13 replies to this topic

[The Immortalist]

I created this thread because I've been drinking a ton of tea and coffee for a years now and I'm wondering whether I'm doing myself any harm. I just can't function without caffeine. I can't imaging going a day without it. It makes my mental performance SO much better. It makes everything SO much better actually, from watching movies to reading books to talking with people etc.  I've tried going 3 months with 0 grams of caffeine and it's just not the same. 

 

Can excessive caffeine intake accelerate aging whether it be your external appearance or the actual health of your bodily systems?

 

The amount I'm talking about would be 1g of caffeine dispersed throughout the day coming from both tea and coffee. 

 

I drink about 8 litres of water a day with most of it coming from tap water and the rest coming from tea and coffee. 

Is it possible that there's something wrong with my brain and I'm using caffeine to compensate for a serious problem? Caffeine actually seems to calm me down and make it easier to focus rather than cause me to go hyper and agitated. 

 

 

Edited by The Immortalist, 14 April 2014 - 05:14 PM.

[rwac]

You have seen this study, right?

 

Caffeine extends life span, improves healthspan, and delays age-associated pathology in Caenorhabditis elegans

[tunt01]

I recall the Genescient group saying more than a cup or two per day was a bad idea.    Their work was done in flies, but I think it is noteworthy nonetheless.  Excessive coffee consumption seems like a bad idea for a variety of reasons not just caffeine related.

[The Immortalist]

You have seen this study, right?

 

Caffeine extends life span, improves healthspan, and delays age-associated pathology in Caenorhabditis elegans

 

Now I have.

[TheFountain]

Too much caffeine has been known to cause adrenal fatigue in some people. Be careful and strike a balance, do not go overboard with 8 cups of coffee a day!

[Absent]

Anything that stresses the body can accelerate aging. Do you think excess caffeine puts any stress on the body?

[maxwatt]

It depends on one's phenotype.  Some people have reduced incidence of cardiovascular problems, in others the risk of heart-attack increases.  If you are homozygous for the CYP1A2*1A allele you are a rapid caffeine metabolizer, CYP1A2*1F are slow metabolizers, and are at increased risk with caffeine consumption.  In the rapid metabolizers caffeine appears to be protective.  If coffee consumption late in the day does not interfere with your sleep you are likely a rapid metabolizer. (Coffee, CYP1A2 genotype, and risk of myocardial infarction -Cornelis MC¹, El-Sohemy A, Kabagambe EK, Campos H.)

 

Given the OP's reported caffeine consumption, it seems likely he is a rapid metabolizer.  There are other factors as well.  Coffee and more especially tea contain polyphenols and other antioxidants thought to be healthy.  Unfiltered coffee contains caffeic acid which lowers HDL cholesterol and increases LDL.  French press and gold coated meal strainers don't remove it, paper does.  If you pour French press coffee through a paper coffee filter, the crud you see caught with the filter should convince you to change your brewing habits.

 

Tea is something else.  Most tea is lower in caffeine than coffee, but some have more.  Green and white teas are rich in EGCG, but not everyone benefits ....  Again, it depends on genetics.  Oxidiation and fermentation convert the EGCG into another form that can be metabolized without the specific polymorphism whose name I forget.  An NiH researcher told me green tea is protective against breast cancer for a certain high percentage of women with the right genetics, not for the rest. 

 

I would think the OP can continue to drink coffee and tea as he enjoys them without ill effect.  The reasons for stopping would have more to do with superstition than with science.

Edited by maxwatt, 20 April 2014 - 01:35 PM.

[nightlight]

Tea is something else.  Most tea is lower in caffeine than coffee, but some have more.  Green and white teas are rich in EGCG, but not everyone benefits ....  Again, it depends on genetics.  Oxidiation and fermentation convert the EGCG into another form that can be metabolized without the specific polymorphism whose name I forget.  An NiH researcher told me green tea is protective against breast cancer for a certain high percentage of women with the right genetics, not for the rest.

 

The problem with black and green tea is fluoride (3-5 times more than in regular fluoridated water). Maybe a solution is to use herbal teas and add some caffeine powder to bring up the daily dose to the levels of black/green tea or coffee.

[maxwatt]

 

Tea is something else.  Most tea is lower in caffeine than coffee, but some have more.  Green and white teas are rich in EGCG, but not everyone benefits ....  Again, it depends on genetics.  Oxidiation and fermentation convert the EGCG into another form that can be metabolized without the specific polymorphism whose name I forget.  An NiH researcher told me green tea is protective against breast cancer for a certain high percentage of women with the right genetics, not for the rest.

 

The problem with black and green tea is fluoride (3-5 times more than in regular fluoridated water). Maybe a solution is to use herbal teas and add some caffeine powder to bring up the daily dose to the levels of black/green tea or coffee.

 

 

This is not necessarily a problem, as not all teas are high in fluoride.  It depends on the soil where they are grown.  Japanese green tea is low in fluoride, but you might find it is radioactive.   Black humor aside, florosis is rarely seen from tea consumption alone,  Apparently the amount needed to cause disease is on the order of a gallon a day for several years (http://www.livescien...a-drinking.html).An exception might be in Tibet, where "brick tea"  is drunk in preference to water.  "Brick tea",is made from a low grade black tea in China, and most of it is exceptionally high in fluoride.  One Tibetan entrepreneur is marketing low-fluoride brick tea in Tibet in response.
 

Whether lower fluoride levels are desirable is disputed by some.  It does result in stronger, harder teeth and bones - up to a point -  too much they get brittle.  I do wonder if moderate tea consumption might ot prevent osteoporosis in old age.  Something to google-search to kill time, rather than play solitaire.

[TheFountain]

It depends on one's phenotype.  Some people have reduced incidence of cardiovascular problems, in others the risk of heart-attack increases.  If you are homozygous for the CYP1A2*1A allele you are a rapid caffeine metabolizer, CYP1A2*1F are slow metabolizers, and are at increased risk with caffeine consumption.  In the rapid metabolizers caffeine appears to be protective.  If coffee consumption late in the day does not interfere with your sleep you are likely a rapid metabolizer. (Coffee, CYP1A2 genotype, and risk of myocardial infarction -Cornelis MC¹, El-Sohemy A, Kabagambe EK, Campos H.)

 

 

Would this apply to low level caffeine consumption too if you happen to be a slow metabolizer? 

 

What about theobromine? 

[maxwatt]

 

It depends on one's phenotype.  Some people have reduced incidence of cardiovascular problems, in others the risk of heart-attack increases.  If you are homozygous for the CYP1A2*1A allele you are a rapid caffeine metabolizer, CYP1A2*1F are slow metabolizers, and are at increased risk with caffeine consumption.  In the rapid metabolizers caffeine appears to be protective.  If coffee consumption late in the day does not interfere with your sleep you are likely a rapid metabolizer. (Coffee, CYP1A2 genotype, and risk of myocardial infarction -Cornelis MC¹, El-Sohemy A, Kabagambe EK, Campos H.)

 

 

Would this apply to low level caffeine consumption too if you happen to be a slow metabolizer? 

 

What about theobromine? 

 

 

An interesting question.  There are other factors that would enter into it, I am sure, including the amount of exercise one takes, diet, and other factors that contribute to or interfere with cardiovascular health.  Avoiding caffeine after noon is a strategy I've seen successfully employed.  Slowing down the rate of input might help if metabolism is rate-limited, but I wouldn't know how to estimate the tipping point from drinking too fast.  I cannot really give you any guidance beyond that.

 

As for theobromine, it would depend on what enzymes metabolize it.  If it is another Cytochrome enzyme, then it woud depend on your other genes.  If it too is CYP!A!, then the same cautions would apply.
 

[TheFountain]

 

 

It depends on one's phenotype.  Some people have reduced incidence of cardiovascular problems, in others the risk of heart-attack increases.  If you are homozygous for the CYP1A2*1A allele you are a rapid caffeine metabolizer, CYP1A2*1F are slow metabolizers, and are at increased risk with caffeine consumption.  In the rapid metabolizers caffeine appears to be protective.  If coffee consumption late in the day does not interfere with your sleep you are likely a rapid metabolizer. (Coffee, CYP1A2 genotype, and risk of myocardial infarction -Cornelis MC¹, El-Sohemy A, Kabagambe EK, Campos H.)

 

 

Would this apply to low level caffeine consumption too if you happen to be a slow metabolizer? 

 

What about theobromine? 

 

 

An interesting question.  There are other factors that would enter into it, I am sure, including the amount of exercise one takes, diet, and other factors that contribute to or interfere with cardiovascular health.  Avoiding caffeine after noon is a strategy I've seen successfully employed.  Slowing down the rate of input might help if metabolism is rate-limited, but I wouldn't know how to estimate the tipping point from drinking too fast.  I cannot really give you any guidance beyond that.

 

As for theobromine, it would depend on what enzymes metabolize it.  If it is another Cytochrome enzyme, then it woud depend on your other genes.  If it too is CYP!A!, then the same cautions would apply.
 

 

This is what I found on wiki.

 

"In the liver, theobromine is metabolized into xanthine and subsequently into methyluric acid.^[26] Important enzymes include CYP1A2 and CYP2E1.^[27]"

And

"As a phosphodiesterase inhibitor, theobromine helps prevent the phosphodiesterase enzymes from converting the active cAMP to an inactive form.^[33] cAMP works as a second messenger in many hormone- and neurotransmitter-controlled metabolic systems, such as the breakdown of glycogen."

 

Also

 

"Theobromine and caffeine are similar in that they are related alkaloids, theobromine is weaker in both its inhibition of cyclic nucleotide phosphodiesterases and its antagonism of adenosine receptors.^[36] Therefore, theobromine has a lesser impact on the human central nervous system than caffeine."

Edited by TheFountain, 26 April 2014 - 02:24 AM.

[TheFountain]

Here is also an old study on Caffeine, Theobromine and Theophylline metabolism in men. I don't have time to read it right now. 

 

http://www.jbc.org/c.../1/315.full.pdf

[Darryl]

Caffeine may offer protection against neurodegenerative diseases via antatagonism at the A2A form of adenosine receptor. From Mark McCarty's bibliography.

 

Animal studies:

Cunha, Rodrigo A. "Neuroprotection by adenosine in the brain: from A1 receptor activation to A2A receptor blockade." Purinergic Signalling 1.2 (2005): 111-134.

Arendash, G. W., et al. "Caffeine protects Alzheimer’s mice against cognitive impairment and reduces brain β-amyloid production." Neuroscience 142.4 (2006): 941-952.

Takahashi, Reinaldo Naoto, Fabricio Alano Pamplona, and R. D. Prediger. "Adenosine receptor antagonists for cognitive dysfunction: a review of animal studies." Frontiers in bioscience: a journal and virtual library 13 (2007): 2614-2632.

Canas, Paula M., et al. "Adenosine A2A receptor blockade prevents synaptotoxicity and memory dysfunction caused by β-amyloid peptides via p38 mitogen-activated protein kinase pathway." The Journal of neuroscience 29.47 (2009): 14741-14751.

Cao, Chuanhai, et al. "Caffeine suppresses amyloid-β levels in plasma and brain of Alzheimer's disease transgenic mice." Journal of Alzheimer's Disease 17.3 (2009): 681-697.

Brothers, Holly M., Yannick Marchalant, and Gary L. Wenk. "Caffeine attenuates lipopolysaccharide-induced neuroinflammation." Neuroscience letters 480.2 (2010): 97-100.

Cunha, Rodrigo A., and Paula M. Agostinho. "Chronic caffeine consumption prevents memory disturbance in different animal models of memory decline."Journal of Alzheimer's Disease 20 (2010): 95-116.

Matos, Marco, et al. "Adenosine A2A receptors modulate glutamate uptake in cultured astrocytes and gliosomes." Glia 60.5 (2012): 702-716.

Matos, Marco, et al. "Astrocytic adenosine A2A receptors control the amyloid-β peptide-induced decrease of glutamate uptake." Journal of Alzheimer's Disease31.3 (2012): 555-567.

 

 

Epidemiology:

Maia, L., and A. De Mendonça. "Does caffeine intake protect from Alzheimer's disease?." European Journal of Neurology 9.4 (2002): 377-382.

Quintana, José Luis Barranco, et al. "Alzheimer's disease and coffee: a quantitative review." Neurological research 29.1 (2007): 91-95.

Ritchie, Karen, et al. "The neuroprotective effects of caffeine A prospective population study (the Three City Study)." Neurology 69.6 (2007): 536-545.

Eskelinen, Marjo H., et al. "Midlife coffee and tea drinking and the risk of late-life dementia: a population-based CAIDE study." Journal of Alzheimer's Disease16.1 (2009): 85-91.

Santos, Catarina, et al. "Caffeine intake and dementia: systematic review and meta-analysis." Journal of Alzheimer's Disease 20 (2010): 187-204.

Santos, Catarina, et al. "Caffeine intake is associated with a lower risk of cognitive decline: a cohort study from Portugal." Journal of Alzheimer's Disease20 (2010): 175-185.

Eskelinen, Marjo H., and Miia Kivipelto. "Caffeine as a protective factor in dementia and Alzheimer's disease." Journal of Alzheimer's Disease 20 (2010): 167-174.

Gelber, Rebecca P., et al. "Coffee intake in midlife and risk of dementia and its neuropathologic correlates." Journal of Alzheimer's Disease 23.4 (2011): 607-615.

Cao, Chuanhai, et al. "High blood caffeine levels in MCI linked to lack of progression to dementia." Journal of Alzheimer's Disease 30.3 (2012): 559-572.