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Lostfalco's Extensive Nootropic Experiments [Curated]

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#1831 Jochen

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Posted 21 February 2014 - 11:52 AM

have any people had problems with vasodilatory headaches? I did a bit longer lasering than usual last night, still under 1 minute per spot..but today i've had a pretty bad migraine type headache, with feelings of slightly low blood pressure


that is interesting, for me it is the exact opposite.

I am prone to migraines, but when I use a bionasal laser I can properly control the migraine. (tDCS does help as well for those cases when the migraine does break through a bit).

Since starting tDCS and Bionasal LLT I have had no severe migraines and only had 1 minor migraine (actually yesterday) which I could immediately 'control' with the above mentioned combination.

What do you use for your migraine symptoms?

#1832 Adaptogen

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Posted 22 February 2014 - 12:39 AM

I don't usually suffer from them, but on the occasions that i do, a high dose of theanine (500-800mg) seems to work as good as anything. I'm not really sure why this is the case, as I would assume theanine is also a vasodilator.

I'm currently out of theanine, but i drank a few cups of strong tea and the cerebral vasoconstriction from the caffeine seemed to solve my headache pretty much immediately.

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#1833 alpal

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Posted 22 February 2014 - 05:39 PM

Day 2 using this for lllt...
http://www.ebay.com/...=item232c0ac99b

It's 850nm, should I still get cognitive benefit?

I used the vetrolaser a while ago and the effect I feel is similar but weaker, which is good because I stopped vetrolaser because it made by brain too lazy and full of serotonin and strangely affected.

Do LEDs that are at 850nm wavelength still actually emit a range of wavelengths including the one lostfalco recommends (810)?

#1834 Razor444

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 01:07 PM

Day 2 using this for lllt...
http://www.ebay.com/...=item232c0ac99b

It's 850nm, should I still get cognitive benefit?

I used the vetrolaser a while ago and the effect I feel is similar but weaker, which is good because I stopped vetrolaser because it made by brain too lazy and full of serotonin and strangely affected.

Do LEDs that are at 850nm wavelength still actually emit a range of wavelengths including the one lostfalco recommends (810)?


850nm is recommended on Lostfalco's profile page; And the unit you link is also the one recommended on said page. So, that's correct.

850nm is the current primary recommendation, I believe.

#1835 Razor444

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 01:19 PM

Lostfalco, other than the wavelength (i.e. 850nm) and number of LEDs, what other parameters should one look for in a device?

I'm looking at this 48 LED unit, and this 140 LED unit. You mentioned them on page 29 of this thread.

I want to check I'm not missing anything, for obvious reasons!

#1836 Razor444

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 11:27 PM

The other parameter is power density.

Is the power density calculation done using the size of each individual LED, or the size of the collection of LEDs (the LEDs on the board)?

As an example, with the 140 LED unit in the forum post above (post #1836), there's the following product description:
Built-in sensor
Illuminating range: Detecting range is 80m, viewing range is 60m (outdoor)
Definition Consumed power: 18W
Wave length : 850nM
Structure: All weather aluminum and reinforced glass
Power: DC 12V 1500mA
Power Supply : AC 100V-240V / DC 12V
Size: 17x13x11cm.

Would I take the wattage (18W) and the size of the board from here (17cmx13cm = 221cm^2)?

That would give: 18watts/221cm^21 = 0.081W/cm^2 (to 3 decimal places). Or 81mW/cm^2.

Or, would I need to find out the specs for the individual LEDs, to calculate the correct power density?

And even if that calculation's correct, there's a couple of other pertinent questions that spring to mind:
1. Is the consumed power (18W) the same as the total power output by the LEDs?
2. Is that the correct size of the LED array, or is that inclusive of the units outer casing, also?

#1837 Razor444

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 02:58 PM

Some videos for those who are less au fait with transcranial LLLT/photobiomodulation.







#1838 Razor444

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 06:00 PM

OK, so I made some progress on the questions I was posing.

First question:

Is the power density calculation done using the size of each individual LED, or the size of the collection of LEDs (the LEDs on the board)?


There's a post where zawy says the following:
"But I do not know the size of its LEDs and the overall Watt specifications do not tell exactly what light the LEDs are outputting."

He's basing a power density calculation, that he would like to do, on individual LEDs. Answer: To be sure of the surface power density, one has to know the specs of the individual LED(s)!

zawy also states:
"It says it consumes 18 W whereas an 96 LED advertisement says 15 W, so it might be a little more powerful, but its area is twice as large so it might take nearly twice the time to get the same treatment per area because the intensity is diluted when you are close to it."

It would seem there's a relationship between the watts consumed and the watts output.

Without knowing exactly what a watt is (pardon the alliteration), I presume there can't be more wattage output than consumed. That being the case, with a 140 LED unit consuming 18W, it can't output more than ~128mW (18 / 140) per LED. And then that ~128mW would have to be divided across the area of the LED to calculate the power density in the form mW/cm2 (it's currently mW). Lostfalco has said not to exceed320mW/cm2(does anyone have a reference for that figure?).

If the above is right, then these units are well below the aforementioned upper limit of 320mW/cm2.

Doing the same calculation with the 96 LED unit which Lostfalco recommends:

15W / 96 LEDs = ~156mW per LED

That's well below the threshold of 320mW/cm2, as the 156mW hasn't even been divided by the area of the LED yet!

Is someone able to confirm my calculations as correct? By doing so, it confirms the safety of these devices, from a power density standpoint. Or maybe this has already been discussed?

Someone/other people must have done power density calculations for the recommended, 96 LED unit? Would love to see them!

#1839 lostfalco

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 04:17 PM

Lostfalco has said not to exceed320mW/cm2(does anyone have a reference for that figure?).

Hey, what's up Razor?

I got that number from the Schiffer study. http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC2796659/

"The level of light exposure at the skin was well below the irradiance allowed by the ANSI standard of 320 mW/cm2."


Here are the full texts of the five human studies:
1. http://dspace.mit.ed...le/1721.1/58558 (scroll to bottom to download full text pdf of pilot study)
2. http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC2796659/ (non-controlled)
3. http://stroke.ahajou.../38/6/1843.long
4. http://stroke.ahajou.../40/4/1359.long
5. http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/23200785 (abstract only...sorry =))

Gonzalez-Lima Summary Article
https://dl.dropboxus...nzalez-lima.pdf

Hamblin Summary
http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC3288797/

Zawy's page
http://heelspurs.com/led.html

Nattzor's Self-Experiment and Gwern's Analysis
http://www.gwern.net/LLLT

Edited by lostfalco, 25 February 2014 - 04:21 PM.

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#1840 Razor444

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 09:46 AM

Those links are useful. Having a summery of the literature is great! Thanks.

I'm still curious about the power of the illuminator lamps people are using for the protocol. In particular, the mW per LED. Even if safe, knowing the exact mW output of each LED helps repeatability. What happens if the recommended lamps on ebay sell out? Or how can people reliably test various sized LED arrays -- maybe reducing the time of the procedure -- without holding the power density constant?

It seems to me, Lostfalco, electronics isn't your strong suit -- Mine either! But on a thread that has over 200,000 views, it seems odd that the devices people are using for TULIP haven't been looked at thoroughly, yet.

#1841 macropsia

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 03:00 PM

I ask a similar question, to which someone supplied a link to earlier in the thread about a page back.

I ask a similar question, to which someone supplied a link to earlier in the thread about a page back.

#1842 lostfalco

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 03:58 PM

Those links are useful. Having a summery of the literature is great! Thanks.

No problem man. =)

Here is some info that might be of interest to you.
http://www.longecity...410#entry621338

http://www.longecity...410#entry621375

I would also recommend starting with this post and reading every post that Zawy has made from that point on.
http://www.longecity...020#entry615009

If you are extremely interested in delving into the engineering side of things then I highly recommend his site (as previously mentioned). He's built multiple devices and really knows his stuff.

Here's the free full-text to the Barrett study I posted earlier.
http://pdfcast.org/pdf/i-ve-seen-the

That should pretty much answer all of your questions. =) Enjoy!

Edited by lostfalco, 26 February 2014 - 04:43 PM.


#1843 cylack

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 04:03 AM

I contacted via email a major researcher in this field (I don't want to say who it is because I'm not sure he'd feel ok me quoting him here and please don't PM me asking who it is). I told him about this thread and asked for advice on dosing protocols using our LED devices. This is what he replied:

"Thanks for your interest and for letting me know about this link. I was not aware of it. As you can imagine, as a responsible scientist I do not advise using this intervention outside of a supervised IRB-approved research protocol, which is the safest scientific way to test whether it works or not. A key to your question would be to know actual energy dose and transcranial transmission from these LEDs as part of a controlled research protocol. Finding a dose with LLLT is different than with pharmacology. For example, the power density (irradiance) in our study was 250 mW/cm2 and the cumulative energy density dose (fluence) given per site was 60 J/cm2. Energy dose (J) = Power (W) x Time (sec). The longer the time of exposure, the larger the dose. One would need to measure the irradiance of the LEDs to estimate the correct time for any given energy dose. I think you might enjoy this paper introducing LLLT. This paper has free open access to download on the internet at this link:
http://www.dovepress...and-brain-a8482
Thank you for your interest and best wishes in your studies."

#1844 burythesystem

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Posted 28 February 2014 - 11:18 AM

Apologies if this was already posted. I am currently making my way through this massive thread, and I am currently on page 42.

Scientists Accidentally Discover How to Stop or Start Pain Using Light


http://gizmodo.com/s...ight-1526906564

Pain is a hard problem. Sure, we can throw a little morphine at pain in the short term, but researchers continue to struggle with solutions for chronic pain. New research from Stanford's futuristic Bio-X lab looks like a light at the end of the tunnel—literally!
Put simply, a team of scientists has developed a way to turn pain on and off using light. They used a technique known as optogenetics to insert light-sensitive proteins called opsins into the nerves of lab mice. After a couple of weeks, the nerves became light-sensitive. One color of light would increase the sensation of pain; another would decrease it. This bears huge implications in a number of fields, from neuroscience to psychology, and could help millions of people who suffer from chronic pain.
So that's pretty awesome. What's even more impressive is the fact that researchers made the discovery by accident. Optogenetics is a burgeoning field pioneered by Karl Deisseroth who was a co-author of a study about the new technique published this week in Nature Biotechnology. It enables scientists to control nerves using just light. Scott Delp, whose lab made the discovery, was exploring the use of optogenetics to control muscle movement when he found that the opsins were also affecting the nerves that controlled pain. "We thought 'wow, we're getting pain neurons, that could be really important,'" Delp said in a statement.
The excitement offered by optogenetics don't stop at pain relief, of course. Just a few months ago, scientists also figured out how to control hunger using opsins and light therapy. Experts say the field could impact everything from brain disease to alcoholism. And they make it look so easy. [Stanford]

Accompanying youtube video:



#1845 RicardoW

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 05:59 PM

This is the best thread in the history of longcity. I'm just wondering is lostfalco.to smart is he promoting his own company selling lasers?
Any way this is what I like to add and hopefully discuss:

Peptide Bioregulators, gene switches that could replace stem cells!
This former Russian military secret is now available to the public!

Today Professor Vladimir Khavinson is the President of the European Academy of Gerontology and Geriatrics, but in the 1980’s he was a Colonel in the Soviet Union military medical corps. At the time, he and his team were approached by Kremlin officials, they wanted them to find a way to protect their troops from a myriad of problems; issues such as radiation for submariners in nuclear submarines to troops that may be blinded from known, (but thankfully unused) new weapons such as battlefield lasers.
What their secret research uncovered- that was used for two decades on many thousands of men and women- was a remarkable link between short chain peptides and DNA.
Now their published research is in the open and it identifies that each organ/ gland/ tissue uses a highly specific short chain peptide to act as a ‘short cut’ to initiate protein synthesis. These peptides can be found in food and unlike proteins they can enter the blood through the stomach. Through a comprehensive list of patents and even copyrighted PowerPoint slides, the Russian research group are showing that each of the concentrated peptide bioregulators so far examined interact with particular strands of DNA- effectively and very specifically activating repair and regenerative processes.
This is a remarkable story since what we are describing here are individualised gene switches and since they have been tested for many years on thousands of individuals, without report of any serious side effects or contraindications to date, they could be set to ‘out do’ stem cells. Why? Because this peptide therapy is relatively cheap, highly specific, can be taken orally and doesn’t require any suppression of the immune system to operate fully.
Professor Khavinson and his award winning team at the St Petersburg Institute of Biogerontology have discovered that each organ/ gland has a biological reserve and despite the origin of the tissue they have studied, incredibly each one is always set at 42%
Even dosing doesn’t need to be daily, these peptide bioregulators have been shown to act even after a simple course of 2 capsules daily for 10-days. Healthy individuals only being encouraged to repeat the course 6-months later, although of course depending on the need this course can be repeated every 3-months, 2-months or 1-month if necessary. But compared to a hormone replacement therapy this is interesting, since hormones would require almost daily application. But these peptide bioregulators aren’t hormones, they are acting on the gland concerned to ‘encourage’ it to become active and effectively ‘younger’ by triggering/ activating the DNA responsible.
Here at Biogenesis, we are excited about this emerging technology and have been following it since 2010 and will be reporting much more, though articles, interviews and videos etc., so please stay tuned. There’s more to learn including the synergistic interaction of the peptide bioregulators themselves and if individuals are using hormones concurrently, then there may well be a need to monitor their blood levels more closely with a view to lowering those doses and applications etc.
Note: Of the 20 or so peptide bioregulators available Biogenesis has chosen the following, (and will be adding more into the range in due course). All the sources of these Peptide Bioregulators are from carefully chosen Danish bovine tissues and processed through pharmaceutical processes and filters.
Currently all of these peptide regulator capsules enjoy registration on the Russian market as food supplements:
•Glandokort® - this is the peptide bioregulator from the adrenal glands and can help support and improve conditions related with weak adrenal glands, particularly for those suffering from adrenal fatigue.
•Libidon®- this is the peptide bioregulator from the prostate gland and can help support and improve conditions related to prostate enlargement.
•Testoluten®- this is the peptide bioregulator from the testes and can help support and improve conditions related to weak testosterone production.
•Visoluten®- this is the peptide bioregulator from the eye retina and can help support and improve conditions related to retinal dysfunction.

Edited by RicardoW, 02 March 2014 - 06:22 PM.


#1846 RicardoW

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 06:06 PM

what I can say is that this was a real project with some interesting outcomes. whether or not this company:
http://www.biogenesi...products_id=694
is selling a genuine product I don't know. i don't know much about molecular biology although i wish i had an degree i in it right now. but I will probably find some one how do!

love to hear you're opinion abut this. any insights or opinions on practical or theoretical basis.

and sorry lostfalco for accusing you of promoting you're own company (witch it in that case and most likely isn't).

Edited by RicardoW, 02 March 2014 - 06:13 PM.


#1847 Nattzor

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 06:55 PM

This is the best thread in the history of longcity. I'm just wondering is lostfalco.to smart is he promoting his own company selling lasers?


So he is promoting lasers but only links to random LED units from random sellers on ebay (heck, he even recommended "my" seller for European people before). He stopped recommending lasers quite fast due to the price. Just writing BS like this is silly, please stop.
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#1848 RicardoW

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 08:04 PM

This is the best thread in the history of longcity. I'm just wondering is lostfalco.to smart is he promoting his own company selling lasers?


So he is promoting lasers but only links to random LED units from random sellers on ebay (heck, he even recommended "my" seller for European people before). He stopped recommending lasers quite fast due to the price. Just writing BS like this is silly, please stop.


if you read the thread you will see that he gives a link to place where he got his own laser. it costs in the range of 1000 to 10 000 us dollar depending on a few factors. however laserleds with the right wave length cots a few dollar on Amazon.

if I would provide lasers of this kind I would be interested in raising interest on this forum. the input about the laser thing are among the most interesting thing lostfalco brings up.and obviously he got massive response. on my hand it was just some thing that hit me (it says more abort me I guess).

Edited by RicardoW, 02 March 2014 - 08:07 PM.


#1849 RicardoW

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 08:11 PM

also it important to add that I'm not questioning the accuracy in what he is saying

#1850 BigPapaChakra

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 08:17 PM

I can guarantee LostFalco isn't selling high powered lasers and trying to get sales for it; he is the sole reason that me and at least 4 other people have had the privilege to use TULIP due to going above and beyond for us, let alone all the information and what not he's shared for all the rest. He frequently accepts/sends PM's from people trying to help them with TULIP and other bio-hacks, as well. Additionally, he used the vetro laser and tendon lite when he started doing LLLT, hence why he posted them; he often said he is 'experimenting with much cheaper units' and will let everyone know how it goes. A little while later, he started recommending LEDs that you can get for under $50 (or cheaper), hence why he has them on his longecity page. Almost everyone here using TULIP/LLLT is using the LEDs, as opposed to the vetro/tendon lite.

Don't wanna come off argumentative, but just adding my two cents.
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#1851 BigPapaChakra

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 08:28 PM

In fact, I'm pretty certain LF posted something about those exact peptides long before in this thread; if not, he did on the Bulletproof Forums. Nonetheless, they seem great and I might give them a trial in the near future after messing around with NSI-189 and infrared saunas.

Quickly before I have to attend some things - for anyone interested in other forms of red/infrared light therapy, look into saunas/mats/etc; I've used the BioMat Pro for 3 nights and will be working out a payment plan with Sunlighten to get their cheapest portable far infrared mat; I worked out payments for the BioMat Pro, but it's not for me - it works quite well but it decreases my serotonin pretty drastically (due to negative ions), and I have reason to believe I already have low serotonin. Point being, my HPPD gets much worse, and not only that, it brings about co-morbid symptoms I don't typically suffer from such as depression, irritability, quick negative reactions to things I can normally inhibit, zero appetite, etc. If you don't have messed up neurotransmitters, it may work great for you. Sunlighten has full spectrum infrared or far-infrared only saunas and mats, without negative ions. Additionally, they also manufacture their products themselves, and have had clinical trials done with their exact product; the same cannot be said for the BioMat.

#1852 Nattzor

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 08:42 PM

if you read the thread you will see that he gives a link to place where he got his own laser. it costs in the range of 1000 to 10 000 us dollar depending on a few factors. however laserleds with the right wave length cots a few dollar on Amazon.

if I would provide lasers of this kind I would be interested in raising interest on this forum. the input about the laser thing are among the most interesting thing lostfalco brings up.and obviously he got massive response. on my hand it was just some thing that hit me (it says more abort me I guess).


And if you would have read the thread (and not just the first few pages, heck you could just have read the last few) you would have known he changed his recommendation. The lasers he started recommend was sub $1000, just 5 pages in he links one sub $200. Less than 20 pages in (iirc), everyone was recommended to buy the $10 LEDs on ebay.

Sure, he might have done it (lolno, he did not, in any way), but taking it up after 60 pages when the recommendations has change a lot is pretty silly.

Sorry if I'm comming of aggressive, but I see these kinds of posts as really un-necessary.

In fact, I'm pretty certain LF posted something about those exact peptides long before in this thread; if not, he did on the Bulletproof Forums. Nonetheless, they seem great and I might give them a trial in the near future after messing around with NSI-189 and infrared saunas.

Quickly before I have to attend some things - for anyone interested in other forms of red/infrared light therapy, look into saunas/mats/etc; I've used the BioMat Pro for 3 nights and will be working out a payment plan with Sunlighten to get their cheapest portable far infrared mat; I worked out payments for the BioMat Pro, but it's not for me - it works quite well but it decreases my serotonin pretty drastically (due to negative ions), and I have reason to believe I already have low serotonin. Point being, my HPPD gets much worse, and not only that, it brings about co-morbid symptoms I don't typically suffer from such as depression, irritability, quick negative reactions to things I can normally inhibit, zero appetite, etc. If you don't have messed up neurotransmitters, it may work great for you. Sunlighten has full spectrum infrared or far-infrared only saunas and mats, without negative ions. Additionally, they also manufacture their products themselves, and have had clinical trials done with their exact product; the same cannot be said for the BioMat.


He did, he liked them but stopped using them because of some theoretical problems (is the "reserve" used up?, etc).

Edited by Nattzor, 02 March 2014 - 08:48 PM.


#1853 BigPapaChakra

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 09:06 PM

Yeah, I could have sworn I saw him speaking about using one of them. I also believe he started/was using other things at the same time thus couldn't ascertain specific effects to the individual peptide, but I don't want to speak for him. Currently using spaced repetition after LF praised Gwern's post on it, and starting to retain a lot of information on biology, biochem, etc. so perhaps in a few months I could have some foundation of knowledge to analyze that professor's/doctor's information on those peptides he's been researching.

#1854 lostfalco

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 12:18 AM

and sorry lostfalco for accusing you of promoting you're own company (witch it in that case and most likely isn't).

It's all good man. I definitely have zero connection with any laser or LED seller of any kind. Just check out the research, come to your own conclusions, and be safe. =) These links are a good place to start. http://www.longecity...830#entry646032

My profile page also has links to $10 and $50 LEDs just as examples, no affiliation. Feel free to buy from Amazon or anywhere else online. http://www.longecity...1887-lostfalco/

Edited by lostfalco, 03 March 2014 - 12:39 AM.


#1855 lostfalco

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 12:23 AM

Thanks Papa and Nattzor...I appreciate it.

#1856 StabMe

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 12:37 PM

I want to say thank you to lostfalco, zawy, opaque_mind, Dr Hill and the rest of the guys who contributed SO MUCH to this thread.

About a year ago i decided to take my adult ADHD seriously and start doing something about it. Tried stimulants and didn't like the effects. Then i got knees deep into neurofeedback and for about 7-9 month been doing nirHEG and EEG neurofeedback. This stuff is amazing and really gives you permanent changes in a natural way. No more temper tantrums, no more speeding, a lot less problems with focusing, much better motivation.

But i still explore new things and open to new ideas. I added tDCS to my regimen and i can see the effects of it on EEG and it makes training with EEG a little easier for the brain. Do not want to overdo it, though, as there are some risks involved.

After reading about LLLT i got extremely excited and started searching locally for such a device and found (and bought) this one:
http://www.pulsar-nv...ts/pulsar-x850/

Posted Image

It is an infrared flashlight used for those who are into hunting so that they put it on their rifles and hunt during the night i guess.
Anyway, here are the specs:

Equivalent IR power: 50 ... 350 mW
Diode type: LED
IR Wavelength: 850 nm
Range of beam divergence: 3 ... 9.5°
Power supply: 3V (2хАА)

I guesstimate the power output to be at about 250mW and make the beam (that is barely seen in the dark) about 1cm in diameter and use it on F3/F4. I only used it two times for 2 minutes per spot. Can't really tell if i can feel any difference. Will try titrating the dose accurately.

- Can somebody please tell me, does this device indeed provide those necessary mWatts per centimeter or am i messing something up?

- Has anyone actually tried EPO as a cognitive enhancer? I have a pack of EPO that i once bought and never used from about a year ago. Tempting to add it to the mix of LLLT and neurofeedback.


My main idea is to train the brain to be more resilient and capable of doing tasks that i impose on it and help it with proper diet, supplementation and other interventions (tdcs, lllt, EPO?). I do not want to be dependent on those interventions. I want to help my brain to change with them. As one would eat enough calories and protein, get a good rest and work-out properly in order to build strength/muscle.

Cheers, people!

#1857 Razor444

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 12:46 PM

In the hopes that others may find it helpful:

I'm from the UK, and ordered the following LED illuminators and power adaptors.That matches the recommendations, as closely as possible.

#1858 StabMe

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 08:18 PM

So i have been contemplating about the EPO. The fact that i have ten 4000IU vials in the fridge contributes to the temptation.
I have listened to the podcast on NeuroScene with Kamilla Miskowiak and skimmed through studies. Kamilla says that she attributes the boost of cognitive functioning from EPO to its direct effects on the brain and not to the increase of red blood cells, although she thinks that this might also contribute to the increase, because of better oxygen transport.

To exclude the possibility of increase in the RBC count, she says, they administered EPO only once a week and the dosage was 40.000IU. I mean what? 40.000 IUs? Isn't it overkill? How can this not cause increase in RBC? I checked through threads on CuttingEdgeMuscle where they have tons of shared experiences of EPO usage and the common scheme is to take EPO in 1500-3000IUs 3 times a week for 2-3 weeks and then same dosage once weekly to maintain gains. And it increases RBCs 1-2% they say. That is 9.000IUs weekly and 27.000 IUs total. And they do it with the sole purpose of more RBCs. But here 40K is administered each week. No increase? Huh?


Does anyone have full text of these? I'd really appreciate that.

Erythropoietin: a candidate treatment for mood symptoms and memory dysfunction in depression.
Miskowiak KW, Vinberg M, Harmer CJ, Ehrenreich H, Kessing LV.


Effects of erythropoietin on depressive symptoms and neurocognitive deficits in depression and bipolar disorder.
Miskowiak KW, Vinberg M, Harmer CJ, Ehrenreich H, Knudsen GM, Macoveanu J, Hansen AR, Paulson OB, Siebner HR, Kessing LV.


#1859 hephaestus

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 12:49 AM

Try /r/scholar on reddit if no one here has them.

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#1860 RicardoW

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 10:15 AM

Yeah, I could have sworn I saw him speaking about using one of them. I also believe he started/was using other things at the same time thus couldn't ascertain specific effects to the individual peptide, but I don't want to speak for him. Currently using spaced repetition after LF praised Gwern's post on it, and starting to retain a lot of information on biology, biochem, etc. so perhaps in a few months I could have some foundation of knowledge to analyze that professor's/doctor's information on those peptides he's been researching.



That would be appreciated! I will also try to find some competent people with some insight. By the way where did you get your peptides? what kind did you use? And was what you’re over all experience of it?

Edited by RicardoW, 04 March 2014 - 11:06 AM.

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