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How to beat high histamine?

histamine

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#1 Jason30

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 12:27 PM


Hi,

 

I wonder how to beat high histamine. I suffer alot from it (Chronic fatigue syndrome, exhaustion, muscle pain, and loss of memory/concentration). These symptoms are higher in the summer (of course when there are pollen).

 

So i am trying to beat my high histamine but i loose every year!

What am i doing at this moment besides avoiding food which are high in histamine:

 

- 2 x L-Methionine (500mg) in the afternoon on a empty stomach

- 1 x p5p 50mg in the morning after dinner

- 1 x cal/mag citrate in the evening as tea

- 1 x 1000mg vitamin c in the morning as powder in my shake

- 2 Quercetin (600mg) in the evening.
- For the last 5 years i take one ceterizine every night before sleep (however, i have read that this could stop DAO).

- I took vitamin b complex but there is folate and vit.b12 in it. I am gonna search for a new vitamin b complex without folate and vit.b12 in it.

 

The problem with above supplements is that it lowers my histamine for a short time.

 

Any tips/help to lower my histamine is appreciated.


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#2 Galaxyshock

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 12:38 PM

Reishi has histamine release inhibiting properties and should also help with the fatigue.


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#3 medievil

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 12:46 PM

Quercetin lowers histamine.



#4 GoingPrimal

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 03:05 PM

I second Galaxyshock's post with reishi. A good hydroethanolic extract would probably help wonders, give it a few weeks to a month to kick in. And this is one of those supp's where quality really makes a difference.

 

Kohda H, Tokumoto W, Sakamoto K, et al. The biologically active constituents of Ganoderma lucidum (Fr.) Karst. Histamine release-inhibitory triterpenes. Chem Pharm Bull (Tokyo). 1985 Apr;33(4):1367-74.



#5 ZHMike

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 03:22 PM

Drink a lot of water, water is a natural and effective way to flush the histamine out of your body, and its free-ish



#6 protoject

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 05:13 PM

Not sure.
I noticed you didn't mention antihistamines, do you have a problem with them?
For example, desloratadine is generally non-sedating and might work.

I tried it last night and it didnt seem to work that much as I was still sneezing and coughing.
I can also feel it still in my system today after taking a double dose.
Seems to have calmed the histamine reactions down a little bit.
Supposedly it's quite tolerable in higher dosages.
I'm betting there is a bit of sedation though. Not nearly as much as other antihistamines but I can feel somethin wierd for sure

I'm gonna consider your recommendations guys.
Medicinal mushrooms give me a bit of a scare though. I've taken some supplements of reishi, maitake, and stuff like that, and it made me feel weird. Also ive taken pure beta glucans. It interacts with the immune system in unknown ways. There were a few times I was on it where i felt like i was becoming incapacitated. Not in like a drug way but just like wtf my fatigue is way worse. Wonder if that was the mushroom causing the effect.



#7 medicineman

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 07:02 PM

I'm sorry, but I doubt histamine is the culprit. High histamine levels would induce unmistakable signs (look up systemic mastocytosis). I think you suffer from something in the spectrum of CFS, fibromyalgia etc.

I would try sulbutiamine in large doses (over a gram). It seems to be more effective than placebo in post encephalitis asthenia.
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#8 pinnacle

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 10:16 PM

SAM-e. Worked way better for me than Methionine ever did.  :)



#9 Mr Matsubayashi

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:24 AM

Try the niacin flush test. Stop all regular supplementation for 2 weeks, get a bottle of niacin (not the no-flush variety) and try 25mg. If the result is a niacin flush you have very high histamine levels.

 

I wouldn't use the above supplements, a simple solution might be to avoid high histamine foods like soft cheese and red wine. Keep a packet of loratadine handy.

 

I'm not familiar with high histamine levels resulting in the symptoms you describe, but i'm no doctor.

 

 



#10 Duchykins

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 04:24 AM

I've been looking at DAOsin recently for my own histamine troubles, and that shit is expensive. But the people with histamine intolerance taking it swear by the stuff.

Since you're taking methionine et al and not looking for an OTC antihistamine Ipresume that's because you know that those antihistamines don't lower histamine, they only block it while many of the synthetic popular ones actually suppress DAO.

I have some butterbur in my cabinet though I never got around to trying it out. It's primarily used as a migraine prophylactic, but it also has antihistamines properties, and apparently it performed as well as fexofenadine (Allegra) vs placebo


http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/16114089

Edited by Duchykins, 25 July 2014 - 04:28 AM.


#11 Duchykins

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 04:34 AM

I've been very interested in this too because my daughter's doctor told us to put her on cetirizine. When on it she can better control her frustration when things don't go her way, sleeps better, scratches less, and can spend more time settling down to learn something new. But I don't want her to have to be on it forever, and there is only so much you can do with avoiding high histamine foods and things that interfere with DAO.

#12 Duchykins

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 04:47 AM

This one says butterbur had no effect on skin tests

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/16784008

*shrug*


Others where butterbur did well against rhinitis comparable to cetirizine and fexofenadine

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/11799030

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15080820


Is this weird?

Edited by Duchykins, 25 July 2014 - 04:52 AM.


#13 dorian34

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 04:53 AM

SAM-e. Worked way better for me than Methionine ever did.  :)

 

agree



#14 Jason30

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 08:24 AM

Thanks all for your reactions.

I will look into reishi and sam-e.

 

Matsubayashi, i have high histamine. A blood test by the doc gives me this as result. I also did some testing last year with niacin, i flushed with 50mg. The doc which gave me niacin also told me that the flush release histamine thus lowers histamine on the long term, but i have read different theory's about that so i have my doubts.

 

Ducyskins, Butterblur looks very interesting! I will order it and see how i react to it. I have bought DAOsin before and tried it but it gave me alof of side effects, so i stopped with it.

 

Medicineman, good catch! I have fibromyalgia.

I have read about Mastocytosis and also about 'Mast Cell Activation Disorder (MCAD)'. When i look at the symptom list of Mastocytosis and MCAD then i have a lot of matches;

http://geneticgenie....in-methylation/

 

Do you (or anyone else) know if there is a test to determine Mastocytosis and/or MCAD (any blood test, supp test)?

 

An interesting piece i found about mast cell activation disorder:

There is also the mast cell activation disorder. In this case either a greater or even a normal number of mast cells may be “twitchy” or too easily activated by stimuli and may even be activated by autoantibodies. For these patients, symptoms may appear from the release of mediators when a histamine threshold has been reached. If one thinks of a “histamine bucket” representing some critical level at which symptoms appear, then any addition to this “bucket” is a burden that commands attention. When some cumulative load from stress, environmental activating stimuli, endogenous histamine, and ingested histamine cause the bucket to “overflow”, then the appearance of symptoms can manifest. Patients whose symptoms wax and wane over time may fall into this category as their histamine “load” varies with circumstance.

 

Source: http://alford.grimtr...ity_Disease.htm

 


Edited by Jason30, 31 July 2014 - 08:25 AM.


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#15 Tom_

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 08:25 AM

First of all Histamine is a STIMULANT!!! CNS affecting antihistamines cause CNS depression. Pro-histaminergic drugs are being tested as treatments for Narcolepsy and hypersomnic disorders.

 

Secondly people don't have a defiency in a single neurotransmitter. IT IS UTTER TRIPE. Doesn't exist, can't happen. That's why you aren't getting better, you aren't treating anything that exists. I don't know how many times I've had to say it on this forum.

 

Histamine only passes through the blood brain barrier in minute amounts and the histamine release from allergic reactions doesn't affect the CNS. Unless you have allergies related to pollonm summer time doesn't affect how much histamine is in the blood and the release is only brief but repeated.

Even if your hyperhistamineism theory was correct taking Ceritizine which barely crosses the blood brain barrier would only effect preferial symptoms. And since you have taken an antihistamine we can clearly show you don't have to much histamine.

As per ususal nobody has suggested plain old depression - which is the most common diagnosis for your symptoms and is likely the answer.

 

Fatigue, Lack of energy, cognitive defecits related to memory and myalgia are all common signs. We can also add in hypercondriais in relation to the (sorry to say wacky theory) and I don't think its strech to say you also feel lower and less pleasure than you used to. I'm going out on a guess hear and going to say you don't sleep as well as you used to. Maybe to long or not enough? Less common but also reasonable diagnoses include hypothryoidism, sleep related breathing disorders and sleep disorders.

Before everyone down-votes me to hell show me I am wrong. Rather than pressing all the new fancy buttons because you don't like what I say, show me that these mono-hyper/hypo neurotransmiterisms can exist except in relation to more complex neurotransmitter, neuropeptide etc.. reactions and even then that they aren't anymore than brief and aren't instead complex interactions with thousands of receptors. Genetic disorders clearly don't count and neither does parkinsons or Alizmers which are the distruction of certain neurotransmitter cell types (dopamine and Ach respectively). And after that show me you can find a disorder that fits his symptoms better than depression, CFS, hypothyroidism or a relatively banal and common sleep disorder.

If you can do that, I will gladly take the downvotes and never complain again about these absurd statements of having to much or to little of a neurotransmitter.


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