20 replies to this topic

[The Immortalist]

I get extremely tired from any sort of interaction outside my house. I only feel good when I'm alone. I feel like shit in any public places. How do I stop this? I want to do so many things that require interaction with people but I want to be able to enjoy myself.

[Ritchie]

Can you be more descriptive. Why do you feel like shit in public. Do you feel scared or depressed in public?

[The Immortalist]

Can you be more descriptive. Why do you feel like shit in public. Do you feel scared or depressed in public?

 

I feel tired, less able to focus, annoyed, uncomfortable in my own skin. Which all makes me feel depressed in time. 

[Ritchie]

 

Can you be more descriptive. Why do you feel like shit in public. Do you feel scared or depressed in public?

 

I feel tired, less able to focus, annoyed, uncomfortable in my own skin. Which all makes me feel depressed in time. 

 

So do you only feel this way in public, or also feel tired when alone? Also, do you have any social skills?

[The Immortalist]

 

 

Can you be more descriptive. Why do you feel like shit in public. Do you feel scared or depressed in public?

 

I feel tired, less able to focus, annoyed, uncomfortable in my own skin. Which all makes me feel depressed in time. 

 

So do you only feel this way in public, or also feel tired when alone? Also, do you have any social skills?

 

Yes I do have competent social skills It's just that using them tires me out for some reason. Today I was so tired I couldn't even muster the strength to even attempt to keep up my appearance or be friendly.

Edited by The Immortalist, 22 April 2014 - 01:10 AM.

[Ritchie]

 

 

 

Can you be more descriptive. Why do you feel like shit in public. Do you feel scared or depressed in public?

 

I feel tired, less able to focus, annoyed, uncomfortable in my own skin. Which all makes me feel depressed in time. 

 

So do you only feel this way in public, or also feel tired when alone? Also, do you have any social skills?

 

Yes I do have competent social skills It's just that using them tires me out for some reason. Today I was so tired I couldn't even muster the strength to even attempt to keep up my appearance or be friendly.

 

Okay, how does your diet, sleeping schedule and exercise regimen look like. Sleep deprivation, being unfit, or having a poor diet could all be causing this. You could also try a stimulant like caffeine of phenylpiracetam, but i'm wondering if you have fatigue all the time or only in public. If it's only in public and you feel otherwise energetic and fine, then i believe this issue probably won't be solved with any supplement.

 

[The Immortalist]

 

 

 

 

Can you be more descriptive. Why do you feel like shit in public. Do you feel scared or depressed in public?

 

I feel tired, less able to focus, annoyed, uncomfortable in my own skin. Which all makes me feel depressed in time. 

 

So do you only feel this way in public, or also feel tired when alone? Also, do you have any social skills?

 

Yes I do have competent social skills It's just that using them tires me out for some reason. Today I was so tired I couldn't even muster the strength to even attempt to keep up my appearance or be friendly.

 

Okay, how does your diet, sleeping schedule and exercise regimen look like. Sleep deprivation, being unfit, or having a poor diet could all be causing this. You could also try a stimulant like caffeine of phenylpiracetam, but i'm wondering if you have fatigue all the time or only in public. If it's only in public and you feel otherwise energetic and fine, then i believe this issue probably won't be solved with any supplement.

 

 

It's only in public. I use caffeine to compensate but it's not enough.

[sthira]

What's wrong with being introverted?

[Ritchie]

 

 

 

 

 

Can you be more descriptive. Why do you feel like shit in public. Do you feel scared or depressed in public?

 

I feel tired, less able to focus, annoyed, uncomfortable in my own skin. Which all makes me feel depressed in time. 

 

So do you only feel this way in public, or also feel tired when alone? Also, do you have any social skills?

 

Yes I do have competent social skills It's just that using them tires me out for some reason. Today I was so tired I couldn't even muster the strength to even attempt to keep up my appearance or be friendly.

 

Okay, how does your diet, sleeping schedule and exercise regimen look like. Sleep deprivation, being unfit, or having a poor diet could all be causing this. You could also try a stimulant like caffeine of phenylpiracetam, but i'm wondering if you have fatigue all the time or only in public. If it's only in public and you feel otherwise energetic and fine, then i believe this issue probably won't be solved with any supplement.

 

 

It's only in public. I use caffeine to compensate but it's not enough.

 

 

You could try to use L-theanine, i hear it works well as anti-anxiety. There are of course the obvious ones like chamomile tea and maybe small amounts of alcohol. But if none of that works you can try Kava. It's like alcohol except it is much less damaging and does not disrupt mental clarity. However before you try Kava I urge you to evaluate your diet, sleep regimen, and exercise schedule.

 

What's wrong with being introverted?

 

Being a little introverted is fine. But being introverted to the point where you can not have a conversation in public leads to many missed opportunities in life as well as loneliness which leads to depression.

[PWAIN]

Doesn't sound like introversion to me, sounds more like some form of social anxiety to me.

[Ritchie]

Doesn't sound like introversion to me, sounds more like some form of social anxiety to me.

This.

OP, do you experience any other symptoms of social anxiety?
If you do than try low doses of Kava, it works wonders and doesn't cause drowsiness.

You could also try 5htp which is a serotonin precursor.

5htp has been shown to be as effective, or even more effective than anti-depressants at treating depression and anxiety in some cases. Just remeber to supplement with L-tyrosine(Dopamine precursor) to maintain balance in the brain.

Other than that you could try serotonergic supplements, just remeber to always combine them with either dopaminergic supplements or a dopamine precursor to prevent a dopamine deficiency.

[VERITAS INCORRUPTUS]

Doesn't sound like introversion to me, sounds more like some form of social anxiety to me.

 

Yes, he is tired due to some form of SAD (social anxiety disorder)  that is causing stress to his system which of course will elicit fatigue in some manner in most (fear > stress >fatigue/anxiety).  Most are of course more concerned with the more typical highly discomforting concerns imposed by anxiety or social awkwardness/paralysis than resultant tiredness/fatigue, which is just one of the resultant symptoms.  There is really no 'cure' for SAD, but there are various means to cope better.  Certainly stimulant will not be any answer to attack the problem at all at the root or anywhere but this resultant symptom.

 

You also may have other comorbidities that may best be diagnosed to best understand your underlying anxiety disorder(s).  SAD and other anxiety disorders are a dysregulation of the 'inner fear' dynamic; most likely derived at a core basis from dysfunctional KOR (kappa opioid receptor) tone.  Downstream of this comes dysregulation of multiple signalling pathways more commonly targeted for anxiety conditions encompassing serotonergic, GABAergic, etc.  Though agents that positively modulate anxiolytic pathways via these more typical pathways can have some meaningful benefit, positively modulating KOR tone/dynamics may be the most superior means to fostering something closer to a 'cure'.  Most profoundly this may be so perhaps best combined with 'training', co-administration of other positive anxiolytic modulators from the existing common classes and an agent for epigenetic modulation.  Some progressive researchers will shortly be embarking on evaluation of such as I am aware

Edited by VERITAS INCORRUPTUS, 22 April 2014 - 02:49 AM.

[ModaMinds]

 

 

 

Can you be more descriptive. Why do you feel like shit in public. Do you feel scared or depressed in public?

 

I feel tired, less able to focus, annoyed, uncomfortable in my own skin. Which all makes me feel depressed in time. 

 

So do you only feel this way in public, or also feel tired when alone? Also, do you have any social skills?

 

Yes I do have competent social skills It's just that using them tires me out for some reason. Today I was so tired I couldn't even muster the strength to even attempt to keep up my appearance or be friendly.

 

 

I have this same exact issue. Sometimes I do love to go out and be in social situations, but my appreciation for them wanes very quickly. Once that happens, I can get very irritable or just shut down, leading everyone to think I'm pissed off at them when I'm just really exhausted. Otherwise, I just don't want to be in social situations at all because I won't have to end up exhausted.

 

Not trying to push product on you, but when I take a stimulant like modafinil, I can keep up appearances for much longer and am much more sociable. I only mention this because I don't get much sleep, I don't have a regulated diet, and I work incredibly long hours sometimes, so I'm generally tired to begin with. Immersing myself with the rest of the world drains by energy that much more quickly. Since the modafinil helps, it makes me think that I'm just not doing enough to be energized enough from natural things like sleep/diet/etc, so perhaps this is also the root of your issue.

 

I've found that my spirits can be really uplifted if I get several hours of sleep of course, but really seems to help is doing a few exercises in the morning. Usually stretching and doing like 30-40 pushups can be of real benefit to me. I imagine this is because, especially since I work from home, that I wake up and my first thought is to be lazy and lounge around, which makes me tired. Whereas if I do some physical exertion, aside from whatever physical benefits there may be (blood flowing, I don't know), I get in the mindset that I want to get things done and be productive, which makes me more happy internally and not so tired.

Edited by ModaMind, 22 April 2014 - 03:18 AM.

[blood]

I see introversion as something to be understood, managed, and maybe when you're ready, celebrated. It might be helpful to you to find your 'introvert pride'.

 

http://www.theatlant...trovert/302696/

 

 

 

 

[Bogomoletz II]

This is not necessarily introversion, just emotional aversion to social environments, perhaps social anxiety, as has been suggested. The Immortalist, do those uncomfortable feelings resemble anxiety?

[Sasha_]

You might want to give Aniracetam a shot, it helps me a lot with my condition which is somewhat similar to yours.

[alpal]

Hey, I had to cure my introversion too. I did it by looking at the biological differences between introverts and extroverts and mimicking an extroverts biology. I actually created a product for it but it tanked lol.

 

Studies have associated introversion with poorer working memory (2) and higher cortisol (1). There are many other better studies but I don't have the time to dig further.

 

Anyways the most cost effective way to mimic the biology of an extrovert and become one in my opinion is to play dual n-back for 25 minutes every day for a month and take tilia tomentosa daily. N-back for the working memory an tilia for the cortisol. 

 

There are so many alternative regimens that will create the same result I'll just name a few things to look at if the above doesn't work and you are willing to spend money. Stablon for working memory (3), Rhodiola Rosea for cortisol, Combination of ginkgo and ginseng for working memory (4), and good quality fish oil for working memory (5), Exercise and sleep for cortisol.

 

 

1)

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/18809259

"Neuroticism and introversion were significantly and differentially associated with features of diurnal cortisol patterns"

 

2)

http://www.scn.ucla....n-Executive.pdf

 

"The results of the current study suggest that extraverts have better working memory skills than introverts." 

 

3)

http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/2680463

"In mice, tianeptine does not impair spatial memory but have facilitating effects on both working and reference memory."

 

4)

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/11140327

"This effect represented an average improvement of 7.5% and reflected improvements to a number of different aspects of memory, including working and long-term memory."

 

5)

http://www.plosone.o...al.pone.0046832

This suggests that dietary supplementation with fish oil might increase VMAT2 availability, enhance dopamine storage and release, and improve dopamine-dependent cognitive functions such as working memory.

[renfr]

Cortisol can play a role in introversion but also low dopamine or high serotonin in certain parts of the brain. It's quite a very difficult problem as any dysfunction can potentially cause introversion (thyroid, high cortisol, low T, low dopamine, high serotonin, vitamin/mineral deficiency, ...)

I too had extreme introversion a while ago and it took me almost 3 years to cure it entirely with supplements, I had to find the right ones which worked.

 

 

[stan08]

Cortisol can play a role in introversion but also low dopamine or high serotonin in certain parts of the brain. It's quite a very difficult problem as any dysfunction can potentially cause introversion (thyroid, high cortisol, low T, low dopamine, high serotonin, vitamin/mineral deficiency, ...)

I too had extreme introversion a while ago and it took me almost 3 years to cure it entirely with supplements, I had to find the right ones which worked.

 

 

 

Which supplement did you find to be most effective?  So far I've had the most luck with Ashwagandha.  I'm considering adding Aniracetam (also for social anxiety) and/or Vinpocetine/Ginkgo (for brain fog).

[GhostBuster]

Hey, I had to cure my introversion too. I did it by looking at the biological differences between introverts and extroverts and mimicking an extroverts biology. I actually created a product for it but it tanked lol.

 

Studies have associated introversion with poorer working memory (2) and higher cortisol (1). There are many other better studies but I don't have the time to dig further.

 

Anyways the most cost effective way to mimic the biology of an extrovert and become one in my opinion is to play dual n-back for 25 minutes every day for a month and take tilia tomentosa daily. N-back for the working memory an tilia for the cortisol. 

 

 

2)

http://www.scn.ucla....n-Executive.pdf

 

"The results of the current study suggest that extraverts have better working memory skills than introverts." 

 

 

 

N=13 in that study, 3 men and 10 women. And according to my understanding the possible effect of sex difference in working memory performance was not analysed. -> Pretty much worthless to draw any conclusion of introverts working memory from that study.

 

Introverts are also overpresented among higher IQ individuals. And the prevalence of introverts gets higher with the rise of IQ. Since working memory is closely related to IQ, it seems that  introverts could actually have better over all working memory than extraverts.

 

Generally speaking, that study appears very prejudiced (and therefore represents junk science). The same goes with your own comments.

 

[renfr]

 

Cortisol can play a role in introversion but also low dopamine or high serotonin in certain parts of the brain. It's quite a very difficult problem as any dysfunction can potentially cause introversion (thyroid, high cortisol, low T, low dopamine, high serotonin, vitamin/mineral deficiency, ...)

I too had extreme introversion a while ago and it took me almost 3 years to cure it entirely with supplements, I had to find the right ones which worked.

 

 

 

Which supplement did you find to be most effective?  So far I've had the most luck with Ashwagandha.  I'm considering adding Aniracetam (also for social anxiety) and/or Vinpocetine/Ginkgo (for brain fog).

 

 

I had most luck with 500mg vitamin B1 a day, iodine, vitamin D and changing my diet also helped (plus losing some weight)...
Also I like the effect of some supplements such as celastrus seeds, selegiline once a month, short term nicotine use and many others which I think contributed to my current mental status.
I tried ashwagandha but to no avail, too much ashwagandha just gave me shaky legs and nothing else.
I can't tell exactly what would work as I had to research all of that myself, trying dozens of supplements over 3 years to cure this "disease" and diagnosing myself, I just think that you should listen to your body until you find the right stuff for you.

 

My problem is that I had high cortisol, low dopamine, high serotonin, low T and low thyroid hormones (and maybe high MAO too...).
 

Edited by renfr, 23 April 2014 - 10:27 PM.