8 replies to this topic

[metabrain]

I have had issues with my memory and executive function for many years as a result of Bipolar 2. I was using Piracetam for about 6 months and found it really good but I had some concerns. I went to see a Thai doctor who was very knowledgeable about Piracetam as it is often used here, he told me that I should not take Piracetam for any longer than 3 months due to oxidative stress on the brain and that Piracetam was only suppose to be used short term.

 

I know some users here like me have also taken this long term too and are fans of Piracetam but I was wondering has anyone else consulted a medical professional for using Piracetam long term?

[erzebet]

Was Piracetam prescribed by a physician? I know that this drug is used off-label by people but you have bipolar and I would ask the psychiatrist before starting it/discontinuing it.

Now in the clinic where I work I commonly see Piracetam prescribed for mild cognitive impairment in elders who don't have a definite diagnosis of dementia and it is prescribed a la longue. Given your post, I searched UpToDate and Pubmed and apart from the risk of discontinuing it abruptly in case of myoclonus, I didn't find anything regarding its possible long-term toxicity.

[Shane Minor]

Piracetam is a deadly viper for acetylcholine production.... I've seen so many studies that actually provide enough evidence pointing toward Piracetams detrimental effects on acetylcholine production in certain areas of the brain... actually lowering in some areas, and very little increase in others.... The fact that there are more effective, and inexpensive treatments for cognitive impairment make a case against Piracetam.... Piracetam has very low toxicity, and effectiveness too.... Uridine stacked with CDP Choline, and a fish oil really helps the acetylcholine production.... taken with Phosphatidylserine, Alpha Lipoic Acid and a Vitamin B Complex will also help all the way around...... too much phosphatidylserine could lead to high oxalates, so you may want to be easy on the doses..... the phosphatidylserine itself is not bad.... but most phosphatidlyserine is derived from soy and sunflower lecithin instead of bovine cow.... that whole mad cow disease freak-out...   

[metabrain]

I need something long term like 10+ years that I could use that wouldn't  be dangerous, is taking something that can make a high level of acetylcholine not dangerous also?

[LexLux]

Thanks for that nugget of knowledge. Where are uridine and alpha-gpc derivied from? Bovine?

 

Piracetam is a deadly viper for acetylcholine production.... I've seen so many studies that actually provide enough evidence pointing toward Piracetams detrimental effects on acetylcholine production in certain areas of the brain... actually lowering in some areas, and very little increase in others.... The fact that there are more effective, and inexpensive treatments for cognitive impairment make a case against Piracetam.... Piracetam has very low toxicity, and effectiveness too.... Uridine stacked with CDP Choline, and a fish oil really helps the acetylcholine production.... taken with Phosphatidylserine, Alpha Lipoic Acid and a Vitamin B Complex will also help all the way around...... too much phosphatidylserine could lead to high oxalates, so you may want to be easy on the doses..... the phosphatidylserine itself is not bad.... but most phosphatidlyserine is derived from soy and sunflower lecithin instead of bovine cow.... that whole mad cow disease freak-out...   

 

[Shane Minor]

No, just the phosphatidylserine is derived from soy.... everything else is soy-free..... Uridine and Alpha GPC taken with Fish Oil is known to be the best and most effective stack out there.... phosphatidylserine/w vitamin b complex will complete it.......whenever you buy a supplement from any vitamin shop they'll have a small print- which might read something like "Contains: No Gluten, Soy-Free" Just so people know what they're taking.

 

Metabrain, this stack can also be taken long-term for 10+ years.... you would just need to cycle it every once and awhile if you're taking it for that long... I know a lot of cyclist have had positive reviews on Phenylpiracetam, its known to help with Physical Endurance more than cognition... kind of like L-Carnitine.....I don't know what kind of stack you're looking for, but if its for memory and cognition... the Uridine, Fish Oil, Phosphatidylserine, with Citicoline, Alpha Lipoic Acid, & Vitamin B Complex will be your best route....

 

 

Most nootropics are going to work on either one of the three:

 

- Levels of Acetylcholine

 

- The Rate at which synapses fire (LTP)

 

- NGF, BDNF

 

-------

The Phosphatidylserine+Uridine+Citicoline+Alpha Lipoic Acid/w Fish Oil & Vitamin B Complex Multivitamin works

through increasing your levels of acetylcholine, Dopamine... and the rate at which your synapses fire, ultimately helping with

chemically induced LTP..... I'm not sure whether it does anything with NGF, or BDNF but I'm also no understanding

of how NGF works either... as far as I know, NGF enhanced from any Supplement hasn't been that authentic in many

studies.... so I just pay attention to the research, and the research validates that the stack I mentioned is worked......

 

Keyword Searches in Google: "Uridine Studies" "Phosphatidylserine+fish oil Studies", read the '.Edu' pages, they're more reliable. 

And sorry for all the grammatical errors, I kind of rushed through this... have to go somewhere :(

[Shane Minor]

Uridine also enhances NGF, I did not know this..... this stack does a lot of interesting things... 

 

I actually just started on this stack, and overtime it's actually giving me an easy euphoria. I'm more present in the moment rather than fogged with my usual day-to-day stress. I have to say, the instantaneous effects of this supplement stack that is suggested to take about 1-2 accumulative weeks to actually work as far as cognition and memory is concern, works very great with mood and emotional well-being. The emotional effects of this stack are noticed right off the bat, and it's not even comparable to the Ayurvedic herb Ashwaganda which I've also trialed... So far, nothing as far as cognition and memory is concerned, but when it comes to being happy and present, absolutely profound effects noticed on the first day of taking this stack.... I recommend a vitamin b multivitamin with Alpha Lipoic Acid if you're taking Uridine with a Fish Oil and Phosphatidylserine, otherwise you'll feel very lethargic.... also an extra choline source like Citicoline, or Alpha GPC is known to really work great with this stack...... I added the phosphatidlyserine, which I think really as an additive makes this stack wonderfully crafted due to a lot of positive results on  studies involved with Phosphatidylserine+Fish Oil. 

 

I'll keep you updated...

[LexLux]

Phosphatidylserine and Alpha Lipoic Acid  - why are these so important? 

[Shane Minor]

Phosphatidlyserine is a phosphalipid component that helps with memory. Phosphatidylserine was first introduced to be effective for memory when they extracted it from the brains of bovine cows and studied its cognitive effects. However, because people were afraid of mad cow disease they stopped extracting it from Bovine. Now Phosphatidylserine is being extracted from soy and sunflower lecithin. Studies show that the soy extract is just as effective as the Bovine extract.. People who have taken phosphatidylserine have noticed cognitive benefits within weeks of supplementation.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC2966935/

 

http://health.howstu...tidylserine.htm

 

http://www.nutrition...?articleid=1412

 

http://www.foodforth...-adhd-kids.aspx

 

 

It's no wonder Alpha Brain also added Phosphatidylserine to their new formula.... which I find funny because they keep having to replace their formula with new materials because of the poor reviews on their supplements..... however, taking Phosphatidylserine by itself is probably more effective than taking a small amount from one of those "Limitless" sales products...

 

 

Okay, and Alpha Lipoic Acid..

 

fights against DNA and RNA transcription errors... Uridine does this too, Uridine has been known to lower Vitamin B9 levels which can actually cause some DNA transcription errors..... as alpha lipoic acid is good for fighting against that type of damage, as well as it fights against free radicals- its a great addition to the stack. It serves as a neuroprotective acid, and working  synergistically with the Uridine, makes it an important part of this stack... It's as important as a B VItamin Multivitamin, this way you're being rather safe than sorry by preventing any down-regulation of your vitamin b levels....

 

 

 

Hope you found those articles insightful.

 

 

Another follow up report,

I am actually starting to notice the cognitive benefits of this stack......When I took fish oil by itself I noticed slight improvements in my ability to reach conclusions, especially concerning mathematical calculations (head math) which I'm able to do a lot faster with this stack. Usually i'm extremely horrible at art, but since supplementation iv'e actually been able to sketch items around the house, and the artwork tends to come out very decently...... Usually I can't draw or sketch anything if my life depended on it, so this is very strange indeed..... It's only been 3 days and already this is doing a lot of positive things for me.......  I could relate this to the placebo effect, but if you've ever seen me draw before you'd know how this couldn't be exaggerated.

 

 

Are these improvements significant?

 

I'd say its only been 3 days so at this point significant results

might not be the thing we should be looking at, but I can say that

the effects of this stack are phenomenal, and definitely significant for mood stability.

I just feel happy. As far as cognition, I am noticing slight benefits already, but then again I am

noticing slight benefits. If you've read any of my other reviews, I've really had no benefits from

taking supplements like Piracetam, Noopept, Ashwagandha, Bacopa, L-Theanine, CHoline Bitartrate- and

gave them really snooty reviews...... But with this stack,  I actually see a variety of benefits from all areas.

 

 

Any other supplement, or supplement stacks mechanism of action is similar to this,

working on your acetylcholine production, and or strengthening your neural networks and synapses,as well as increasing

NGF and BDNF... Uridine is known to increase NGF- but studies at MIT and other universities, as well as clinical studies show its more profound effects are its ability to increase and support the synaptic activity in the brain...

 

http://cognitivefun.net/talk/post/9003

 

 

 

Thank you,

 

If you have any more questions

please feel free to ask.

 

 

- Shane Minor