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Protocol for Short Notice Half-Marathon

adaptogens mitochondria c60 pqq endurance coq10

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#1 GoingPrimal

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Posted 29 September 2014 - 11:05 PM


So I recently decided to run the Baltimore Half-Marathon on Oct. 18th, despite my usual run being a two-mile trail up in the mountains, in addition to weight lifting and HIIT. Basically I gave myself a month to be able to run 13.1 miles. Why? Because it is a challenge and something to accomplish, simple enough. I'm 25 y.o. male and in very good health, and will be focusing on pushing myself and "recovering hard".

 

I'm here mainly for any ideas in terms of supplements and for a stack critique.

 

Heres what I'm thinking :

 

Adaptogens - Mainly Cordyceps, Rhodiola and Eleuthero prior to running. Various others throughout the day, including Reishi, Ginseng, Astragalus and Gynostemma. While not an adaptogen to my knowledge, I've found Coca powder (not Cacao) to enhance endurance and oxygen utilization.

 

Mitochondrial Enhancers - Pqq (20 mg now, considering 40 mg closer to race day, thoughts?), CoQ10 (50 mg now, 100 mg closer to race day), ALCAR 500-1000 mg, and C-60oo once it arrives, thinking a dropper squeeze a day, too much? Every other day?

 

Joint / Inflammation Support - Daily homemade bone broth, MSM, epsom salt baths, ice baths, fish oil/cod liver oil, SAMe 400 mg, Meriva Curcumin, 500 - 1000 mg, Tart Cherry Juice, Dark Chocolate/Cacao, and occasionally some colostrum a few times a week.

 

On top of this, plenty of greens, pastured eggs, grass-fed meat and dairy, yada yada. A greens powder, Green Vibrance at home and Vitamineral Green at work. B-Vitamins, vitamin d/k2 complex. Also sauna and cold showers, yoga once or twice a week and daily meditation.

 

 

Interested to hear everyone's thoughts.

 

 


Edited by GoingPrimal, 29 September 2014 - 11:25 PM.


#2 Krell

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Posted 30 September 2014 - 04:47 PM

Beetroot juice improved my last 5k race endurance/speed by 1 minute/mile!
I drank one 16oz bottle on each of 6 days before my race
but I think just drinking 1-2 bottles before the race would be significant.
 
 
 
 
http://jap.physiolog...tent/109/5/1394
 
 
 
The beetroot juice cost me about $30 for 6 bottles from this vendor
 
you might also want to try cherry juice for improved post race recovery

 


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#3 meth_use_lah

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Posted 30 September 2014 - 05:11 PM

Nice list. I would possibly add Cissus Quadrangularis, it definitely helped my joints recover when I started running barefoot/minimalist.


Edited by meth_use_lah, 30 September 2014 - 05:12 PM.


#4 GoingPrimal

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Posted 01 October 2014 - 02:36 PM

Thanks for the replies guys.

 

Krell, I was actually looking at beet juice this morning, debating either juicing them myself to save a few bucks or just buying pre-juiced or even beet juice concentrate, as I was one study used a "shot" called BeetIt.

 

Meth_use_lah, thanks for the input on Cissus. Any recommendations on where to buy from or should I just check out iHerb?



#5 Krell

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Posted 01 October 2014 - 05:04 PM

Thanks for the replies guys.

 

Krell, I was actually looking at beet juice this morning, debating either juicing them myself to save a few bucks or just buying pre-juiced or even beet juice concentrate, as I was one study used a "shot" called BeetIt.

 

Meth_use_lah, thanks for the input on Cissus. Any recommendations on where to buy from or should I just check out iHerb?

 

Yes juicing canned beets may be the most cost effective route. Look for unsalted.

 

Beetlt beetroot shots look pretty interesting.

http://www.jameswhit...t_it_shot_sport

 

Each shot seems to be equivalent to one of my 500ml Biotta beet juice bottles.

My bottles say that each one contains juice from 3 beet roots.

 

But the Beetlt shot price seems somewhat less than the Biotta bottles.

 

I guess the best effectiveness test is to see if the shots turn your pee and poop purple like the 

500ml juice does!

 

I can not find Beetlt in the USA.  Google shows one vendor out of stock.

http://athleteapprov...t-stamina-shot/



#6 Krell

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Posted 01 October 2014 - 05:12 PM

Hmm, here is a powder form of beetroot juice!

 

http://neogenissport...t-beets-in.html

 

$2.70/packet from Iherb FS

http://www.iherb.com...10-g-Each/58654

 

Each packet seems to be equivalent to 6 beets/two 500ml bottles of beetroot juice.

 

some amazon reviews

http://www.amazon.co...iews/B00BL7NIKU

http://www.amazon.co...iews/B00FI9K5BC


 


Edited by Krell, 01 October 2014 - 05:31 PM.


#7 GoingPrimal

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 07:24 PM

Crazy, great find Krell. I'll have to order some of those, do you think powder beetroot would still have bio-avaliable nitrates/nitrites? 



#8 meth_use_lah

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 09:04 PM

I've mainly used primaforce cissus caps/powder, I prefer the powder because it's usually cheaper and has a taste similar to salmiak (salty liquorice).

Although nowdays I would probably buy the cheapest powder I could find at a bulk supplier.



#9 Krell

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 01:36 AM

Crazy, great find Krell. I'll have to order some of those, do you think powder beetroot would still have bio-avaliable nitrates/nitrites? 

 

I don't know. One of the Amazon comments says that when

urine test strips were used to check the dose, the powder was

less effective than the juice.  But not ineffective.    

 

Several Amazon comments

said the powder was too expensive, but my juice is

about twice as expensive as the powder.  About $6 per bottle

as compared to $3 for the powder packets. 

 

But here is yet another wrinkle!

 

According to

http://jap.physiolog...tent/109/5/1394

L-ArgInine has the same effect as beetroot juice.

 

You can buy it in bulk here

http://www.amazon.co...d/dp/B0019LWV74

but it tastes horrible according to the comments!

My guess is that this is cheaper than any form of beetroot.

 

I am planning to buy some of the beetroot powder and some L-Arginine and put

them to the test.  I have a 20 minute mountain climb that I do weekly for time to

test my fitness, and that should give me some data points.  

 

Yet another wrinkle is when to take these supplements.  I have been taking the beetroot juice

over 6 days before I race, but some of the comments and product directions

suggest that 30 minutes before exercise is sufficient.   I was following one of

the beetroot studies that showed a buildup of the substance in the blood

over several days, and I am assuming that higher blood concentrations

mean more endurance. On the day before my last race I drank two

bottles and set a PR.  Who knows what I could have done if I had

drunk a bottle on the morning of the race! :)

 

Also, I may also test the efficacy of tart cherry juice in preventing

soreness as reported for marathon runners.

http://www.amazon.co...s/dp/B004M0Y8T8

 

BTW: My experience in racing under the influence of beetroot juice

is that you do not feel any special increase in endurance, but by the

end of the race you are passing other runners when your experience

suggests they should be passing you.


Edited by Krell, 03 October 2014 - 01:55 AM.


#10 GoingPrimal

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 12:15 PM

Meth_use_lah, I'll have to check some bulk sources for the cissus since my only real concern is whether my ankles and knees can handle the increased training loads and sudden switch to long distance running on pavement. I was doing some light trail running before this and always hated how jarring pavement was. Most of the other supplements are just to improve my time as much as possible  ;)

 

Krell, I've used L-Arginine many times and does indeed increase nitric oxide and give a good pump - pick some up as it is effective and relatively cheap. That said I like the idea of consuming something as healthy as beets and getting a good boost to endurance, as beets are packed with betaine, help cleanse the liver, make your piss red, yada yada.

 

According to the study shown in this article,  nitric oxide levels actually peaked 2-4 hours after ingesting beet juice, which seems like an awfully slow process but might actually be for the best if I'm doing a longer run. Chug some beet juice prior to leaving the house, hour drive, start the race, and my nitric oxide levels should be peaking an hour to two into the race.

 

Yesterday I juiced one beet (not nearly as much juice as people are recommending), waited two hours and went on a run. My endurance was definitely improved, but this is confounded by the fact I took a few new goodies that had just arrived before the run as well  :happy:



#11 Krell

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 09:08 PM

 

According to the study shown in this article,  nitric oxide levels actually peaked 2-4 hours after ingesting beet juice, which seems like an awfully slow process but might actually be for the best if I'm doing a longer run. Chug some beet juice prior to leaving the house, hour drive, start the race, and my nitric oxide levels should be peaking an hour to two into the race.

 

Yesterday I juiced one beet (not nearly as much juice as people are recommending), waited two hours and went on a run. My endurance was definitely improved, but this is confounded by the fact I took a few new goodies that had just arrived before the run as well  :happy:

 

Thanks for the article about 2-4 HOUR peaking.  I guess I wasted a lot of beet juice in my 6 DAY saturation technique. :sad:   But it was based on a previous study.

 

As for you "chugging" beet juice, you may want to sip it leisurely like a fine wine, because the mixing with saliva is reported to be essential according to

http://jap.physiolog...tent/107/4/1144

In this study they had some of the beet juice drinkers spit their saliva out to prevent mixing, and the beneficial effects went away completely!


Edited by Krell, 05 October 2014 - 09:11 PM.

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#12 Kalliste

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Posted 06 October 2014 - 04:11 PM

Why not eat the raw Beetroots? They are cheap and don't taste too bad. Is mixing essential?



#13 Krell

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Posted 06 October 2014 - 07:05 PM

Why not eat the raw Beetroots? They are cheap and don't taste too bad. Is mixing essential?

 

Yes I guess that raw or canned cooked beetroots would be effective, but all the endurance enhancement studies seem to be limited to beetroot juice or powder, so I am not sure how many beetroots would be similarly effective.

 

For instance, my Biotta beetroot juice bottles (16.9 fl oz or 500ml) say that they contain "juice from 3 beet roots".  How many raw beetroots is this comparable to? My guess is that it would be less than 3 raw beetroots, since they probably contain beneficial solids as well as juice.

 

If you mean by "mixing", mixing with saliva, then I think the studies say that this is essential for the necessary chemical reactions, whether you ingest solid or liquid beet products.  I see no problem with eating raw or canned beetroots slowly so as to get good mixing with saliva.

 

On the other hand, I am not sure I would want to eat several raw or canned beet roots an hour or two before a running or bike race!  :)


Edited by Krell, 06 October 2014 - 07:18 PM.


#14 Kalliste

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Posted 06 October 2014 - 07:26 PM

I've eaten them raw. I have no problem eating several, just slicing them to pieces. They do leave a weird after-taste. The saliva part seems reasonable, I wonder if it is the reaction with salivary amylase that is important. Maybe I will run them in the mixer first, but I don't wanna ruin the dietary fibers. Maybe heating is important, do you know anything about that Krell?



#15 Krell

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Posted 07 October 2014 - 02:13 AM

I've eaten them raw. I have no problem eating several, just slicing them to pieces. They do leave a weird after-taste. The saliva part seems reasonable, I wonder if it is the reaction with salivary amylase that is important. Maybe I will run them in the mixer first, but I don't wanna ruin the dietary fibers. Maybe heating is important, do you know anything about that Krell?

 

No, I do not remember reading anything about heating.  But I assume that beetroot juice is heated during processing, and I assume that canned beets are heated too.  So my guess is that heating does not destroy the ingredients we are looking for.  But I do not have any information about the the efficacy of unheated raw beetroot.  I assume it is efficacious.

 

According to this article

http://jap.physiolog...tent/107/4/1144

anerobic bacteria and saliva are necessary to convert the beetroot nitrates.

 

One possible way to check the efficacy of various forms of beetroot may be to use saliva test strips, but I have never used them.

http://www.amazon.co...y/dp/B00H6Y4NT2


Edited by Krell, 07 October 2014 - 02:30 AM.

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#16 Kalliste

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Posted 07 October 2014 - 05:05 AM

Thanks for reminding me about Beetroots Krell.

#17 GoingPrimal

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 03:24 PM

I'm all about eating some beets as well, its just that for a pre-race boost, I would not want all the solids from the beets weighing me down. I'm always looking for more fiber in my diet and am not a fan of fast digesting carbs, be it bread, refined grains or fruit juices, but in terms of me running this half marathon I'm going to have to make some room for juices and less fiber.



#18 mitchs

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Posted 09 October 2014 - 07:30 PM

Primal,

There's a Runner's World article that I think provides a good synopsis of the beet juice research and guidelines of how much and when.  Don't know if I can post links yet...

Good luck at your half.  Sounds like this is your first; enjoy your PR!  Long range forecast looks decent.

Here's an approximate link just in case I can't insert a full URL:

www_runnersworld_com/nutrition-for-runners/beet-juice-how-much-and-when

 



#19 GoingPrimal

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Posted 09 October 2014 - 07:33 PM

Update -

 

Training is going really well. Focusing mainly on recovery and not over-training as I know my body isn't used to long-distance runs on pavement. Went on a nice 5 mile run on Monday, mostly flat but with a few long and steep hills. I was amazed that even going up the hills I wasn't getting fatigued. By the time I got home I felt like I had at least another two miles in the tank but knew I shouldn't push it too much, too fast. 

 

I'm thinking the cordyceps, rhodiola and coca (again, NOT cocoa or cacao) powder are the main things aiding my quick improvements in endurance, with the PQQ/CoQ10 helping out more in the background.

 

The C60oo just arrived Monday so I've yet to see it's effects in action, but judging from what I've read in others' reports and from what I remember from my last bottle, it can only help.



#20 GoingPrimal

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Posted 09 October 2014 - 07:43 PM

Thanks for the input mitchs, and thanks for the support!



#21 lammas2

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Posted 10 October 2014 - 11:08 PM

What is coca powder? Powdered coca leaf?

#22 GoingPrimal

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Posted 11 October 2014 - 02:04 PM

What is coca powder? Powdered coca leaf?

 

Indeed. Apparently it must be "decocaine-ized" before being sold internationally. Whether it  is or isn't doesn't concern me as the total alkaloid content of the leaves is somewhere around .25 to .77%, and it has had a long traditional use in native countries as a tea and nutritious foodstuff. It does provide a very, very subtle energy lift along with mood enhancement, and seems to improve my endurance a bit.



#23 Kalliste

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 12:28 PM

I chugged down a plate of beetroots today. After heating they had a sweet taste, I had forgotten about them completely. Thanks for the reminder.



#24 GoingPrimal

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Posted 19 October 2014 - 01:13 PM

Update

 

Raced yesterday, it was great! After a SNAFU with registering and some traffic problems, I arrived bright and early around 8. Had a super fun run, weather was excellent, crossed the finish line as the clock read 2:37:35. I was hoping for under 2:30 but I'm honestly just glad I finished!

 

Here was my morning protocol -

 

Woke up at 6;30, immediate glass of coconut water with a tablespoon of beet crystals and a scoop of D-Ribose, half capsule of Coenzyme B-Vitimans, 400 mg SAM-e, 12 mg astaxanthin, 2 capsules curcumin extract, 40 mg PQQ, 300 mg CoQ10, two capsules of Rhodiola, one homemade, very full capsule of cordyceps powder, one homemade capsule of coca leaf powder, and one squirt of c60. Another glass of coconut water with a scoop of whey protein. Heated up some rice (mainly white but with a bit of brown), added a tablespoon of coconut oil and a generous portion of himalayan salt. Prepared my pre-race beverage, consisting of another spoonful of beet crystals, another scoop D-Ribose, a scoop of Purple Wraath, and a teaspoon full of CocoHydro coconut water crystals. 

 

Ate the rice on the ride to the race.

 

As I stood in with my "wave" of racers at around 8:30, I drank my pre-race beverage. I also consumed one more pill of cordyceps and rhodiola, as well as 20 mg NADH. After that, all I had to consume during the race was 3 GU gel packs, as well as whatever water and gatorade I could snag from the assistants handing them out. Honestly I felt great the whole run - knees and ankles hurt a bit even in the first mile, probably due to only giving myself a month to train, and the pain increased throughout the race but never more than a 5 on a scale of one to ten. Paced myself very well, taking it slow out the starting gate, and building in a few short walks from mile 3 on, even though I felt like I didn't need to. I did not feel the slightest bit of fatigue until about mile 10, and didn't really feel like I wanted to stop till mile 12. As I made it to the final stretch I got a second wind, especially with all the crowds cheering everyone on, and boy did crossing the finish line feel good. 

 

My recovery beverage was 40 g of whey and a scoop of colostrum in half a bottle of tart cherry juice. I also took 6 mg astaxanthin, 3 more curcumin capsules (spread out), and a New Chapter Holy Basil Force capsule. And some cod liver oil.

 

Just wanted to share my experiences with everyone here as I've learned a lot from Longecity. Obviously the goals were to prevent and reduce inflammation and damage (curcumin, astaxanthin), increase endurance (cordyceps, rhodiola, coca leaf, D-Ribose, beet crystals) and improve mitochondrial function (coQ-10, PQQ, c60).

 

Thanks to everyone who read or chimed in  ;)


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#25 mitchs

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Posted 21 October 2014 - 08:51 PM

GoingPrimal,

Congratulations on your PR (I assume?)! 

 

Your initial post inspired me to dig more deeply into nitric oxide enhancers, as I had tried beet juice before to no noticeable effect.  So I got some l-citrulline malate powder from Swanson's and dosed ~ 5 g about 2 hrs. before a long run.  Sure enough, it seemed to have the claimed effect (I fully acknowledge the probability of placebo effect) of reducing perceived fatigue.  I'm going to keep trying it and see if I can get repeatable results.



#26 GoingPrimal

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Posted 22 October 2014 - 10:14 PM

Mitchs - thanks a bunch. Technically it was a PR, because it was my first half-marathon.

Glad to see the citrulline malate is working for you, keep us posted. I don't have any experience with it other than what's in the Purple Wraath, and I can't say to what degree it contributed to enhancing my endurance because of everything else I was taking.

#27 PerfectSeek

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Posted 24 October 2014 - 11:19 AM

I think cordyceps is a pretty interesting one here.  I tried it a long time ago and noticed some increased lung capacity, but it seemed temporary and after taking it for an extended period of time it didn't seem to have the same effect for me.  I know it is already complete, but some recommendations (for the next one?)

 

 - c60, increased endurance is probably the most consistent effect for people.  

 - BCAAs, which, I think you already took?

 

Congrats on the marathon.  



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#28 GoingPrimal

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Posted 24 October 2014 - 01:45 PM

Thanks PerfectSeek. Both were included in the protocol to great results. I've noticed that cordyceps' energy boosting aspect fades with time, but the endurance/lung capacity enhancing effect doesn't, at least for me. Kind of like how caffeine will continue to enhance performance, whether you get a buzz from it or not.







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