8 replies to this topic

[xlpwsmithx]

Hello all,

I just finished reading devinthayers post "How to Make Your Own Extended Release Pills" (due to forum rules for newbies, I cant post a link).

It's my goal to mix two to three supplements into a delayed-relese capsule, having them all simultaniously release at around 5 hours after ingestition. Some of the recommendations that I found in the formentioned post:

- "My compounding pharmacy makes "slow release" meds and supps by mixing them with celulose. It is supposed to realease over 8 to 10 hours. It forms a sticky non digestable ball in you GI tract and the ball slowly disolves over time releasing the med."

- "The cellulose polymers are the easiest way to get a reproducable time release matrix ... Using METHOCEL™ Cellulose Ethers for Controlled Release of Drugs in Hydrophilic Matrix Systems"

- "So I gathered a small 3mg melatonin pill, an empty 00 cap, and a bit of whey protein powder. Then mixed the protein powder with a small amount of water to create a thick paste. After coating the small melatonin cap, I place it in the larger cap."

- "Hydroxypropyl methylcellulose, is a vegetarian ingredient use for slow release formulas."


My goal is to mix the three ingredients into one capsule and ingest it prior to sleeping. The desired release time for all three ingredients would be 5 hours after one goes to sleep, and they would need to all release at the same time.

Whats the best way to to do this? Thanks!

[YOLF]

Hmmm... delayed release... I was wondering why delayed? Why not time release, it takes 2 hours to make use of the melatonin after you swallow it anyways, so it'll really be 7 hours after you swallow yours... Sure that's what you want?

[xlpwsmithx]

I'm researching the interactions between certain supplements and dream recall/intensity. The most effective way for to do this is to ingest the chemical just before one enters their final and most vivid dream cycle. For most people this is after about 6-7 hours of sleep, and the chemicals im interested in take around 1 hour before they take effect.

A delayed release what i need, or time released would limit the potential effects of that last and most memorable dream.

[MrSpud]

You could do it with a technology called pulsincap. You coat a half of a capsule so it doesn't dissolve, put your drug in the capsule and then insert a plug in the end of the capsule that is designed to swell and pop out and/ or dissolve enough to fall out at the appropriate time and then release the drug all at once. Here's a link to a brief description. You can google pulsincap if you want to find out more if you are really interested. http://www.iosrphr.o...ZL022338339.pdf

Edited by MrSpud, 22 August 2013 - 03:12 AM.

[MercuryAX]

MrSpud, that definitely looks promising - although would there be a way to implement this using supplies easily available? Hopefully someone comes up with something...

[xlpwsmithx]

MrSpuds, this is an awesome idea! I agree with Mercury though, theres no real way to come by these types of capsules for the amature hobbyist.

Maybe there is a way to replicate this process by using accessable materials, in a clean, professional, and reproductable way?

[MrSpud]

You're probably right about it being too hard to do at home, but it might be possible to get something close if someone really wanted to. You could look at the pulsincap patent as well as the various patents for the drugs that have been developed using the technology and find one with an example formula for one with a 5 hour release. It probably will have a formula for the swellable plug. The plug is what you'd have to replicate. For the non dissolving capsule portion you could coat the body of a regular capsule with ethyl cellulose dissolved in alcohol by painting it on with a brush. I'm not saying to do it. It sounds like too much trouble, I'm just saying that someone could probably do it if they were motivated enough.

Edited by MrSpud, 24 August 2013 - 10:52 PM.

[xlpwsmithx]

Okay, thanks.

I'll look around for a way to replicate the plug. And the ethycellulose coating is a good idea; would it be possible to just dip several at once? vs. coating each one individually.

I saw that many medications that use this format, are medications that get released in the intestines/colon. would chemicals release in these later stages still be able to reach the brain quickly?

The chemicals that im interested in will travel through the blood and eventually pass the bloodbrain barrier.

Maybe there is another method of ingestion (nasal spray, patch, etc) that would allow the delayed-release?

[ckendrick99]

Thought I'd try to resurrect this old thread as I have the same question.

 

Gelatin capsules are available in various sizes all the way up to ones meant for very large animals.  What about a series of such capsules, each encapsulating the last, like a Russian doll?  

 

A rule of thumb for gelatin caps is 20 minutes to dissolve, so would we be looking at (20 minutes X number of layers) as a maximum, or are there special reasons why it would be either significantly shorter or longer (such as surviving to a less acidic environment if you can last until gastric emptying has occurred)?

 

Is there reason this could be dangerous - like getting a large, unbroken chunk of material into the small intestine could lead to blockage?

 

Finally, this strategy was somewhat mentioned above, with whey paste suggested as a filler between capsule layers.  Whey is considered a quickly digested protein, at least by body builders, so I'm not sure why it was suggested if a delay is wanted.  Anyone have a suggestion for a better material that can be readily prepared - maybe fiber (e.g. Metamucil) with egg (for the casein) as a binder?

 

And finally finally, if anyone wants to wing it, I have a suggestion for a test substance: beta-alanine, because it causes paresthesia (pins and needles), so its onset would be unmistakable, yet it's a harmless well-studied supplement used daily by many endurance athletes.