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Mild cognitive impairment from heavy AAS usage

cognitive aas bodybuilding impairment

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13 replies to this topic

#1 Splitsoul

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 09:47 PM


I´m a 30 year old man with a ba in Bachelor in Bio-medical Laboratory Technology.

I am a former competitive bodybuilder with a history of heavy AAs use, after discontinuing my last cycle about a year ago i have been experiencing cognitive decline.

 

Symptoms include:

Inability to concentrate 

Short term memory loss

decline in executive functions

loss of energy

sleep disturbance

 

I have been on Venlafaxin (SNRI) and Mirtazpin (Nassa) which have been of no help to me, they only seem to kill my sex drive and that's it!

I have also been receiving cognitive psychotherapy to no avail.

 

From what little i have found AAS such as nandrolone can cause dysregulation of both the serotonergic and dopminergic systems    file:///C:/Users/kontor/Downloads/AAS_dopamin_serotonin_Birgner%20(4).pdf

I do not have the skill set to fully understand the linked article and would like som help as to what could be beneficial in my situation.

 

I think my problem is linked to my excessive use of trenbolone for a prolonged lenght of time. trenbolone is a derivative of nandrolone and also have progestationel binding affinity.



#2 Metagene

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 11:56 PM

Could you please correct the link?

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#3 medicineman

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Posted 25 November 2014 - 05:00 AM


I´m a 30 year old man with a ba in Bachelor in Bio-medical Laboratory Technology.

I am a former competitive bodybuilder with a history of heavy AAs use, after discontinuing my last cycle about a year ago i have been experiencing cognitive decline.


Symptoms include:

Inability to concentrate

Short term memory loss

decline in executive functions

loss of energy

sleep disturbance


I have been on Venlafaxin (SNRI) and Mirtazpin (Nassa) which have been of no help to me, they only seem to kill my sex drive and that's it!

I have also been receiving cognitive psychotherapy to no avail.


From what little i have found AAS such as nandrolone can cause dysregulation of both the serotonergic and dopminergic systems file:///C:/Users/kontor/Downloads/AAS_dopamin_serotonin_Birgner%20(4).pdf

I do not have the skill set to fully understand the linked article and would like som help as to what could be beneficial in my situation.


I think my problem is linked to my excessive use of trenbolone for a prolonged lenght of time. trenbolone is a derivative of nandrolone and also have progestationel binding affinity.

trenbolone is the biggest and baddest. I find it unlikely that testosterone or any of the typical AAS would have any long lasting effects (over a year) but anecdotally, trenbolone seems to have longer lasting deleterious effects.

is your hormonal profile normalized? tren, unlike typical AAS, may cause severe hyperprolactinemia. it's worth performing a testicular ultrasound if hormonal profile is off. tren can affect thyroid function (anecdotally) and that's worth checking out. if anything is off, treat accordingly.

keep in mind that AAS may mask depression which you might have had already.

Edited by medicineman, 25 November 2014 - 05:02 AM.

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#4 Splitsoul

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Posted 25 November 2014 - 08:56 AM

New linkhttp://www.dissertat...ion/a4527c3a09/
Full text can be downloaded from here.
Thyroid tsh, t4, t3 all within normal.
prolactin is also normal.
Testosterone is very low and so is progesterone, not sure about my estrdiol.
my endo is hesitant to help me with my hormonal profile (i have seen 3 different endos), i have tried for over 6 months as i dont think my hormonal profile will ever return to normal levels.
All treatment so far have been focused on treating depression and anxiety, wich i dont think i have.

Edited by Splitsoul, 25 November 2014 - 09:00 AM.


#5 medicineman

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Posted 25 November 2014 - 12:53 PM

New linkhttp://www.dissertat...ion/a4527c3a09/
Full text can be downloaded from here.
Thyroid tsh, t4, t3 all within normal.
prolactin is also normal.
Testosterone is very low and so is progesterone, not sure about my estrdiol.
my endo is hesitant to help me with my hormonal profile (i have seen 3 different endos), i have tried for over 6 months as i dont think my hormonal profile will ever return to normal levels.
All treatment so far have been focused on treating depression and anxiety, wich i dont think i have.


Your endo is refusing to treat you, a thirty year old with hypogonadism? This may have disastrous implications.

This is the recommendation to treat hypogonadism. Signs and/or symptoms of low androgen levels and subnormal levels of morning testosterone on three separate occasions. To be able to help you more, is your family complete or not?
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#6 Splitsoul

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Posted 25 November 2014 - 12:59 PM

The levels have been thoroughly checked numerous times. with the exact same levels every time. I have a new appointment at my endo the 23.dec to discuss my lack of treatment.

If by a complete family you mean i have the children i want the answer is yes. 

I have just been to psychiatrist today who ruled out depression, but mentioned chronic fatigue syndrome (post viral syndrome). 

When these pop up immediately think of the problems people claim to have experienced from flour-quinolons. A couple of months before my symptoms began i had a severe stomach infections wich was treated with  IV ciprofloxacine. I olso blame the cipro for a pec-tear i sustained 3 months ago, due to its detrimental effect on tendons. the tear append on what constituts  70% of my previous max bench pres.


Edited by Splitsoul, 25 November 2014 - 01:11 PM.


#7 medicineman

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Posted 25 November 2014 - 02:34 PM

The levels have been thoroughly checked numerous times. with the exact same levels every time. I have a new appointment at my endo the 23.dec to discuss my lack of treatment.
If by a complete family you mean i have the children i want the answer is yes.
I have just been to psychiatrist today who ruled out depression, but mentioned chronic fatigue syndrome (post viral syndrome).
When these pop up immediately think of the problems people claim to have experienced from flour-quinolons. A couple of months before my symptoms began i had a severe stomach infections wich was treated with IV ciprofloxacine. I olso blame the cipro for a pec-tear i sustained 3 months ago, due to its detrimental effect on tendons. the tear append on what constituts 70% of my previous max bench pres.


if your family is complete, and you have clinical and biochemical hypogonadism, not treating you would be a crime. fair enough cipro is a cause of tendon issues, but you can't blame it for your mood and cognition, when there is an obvious, medically established cause of the neuropsychiatric symptoms you are exhibiting. I would trial hormone replacement therapy via your endocrinologist. I bet it will transform your condition. even if it doesn't help, being 30 and suffering from hypogonadism will have very unpleasant long term repercussions if untreated.

#8 Splitsoul

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Posted 25 November 2014 - 03:12 PM

I could blame it on the cipro due to mitochondrial damage and damage to gaba receptors.

But evidence to this is inconclusive.

I also think the hypogonadisme is far more likely but depends on my endo.

If he still refuses i will go to the private sector for help. 



#9 MetaphasicSystems

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Posted 30 November 2014 - 11:28 PM

Switch to hgh and sarms.
Or hgh and 500mg weekly of Sustanon or test en.

#10 medicineman

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Posted 02 December 2014 - 03:11 AM

There is one case study of persistent AAS induced hypogonadism reversed with triptorelin.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/20416868

#11 MetaphasicSystems

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Posted 02 December 2014 - 03:13 AM

Triptorelin works great, but...?

#12 Splitsoul

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Posted 02 December 2014 - 09:20 AM

Triptorelin does not seem as a bet i would take.
i would rather do the clomiphene challenge then.
I know about my treatment options, but i am trying to find a long term solution through the healthcare system here in denmark.
Testosterone replacement only does not relieve my cognitive symptoms as i have tried that about 6months in.
wich is why i think it is the progestagenic effects of the tren that has fucked my brain up long term and why i think some of the answers lie in the article i linked to.
my thougts are long term clomiphene to stimulate lh, fsh, to stimulate the testis and hopefully end up with close to normal ratios of testosterone, estradiol, progesterone and shbg. From the linked article i understand that i would also benefit from an snri + a dopamine agonist such as pramipexole or even some adderall.
So back to my original question, have i come to the the right conclusion that i would benefit from a dopamine agonist qua the linked article?

#13 Jbac

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Posted 02 December 2014 - 10:30 AM

DHT replacement (Andractim). Something might have happened to your ability to convert test to DHT
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#14 Splitsoul

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Posted 02 December 2014 - 10:40 AM

Thank you i will look in to that.





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