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Phenibut is the only supplement to have a noticable effect on me

phenibut

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#1 Llama Chris

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Posted 23 July 2013 - 01:14 PM


I just wanted to detail my experiences with phenibut, and also to ask and see if anyone has any suggestions for other supplements I could try that may have a noticable impact on my mood, and other mental capacities.

In the past I have taken:

Sulbutiamine
Modafinil
Deprenyl
Piracetam
Aniracetam
Noopept
Pramiracetam

The above I have all tried and have never noticed the slightest effect (that is not to say some unnoticable effect is going on), but I'm more looking for things I will notice.

Phenibut, however was different. Now, I will I add I frequently get pretty depressed and down, lack motivation and energy, and very socially awkward - terrible at making conversation and such. I've drunk a lot of alcohol in the past to overcome social confidence issues- I can go from being a really quiet shy guy with nothing to say, to laughing and starting up conversation with anyone - and I love that, but it's just not a good thing for me to be drinking, and I don't wish to continue down that path.

So two weeks ago, my Phenibut and arrived and I took some.

I weighed out 750mg. Waited about 2 hours, and nothing. I had intended to be scientific, take certain doses, see the effect, try more two weeks from then, etc. But, I am impatient.

I took another 750mg.

Within half an hour I started feeling a little light headed - I put this down to the first dose starting to kick in. I was feeling a little giggly (I'm attributing this to excitement or anticipation so far). Within an hour or two... I wasn't feeling like my usual morose self.

I was feeling amazing! Like really happy! Excited! Energetic! Like crazy. Another hour or two, I was yapping away, just talking, and talking. I tried doing some writing, and found it very hard to concentrate and focus - and I was feeling dizzy and a little sick.

But the main gist of the feeling I was having was the same feeling I get after a few beers or more - I was feeling relaxed, confident, introspective, motivated - felt like I could take over the world.

I met up with a friend that night; and by the time I got there; I was feeling hyper. Felt really confident. Really happy. All this good stuff. It was great!

The mood was less pronounced probably within another five hours; and I went home, went to bed, and had the deepest most relaxing sleep I had had in a long, long time.

I know i should have waited; but the next day I had 1600mg. It had the exact same effects again. I was happy. Reflective. Confident. Talkative. But that evening I felt REALLY sick. I was dizzy. I was driving home and couldn't concentrate or stay focused, felt like i was going to be sick. I felt terrible.

I put this down to having too much in a short amount of time, not a problem that should arise with responsible phenibut usage. I tried some more two days later, and all it did was make me feel even more sick.

So, so far from this one trial - it is my belief that phenibut may be an awesome supplement, but only to be taken very infrequently (as everyone suggests be done already); and I will be trying it again in about a week and a half. If it continues to work well for me for the next few times; I will probably keep it and use it for special social occasions where I need extra confidence and positive mood.

Unfortunately, this means it is something I can't use often.

As I mentioned in the list above, this is the first brain supplement that has noticably changed my mood and/or mental feelings and processes. Could anyone suggest anything else to try?

#2 zeddy

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Posted 23 July 2013 - 08:31 PM

i've bought some phenibut but its just sitting there. i wanna try it but after reading all the horror stories about tolerance and withdrawal im kinda being put off it. is there anyone with a success story concerning phenibut except yours? because most of the things i hear about it are negative.

as far as your question goes the most potent supp ive taken is st johns wort, it totally numbed my bad emotions, took a week for it to kick though. im taking aniracetam for anxiety and its honestly doing wonders, especially when it comes to fluency of speech. noopept worked for me but it was subtle.

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#3 golden1

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Posted 23 July 2013 - 09:44 PM

Don't know.. if you don't notice modafinil or deprenyl then I can't think of anything that would be more obvious, nootropic/non-prescription wise.

#4 xsiv1

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 02:48 AM

Please refer to the thread I'm linking. It's the internet's most complete resource for Phenibut and includes horror stories, success stories, stories of long-term use, successful withdrawal regimens and other supplements/grey market compounds that can help you achieve what you're looking for without relying exclusively on a compound that will eventually downregulate your Gaba receptors and very like dopamine receptors as well. It's what differentiates it from Baclofen. Both have an affinity to Gaba (Baclofen moreso) but Phenibut has a strange connection to dopamine as well which Baclofen doesn't seem to have...explaining it's near zero recreational potential. Many of us have felt the exact way as you, and one day..the day does come.... the tolerance sets in and increasing dosages is not the answer if you enjoy your sleep and your emotional state after abuse. It will help you tremendously in all things related to Gaba agonists like Phenibut. You're clearly what we call a positive responder (because it's positively effecting your mood, motivation, sociability and the like) so I think you'll find a lot of similarities between yourself and some of the intelligent people in this thread...btw, I'd have a comfortable chair and a drink and if I were in your position..read it from page one until the end...it'll take you a while.

http://www.mindandmu...nibut-casualty

You don't "have" to be another Phenibut casualty if you do it correctly and, well, read the thread lol.
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#5 Llama Chris

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 12:28 PM

i've bought some phenibut but its just sitting there. i wanna try it but after reading all the horror stories about tolerance and withdrawal im kinda being put off it. is there anyone with a success story concerning phenibut except yours? because most of the things i hear about it are negative.

as far as your question goes the most potent supp ive taken is st johns wort, it totally numbed my bad emotions, took a week for it to kick though. im taking aniracetam for anxiety and its honestly doing wonders, especially when it comes to fluency of speech. noopept worked for me but it was subtle.


I think it is safe to try at least once, just to see how it goes. I don't expect withdrawl effects would be too serious if you only have one dosage? Of course I'm no doctor and am not recommending anything; but if *I* had some there, I want to try it just once at least, just to see how it goes. I'd be interested in reading your experiences with it.

I may try Aniracetam again, because anxiety was originally the reason I got it. Maybe I'll try another brand or something. I just find it amazing there are all these noots out there that so many rave about, and I don't feel the slightest impact from most of them? St Johns Wort is interesting too. Not something I was aware of in this context, I might look into it.

Don't know.. if you don't notice modafinil or deprenyl then I can't think of anything that would be more obvious, nootropic/non-prescription wise.


I was honestly surprised with Modafinil. Considering it seems to be a much more mainstream item, and actually prescribed for things and such. I originally got it because I was having issues with severe fatigue and tiredness; but it didn't affect that at all, or appear to have any noticable nootropic effects. I was thinking of maybe trying some adrafinil, since it's a lot cheaper than modafinil anyway.

As for deprenyl, I actually had an effect from it ONCE, just the first time. So it could have been effective, but it may habe been a placebo, or just I was having a good day. The very first time I took it, I was wide awake, happy, talking at a million miles an hour about anything and to anyone. Never had that, or anything again. And I am a bit wary about taking it, so don't really want to continue with it.

Please refer to the thread I'm linking. It's the internet's most complete resource for Phenibut and includes horror stories, success stories, stories of long-term use, successful withdrawal regimens and other supplements/grey market compounds that can help you achieve what you're looking for without relying exclusively on a compound that will eventually downregulate your Gaba receptors and very like dopamine receptors as well. It's what differentiates it from Baclofen. Both have an affinity to Gaba (Baclofen moreso) but Phenibut has a strange connection to dopamine as well which Baclofen doesn't seem to have...explaining it's near zero recreational potential. Many of us have felt the exact way as you, and one day..the day does come.... the tolerance sets in and increasing dosages is not the answer if you enjoy your sleep and your emotional state after abuse. It will help you tremendously in all things related to Gaba agonists like Phenibut. You're clearly what we call a positive responder (because it's positively effecting your mood, motivation, sociability and the like) so I think you'll find a lot of similarities between yourself and some of the intelligent people in this thread...btw, I'd have a comfortable chair and a drink and if I were in your position..read it from page one until the end...it'll take you a while.

http://www.mindandmu...nibut-casualty

You don't "have" to be another Phenibut casualty if you do it correctly and, well, read the thread lol.


Thanks, I will read that probably tomorrow after school. I'm a bit short on time at the moment. I think I may have read some of it recently, because the website tells me I've used up my free visits, and need to register. So I'll have a read tomorrow and get back to this thread with any further thoughts. Have you used Phenibut previously, yourself Siv?

Are you saying that IF I used it correctly; I won't run into these negative problems that most people seem to? Or the thread itself may lend itself to suggesting some more appropriate supplements to take? I must have remembered my research into Phenibut incorrectly, because I was actually under the impression that Phenibut WOULDN'T downregulate gaba receptors (or dopamine), but you are saying it does with continued use? And is it a permanent down regulation? Anything permanent would seem to not be worth the present effect.

I have never heard of Baclofen. You say it is similar to Phenibut, but doesn't down regulate receptors? Is it as easily obtainable as phenibut?

And, as I asked before - have you used phenibut? You seem to know a bit about it? Through your research have you perhaps found other supplements that have similar effects to phenibut, but perhaps lack the downsides?

Anyway, I'll read that thread tomorrow after Uni and get back to this thread.

#6 xsiv1

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 02:25 PM

Thanks, I will read that probably tomorrow after school. I'm a bit short on time at the moment. I think I may have read some of it recently, because the website tells me I've used up my free visits, and need to register. So I'll have a read tomorrow and get back to this thread with any further thoughts. Have you used Phenibut previously, yourself Siv? Yes, extensively. Grew dependent on it with numerous attempts to come off. Initially started at small and sporadic use. Responded so well to it that I fell into it's hole and it took me 9 mths to figure out how to climb out without resorting to bennzodiazepines or other Gaba agonists or analogs.

Are you saying that IF I used it correctly; I won't run into these negative problems that most people seem to? Or the thread itself may lend itself to suggesting some more appropriate supplements to take? I must have remembered my research into Phenibut incorrectly, because I was actually under the impression that Phenibut WOULDN'T downregulate gaba receptors (or dopamine), but you are saying it does with continued use? And is it a permanent down regulation? Anything permanent would seem to not be worth the present effect. Incorrect impression. It will downregulate both with use at more than twice per week (if that), specifically Gaba B receptors. You 'can' use it, but I wouldn't even follow the directions on the bottle. I'd recommend treating it like any other benzodiazepine. 2 days per week max. If you don't follow this, you, like many others before you - will fall into the hole of dependence. Luckily, the thread I've linked discusses ways to deal with this problem successfully. Now that I'm fully aware of it's pitfalls, having lived through them, I can use it once a week as a social lubricant/motivational tool since that's how I respond to it. I don't ever go beyond that except on rare occasions where I may do some on a Friday and a Saturday.

I have never heard of Baclofen. You say it is similar to Phenibut, but doesn't down regulate receptors? Is it as easily obtainable as phenibut Baclofen also downregulates (is a Gaba B agonists) receptors but doesn't display nearly the same affinity toward dopamine pathways that phenibut does. Prescription only.

And, as I asked before - have you used phenibut? You seem to know a bit about it? Through your research have you perhaps found other supplements that have similar effects to phenibut, but perhaps lack the downsides?

Anyway, I'll read that thread tomorrow after Uni and get back to this thread.

Read the thread when you get a chance, it'll help you come to many conclusions.

#7 bern004

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 04:25 PM

Phenibut is not a supplement, it's a drug. The effects are definitely an order of magnitude more perceivable than the others, because it's more potent than any of the nootropics you listed (Selegiline and Modafinil vie for second on the list). Phenibut is also more habit forming and brings on withdrawal symptoms more than the others.

What dosage of Selegiline did you take? I noticed, when I was taking Selegiline, that at higher doses (10mg or so) I'd feel a sense of confidence and extreme concentration, moreso than any other substance (even more than amphetamines or modafinil).

Edited by bern004, 24 July 2013 - 04:28 PM.


#8 Galaxyshock

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 05:04 PM

I'm another victim of what was meant to be "controlled" Phenibut usage, eventually leading to a six-month continous use with some breaks / cycling with GABA agonists and taper-attempts... eventually withdrawing and leading to 15 months of anhedonia, anxiety, dp/dr, cognitive, depressive issues and I'm still not 100%. I've managed to be somewhat functional during this time though and I have to say that I haven't been completely responsible with the wds as I've used some GABA agonists etc. and few short-term Phenibut reinstatements but still, Phenibut is one of the nastiest compounds out there, I'd say even benzos are less mind-fucking drugs.

Edited by Galaxyshock, 24 July 2013 - 05:31 PM.


#9 xsiv1

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 05:56 PM

I'm another victim of what was meant to be "controlled" Phenibut usage, eventually leading to a six-month continous use with some breaks / cycling with GABA agonists and taper-attempts... eventually withdrawing and leading to 15 months of anhedonia, anxiety, dp/dr, cognitive, depressive issues and I'm still not 100%. I've managed to be somewhat functional during this time though and I have to say that I haven't been completely responsible with the wds as I've used some GABA agonists etc. and few short-term Phenibut reinstatements but still, Phenibut is one of the nastiest compounds out there, I'd say even benzos are less mind-fucking drugs.


I'd tend to agree with nearly everything you've stated galaxy. Question though. You say that you've experienced these types of symptoms for 15 months and you're still not 100 percent. What doses were you up to and what treatment did you use (if any) to help you overcome what's seemingly PAWS. I abused it for a period of 9 months and can now still use it at once per week, albeit at spread out doses of 250mgs where I don't exceed 750mgs - 1 gram on any trial. I tapered off it entirely with the use of other supplements even though I had baclofen and benzodiazepines on hand. It wasn't easy but it wasn't unbearable. By about a month or two after complete cessation, the only thing I experienced that was different from baseline was fragmented sleep where I'd wake up twice per night instead of my regular one time during baseline periods prior to its use.

Additionally, I'd never recommend it to someone unless they were absolutely treatment resistant as many a person, despite reading all the horror stories, has fallen to its allure and then full blown dependence. Ideally, a 12-16 week tapering protocol should be followed in conjunction with many or some of the supplements/Rx found in the thread I've linked to above. It also details what I've continued to use that's replaced my desire to use phenibut and involves a cyclical approach to various supplements and nootropics.

I'm another victim of what was meant to be "controlled" Phenibut usage, eventually leading to a six-month continous use with some breaks / cycling with GABA agonists and taper-attempts... eventually withdrawing and leading to 15 months of anhedonia, anxiety, dp/dr, cognitive, depressive issues and I'm still not 100%. I've managed to be somewhat functional during this time though and I have to say that I haven't been completely responsible with the wds as I've used some GABA agonists etc. and few short-term Phenibut reinstatements but still, Phenibut is one of the nastiest compounds out there, I'd say even benzos are less mind-fucking drugs.


I'd tend to agree with nearly everything you've started galaxy. Question though. You say that you've experienced these types of symptoms for 15 months and you're still not 100 percent. What doses were you up to and what treatment did you use (if any) to help you overcome what's seemingly PAWS. I abused it for a period of 9 months and can now still use it at once per week, albeit at spread out doses of 250mgs where I don't exceed 750mgs - 1 gram on any trial. I tapered off it entirely with the use of other supplements even though I had baclofen and benzodiazepines on hand. It wasn't easy but it wasn't unbearable. By about a month or two after complete cessation, the only thing I experienced that was different from baseline was fragmented sleep where I'd wake up twice per night instead of my regular one time during baseline periods prior to its use.

Additionally, I'd never recommend it to someone unless they were absolutely treatment resistant as many a person, despite reading all the horror stories, has fallen to its allure and then full blown dependence. Ideally, a 12-16 week tapering protocol should be followed in conjunction with many or some of the supplements/Rx found in the thread I've linked to above. It also details what I've continued to use that's replaced my desire to use phenibut and involves a cyclical approach to various supplements and nootropics.

Edited by xsiv1, 24 July 2013 - 05:56 PM.


#10 zeddy

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 06:42 PM

http://www.mindandmu...nibut-casualty

You don't "have" to be another Phenibut casualty if you do it correctly and, well, read the thread lol.


thanks will do.

#11 Luddist

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 03:11 AM

A friend of mine is taking a supplement called Kavinace. That place does saliva swabs to measure neurotransmitters for people that don't feel right. For them, GABA was measured lower than their reference levels. Click the link, click view more, and then click ingredients to see that Kavinace contains a proprietary blend of taurine and phenibut. Thankfully the taurine is listed first but I'm concerned about the chronic low dose of phenibut my friend is taking. It's troubling that they don't find it necessary to give the exact dose of a substance that shouldn't be used lightly.

At what dose does chronic daily use become an addictive problem?

Edited by Luddist, 25 July 2013 - 03:12 AM.


#12 Galaxyshock

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 07:51 AM

I'd tend to agree with nearly everything you've started galaxy. Question though. You say that you've experienced these types of symptoms for 15 months and you're still not 100 percent. What doses were you up to and what treatment did you use (if any) to help you overcome what's seemingly PAWS. I abused it for a period of 9 months and can now still use it at once per week, albeit at spread out doses of 250mgs where I don't exceed 750mgs - 1 gram on any trial. I tapered off it entirely with the use of other supplements even though I had baclofen and benzodiazepines on hand. It wasn't easy but it wasn't unbearable. By about a month or two after complete cessation, the only thing I experienced that was different from baseline was fragmented sleep where I'd wake up twice per night instead of my regular one time during baseline periods prior to its use.


Yes my withdrawal syndrome has been very similar to PAWS from benzos as I've had symptoms come in waves. The acute withdrawal was a lot less that I expected which probably is the reason for protracted symptoms. I don't think I ever used over 3g a day. Towards the end I already had had some taper attempts and was down with the dosage, I didn't seem to respond to Phenibut anymore and was unable to sleep under its influence so I thought I'll just go off. The withdrawal was delirium-like and trippy but no hallucinations, seizures or extreme things like that. Several days of strong "primal anxiety", depression and some other symptoms but that was really it.

I guess something left unfinished as the typical symptoms came with delay. My post probably makes it sound very bad, well there has been some tough times, but I mean I was able to move to new city, start school etc. after few months from the wd. It's just the protractedness that's been frustrating, and the severe anhedonia symptoms have definitely been the worst (probably some genetic predisposition to it). Well, I'm a lot better now and in many ways better than before using Phenibut, but I still feel I lack some sharpness etc. but it's slowly coming back. I can't of course say it's all from Phenibut wd either, I mean in 15 months other things sure influence how I feel.

Edited by Galaxyshock, 25 July 2013 - 08:26 AM.


#13 airplanepeanuts

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 08:48 AM

So you had anhedonia before Phenibut as well? Would be kind of strange if not because Phenibut is one of the few things actually helps with anhedonia in the short therm.

#14 Galaxyshock

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 11:04 AM

Some anhedonic symptoms before and during the usage, but something that probably could have been cured by changing habits and thinking patterns. Phenibut can help a lot of things in the short-term, but almost surely leaves you worse. I would not go medicating anything with it unless prescribed by a doctor, which I guess only happens in Russia, and is small doses for short-term. I'm sure it has some uses. Recreationally it's awful for drug-naive people. Phenibut is one of those drugs that don't punish you straight away - it's the best thing it the world at first, convinces you there's no harm and it's what you've been missing. One becomes care-free until rebounds start occuring after a delay, with the most awful and wierd symptoms. Quickly you need Phenibut to have some sort of mental sense and function, and get deep into a habit. The drug lives a life of its own and changes your behavior in a very wierd way. It's also not good to read those comments where some use it 12 grams doses and say there's no issue. These are people with already screwed up brain and on heavy medications and you never hear from them when they aren't drugged up. Of course some don't even initially respond to Phenibut well, but to us who did it is incredibly easy to become a problem.

Edited by Galaxyshock, 25 July 2013 - 11:26 AM.


#15 airplanepeanuts

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 12:04 PM

I have used it 3 times thus far in over a year. But I plan to take it maybe weekly in the future. Can you give an example of behavior changed in weird way?
Also do you feel it had detrimental effects on your intelligence? It's all about brain health here after all:)

Edited by airplanepeanuts, 25 July 2013 - 12:10 PM.


#16 xsiv1

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 01:54 PM

A friend of mine is taking a supplement called Kavinace. That place does saliva swabs to measure neurotransmitters for people that don't feel right. For them, GABA was measured lower than their reference levels. Click the link, click view more, and then click ingredients to see that Kavinace contains a proprietary blend of taurine and phenibut. Thankfully the taurine is listed first but I'm concerned about the chronic low dose of phenibut my friend is taking. It's troubling that they don't find it necessary to give the exact dose of a substance that shouldn't be used lightly.

At what dose does chronic daily use become an addictive problem?


That's the exact product that I initially began to use. I loved it but called the company and spoke to one of their research techs to find out that it was 300mgs of Phenibut per serving. Not exactly something you want to take daily as dependence/withdrawal will likely occur for your friend. I'm also not a fan of these neurotransmitter tests and their reliability however, having said that, it IS quite likely that his gaba system is not optimal and this is the cards he was dealt, if not at birth, then from his genetics and any other environmental variables that have intervened since. There's research indicating that alcoholics have lower than optimal (can't remember if it was less Gaba receptors, less density or sensitization) Gaba action. I'll see if I can dig up some of the research. The problem with phenibut is that eventually it will downregulate those Gaba B receptors meaning higher and higher amounts will be required to maintain the effects desired. Unfortunately, what a lot of people don't realize, is that Phenibut, when taken in "high" doses of over 1000mgs (perhaps a bit higher, ymmv) acts a stimulant. It's role with Gaba doesn't preclude what it does with PEA. Once the Gaba effect wears off, PEA receptors become more active. Will high dosages, Phenibut acts on both Gaba B and A receptors and the resulting PEA flood (not to mention Glutamate) is what stimulates people and screws with their sleep. Some people have worked upto 20-30 grams per day in an effort to retain the "quality" sleep they were getting when they first began their Phenibut use. Unfortunately, sleep becomes totally fragmented at these insane doses and I've narrowed my "fragmented" sleep dose down to 1700mgs total/day. Dosing intervals will play a role here though and may skew it's effect on sleep. For example, if you begin taking it early in the day, you might be able to sleep soundly at night. Nearing the end of my use (I never usually exceeded 3grams per day ever, although there were a few times when I'd try up to 5. Insane now that I know so much about my experience), I knew that anything over 1500mgs would have me waking more than a couple times per night. When I began my 'successful' taper, I was committed to stick to my excel spreadsheet, timing my doses with the highest being first thing in the morning and last time at 7:30pm. It was cumbersome, annoying...made me ruminate and continually assess my mood, feelings etc. But I did it. Magnesium Glycinate, Suntheanine, Taurine, Bacopa all helped me along the way..perhaps the most. But I didn't limit myself to those. I'd tell your friend to try and slowly reduce his dosage knowing the risks. The biggest risk for someone coming off cold turkey is the resulting glutamate storm that develops in your brain. Not good. Apoptosis likely. NMDA antagonists, L-theanine, and even other Gabaergics, like benzos, Baclofen or mimetics like Gabapentin/Lyrica although addictive as well...will be safer for your brain than nothing at all and then of course, they'd have to be tapered off of. Sad but true.

Edited by xsiv1, 25 July 2013 - 01:57 PM.


#17 Galaxyshock

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 02:26 PM

Magnesium and Bacopa are definitely good anxiolytics with minimal side-effects and no rebounds. I use both somewhat continously. Hypericin-extracted St. John's Wort feels a bit Phenibut-like as a moodlift and anxiolysis, but without getting high or suffering of withdrawals. I assume the GABA-Bergic effect is similar to that of Baclofen.

Hypericin may also affect activity at GABA receptor level. The effect at the GABA-A receptor subtype is shown with an IC50 of 75 ng ml-1 and that at the GABA-B receptor is seen at 6 ng ml-1 which is the most potent effect reported to date8.


http://journals.camb...368980000000562

I was able to cycle Phenibut with strong Ashwagandha-extract which has GABA-mimicing action and quite potent GABA-B agonism too. It didn't completely kill the wds but kept me functional when taken every ~5 hours. Gotu Kola is also a GABA-B agonist and very harmless, I used it after the withdrawal a lot and still time-to-time, never noticed any sort of rebounds. But these aren't something reacreational either. Phenibut seems indeed very different, must be something about the phenylethylamine-like structure to it and messing with NMDA and other things. Kava would be a better choice for a GABAergic with some recreational value.

Edited by Galaxyshock, 25 July 2013 - 02:32 PM.


#18 xsiv1

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 02:32 PM

If you absolutely have to use Phenibut, I'd keep it to once a week and in a moderate dose. Like Galaxy stated, it's all blue and sunny skies in the beginning but with ongoing use (more than 1 time per week) or abuse (more than 1200mgs throughout the day), those skies eventually dissipate and then comes the storm. Some come out of it unscathed following a proper tapering regimen (10% reduction of dose per week) along with the necessary supplements and/or meds) but others don't. You really need to liken it to a seriously addictive drug and use it as such. It's not going to fry your brain at once per week use, just as heroin use wouldn't lol. The Russian literature claims it has nootropic properties and being on it for a while did not alter my kidney/liver panels adversely It's the resultant dependence, withdrawal and the glutamate excitotoxicity upon cessation that lead to cell death...not unlike the alcoholic who goes through glutamate excitotoxicity on a constant basis until the Gaba agonist, alcohol, is reintroduced. Of course, excess binges with alcohol have other health ramifications as we all know.
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#19 xsiv1

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 02:36 PM

EDIT: I had to add this first sentence....Phenibut also exerts action on dopamine and with far more affinity than Baclofen which is more potent at the Gaba B sites. Once you come off Phenibut, you're not only dealing with Gaba downregulation, you're also dealing with the remnants of no longer brushing those dopamine receptors as you've grown accustomed to which are now likely desensitized as well. If you absolutely have to use Phenibut, I'd keep it to once a week and in a moderate dose. Like Galaxy stated, it's all blue and sunny skies in the beginning but with ongoing use (more than 1 time per week) or abuse (more than 1200mgs throughout the day), those skies eventually dissipate and then comes the storm. Some come out of it unscathed following a proper tapering regimen (10% reduction of dose per week) along with the necessary supplements and/or meds) but others don't. You really need to liken it to a seriously addictive drug and use it as such. It's not going to fry your brain at once per week use, just as heroin use wouldn't lol. The Russian literature claims it has nootropic properties and being on it for a while did not alter my kidney/liver panels adversely It's the resultant dependence, withdrawal and the glutamate excitotoxicity upon cessation that lead to cell death...not unlike the alcoholic who goes through glutamate excitotoxicity on a constant basis until the Gaba agonist, alcohol, is reintroduced. Of course, excess binges with alcohol have other health ramifications as we all know. Too bad the site doesn't allow you at least a couple hours to make an edit to a post lol. I've never seen anything like it. Oh well.


Edited by xsiv1, 25 July 2013 - 02:38 PM.


#20 123apk

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Posted 05 March 2016 - 06:26 PM

Thanks, I will read that probably tomorrow after school. I'm a bit short on time at the moment. I think I may have read some of it recently, because the website tells me I've used up my free visits, and need to register. So I'll have a read tomorrow and get back to this thread with any further thoughts. Have you used Phenibut previously, yourself Siv? Yes, extensively. Grew dependent on it with numerous attempts to come off. Initially started at small and sporadic use. Responded so well to it that I fell into it's hole and it took me 9 mths to figure out how to climb out without resorting to bennzodiazepines or other Gaba agonists or analogs.

Are you saying that IF I used it correctly; I won't run into these negative problems that most people seem to? Or the thread itself may lend itself to suggesting some more appropriate supplements to take? I must have remembered my research into Phenibut incorrectly, because I was actually under the impression that Phenibut WOULDN'T downregulate gaba receptors (or dopamine), but you are saying it does with continued use? And is it a permanent down regulation? Anything permanent would seem to not be worth the present effect. Incorrect impression. It will downregulate both with use at more than twice per week (if that), specifically Gaba B receptors. You 'can' use it, but I wouldn't even follow the directions on the bottle. I'd recommend treating it like any other benzodiazepine. 2 days per week max. If you don't follow this, you, like many others before you - will fall into the hole of dependence. Luckily, the thread I've linked discusses ways to deal with this problem successfully. Now that I'm fully aware of it's pitfalls, having lived through them, I can use it once a week as a social lubricant/motivational tool since that's how I respond to it. I don't ever go beyond that except on rare occasions where I may do some on a Friday and a Saturday.

I have never heard of Baclofen. You say it is similar to Phenibut, but doesn't down regulate receptors? Is it as easily obtainable as phenibut Baclofen also downregulates (is a Gaba B agonists) receptors but doesn't display nearly the same affinity toward dopamine pathways that phenibut does. Prescription only.

And, as I asked before - have you used phenibut? You seem to know a bit about it? Through your research have you perhaps found other supplements that have similar effects to phenibut, but perhaps lack the downsides?

Anyway, I'll read that thread tomorrow after Uni and get back to this thread.

Read the thread when you get a chance, it'll help you come to many conclusions.


So you've been addicted to it, how long did withdrawal take? Did you get PAWS? And how long did you wait to use it again?
You also say you use it for social occasions, does the full socialising magic come back after abstinence or is it purely sedating?

I'm on Phenibut now, have been almost daily for 6 months and I'm tapering off and going to jump off when I have a week off at the end of the month.
Just wondering if I can ever use it again or if it's permanently off limits?
I feel its magic has gone, now I just get side effects when it wears off (social anxiety comes back stronger when it wears off - I try to be at home when that happens, consequently I have no life at the moment). When I started it I got a happy, glowing, pro-social, chatty feeling all day. Now it just makes me feel "normal" (pre-Phenibut state).

One weird side effect I still get is if I wake up with a groggy feeling of headache Phenibut still lifts it.

#21 12 String

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Posted 06 March 2016 - 02:53 PM

My partner and I have taken Pheni 2x week for years for sound sleep. Good sleep is hard to get for us senior citizens. The morning after a pheni nite the bags under the eyes have almost disappeared, at least for a few hours. The sleep is amazing. Waking up is slow and delicious - like when we were teenagers. It's really amazing.

I've never felt the slightest compulsion to take it more often. The good effects take hours to come on. It's not eurphoric, it's not like getting drunk or high. For us it's somewhat relaxing and fun, but the sleep is the main reason for taking it.

I read the stories of withdrawal and addiction and wonder why this hasn't happened.  Maybe it's different physiology. Maybe when someone finds that the first hit of Feni a wonderful anti-anxiety experience, or it "loosens you up", just stay away from it. 


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#22 multispeedo

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Posted 06 March 2016 - 09:03 PM

Phenibut gave me the worst withdrawals - I tried it for sleep and it barely had any effect. I still kept using it. Once I quit cold turkey after a few weeks I had basically no sleep for several nights and sever panic attacks.







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