Maybe a little. But nothing helpful
- Lots of greens, DHA+EPA (1-2 g), Magnesium, Matcha tea, ginger, blue berries, generally no junk food. No effect
- Manganese: No effect
- Astaxanthin: No effect
- Cocoa: No effect
- Cut back on coffee to 2 mugs per day (quitting coffee doesn't help any)

Some of these improved some of the tiredness (the food stuff)

I am generally pretty fit, maybe around 12-14% body fat. Used to be able to go with little sleep (not anymore). I have a robust metabolism (no blood sugar swings, no known allergies (beyond Chinese Restaurant Syndrome - burning/tingling/warm sensation in the neck after some meals)

So maybe you could point me to a few things, I could try. Or at least explain some of this

Thanks!

EDIT1 (some more observations):
- Was the most productive in the late hours (too tired nowadays)
- Procrastinator, usually crammed for exams at the last possible minute
- Somewhat reclusive, but socially competent, introverted
- Basically feel healthy, but no use since brain-tired/without drive all the time
- Tried Vitamin D (1000 I.U. spray a few times per day), too. No effect, but ordered a different supplement/higher dose (LEF)
- Scandinavian/Northern-German roots

Edited by skrmn, 07 January 2013 - 03:05 AM.

[sparkk51]

Sounds exactly like me

been looking for something that not only makes me motivated to DO something but also something that I wont tolerate.

[norepinephrine]

Have you considered uridine?

[Dissolvedissolve]

We've been talking about similar issues in the anticipatory anhedonia thread, which you can find here: http://www.longecity...hedonia-thread/

Unfortunately, I haven't found any supplemental options that work. I've tried tyrosine, ephedrine, rhodiola rosea, uridine monophosphate, vitamin D, various racetams (pi-, oxi-, ani-, prami-, and noopept), fish oil, and various vitamins and minerals (Mg, Zn, 5-MTHF, methylcobalamin), all with no effect. There are many more I can't recall at that moment. I get some temporary benefits from caffeine, nicotine (gum), and armodafinil (only minimal improvement). I've gotten worsening of symptoms with any pro-serotonergic or pro-GABAergic substances, so I'd suggest you stay away from those, although I'm oversimplifying since different subtypes of serotonin receptors may be "good" or "bad" for treating this issue.

I've speculated that some feasible pharmaceutical options are selegiline, pramipexole, stimulants (methylphenidate or dextroamphetamine). Wellbutrin and fluoxetine are two readily-available options with some possible utility. I've discussed the pharmacology and risks and benefits of all these routes in the thread, and some individuals have offered feedback on different treatment options. You'd learn a decent bit if you spend a moment reading through it.

Edited by Dissolvedissolve, 07 January 2013 - 05:34 AM.

[abelard lindsay]

Have you tried Catuaba, a Brazillian herb? In my subjective opinion it seems to work differently from most motivation/dopamine supplements. It's also a potent ant-viral/anti-bacterial.

Edited by abelard lindsay, 07 January 2013 - 06:26 AM.

[NeuroNootropic]

Sounds almost like myself. I find 1000 mg of Maca root to help subtlety motivate me.

I would love to hear of a success story for treating low motivation because I feel like I'm going to be this way for the rest of my life.

[MrHappy]

I would also +1 on uridine. You'll need to lose the caffeine, though.

[RJ100]

- I am pretty much unable to make a start on complex tasks (programming, studying). Instant blockade on thinking about them.
- Even if I get a start, no momentum develops
- Hard to get started on everyday's tasks, exercise
- No drive. Also no drive to get out (partying), low libido
- Generally tired, sleep is not refreshing (8 hours), foggy brain
- Generally in a good mood, stable (almost too stable, hard to get excited about anything really)
- Only starting into a completely new topic (e.g. new programming framework, some other topic) gets me somewhat excited for a few days but that fades away quickly

- Consuming coffee has no effect on motivation on me (1-2 liters/day). I enjoy it (good coffee), but no effect. Can quit drinking it without too much effort for a few days. Usually come back to it. Hardly react to it physically (sometimes a perception of warmth, but no jitters, etc). A few years ago it had the effect of making me go out and run.
- Smoked a few times in the past years (1 or 2 packs in a day or two, then no smoking for several months). Used it to fuel exam preparation). Had a motivating effect, but not anymore (no sensation of a high anymore). Not addictive to me.
- A few drinks sometimes, nothing serious, nothing regular
- Family history of Parkinson's Disease (starting at about age 65)
- I feel, I have a relatively low tolerance to exertion (sprinting, resistance exercise). No problem doing endurance exercise in the summer (27 km/h for a few hours on a bike).


EDIT1 (some more observations):
- Was the most productive in the late hours (too tired nowadays)
- Procrastinator, usually crammed for exams at the last possible minute
- Somewhat reclusive, but socially competent, introverted
- Basically feel healthy, but no use since brain-tired/without drive all the time
- Tried Vitamin D (1000 I.U. spray a few times per day), too. No effect, but ordered a different supplement/higher dose (LEF)
- Scandinavian/Northern-German roots

Interesting to read this - I'd say about 90% of this describes me, as well.

Unfortunately I've yet to find anything that really helps. I tried lots of things, including uridine, which had a negativve effect on me, perhaps due to methylation issues. Once my 23andme data is back I should know more.

The Anticipatory Anhedonia Thread is interesting. I just connected it to vacation and how I couldn't be bothered with the jacuzzi (even though I enjoy really it) because going to the room to change into my bathing suit required too much effort. I have wants but I have zero drive to devote time/energy to achieve them.

[skrmn]

Noticed another thing today. Having only slept 3 hours, my motivation to actually get things done was not great, but workable. Someone made the connection between high stress hormone output (lack of sleep) and motivation/drive. Obviously not a permanent solution. But adds to the puzzle for me.

I would also +1 on uridine. You'll need to lose the caffeine, though.

Does the caffeine somehow interfere with uridine or did you mean it as a separate advice?
What about Citicoline in that regard (CDP-Choline)? Could not quite extract a preference for one of the two from the threads.

Sounds almost like myself. I find 1000 mg of Maca root to help subtlety motivate me.

I would love to hear of a success story for treating low motivation because I feel like I'm going to be this way for the rest of my life.

Are you taking Maca regularly or just in some situations? What product do you use?

[Guardian4981]

Have you had your thyroid tested?

I shouldn't even ask because I have not had mine tested and dislike the medical community.

Anyways, I have been similar to you, although I am not where I want to be I will say I believe I suffered from low T3 levels which I have since corrected with selenium supplementation.

I now feel like my body is working more optimally though my mind still has some troubles which is up next for me to zero in on and hence I am going to the uridine thread next to post.

[skrmn]

Hi, thanks for your reply.

What type of dosage and selenium and time frame for effects are we talking about?

I took this for some time (selenium in it, http://www.nowfoods....ent/M013101.htm). Not really because I thought, I had thyroid problems. Had no effect.

What are the physical effects I would be looking for? My body temperature seems fine. I tolerate cold and heat very well, I do not freeze and I do not not sweat. Only thing I notice is a bit of cold feet in the later evening (it's winter, though and no nightly heating). Wound healing is not very fast around the feet as well.

The auto-immune low-T3 variety seems a bit drastic

Have you had your thyroid tested?

I shouldn't even ask because I have not had mine tested and dislike the medical community.

Anyways, I have been similar to you, although I am not where I want to be I will say I believe I suffered from low T3 levels which I have since corrected with selenium supplementation.

I now feel like my body is working more optimally though my mind still has some troubles which is up next for me to zero in on and hence I am going to the uridine thread next to post.

[lourdaud]

Hm, may be a bit redundant to adress it as a dopaminergic problem I think, all those symptoms could result from low levels of noradrenaline as well, or from low levels of both neurotransmitters for that matter..
I'd say go for bupropion, it'll help with all the issues you describe. It's also pretty mild and free from side-effects.

Btw, when saying you've been having these problems for a while, are you talking about months or years? Because if it's typical SAD you may also want to check out bright light therapy.

[NeuroNootropic]

Noticed another thing today. Having only slept 3 hours, my motivation to actually get things done was not great, but workable. Someone made the connection between high stress hormone output (lack of sleep) and motivation/drive. Obviously not a permanent solution. But adds to the puzzle for me.

I would also +1 on uridine. You'll need to lose the caffeine, though.

Does the caffeine somehow interfere with uridine or did you mean it as a separate advice?
What about Citicoline in that regard (CDP-Choline)? Could not quite extract a preference for one of the two from the threads.

Sounds almost like myself. I find 1000 mg of Maca root to help subtlety motivate me.

I would love to hear of a success story for treating low motivation because I feel like I'm going to be this way for the rest of my life.

Are you taking Maca regularly or just in some situations? What product do you use?

I take Maca regularly, every day in fact. I use NOW Foods Maca root extract. I'm not sure why it works, but Maca contains a lot of nutrients. It also has Uridine and quercetin. I was actually going to do a post on my nootropic site summarizing how maca works, but never got the drive or energy to do so. Here are some studies I found that I was going to use for my post:

http://www.biomedcen...1472-6882/6/23/

Although' class='bbc_url' title='External link' rel='nofollow external'>http://www.biomedcentral.com/1472-6882/6/23/']Although Maca has been traditionally described to be favorable for fertility [1], other properties have also been scientifically reported. For instance, men taking gelatinized Maca show lower scores for the Hamilton Rating Scale for Depression after four weeks of treatment [15,16]. Moreover, it was demonstrated the anti-stress activity of a methanolic extract of Maca in rats [17]. However, nothing is known about the differential effect of varieties of Maca.

In the forced swimming test, we observed that all three varieties, Yellow, Red and Black Maca reduced the immobility time in OVX mice without differences between them. The antidepressant activity of Maca could be due to the presence of phytoestrogens such as quercetin and anthocyanins. Quercetin presents antidepressant activity [42]. However, it is possible that other principles may be acting as anti-depressants, since in previous study it has been demonstrated that scores for depression were reduced after Maca treatment without changes in serum estradiol levels [3,16].

→ source (external link)

http://www.ncbi.nlm....0,f1000m,isrctn
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/20447436

[MrHappy]

Sounds good. A lot of things contain uridine (it's derived from RNA), but do you know how much is in it? I suspect you wouldn't reach the supplemental dose range, as when taken separately.

[NeuroNootropic]

Unfortunately, I don't know how much is in it. There's not a lot of information on Maca's contents. Though, Maca contains methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydro-beta-carboline-3-carboxylic acid which is thought to work on the CNS, but I haven't read anything on what exactly it does.

[dsohei]

My tcm doc would say "lack of kidney Yang" or something along those lines. Every persons condition is unique tho and has multiple factors influencing the daily experience.
Helping the thyroid and liver convert and create enough t3 is key, so that the body can use the t3 to create daily cortisol. Beyond that healthy diet (for you), personal meditation and relaxation practices will support an obviously overwhelmed system.

[Galaxyshock]

Consider trying Jiaogulan (an adaptogenic herb) extract. It has a "reconnecting"-like effect to dopaminergic neurons and has been shown to prevent Parkinson's disease ( http://www.mdpi.com/...-3049/15/4/2814 ). In my experience it has the smartest and best dopamine-modulating effect of all herbs and doesn't have the problems of direct stimulants. If it's not enough a stimulant could be considered perhaps with the addition of CILTEP-supplements. But regardless Jiaogulan can help as an add-on especially if you may be prone to Parkinson's disease.

Edited by Galaxyshock, 13 January 2013 - 11:33 AM.

[Heh]

Heh, this sounds exactly like the problems I'm being harassed with (don't naturally have). Maybe a combination Pramiracetam+Noopept+Centrophenoxine would work. Or you could try one of the amphetamines (try it out first, no need wasting money), or Modafinil (can try the cheaper Adrafinil first).

Either way, you can water/juice fast, fix your diet, then run a course of Cerebrolysin (5-10ml 5 days a week for 4 weeks) to maybe help reset whatever's screwed up.

Edited by Joel, 13 January 2013 - 01:35 PM.

[nupi]

Consider trying Jiaogulan (an adaptogenic herb) extract. It has a "reconnecting"-like effect to dopaminergic neurons and has been shown to prevent Parkinson's disease ( http://www.mdpi.com/...-3049/15/4/2814 ). In my experience it has the smartest and best dopamine-modulating effect of all herbs and doesn't have the problems of direct stimulants. If it's not enough a stimulant could be considered perhaps with the addition of CILTEP-supplements. But regardless Jiaogulan can help as an add-on especially if you may be prone to Parkinson's disease.

I have some Paradise Herbs Jiaogulan and American Ginseng on the way. I am still wondering how exactly the Jiaogulan works but since it does not seem to be a MAOI, it should be safe to try, in any case.

[@now]

My energy goes up if I take enough AlphaGPC (1-2x a day 1-2x 300mg), optionally with Pramiracetam (300mg) and/or Oxiracetam (600mg). And the recall, memory, etc. is all "on top". Adding noopept (after 1-2 weeks build-up) can be added as well - it works wonders for my motivation but makes me a bit moody. And of course your regular multivitamin and fish oil.

Sulbutiamine works highly energizing as well, but always makes me moody as hell. Finally, genuine phenylpiracetam (Phenotropil) always works, but you can't do that too often.

But the three most important things are:
1) work out
2) sleep enough (you seem to do that)
3) diet

Without those three, everything else is futile.

[Dissolvedissolve]

Consider trying Jiaogulan (an adaptogenic herb) extract. It has a "reconnecting"-like effect to dopaminergic neurons and has been shown to prevent Parkinson's disease ( http://www.mdpi.com/...-3049/15/4/2814 ). In my experience it has the smartest and best dopamine-modulating effect of all herbs and doesn't have the problems of direct stimulants. If it's not enough a stimulant could be considered perhaps with the addition of CILTEP-supplements. But regardless Jiaogulan can help as an add-on especially if you may be prone to Parkinson's disease.

I know Jiaogulan and ginseng have similar substituents. Could you offer any detailed comparisons between the two? If I've tried neither, do you have a recommendation for which to start a with?

[Galaxyshock]

Consider trying Jiaogulan (an adaptogenic herb) extract. It has a "reconnecting"-like effect to dopaminergic neurons and has been shown to prevent Parkinson's disease ( http://www.mdpi.com/...-3049/15/4/2814 ). In my experience it has the smartest and best dopamine-modulating effect of all herbs and doesn't have the problems of direct stimulants. If it's not enough a stimulant could be considered perhaps with the addition of CILTEP-supplements. But regardless Jiaogulan can help as an add-on especially if you may be prone to Parkinson's disease.

I know Jiaogulan and ginseng have similar substituents. Could you offer any detailed comparisons between the two? If I've tried neither, do you have a recommendation for which to start a with?

Unfortunately I can't give detailed information yet, I haven't looked into these herbs that much. I'm planning to start a website and get deeper into the science behind adaptogens, their use and gathering of anecdotes. Based on my experiences though I would recommend to start with Jiaogulan because of its unique effect on dopaminergic signaling and faster onset of effects. I think the term "immortality herb" could stem from its affinity at certain dopamine-receptors perhaps responsible for the feeling of "new and novelty" and "alive" (D3). Panax Ginseng tends to require longer time for its therapeutic effects but could be superior in some other areas. Both have a lot of similar benefits though.

[NeuroNootropic]

Consider trying Jiaogulan (an adaptogenic herb) extract. It has a "reconnecting"-like effect to dopaminergic neurons and has been shown to prevent Parkinson's disease ( http://www.mdpi.com/...-3049/15/4/2814 ). In my experience it has the smartest and best dopamine-modulating effect of all herbs and doesn't have the problems of direct stimulants. If it's not enough a stimulant could be considered perhaps with the addition of CILTEP-supplements. But regardless Jiaogulan can help as an add-on especially if you may be prone to Parkinson's disease.

I know Jiaogulan and ginseng have similar substituents. Could you offer any detailed comparisons between the two? If I've tried neither, do you have a recommendation for which to start a with?

Unfortunately I can't give detailed information yet, I haven't looked into these herbs that much. I'm planning to start a website and get deeper into the science behind adaptogens, their use and gathering of anecdotes. Based on my experiences though I would recommend to start with Jiaogulan because of its unique effect on dopaminergic signaling and faster onset of effects. I think the term "immortality herb" could stem from its affinity at certain dopamine-receptors perhaps responsible for the feeling of "new and novelty" and "alive" (D3). Panax Ginseng tends to require longer time for its therapeutic effects but could be superior in some other areas. Both have a lot of similar benefits though.

You mean like my site? I'll make you an editor if you want. I've been planning on working on it for months now, but I just can't find the drive or energy to do so.

From my experience with Panax Ginseng, it wasn't all that dopaminergic. It did nothing for anhedonia, motivation and drive, energy, nor memory. Also, it's estrogenic:

We' class='bbc_url' title='External link' rel='nofollow external'>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15240639']We studied the estrogenic activity of a component of Panax ginseng, ginsenoside-Rb1. The activity of ginsenoside-Rb1 was characterized in a transient transfection system, using estrogen receptor isoforms and estrogen-responsive luciferase plasmids, in COS monkey kidney cells. Ginsenoside-Rb1 activated both alpha and beta estrogen receptors in a dose-dependent manner with maximal activity observed at 100 microm, the highest concentration examined. Activation was inhibited by the estrogen receptor antagonist ICI 182,780, indicating that the effects were mediated through the estrogen receptor. Treatment with 17beta-estradiol or ginsenoside-Rb1 increased expression of the progesterone receptor, pS2, and estrogen receptor in MCF-7 cells and of AP-1-driven luciferase genes in COS cells. Although these data suggest that it is functionally very similar to 17beta-estradiol, ginsenoside-Rb1 failed to displace specific binding of [(3)H]17beta-estradiol from estrogen receptors in MCF-7 whole-cell ligand binding assays. Our results indicate that the estrogen-like activity of ginsenoside-Rb1 is independent of direct estrogen receptor association.

→ source (external link)

[BLimitless]

Protip: stop whacking off or any other compulsive habits you have

This is not an issue you fix with supplements. It is an issue you fix by reducing Delta-FosB in the brain. The concentration impairment is due to consistent high intensity dopamine burst activity typically driven by novelty seeking behaviours.

A correctly calibrated dopamine system provides relatively large spikes for small but significant rewards (e.g. nailing down a guitar chord or debugging a snippet of code). Constant high intensity dopamine activity will destroy this sensitive calibration and you will cease to get the dopamine spikes necessary to drive you to learn things; as it literally reduces your mental grit, your ability to sit down and grind away at a task until you reach the solution. After all: why do that when you have an instant dopamine explosion attainable through easier means? That's the role of Delta-FosB: the inner sirens that cause a sailor of the ripples of the universe to crash against the rocks of suffering.

This is no different to being a crack addict or a meth junkie. The only difference is that one ridiculous compulsion is socially acceptable while these same hypocrites will look down on methamphetamine users, totally unaware of how essentially identical their brain chemistries are to each other.


Everything else listed in this thread is secondary to this. It's the harsh truth but then the truth shall set you free.

Edited by BLimitless, 14 January 2013 - 07:20 PM.

[skrmn]

Well, it's not jacking off - I can assure you :-)

Of course, internet surfing (in some form or another) is a similar activity pattern, if I get you right. Obivously, surfing the nets and passively consuming content is one of the things I am capable of when in that kind of mental state.
On the other hand, playing RTS games (which I don't do to a great extent) is already too hard in that mental state.

And even then, I would expect 1-2 weeks of bidaily endurance exercise to somewhat improve the brain (seeing how it takes a lot of effort to get started on it and the time off computer, etc). Or going for 1h walks. Not a cure - but improvement. I did not get that experience.

OTOH I have a great burden on me since I have to finish my degree that I have struggled with for years. But I cannot muster up the energy to begin that 6 month of intense work. The question is - is there a drug that can help you overcome this kind of burden and help reset your brain wiring/chemistry.

And then - how to get away from the bad idling habit of surfing the internet, when the alternative is other distracting acitivities or to begin a hard piece of work. What can push you over this hurdle?

Thanks for the insight, so far.

Protip: stop whacking off or any other compulsive habits you have

This is not an issue you fix with supplements. It is an issue you fix by reducing Delta-FosB in the brain. The concentration impairment is due to consistent high intensity dopamine burst activity typically driven by novelty seeking behaviours.

A correctly calibrated dopamine system provides relatively large spikes for small but significant rewards (e.g. nailing down a guitar chord or debugging a snippet of code). Constant high intensity dopamine activity will destroy this sensitive calibration and you will cease to get the dopamine spikes necessary to drive you to learn things; as it literally reduces your mental grit, your ability to sit down and grind away at a task until you reach the solution. After all: why do that when you have an instant dopamine explosion attainable through easier means? That's the role of Delta-FosB: the inner sirens that cause a sailor of the ripples of the universe to crash against the rocks of suffering.

This is no different to being a crack addict or a meth junkie. The only difference is that one ridiculous compulsion is socially acceptable while these same hypocrites will look down on methamphetamine users, totally unaware of how essentially identical their brain chemistries are to each other.


Everything else listed in this thread is secondary to this. It's the harsh truth but then the truth shall set you free.

[Olon]

Minocycline improves drive in schizophrenics and protects dopaminergic neurons in parkinson models.
Alternatively curcumin could be considered (dopaminergic neuron protection and MAO inhibition).
And stay away from stimulants.

[Galaxyshock]

Minocycline improves drive in schizophrenics and protects dopaminergic neurons in parkinson models.
Alternatively curcumin could be considered (dopaminergic neuron protection and MAO inhibition).
And stay away from stimulants.

A broad spectrum immunesuppressing tetracycline-antibiotic is fine for totally off-label use but any stimulant is unquestionable?

[BLimitless]

Well, it's not jacking off - I can assure you :-)

Of course, internet surfing (in some form or another) is a similar activity pattern, if I get you right. Obivously, surfing the nets and passively consuming content is one of the things I am capable of when in that kind of mental state.
On the other hand, playing RTS games (which I don't do to a great extent) is already too hard in that mental state.

And even then, I would expect 1-2 weeks of bidaily endurance exercise to somewhat improve the brain (seeing how it takes a lot of effort to get started on it and the time off computer, etc). Or going for 1h walks. Not a cure - but improvement. I did not get that experience.

OTOH I have a great burden on me since I have to finish my degree that I have struggled with for years. But I cannot muster up the energy to begin that 6 month of intense work. The question is - is there a drug that can help you overcome this kind of burden and help reset your brain wiring/chemistry.

And then - how to get away from the bad idling habit of surfing the internet, when the alternative is other distracting acitivities or to begin a hard piece of work. What can push you over this hurdle?

Thanks for the insight, so far.

Two things will help:


1.) Iboga
2.) Meditation

Practice meditation as often as possible. This is NOT a supplement solvable issue unless your body balance itself is whack. This is purely a reward system miscalibration, every dopaminergic supplement will only add to the imbalance by reinforcing your destructive behaviours.

Let's present an analogy -


Problem: Drug addict has run out of money to buy drugs
Solution: Stop using the damn drugs
NOT a solution: Feed money into his bank account so he can now keep buying drugs


Meditation will push you beyond this hurdle. It is a direct therapy, it is infinitely more effective than any supplement you can get because meditation IS the calibration of the reward system. Sit in meditation for 30 seconds. When you can do 30 seconds, then hold it for a minute. Then for 2 minutes, then for 5, then for 10, 15, 30. 45, 1hr, 2hr, 4hr, 8hr. If you can do a full 24hr silence then damn! My advice would have been rendered obsolete in such a case (it's not remotely rare though! thousands of monks in far off countries do this every day or every so often).


Anyway, the mere act of meditating will teach you how to sit still and this hurdle will dissolve by itself. Willpower is a muscle, and willpower is a battery. Give it some strength training.


That bidaily endurance exercise is near useless if the time allocated ratio of exercise:impulsive behaviours is heavily skewed in favour of impulsivity. This is like a posture defect. A person might do 15 mins of stretches to correct their posture. Then they sit down on the computer for 8 hours. Laughable!

Edited by BLimitless, 14 January 2013 - 09:07 PM.

[RJ100]

Protip: stop whacking off or any other compulsive habits you have

This is not an issue you fix with supplements. It is an issue you fix by reducing Delta-FosB in the brain. The concentration impairment is due to consistent high intensity dopamine burst activity typically driven by novelty seeking behaviours.

A correctly calibrated dopamine system provides relatively large spikes for small but significant rewards (e.g. nailing down a guitar chord or debugging a snippet of code). Constant high intensity dopamine activity will destroy this sensitive calibration and you will cease to get the dopamine spikes necessary to drive you to learn things; as it literally reduces your mental grit, your ability to sit down and grind away at a task until you reach the solution. After all: why do that when you have an instant dopamine explosion attainable through easier means? That's the role of Delta-FosB: the inner sirens that cause a sailor of the ripples of the universe to crash against the rocks of suffering.

This is no different to being a crack addict or a meth junkie. The only difference is that one ridiculous compulsion is socially acceptable while these same hypocrites will look down on methamphetamine users, totally unaware of how essentially identical their brain chemistries are to each other.


Everything else listed in this thread is secondary to this. It's the harsh truth but then the truth shall set you free.

"Constant high intensity dopamine activity" certainly can be an issue, but it's not the sole cause. I do not and have not ever engaged in a high amount of "dopamine burst activity".

[Olon]

A broad spectrum immunesuppressing tetracycline-antibiotic is fine for totally off-label use but any stimulant is unquestionable?

Dopamine metabolism is not healthy for cells, and with a family history of Parkinson one could assume that you have already lost some of them.