10 replies to this topic

[LIB]

I know its not a new topic, but I don't know if I've come across the answer, or ways to mitigate. I was actually hoping to take PCC (Polyenylphosphatidylcholine) for a little fatty liver my Dr. noticed on an ultrasound. He made it seem like no big deal and not to worry about it, but I don't think its exactly normal.  Anyways, I wanted to take PPC due to the fact it rates well and I react poorly to other liver support, milk thistle, SAM-E. 

 

Just one or two days into taking PPC I get very depressed. Same with other sources of choline, cdp-choline, regular PC. Its actually a little scary how quickly I get seriously sad and depressed. 

 

Is there a way to see the benefits of choline without the depression? 

Edited by LIB, 20 January 2015 - 07:42 AM.

[LIB]

Article I came across suggesting depression could be due to high brain levels of acetylcholine and that Prozac increases the enzyme acetyl-cholinesterase (AChE), which breaks down acetylcholine. 

 

My experiences on this theory seem reasonable. I took Paxil for some time, which is known to be anticholinergic. I do remember having periods of actually being happy while taking Paxil, but it was also very sedating and seemed to make me a bit foggy. Almost too anticholinergic, and definitely lowered dopamine which doesn't help the sedation/fog like most/all SSRI's.

 

Next experience is with Effexor XR/Pristiq. This drug used to work great for me. I don't believe it is supposed to be anticholinergic, but, in a very repeatable way, it gives me urinary incontinence. The doc gave me Vesicare for the bladder issue, which is a muscarinic receptor antagonist (prevents binding of acetylcholine to the receptors). My bladder instantly felt normal again, not uncomfortable and stressed. But, I also instantly got major brain fog/fatigue. 

 

Next theory I've read about is the acetylecholine/dopamine balance. One goes up, one goes down. While increasing dopamine (selegline/nuvigil) certainly helps me in certain areas, doesn't cure my depression either. 

[normalizing]

fuck choline. ive tried several, from the basic choline bitartrate to the more advanced patented choline supplements, its the same shit. it either doesnt work or causes depression, mania etc. from the way i see it, its primitive form of enhancing cognition. aim for something for something newer, more advanced.

[LIB]

Agreed, I've left all the nootropic choline stuff behind a while ago. CDP-choline, acetyle-l-carnitine, etc. 

 

I was hoping I could take PPC to help my liver though, but once again, massive depression. 

[LIB]

Forgot link to article in my 2nd post

 

https://bbrfoundatio...-narsad-grantee

[iseethelight]

Bumping an old thread to reiterate this cholone crap. Choline makes me smarter and more verbal but it depresses the hell out of me, mellows me out like a docile bitch...

[monowav]

yeah choline never works for me and anything cholinergic makes me feel worse

[pamojja]

Worked great for me to shrink a fatty liver. But then, no amount of any choline ever made me depressed. Only side-effect I get with really high doses is a bid tension in caws and clenching.

[ceridwen]

Makes me have panic attacks

[PeaceAndProsperity]

Anyone else feels "hyperemotional" when taking anything choline? Hyperemotional like overly excited, overly expressive, psychologically frail, etc...

[gamesguru]

depends on the individual, some people swear by the stuff really.  i think isochromo was taking it, for example?  but no surprise when you call out haters of choline, you get a negative response.  potential theories for non-responders include downregulated nicotinic activity and/or downstream dopamine pathways

 

btw does anyone else feel like complete shit when smoking tobacco or is it just me? and fwiw, i've not had terrible reactions from Alcar or Phosphatidylcholine