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Nanotechnology for Changing Your Looks


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Poll: When Nanotechnology will be available for changing the body shape to a living organism but whom shall look however you'd wish, what will you do with it to your looks? (99 member(s) have cast votes)

When Nanotechnology will be available for changing the body shape to a living organism but whom shall look however you'd wish, what will you do with it to your looks?

  1. I'll do absolutely nothing, I love myself as I am, and always will (4 votes [4.21%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.21%

  2. I'll do absolutely nothing, I really don't care how I look like (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  3. I'll do nothing BUT healing scars from wounding and wounds (8 votes [8.42%])

    Percentage of vote: 8.42%

  4. I'll only ameliorate my looks by improving my natural looks(Change only little annoying things I've always dreamed of) (17 votes [17.89%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.89%

  5. I'll only ameliorate myself and add decorations for more *godly* looking, but will NOT change my base... (15 votes [15.79%])

    Percentage of vote: 15.79%

  6. I'll change a LOT, I'll keep only ->very few<- things I love (4 votes [4.21%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.21%

  7. I'll totally change myself, other looks. as a new person (10 votes [10.53%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.53%

  8. Who said I'm going to remain with a human looking...? (30 votes [31.58%])

    Percentage of vote: 31.58%

  9. Other (7 votes [7.37%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.37%

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#1 Infernity

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Posted 20 June 2005 - 06:54 PM


I wonder how nobody has asked it before, or am I just not a good seeker?
However,
When Nanotechnology will be available for changing the body shape to a living organism but whom shall look however you'd wish, what will you do with it to your looks?

Hmm, I still need to think of it...

Yours truthfully
~Infernity

#2 Infernity

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Posted 20 June 2005 - 06:59 PM

I think I'll go for amelioration and divine ornamentations [tung]

Sounds cool.

Err, a quick suggestion, dear leaders, let have the option to edit the poll if no one has voted yet.

Yours truthfully
~Infernity

#3 psudoname

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Posted 20 June 2005 - 08:54 PM

Well, I think there is no real reason to keep a human looking body for ever. If I end up being able to think far faster then I can now (I seem to remember signals in the brain travels 200m/s compared to the theroretical limit of 300 000 000m/s for light) then interacting in a physical way would seem increadbly slow. That and other factors mean I would focus a lot of my attention upon a virtual world.
I think being a 'jupiter brain' would be a good future. [thumb]

As to how I would change my body if uploading and messing with the brain wasn't allowed:
After increacing my health ( it would be nice to be able to run faster then a speeding bullet), and getting rid of little imperfections like spots and excess fat, I would change my looks a bit.

Tattoes and peircings without the pain and irriversablity would be nice. I would get some abstract tattoes. Maybe ones that change constantly, which you could do with nanotech.

Of course there are a lot of very kinky things you could do.......

I found some writing on this but can't find it now. Exactly what I would do in that regard in this hypothetical time in the future would depend upon what my hypothetical future girlfriend thought of course.

I have a very high shock level. With everything. [lol]

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#4 th3hegem0n

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Posted 21 June 2005 - 01:45 AM

Total change. I'll try everything once.

Hey, I've never been a tattoo kinda guy, but the idea of irreversability and moving tattoos and such sounds pretty f***in cool.

Eventually I want to have experienced life from every possible angle (most likely a lot of whole earth VR sims and such), some people say they would love to relive a few years and such, but i would like to relive life as a whole-- many many times, in many real and imagined worlds and points in history and with many different bodies (definitely both genders). That'd definitely be my preferred route of becoming the equivalent of an all-knowing superwise god-entity. Especially if I use a brain upload or some sort of computer interface that speeds up subjective time so I could live a few thousand simulated years in less than a day.

Hey, it's shocking, but it's entirely possible.



(navigation: please keep potty mouth to a minimum)

Edited by DonSpanton, 21 June 2005 - 11:42 PM.


#5 Utnapishtim

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Posted 21 June 2005 - 06:49 AM

The defeat of ugliness will be an amazing thing. The amount of mental anguish and low self esteem that is caused by physical unattractiveness is a truly terrible thing. Study after study has shown that whether professionally or socially the penalties of ugliness are vastly underestimated. I am deeply suspicious of individuals who claim not to judge others on the basis of appearance. To me it betrays an ignorance of universal inbuilt human biases. The individual who operates on the theory that he does not judge others by shallow criteria like looks is forced to exaggerate in his own mind the character virtues of the beautiful and the character deficiences of the ugly. The catty sorority girl with her explicit preference for beautiful friends is at least more honest, both with herself and others, than those who ascribe great moral worth to those with a "kind and honest face"

#6 Infernity

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Posted 21 June 2005 - 11:23 AM

Well Utnapishtim, I don't totally agree with you, although I'm not sure it is contrasting...

Maybe a first impression you get by the looks but after you know someone, he appears different to you even if he did not change.
Inner beauty is being thrashed out and so inner ugliness. I've seen it a lot, I actually get to see this all the time.
I'll give you an example of two friends of mine, one of them, I when I just met her, she seemed not ugly, but not pretty, you know, normal face of a girl. Since I became a good friend of her, she appears pretty, she really is.
And another example, one of the girls I know always appeared to me as a pretty one, till I got to know her, and since then, she really looks bad to me. No kidding, she really disgusts me.
However, I do not judge by the way people look, but their behavior, and the eyes tells a lot too.

Of course a really good looking person shall catch my aye, but it doesn't mean I'll judge him/her by it. But after all, a muscle guy is obviously working out, which points on taking care of his health. And it is showing a bit of his personality.
As an extremely ugly person shall catch my eye too, and maybe even deter.

I suppose it has to do with evolution. People saw a good looking person of the other gender and concluded he/she's healthy and shalt bequeath a good genes and so they should have a strong healthy offsprings.
As a bad looking one is weak and might be sick, and deter people from wanting to continue their generations.

Yours
~Infernity

#7 psudoname

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Posted 21 June 2005 - 09:24 PM

but i would like to relive life as a whole-- many many times, in many real and imagined worlds and points in history and with many different bodies (definitely both genders)


Well I would like to live in a lot of different worlds, maybe one where I could be a hero from lord of the rings, one where I could be Napolion, maybe even relive my live making the desicions I would have made in retrospect. Also messing around with different bodys could be interesting. I could be a troll from LOTR.....

And as far as messing around with gender goes....

http://www.natasha.cc/sex.htm


The individual who operates on the theory that he does not judge others by shallow criteria like looks is forced to exaggerate in his own mind the character virtues of the beautiful and the character deficiences of the ugly.


Not too sure about this. I think you can judge people a lot by facial expressions, but restructuing a face with nanotech won't give someone a happy freindly smile if they arn't happy and freindly (unless you put their face on auto pilot). In my opinion, personality shows though the face and is more important then superfical aspects of beauty e.g. the way someone smiles is more important then their teeth being very white.

#8 Utnapishtim

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Posted 21 June 2005 - 09:46 PM

Psudoname

I think judging people by facial expressions may be almost as unfortunate aninevitability as judging them by their appearance. But a distinction between the two is almost impossible to make in practice anyway.
Regarding facial expresssions:
The degree of fine motor control people possess in this regard, varies widely and I believe that studies have shown it dramatically contributes to an individuals social success. It is a skill/talent like any other. In some professions such as acting or stand up comedy it is vital. There seems little correlation between an individuals capacity to touch us emotionally with his physical presence and his moral worth or the quality of his ideas.

Actors (even the less physically attractive ones eg Whoopi Goldberg) are generally exceptionally good at this. Look at Tom Hanks a man of distinctly average physical attractiveness who has leveraged his skill at eliciting positive responses through facial expressions into millions of dollars and worldwide fame.

If facial expression were really a useful guide to character Hollywood would be the most morally upstanding community in the world. I persoanlly dont believe that it is.

#9 DJS

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Posted 21 June 2005 - 11:49 PM

I chose *other* Infernity because you did not provide the choice of **looking however I want, whenever I want**. I like the idea put forward by other THist thinkers of being able to use advanced nanotech (molecular assemblers) to become a shape shifter of sorts. I believe that Lazarus referred to this as a polymorph. One minute I could be me at 21, the next minute I could morph into a desk then a weird green alien being, etc etc.

Though my ideal me would probably be me at around 22.

#10 Lazarus Long

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 12:17 AM

I believe that Lazarus referred to this as a polymorph. One minute I could be me at 21, the next minute I could morph into a desk then a weird green alien being, etc etc.


Yes I did. I am glad you remember [lol]

Only I go a step further and see this as a form of universal adaptation allowing for intentional directed morphology to any specific environment. I believe the ancients call it shape shifting but in the shamanic sense.

What I mean is the ability to go aquatic, arboreal, reptilian, avian and insect at will with an eye toward maximum efficiency for any specific environmental condition encountered. It can also work to pass for a native (of any planet) :))

I go again farther and think we should figure on an alternative synthetic mitochondria that is modified to contain characteristics of chloroplasts instead of melanin. It can possibly have the effect of not only providing an alternative diet of light but perhaps also extend our lifespans in the fashion of Sequoia. [alien]

#11 John Schloendorn

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 02:27 AM

Hmm, Laz you make me think there...
What exactly would it take to make a shiny green, facultatively phototrophic nude mouse? Are the genes for the structural synthesis of the chloroplast known? If not, could the mitochondrion be turned into a photosynthetic site, increasing the number of mitos if need be? Will there be crosstalk between photosynthesis and respiration pathways? How many genes would need to be transferred? It seems they might fit onto a single mammalian artificial chromosome... How could photosynthesis be regulated in mammals? Perhaps couple it to gluconeogenesis regulation? C4 or CAM metabolism perhaps? And in the end, what could one use this animal for, beyond hugely advertising one's biotech company [tung]? Add the chromosome to our own replacement cells in case we do something like WILT one day?

#12 Lazarus Long

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 03:36 AM

(John) How could photosynthesis be regulated in mammals? Perhaps couple it to gluconeogenesis regulation?


Photosynthesis provides food John. It is a means to never starve in the light as long as the bsic lements of water and minerals were available as opposed to compled organic nutrients. Consider it a way of not only using our skin for cooling and a weak third kidney but to go the other way and by exposure draw in nutrient energy to recombine with recycled mineral/protein and simultaneously block radiative mutation through nucleus scale shielding.

BTW it has the drawback of course that one must look good running around nearly naked [:o]

We are a bald ape anyway, though one alternative with polymorphism is to be able to extend fur as needed for warmth and modify it surfaces to adapt to surrounding conditions. Maybe like animals change fur color for seasons and grown different coats or even as expressive styling. Imagine the end of PETA as there is no need to kill animals for fur if you can grow you own ermine as required and make it disappear without a coat check as you walk into the opera.

Though there is the possibility of the Polynesian fondness for surface area advantage that might serve as an alternative albeit self limiting option.

I have pondered the transgenic advantages of modifying mitos with chloro genes as basically they are very similar genetically. True they are coded very differently but the origins of their genetics go back to a common ancestor so there should be transgenic possibility worth investigating. They program to the same coded language so to speak and I suspect like bacterial transcription of plasmids the manipulation of the genome should be far easier and generally safer.

I always planned to use this idea as a form of space suit for my little green men. :))

After all it would allow a deep exploratory crew to offset a portion of their physical supplies with direct energy absorption/conversion that is far more efficient. Even at say 20 percent under controlled CRON that could ensure survival for prolonged periods between Port O'Calls. [pirate]

I also ponder its advantages against mutation. I figure it is better to work with the mitochondrial genes directly than necessarily incorporate the gene into the nucleus.

Edited by Lazarus Long, 22 June 2005 - 03:26 PM.


#13 Lazarus Long

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 03:49 AM

BTW HI Utna [!]

and I don't think we can ever end ugliness because like beauty it really exists primarily in your heart and the eye of the beholder.

In fact as everyone seeks a common standard it will be like cars and they will all look alike. Beauty then like the flaw in the diamond will find new expression and imperfection as uniqueness. But no matter how carefully you wrap up an ugly heart its appearance may deceive but cannot fully mask the aesthetic offense.

Often even today wealth buys the impression of beauty not the reality. After all isn't that the nickname of the true wealthy elite; the "beautiful people." The problem begins with defining beauty as something to covet versus desire. It is through that psychosocial balance that one can change from one to the other like a polymorph.

BTW, ugliness has its own beauty too within its horror so to speak. The apparition of threat as symbolic of power. And true power in any form can become a type of aphrodisiac and thus conflated with beauty.

#14 John Schloendorn

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 04:48 AM

block radiative mutation through nucleus scale shielding

I'd rather keep the photosynthetic cells post-mitotic and disposable, and shield my stem cells with lots of pigmented epithelial substance, similar to what trees do

running around nearly naked

just absorb all of the light, rather than reflecting it - no one will see you. just when the pigment fails for some reason, you're in trouble :)

offset a portion of their physical supplies with direct energy

Hm, I'm afraid chemical or biological de novo synthesis of food remains the easier option. This idea would be cool only if there were any economical application...

incorporate the gene into the nucleus

Once we can mess around with the mito genome like that then there is indeed no need to

#15 justinb

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 05:39 AM

I want to be an Androgenous Brunette Lesbian (ABL) that wears french school girl clothes and drive all you horny Immortalists crazy. [:o] [lol]

Hell even the genetically and neurologically asexual immortalists will hate me because I will make them want to go sexual again. [sfty]

Edited by justinb, 22 June 2005 - 08:40 AM.


#16 Richard Leis

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 06:54 AM

I will become a cactus-dolphin with improved interior design tastes. Or something like that...

#17 justinb

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 06:56 AM

I will become a cactus-dolphin with improved interior design tastes.  Or something like that...


HAHAHA, WHAT THE F***?!






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Edited by DonSpanton, 24 June 2005 - 02:40 AM.


#18 Lazarus Long

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 11:41 AM

Hey this thread is all about diverse imaginative applications. If you keep picking on him maybe somebody will give you, in your French school girl dress, a weggie. [lol]

Actually to bring everybody back to Earth and REAL world possibilities here is an example of the use of nanoparticles to target cancer cells by also shaping them to make an *attractive molecular fit*.
[quote]Nanoparticle boosts chemo effectiveness
http://news.yahoo.co...m/nano_chemo_dc

NEW YORK (Reuters Health) - By attaching a chemotherapy drug to a microscopic "nanoparticle," scientists have increased the cancer-killing capacity of the drug while reducing its toxic side effects, experiments in mice show.

Dr. James R. Baker Jr. of the University of Michigan Health System in Ann Arbor and his team attached methotrexate to a multi-branched synthetic macromolecule called a dendrimer. To target it to cancer cells they also attached folic acid to the nanoparticle, along with imaging agents so they could see what went on.

They found that cells that overexpressed folate receptors on their surface readily took up the engineered particle.[/quote]

This approach is very similar in principle to how I would like to see neural scanning technology improved by using a more advanced nanoparticle, which would act as a signaling device (like a molecular scale transponder) telling the scanner not just where the activity is in the brain but when specific synapses fire, rest and the *direction* (pathway) of the signal through the neural net.

The importance of this approach is significant in that it would allow fine detailed analysis of neural function and improve the chance of decrypting the operational language and distributed functioning of the brain's neural net. This approach would not just light up the brain but if done right could light up the entire nervous system.

[quote](John Schloendorn)
[quote]  (Laz)
block radiative mutation through nucleus scale shielding[/quote]

I'd rather keep the photosynthetic cells post-mitotic and disposable, and shield my stem cells with lots of pigmented epithelial substance, similar to what trees do
[/quote]

I generally agree with you but what I was referring to is also a way to shield the DNA but I am also wondering about how to insert an alternative engineered organelle that could pick up where mitos fail due to mutational damage.

[quote]  (John Schloendorn)
[quote]  (Laz)
running around nearly naked[/quote]

just absorb all of the light, rather than reflecting it - no one will see you. just when the pigment fails for some reason, you're in trouble [/quote]

Basically we are already on the same page. You are describing the chameleon aspect of the idea. You can alter at will your surface color and patterning to match surroundings.

I just feel that *absorption* should also support function because chloroplasts basically function by a parallel adaptive strategy to mitos except that they use photons of sunlight to help process metabolites and they apply photosynthesis to actually release O2 and consume CO2 in the presence of light.

IOW I wonder if they could ber modified to act as cellular scale scrubbers for some of the waste products of mitos and perhaps symbiotically supoort eachother by bypassing the lungs for some percent of respiration and in the same process reduce the overall presence of free radical oxygen in the cell that is contributing to aging.

While we could imagine going to gills and other adaptive techniques with late stage biomorphic nano I am also pondering a more subtle and available reason for this transgenic technique. I wonder if it is possible to create a *partner* for the mito that could perhaps dramatically reduce oxidative stress. Chloroplasts by virtue of how they function don't really experience this type of stress but also they could perhaps work inside the cell to strip away excess free radicals while increasing available energy to the body (and brain) AND dramatically slowing aging.

One advantage for this approach to engineering a transgenic second cellular symbiote is that if it could be designed to effectively live alongside mitos in the cytoplasm then it would not only be able to be transfected into the cell of living folks but might pass itself on generation after generation and improve itself through selection pressure over time. The problem is that the effect is only *skin deep*. Maybe the adaptation could be just to skin cells? hmmm [glasses]

BTW 'Justine' (that fits the ABL in the French schoolgirl dress better don't you think? :)) ) asexuals don't hate everyone else they just love themselves more. Perhaps some dislike being made to feel unfaithful to themselves but even earthworms can change their (ahem) minds and go both ways. [lol]

Once you are hermaphroditic everyone is a lesbian. [wis]

#19 Infernity

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 03:20 PM

[quote]I think judging people by facial expressions may be almost as unfortunate aninevitability as judging them by their appearance. But a distinction between the two is almost impossible to make in practice anyway.[/quote]
Wrong Unta, body language tells a LOT!

You know, a person who saw me started telling my parents things on myself they were shocked to hear, and I was shocked he saw it. I had a secret at the time, and he found out I do. He found lots of things about me, my behavior etcetera. He reads body language. It's amazing, he got me all bulls-eye.

[quote]I chose *other* Infernity because you did not provide the choice of **looking however I want, whenever I want**.[/quote]
Oh Don, what can I do that you leaders gave only 10 options..? [mellow]

*However, you all guys think of changing not only shape but all the inside! I don't think it is possible, you have to contain all you system as a human don't you? I mean how would a desk be able to turn back to an organism without a brain? is it a long squeezed one?!

[quote]and I don't think we can ever end ugliness because like beauty it really exists primarily in your heart and the eye of the beholder.[/quote]
Heh Laz, http://www.imminst.o...880

[quote]I want to be an Androgenous Brunette Lesbian (ABL) that wears french school girl clothes and drive all you horny Immortalists crazy. [:o]
[lol]

Hell even the genetically and neurologically asexual immortalists will hate me because I will make them want to go sexual again. [sfty][/quote]
Hehehe well Justin, continue hallucinating... [g:)]

[quote]I will become a cactus-dolphin with improved interior design tastes. Or something like that...[/quote]
Is this REALLY what you wanna be? [:o]

[quote]The problem is that the effect is only *skin deep*. Maybe the adaptation could be just to skin cells? hmmm [glasses][/quote]
[>] *If the internet wouldn't fail damn it, I needed to write it all again and your post was already here.

Yours truthfully
~Infernity

#20 antilithium

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 03:31 PM

Posted Image

This is what I'm going to be when I grow up: an interstellar death-mobile.

First, I'll convert all the mass of our tiny solar system into a 5 AU iron fist of suffering. Then I (and only I because everyone's computational patterns were converted into *me*) will launch a never ending stream of 15 mm Von Neumann probes loaded with 3.5 exabytes of software. I PITY THE POOR ALIEN CIVILIATION THAT WOULD RUN INTO THESE MOTHERS. Because I'll convert their asses, along with their solar system. In time the Milky Way will become one mind... ME!!!!11!!!11 OMFG WTF I'll just get bigger and bigger until I utterly transcend the universe.
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#21 justinb

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Posted 23 June 2005 - 09:18 PM

Hey this thread is all about diverse imaginative applications. If you keep picking on him maybe somebody will give you, in your French school girl dress, a weggie


If he did that his cactus would get hard..... [tung] [lol]

#22 John Schloendorn

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Posted 24 June 2005 - 01:26 AM

symbiotically supoort eachother by bypassing the lungs for some percent of respiration and in the same process reduce the overall presence of free radical oxygen

Yeah, plants do that all the time. The former is photosynthesis and the latter is photorespiration. It'd sure be fun to develop that in mammals, just a matter of getting the regulation right. If it weren't so utterly application-less :-)

I wonder if it is possible to create a *partner* for the mito that could perhaps dramatically reduce oxidative stress.

Unfortunately, much of the causes and effects of oxidative stress are within the same mito. So an organellar symbiont would not get to the root of the problem.

#23 justinb

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Posted 26 June 2005 - 08:20 AM

Androgyny

Posted Image

Just a slightly stronger nose and that will be perfect!

#24 Infernity

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Posted 26 June 2005 - 11:09 AM

Hey Kid, interstellar death-mobile, why do you want to be it?! [huh]

Is this attracting you to be such... thing?

Yours truthfully
~Infernity

#25 justinb

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Posted 26 June 2005 - 04:19 PM

The picture doesn't seem to work.

Infernity,
I want to experiance everything.

#26 Infernity

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Posted 26 June 2005 - 04:34 PM

I know what you want Justin, I was talking to antilithium... [glasses]

~Infernity

#27 justinb

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Posted 27 June 2005 - 03:51 AM

I know what you want Justin]

~Infernity


Antilithium is just a punk! [lol]

Seriously, he said he would kill a copy of himselve... weirdo!

#28 Infernity

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Posted 27 June 2005 - 01:28 PM

Justin, you deserve the mess of the quote, since it took you time to realize there's a glitch, or maybe you still didn't get it?
Hahaha.

However, I can put money on that I'll try to kill my copy. The problem is she might kill me before... Heh, but I suppose I', now also a weirdo?
Ahm ahm, look who's talking...

Yours
~Infernity

#29 justinb

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Posted 29 June 2005 - 05:20 AM

Justin, you deserve the mess of the quote, since it took you time to realize there's a glitch, or maybe you still didn't get it?
Hahaha.

However, I can put money on that I'll try to kill my copy. The problem is she might kill me before... Heh, but I suppose I', now also a weirdo?
Ahm ahm, look who's talking...

Yours
~Infernity


Yes, I believe that dilemma is the absolute test of ethics and the absolute perfect fate all in one. If you choose to kill a copy of yourself, there is about a 50% chance that you will die from the encounter. Your fate is completely determined by yourself. [lol]

A copy of myself would agree to become a lesbian and we would have hot girl on girl sex for a very long time.... [:o]

Note that we would flip a coin on hair color, body type, etc.... [tung]

The same two lesbians doing it would be less interesting then two different lesbians doing it! But it would still be insanely awesome none-the-less!

Edited by justinb, 29 June 2005 - 10:19 AM.


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#30 Infernity

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Posted 29 June 2005 - 10:19 AM

Well, but you and your copy might want to look the same... I mean not like you two will like to look like each other, but simply the design you two will want to be will be the same. After same mind heh.

Yours truthfully
~Infernity




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