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Long-term SSRI use and persistent brain changes

ssri zoloft 5ht1a 5ht2a sjw st johns wort pssd bipolar social anxiety

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#1 Professorben11

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Posted 21 January 2015 - 02:47 AM


I was on 200mg Zoloft qd for four months back when I was in high school.  I have had mood episodes resembling those of ultra-rapid-cycling bipolar II disorder since discontinuing, even seven years after the fact, which were not present before I started taking the medication.

 

This issue has been seriously hurting my ability to form proper social relationships, namely because I go through a depressive episode (and a hypomanic episode) once per week.  During hypomanic episodes everything is fine and dandy (and I'll get into that more in a bit), but during the depressive episodes I have a low mood, low confidence and self-esteem, and in general wish to withdraw from everyone.  Concentrating is much more difficult, and my mind simply reacts slower.  For example, when I'm in a conversation with someone and it's my turn to respond it takes like a full three seconds for a response to fully form in my head when it used to be near-instantaneous.

 

From my perspective, the feeling is like my brain doesn't know how to restrain itself in expending energy used in processing responses to stimuli.  During the hypomanic phases I will be very quick and agile mentally, and am able to keep up a conversation easily; "excessive" accurately characterizes the energy, the confidence, everything about this state.  Then during depressive phases its the complete opposite.  Its like I have no more energy to think quickly and accurately or be happy and have to wait three-ish days for the energy stores to rebuild.  Unless I put every ounce of effort into restraining myself in my reactions to stimuli I cannot control these mood episodes.  I can't even listen to music while running or doing cardio exercise anymore because it excites me too freaking much and will inevitably trigger an episode.

 

I've been through a large number of medications and supplements and nothing has worked to fix the problem (and by fix, I mean end the constant cycling).  I have a dx of social anxiety disorder currently (though it is being successfully treated with CBT/exposure), and my psychiatrist no longer wants to prescribe medication for the mood swings because she thinks they are purely a product of the anxiety.  At this point, I'm inclined to disagree.

 

I'm wondering if it was possible that my serotonergic neurotransmission has been permanently altered because of my experience with Zoloft.  The only information I've been able to find on permanent changes caused by SSRIs is about post-SSRI sexual dysfunction (PSSD).  Here's a summary of the available literature on the disorder.

Under the summary article, I found this study:

 

Sustained desensitization of hypothalamic 5-Hydroxytryptamine1A receptors after discontinuation of fluoxetine: inhibited neuroendocrine responses to 8-hydroxy-2-(Dipropylamino)Tetralin in the absence of changes in Gi/o/z proteins.

 

Long-term exposure to fluoxetine produces a desensitization of hypothalamic postsynaptic 5-hydroxytryptamine (5-HT)1A receptors, indicated by a substantial inhibition of the 5-HT1A receptor-mediated stimulation of oxytocin and adrenocorticotropic hormone (ACTH) secretion. The present study investigated the time course and mechanism of this desensitization after discontinuation of fluoxetine administration. Male rats were injected with saline or fluoxetine (10 mg/kg/day, i.p.) for 14 days and were challenged with a 5-HT1A agonist, [8-hydroxy-2-(dipropylamino)tetralin (8-OH-DPAT) 50 microg/kg, s.c.] 2, 4, 7, 14, 28, or 60 days post-treatment. In control animals, 8-OH-DPAT significantly increased (approximately 15-fold) plasma levels of oxytocin and ACTH. At 2 days post-treatment, oxytocin and ACTH responses to 8-OH-DPAT were reduced by 74% and 68%, respectively. During further withdrawal from fluoxetine, there was a gradual increase in the oxytocin response toward control levels. However, even 60 days after discontinuation of fluoxetine, the oxytocin response was still significantly reduced by 26% compared with controls. In contrast, the suppressed ACTH response to 8-OH-DPAT (a less-sensitive indicator of desensitization) gradually returned to control levels by day 14 of withdrawal from fluoxetine. Interestingly, the sustained reductions in the hormone responses occurred in the absence of reductions in Gz or Gi protein levels in the hypothalamus. Furthermore, this desensitization was sustained in the absence of detectable levels of fluoxetine and norfluoxetine in plasma and brain tissue. These findings suggest that the sustained desensitization of hypothalamic 5-HT1A receptor systems, observed during fluoxetine withdrawal, may be due to altered interactions among the protein components of the 5-HT1A receptor system, rather than their absolute levels.

→ source (external link)

 

It seems that fluoxetine at least has the ability to effect residual changes on serotonergic neurotransmission, specifically on the 1a receptor subtype.

 

I've read that St. John's Wort (SJW) has been found to upregulate the 1a and 2a 5-HT receptor subtypes over the long-term, though whether this effect is persistent and residual I have not been able to clarify.  The only evidence I've seen of SJW providing lasting effects are anecdotal reports of using SJW to cure PSSD, and of SJW being successfully used to rekindle the "magic" of MDMA usage.  I'm wondering if the upregulation caused by SJW will be able to correct the possible dysfunctional serotonergic neurotransmission causing my mood episodes and over the long-term.

 

I've also looked at tianeptine and am wondering if that would help as well, since its pharmacological profile is somewhat novel regarding serotonin.

 

Other than those two supps I'm running out of ideas, and I'm nearly at wit's end.  I don't like being medicated, but I can't go through life with these freaking mood swings anymore.

 

P.S. There might be a dopaminergic issue as well.

 

Prior to being on Zoloft I was on 60mg Adderall XR qd for 3-4 months.  No mood swings were noticed then, just intense anxiety.  I can't rule out the Adderall as causing the mood swings because I was put on Zoloft immediately after weaning off of the Adderall.

In this same vein, I can't tolerate vitamin D3-containing supplements.  I've read that D3 upregulates expression of tyrosine hydroxylase, which is the rate-limiting enzyme in the conversion pathway for dopamine.  Taking even as low as 800 IU a day for a couple of weeks prolongs the hypomanic phase by two days or so, but GREATLY increases the cognitive deficits associated with the depressive phase to the point where my concentration and focus are absolute shit, my short-term memory is incredibly short, and my ability to plan tasks i.e. for helping a patient with an issue in the pharmacy, is shot.


Edited by Professorben11, 21 January 2015 - 03:06 AM.


#2 Michael Rian

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Posted 21 January 2015 - 04:05 AM

I having nothing of value to add other than I feel I have been down a similar road after being on the SSRI Cipralex(escitalopram).  Your post really hit home with me and I appreciate your struggle.  I have found the supplement NAC has helped in a minor way with the rapid cycling.  Here is a quick link to some info on NAC being used as a mood stabilizer in Bipolar disorder. 

 

http://psycheducatio...-cysteine-nac/ 

 

I am still searching for relief and hopefully someday we will find it.  All the best,


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#3 forexworld12

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Posted 21 January 2015 - 08:01 AM

I have PSSD and apathy from SSRI use 11 months on and off ..........It's true The 5HTIA presynaptic is de-sensitized !  at the moment we don't have anything that can effectively target to re-sensitize the 5HTIA so treating this condition requires a different multiple Approach !

St john worth Up-regulates The Post synaptic 5HTIA auto-receptor not the pre-synaptic .. as it is we need sensitization not up-regulation !

 

I tried tianeptine a few days ago for maybe 2.5 days . I couldn't tolerate the side effects so had to quit it  ... It might be worth a shot

 

BUT after reading the entire thread  your condition doesn't look like its Post SSRI related at all !  Post ssri  has a very different set of symptoms ! 


Edited by forexworld12, 21 January 2015 - 08:03 AM.

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#4 Professorben11

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 02:52 AM

I having nothing of value to add other than I feel I have been down a similar road after being on the SSRI Cipralex(escitalopram).  Your post really hit home with me and I appreciate your struggle.  I have found the supplement NAC has helped in a minor way with the rapid cycling.  Here is a quick link to some info on NAC being used as a mood stabilizer in Bipolar disorder. 

 

http://psycheducatio...-cysteine-nac/ 

 

I am still searching for relief and hopefully someday we will find it.  All the best,

 

I've actually been using NAC for the past couple of months, but for a different reason (trying to kick an addiction).  It works pretty well for that purpose, but it hasn't really stabilized my moods at all.

 

I used Perika St. John's Wort in conjunction with NAC (since NAC reduces the increased intensity of addictive cravings that SJW apparently causes) a couple of times over the past 48 hours and it's odd, but so far I feel better.  At the moment I don't feel like my brain is a pot in danger of boiling over.  I'm not going to dose SJW again until the effects fade so I can see how long they last.  Have you tried SJW at all?

 

I have PSSD and apathy from SSRI use 11 months on and off ..........It's true The 5HTIA presynaptic is de-sensitized !  at the moment we don't have anything that can effectively target to re-sensitize the 5HTIA so treating this condition requires a different multiple Approach !

St john worth Up-regulates The Post synaptic 5HTIA auto-receptor not the pre-synaptic .. as it is we need sensitization not up-regulation !

 

I tried tianeptine a few days ago for maybe 2.5 days . I couldn't tolerate the side effects so had to quit it  ... It might be worth a shot

 

BUT after reading the entire thread  your condition doesn't look like its Post SSRI related at all !  Post ssri  has a very different set of symptoms ! 

 

Are you positive its the post-synaptic 5ht1a that is upregulated by SJW?  Because I can't find anything specific about it.

I'm still not entirely sure which type of 5ht1a receptors are the issue here.  On one hand it could be that the 5ht1a autoreceptors are downregulated to a degree that there is too much signaling on post-synaptic cells, and since post-synaptic 5ht1a receptors are heavily expressed in neurons that control neuroendocrine function it's possible that excessive signaling there is causing the problem.  On the other hand, it could be that the post-synaptic receptors are downregulated and because 5ht1a post-synaptic is generally inhibitory in action that there's not enough inhibition signaling happening.  Either way I still suspect 5ht1a because from what I've read, pre- or post-synaptic, it's not a very plastic subtype, so it would make sense that after long-term excessive serotonergic signaling during SSRI treatment it remains in an adaptive state.

But despite all the research I've done the past seven years, my knowledge is still pretty tenuous, so I could be completely off-base here.

 

As far as your PSSD goes, have you read through Area-1255's threads/blog?  He seems to be heavily invested in PSSD research and has come up with several potential supps which could help ameliorate the condition.

 

I appreciate your opinion on the matter, but I don't see how this could be anything other than a post-SSRI condition given the circumstances.


Edited by Professorben11, 22 January 2015 - 02:54 AM.

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#5 forexworld12

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 03:31 AM

 

I having nothing of value to add other than I feel I have been down a similar road after being on the SSRI Cipralex(escitalopram).  Your post really hit home with me and I appreciate your struggle.  I have found the supplement NAC has helped in a minor way with the rapid cycling.  Here is a quick link to some info on NAC being used as a mood stabilizer in Bipolar disorder. 

 

http://psycheducatio...-cysteine-nac/ 

 

I am still searching for relief and hopefully someday we will find it.  All the best,

 

I've actually been using NAC for the past couple of months, but for a different reason (trying to kick an addiction).  It works pretty well for that purpose, but it hasn't really stabilized my moods at all.

 

I used Perika St. John's Wort in conjunction with NAC (since NAC reduces the increased intensity of addictive cravings that SJW apparently causes) a couple of times over the past 48 hours and it's odd, but so far I feel better.  At the moment I don't feel like my brain is a pot in danger of boiling over.  I'm not going to dose SJW again until the effects fade so I can see how long they last.  Have you tried SJW at all?

 

I have PSSD and apathy from SSRI use 11 months on and off ..........It's true The 5HTIA presynaptic is de-sensitized !  at the moment we don't have anything that can effectively target to re-sensitize the 5HTIA so treating this condition requires a different multiple Approach !

St john worth Up-regulates The Post synaptic 5HTIA auto-receptor not the pre-synaptic .. as it is we need sensitization not up-regulation !

 

I tried tianeptine a few days ago for maybe 2.5 days . I couldn't tolerate the side effects so had to quit it  ... It might be worth a shot

 

BUT after reading the entire thread  your condition doesn't look like its Post SSRI related at all !  Post ssri  has a very different set of symptoms ! 

 

Are you positive its the post-synaptic 5ht1a that is upregulated by SJW?  Because I can't find anything specific about it.

I'm still not entirely sure which type of 5ht1a receptors are the issue here.  On one hand it could be that the 5ht1a autoreceptors are downregulated to a degree that there is too much signaling on post-synaptic cells, and since post-synaptic 5ht1a receptors are heavily expressed in neurons that control neuroendocrine function it's possible that excessive signaling there is causing the problem.  On the other hand, it could be that the post-synaptic receptors are downregulated and because 5ht1a post-synaptic is generally inhibitory in action that there's not enough inhibition signaling happening.  Either way I still suspect 5ht1a because from what I've read, pre- or post-synaptic, it's not a very plastic subtype, so it would make sense that after long-term excessive serotonergic signaling during SSRI treatment it remains in an adaptive state.

But despite all the research I've done the past seven years, my knowledge is still pretty tenuous, so I could be completely off-base here.

 

As far as your PSSD goes, have you read through Area-1255's threads/blog?  He seems to be heavily invested in PSSD research and has come up with several potential supps which could help ameliorate the condition.

 

I appreciate your opinion on the matter, but I don't see how this could be anything other than a post-SSRI condition given the circumstances.

 

Yes you are right it is the excessive signalling that is causing the issue

 

Yes Positive it is the Post-synaptic 5HTIA that is increased in number by Sjw.

 

http://www.hippocrat...harmacology.pdf

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/11277608

 

http://en.wikipedia....icum_perforatum

 

Areas-1255 is my friend . 

 

The issue is the Pre-synaptic 5HTIA auto-receptor desensitization that is signalling excess serotonin in the Post synaptic side ... with such excess serotonin being released it makes sense for the Post synaptic side to Down-regulate. and since a lot of Serotonin is flowing into the Post-synaptic side it is inhibiting Dopamine,Norepinephrine,acetylcholine,oxytocin etc thus causing causing emotional  numbness ,anhedonia and sexual dysfunction !

 

Don't get me wrong - Post synaptic Up-regulation would be great ... It would be new gateways for the excess serotonin to pass through that is released by the Pre-synaptic - But the problem with SJW is that there are a lot of other unwanted mechanism that may not be beneficial at all  . 



#6 Professorben11

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 06:49 PM

Yes you are right it is the excessive signalling that is causing the issue

 

 

Yes Positive it is the Post-synaptic 5HTIA that is increased in number by Sjw.

 

http://www.hippocrat...harmacology.pdf

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/11277608

 

http://en.wikipedia....icum_perforatum

 

Areas-1255 is my friend . 

 

The issue is the Pre-synaptic 5HTIA auto-receptor desensitization that is signalling excess serotonin in the Post synaptic side ... with such excess serotonin being released it makes sense for the Post synaptic side to Down-regulate. and since a lot of Serotonin is flowing into the Post-synaptic side it is inhibiting Dopamine,Norepinephrine,acetylcholine,oxytocin etc thus causing causing emotional  numbness ,anhedonia and sexual dysfunction !

 

Don't get me wrong - Post synaptic Up-regulation would be great ... It would be new gateways for the excess serotonin to pass through that is released by the Pre-synaptic - But the problem with SJW is that there are a lot of other unwanted mechanism that may not be beneficial at all  . 

 

 

If I'm not mistaken, then unless the 5ht1a autoreceptors are resensitized, any upregulation in the post-synaptic 5ht1a receptors will eventually be downregulated because of the excess of serotonin being released.  Any progress on this front?  How about WAY 100,635, would that work to resensitize the autoreceptors?

 

Which of the other mechanisms of SJW do you think may not be beneficial?  And are we talking counter-productive mechanisms?



#7 Michael Rian

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 12:44 AM

I saw my Psychiatrist the other day.  He is going to let me try out Moclobemide to see if it helps out any of my issues.  I think it is at least worth a shot.  I have spent the last few years doing the medication free, healthy lifestyle routine, but I still feel like I need some help.  Fingers crossed that I see some benefit.  Just thought I would share,  Thanks



#8 forexworld12

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 05:51 AM

 

Yes you are right it is the excessive signalling that is causing the issue

 

 

Yes Positive it is the Post-synaptic 5HTIA that is increased in number by Sjw.

 

http://www.hippocrat...harmacology.pdf

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/11277608

 

http://en.wikipedia....icum_perforatum

 

Areas-1255 is my friend . 

 

The issue is the Pre-synaptic 5HTIA auto-receptor desensitization that is signalling excess serotonin in the Post synaptic side ... with such excess serotonin being released it makes sense for the Post synaptic side to Down-regulate. and since a lot of Serotonin is flowing into the Post-synaptic side it is inhibiting Dopamine,Norepinephrine,acetylcholine,oxytocin etc thus causing causing emotional  numbness ,anhedonia and sexual dysfunction !

 

Don't get me wrong - Post synaptic Up-regulation would be great ... It would be new gateways for the excess serotonin to pass through that is released by the Pre-synaptic - But the problem with SJW is that there are a lot of other unwanted mechanism that may not be beneficial at all  . 

 

 

If I'm not mistaken, then unless the 5ht1a autoreceptors are resensitized, any upregulation in the post-synaptic 5ht1a receptors will eventually be downregulated because of the excess of serotonin being released.  Any progress on this front?  How about WAY 100,635, would that work to resensitize the autoreceptors?

 

Which of the other mechanisms of SJW do you think may not be beneficial?  And are we talking counter-productive mechanisms?

 

Exactly . so either way we just have to keep taking anything that up-regulates post synaptic to reach a net level .. otherwise like you said excess serotonin is going to down-regulate it further ! Re-sensitization is the key which Right now we don't have anything to do that effectively ! 

There are some good things and some bad things about SJW. good is it inhibiting the re-uptake of  NA and DA  but bad it that it acts like an SSRI inhibiting the reuptake of 5HT too ..

 

WAY 1000-635 is a selective antagonist of 5HTIA it blocks both pre and post synaptic ... since we need sensitization at the pre-synaptic which is not there we can assume it is not going to attach there either way but only too the Post synaptic.. by attaching to the Post synaptic it is going to release more serotonin through antagonism at post-synaptic But on the other hand it will stop the inhibition of Dopamine etc etc ... Generally I have seen an agonist working for less severe cases and an antagonist working for cases for PSSD +emotional numbling !  


Edited by forexworld12, 23 January 2015 - 05:51 AM.


#9 TheWorldAroundUs

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 10:06 PM

Have you looked into serotonin precursors? Not only do SSRIs desensitize Serotonin receptors, but they also deplete serotonin because blocking reuptake means less serotonin is being recycled for later use and more if it is being broken down into inactive metabolites. This depletion usually isn't permanent with occasional or one time use but I imagine if you used it non-stop every day, there is a possibility that you have developed a permanent depletion somehow, so its worth it to look into serotonin precursors L-tryptophan(best one) or 5-htp(Strong than L-tryptophan but causes Heart damage). Additionally Constantly shooting up serotonin levels depletes dopamine as they are inverse antagonists towards each other(Increasing one depletes the other by default), again this depletion usually isn't permanent, but there is a possibility it could be for you because you used an SSRI daily for a really long time. So again, try taking L-tyrosine(Dopamine Precursor) or very low dose Mucuna Pruriens(Contains L-dopa, which is a stronger precursor than L-tyrosine).

 

Try those out and stay hopeful. Keep me/us posted.



#10 sensei

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 02:28 AM

Bacopa apparently regulates the serotonergic system.

 

I'm not all that clear on the details -- but more than one holistic physician I have talked to has said they recommend it for SSRI discontinuation syndrome.

 

Also vistaril (hydroxyzine) is a  5-HT2A antagonist. -- It is also used for SSRI and SSNRI (lexapro) discontinuation syndrome.



#11 nowayout

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 02:56 PM

 

I've actually been using NAC for the past couple of months, but for a different reason (trying to kick an addiction).  It works pretty well for that purpose, but it hasn't really stabilized my moods at all.

 

I appreciate your opinion on the matter, but I don't see how this could be anything other than a post-SSRI condition given the circumstances.

 

 

May I suggest that given that (1) the problem occurred during/post high school, a typical time for many people first come down with mental illnesses anyway, and (2) you had an addiction, there are simply too many variables to ascribe your problem to SSRIs in particular.  You don't say what the addiction was, but if I were trying to find something to blame for messing up my brain, the addiction would be my first target, even though I am no friend of SSRIs.


Edited by nowayout, 30 January 2015 - 02:56 PM.


#12 Professorben11

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Posted 03 February 2015 - 01:26 AM

 

 

I've actually been using NAC for the past couple of months, but for a different reason (trying to kick an addiction).  It works pretty well for that purpose, but it hasn't really stabilized my moods at all.

 

I appreciate your opinion on the matter, but I don't see how this could be anything other than a post-SSRI condition given the circumstances.

 

 

May I suggest that given that (1) the problem occurred during/post high school, a typical time for many people first come down with mental illnesses anyway, and (2) you had an addiction, there are simply too many variables to ascribe your problem to SSRIs in particular.  You don't say what the addiction was, but if I were trying to find something to blame for messing up my brain, the addiction would be my first target, even though I am no friend of SSRIs.

 

 

You're right on the money.  The issue is complicated, but I've found that the mood swings are connected to the addiction (which is to pornography; it's not something I really like admitting) and to my mental state as a result of the addiction, which predates my experiences with pharma drugs by at least four years.

 

The SSRI played some role in destabilizing my mental state, but I'm seeing more evidence that the damage was psychological and not the result of persistent auto-receptor desensitization, as forexworld12 correctly anticipated.  I guess that excuses SSRIs in my case from causing my mood swings.  It was my behavioral and cognitive patterns all along, they were just severely entrenched to the point that it seemed there was something biologically wrong with my brain.  And that realization is a bit of a relief.



#13 Flex

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Posted 14 February 2015 - 08:24 PM

 

 


 

If I'm not mistaken, then unless the 5ht1a autoreceptors are resensitized, any upregulation in the post-synaptic 5ht1a receptors will eventually be downregulated because of the excess of serotonin being released.  Any progress on this front?  How about WAY 100,635, would that work to resensitize the autoreceptors?

 

Which of the other mechanisms of SJW do you think may not be beneficial?  And are we talking counter-productive mechanisms?

 

Exactly . so either way we just have to keep taking anything that up-regulates post synaptic to reach a net level .. otherwise like you said excess serotonin is going to down-regulate it further ! Re-sensitization is the key which Right now we don't have anything to do that effectively ! 

There are some good things and some bad things about SJW. good is it inhibiting the re-uptake of  NA and DA  but bad it that it acts like an SSRI inhibiting the reuptake of 5HT too ..

 

WAY 1000-635 is a selective antagonist of 5HTIA it blocks both pre and post synaptic ... since we need sensitization at the pre-synaptic which is not there we can assume it is not going to attach there either way but only too the Post synaptic.. by attaching to the Post synaptic it is going to release more serotonin through antagonism at post-synaptic But on the other hand it will stop the inhibition of Dopamine etc etc ... Generally I have seen an agonist working for less severe cases and an antagonist working for cases for PSSD +emotional numbling !  

 

 

Look into Kanna / Sceletium tortuosum / Zembrin

at the graphical abstract

it could (inhhibit ?) / bind with a potency of 40% to 5-ht1a. However the downside is its binding affinity to SERT

Pharmacological actions of the South African medicinal and functional food plant Sceletium tortuosum and its principal alkaloids

http://www.sciencedi...378874111005113

 

nelumbo nucifera would increase 5-ht1a receptors to some extend ( assuming it is that what Youre looking for)

Nelumbinis Semen reverses a decrease in 5-HT1A receptor binding induced by chronic mild stress, a depression-like symptom.

The present study assessed if Nelumbinis Semen (N.s.) had an anti-depression effect through reversing a decrease in 5-HT1A receptor binding in rats with depression-like symptoms induced by chronic mild stress.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15554266

The anti-depressant effect of Nelumbinis semen on rats under chronic mild stress induced depression-like symptoms.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15974480

 

 

I´ve tried allrady kanna a few Years ago and it wasnt that overwhelming, though I was rather interrested in psychonautic stuff.

It works fast but wears also fast off, has some stimulating effects and, IIRC, a bit aphrodisiac effects among others.

 

I´ve ordered Nebulis and will report the effects if You like.

 

Btw: Why wouldnt You look into Cannabinoid signalling to prove the 5-ht hypothesis ?

( my hypothesis is still an epigenetic alteration)

 

Relationships between serotonergic and cannabinoid system in depressive-like behavior: a PET study with [11C]-DASB.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/24646401

..Chronic restraint stress induces depressive-like behavior and reduced 5-HTT levels in WT mice similar to those revealed in non-stressed CB1-KO mice

 

So a CB1 inhibitor like Rimonabant or Voacanga would have the same effects.

Cannabinoid: cb1 antagonist cb2 agonists/antagonists and Gpr55 antagonists

http://www.longecity...55-antagonists/

 

However, when I´ve smoked weed in the past, it made me allways horny.

I guess its because of a underfunctioned caudate ( caused by THC!?) which has been implicated in hypersexuality

 

Furthermore, as You have allready had once delusions (If I remeber correctly) I would rather advise You against smoking pot !


Edited by Flex, 14 February 2015 - 08:41 PM.


#14 Flex

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Posted 14 February 2015 - 09:42 PM

or try Luteoline / Lutimax

Functional activation of monoamine transporters by luteolin and apigenin isolated from the fruit of Perilla frutescens (L.) Britt.

Here, we isolated luteolin and apigenin from the fruit of Perilla frutescens (L.) Britt by using an activity-guided extraction technique, and proved that the two compounds possess actions of enhancing monoamine uptake either upon monoamine-transporter transgenic Chinese hamster ovary (CHO) cells or upon wild dopaminergic cell lines, with higher specificity for dopamine (DA) uptake than for norepinephrine (NE)- and serotonin (5HT)-uptake, as well as with more potency and greater efficacy for luteolin than for apigenin

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19815045



#15 Flex

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Posted 16 February 2015 - 01:14 AM

Forgott to mention:

Rimonabant can cause nasty depressions to an extend that drove some people into suicide.

Thats why they banned it in 2008



#16 Flex

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Posted 18 April 2015 - 08:43 PM

Posted this in the Pssd forum

http://www.pssdforum....php?f=10&t=214

 

Antidepressant Treatment Reduces Serotonin-1A Autoreceptor Binding in Major Depressive Disorder

http://www.academia....essive_Disorder

 

So according to this AND to paper of the #1 post where a gradual recovery is observeable after 6 weeks,

Your autoreceptors could recover after months to Years

and the benchmark seems to be 4 Years

 

My laymans opinion is, that the duration of the intake of the antidepressant as well as the time (i.e. adolescence) could play a role in the recovery time

and perhaps stretch it(?)

 

Nevertheless (IIRC) Sonny the moderator form the pssd forum recovered after 10 years whereas on other still suffer for 20 years.

 

Here and as well as in the pssd-forum above are some compounds that may help:

Natural 5-HT1A Agonists/Antagonists (PSSD,and Cognitive Function)

http://www.longecity...itive-function/

 

Serotonin 5-HT(1)A Receptor and Male Sexual Function / Motivation

http://www.longecity...e-2#entry723595

 


Edited by Flex, 18 April 2015 - 08:48 PM.


#17 Mental_Divergence

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Posted 08 November 2016 - 03:53 PM

Pssd is nonsense. The effects are not permanent, get your depression/anxiety/OCD in check.
  • Pointless, Timewasting x 1

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#18 Mental_Divergence

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Posted 22 February 2017 - 05:13 PM

Check your hormones!!!!!!!!!!!







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: ssri, zoloft, 5ht1a, 5ht2a, sjw, st johns wort, pssd, bipolar, social anxiety

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