83 replies to this topic

[platypus]

Did nofap actually help you in some way, or was it detrimental?

[Baten]

Did nofap actually help you in some way, or was it detrimental?

Nofap exposed the problem, after which 'recovery' begins. You cannot heal overstimulated receptors by keeping up the (often extreme) stimulation. Thinking back at old playboy books, porn nowadays is no longer as mild and yet widely available. Definitely best to cut it out of one's life. Once 'healed' you could theoretically pick it up again as long as you don't overdo it. Those with 'problems' are the ones who indulge in porn every single day. And not everyone ends up this way.

 

So it can be perceived as 'detrimental', but only because you then realize your brain has been overloaded. I'm still trying to get a normal reaction from normal stimulation, and still haven't recovered after almost 7 months now. I have a much healthier lifestyle and habits nowadays though, have been finally picking up things I've been procrastinating for way too long, and no longer live empty, getting the same 'cheap' satisfaction and thrill day by day.

 

So basically, don't overdo it and you'll be fine. Overdo it and you'll be in for a hell of a long recovery. Not everyone is the same, though. But read up and you'll find a real plague of people suffering from the same thing, ever since high-speed internet has become mainstream. People should at least be aware, but generally this kind of thing gets laughed off by people unaffected, or people who don't want to see it becoming a problem.

Edited by Baten, 19 August 2015 - 01:25 PM.

[platypus]

I have trouble believing masturbating to porn or having sex, say, once a day is detrimental in any way.

[Baten]

I have trouble believing masturbating to porn or having sex, say, once a day is detrimental in any way.

It doesn't need to be, but for many people it tends to become one. It all depends, I suppose.

 

I can't see actual sex being detrimental though, no. At least not normally.

[platypus]

 

I have trouble believing masturbating to porn or having sex, say, once a day is detrimental in any way.

It doesn't need to be, but for many people it tends to become one. It all depends, I suppose.

 

I can't see actual sex being detrimental though, no. At least not normally.

 

If too much porn can screw up one's receptors so could too much sex. I see no reason why not..

[crazepharmacist]

SERMs aren't something to play around with though. Ceretropic has some anabolic ones and most can cause shutdown.

Clomid/Tore is relatively safe but you have to know what you're doing. Edit*: and they didn't help for me, personally :(

 

No, you're thinking about SARMS, which can cause suppression. SERMS do the opposite, boost natural testosterone levels. 

[Baten]

If too much porn can screw up one's receptors so could too much sex. I see no reason why not..

Sure, too much of anything can be harmful I'm sure, there's no doubting that. The problem with porn is that it's endless: something 'new' is always readily available, one always finds a new limit. There lies the danger, in my opinion. If not for that, porn wouldn't become a problem too easily, just like sex wouldn't become a problem too easily.

 

 

 

SERMs aren't something to play around with though. Ceretropic has some anabolic ones and most can cause shutdown.

Clomid/Tore is relatively safe but you have to know what you're doing. Edit*: and they didn't help for me, personally :(

 

No, you're thinking about SARMS, which can cause suppression. SERMS do the opposite, boost natural testosterone levels. 

 

My bad, thanks for the correction.

[platypus]

Porn is not bad for you, but rather increases one's interesting in having real sex with normal partners

 

http://aeon.co/magaz...exual-pleasure/

 

"When Prause and the psychologist James Pfaus of Concordia University in Quebec recently measured sexual arousal in 280 men, they found that watching more pornography actually increased arousal to less explicit material – and increased the desire for sex with a partner. In other words, it made them more, not less responsive to ‘normal’ cues, and more, not less, desirous of real physical relationships."

I'm more and more convinced that NoFap is a puritan scam that is harming men.

Edited by platypus, 23 August 2015 - 08:18 PM.

[Baten]

Porn is not bad for you, but rather increases one's interest in having real sex with normal partners

 

Interest, sure, but I do think it's more complicated than that. I reckon for many people porn is 'fine', but I do believe there's a potential for abuse. Those who have hard drives full of it are probably better off without. I fell in that category and I know it's not 'good' for you in that case.

 

But enough about the porn subject. Let's just agree that everyone's different and that you can't generalize its effect on all men (or women for that fact).

[Iamnobodi]

Porn is not bad for you, but rather increases one's interesting in having real sex with normal partners

 

http://aeon.co/magaz...exual-pleasure/

 

"When Prause and the psychologist James Pfaus of Concordia University in Quebec recently measured sexual arousal in 280 men, they found that watching more pornography actually increased arousal to less explicit material – and increased the desire for sex with a partner. In other words, it made them more, not less responsive to ‘normal’ cues, and more, not less, desirous of real physical relationships."

I'm more and more convinced that NoFap is a puritan scam that is harming men.

 

Don't be quick to believe everything you read Mr. Platypus: 

"It's unfortunate that readers will be left with the impression that Ms. Konnikova presented a balanced review of the neuroscience on internet pornography use. Ms. Konnikova chose to highlight Nicole Prause's two studies, while ignoring recent brain scan studies by addiction neuroscientists from Cambridge University and The Max Planck Institute. Konikova also ignored several recent neurcognitive studies by German neuroscientists Brand & Laier.

One glaring fact turns this entire article upside down: All published brain & neurocognitive studies have reported evidence of porn addiction - including Nicole Prause's 2013 EEG study (more on that).

First, the names and highlights of the Max Planck and 2 Cambridge studies:

1) "Brain Structure and Functional Connectivity Associated With Pornography Consumption: The Brain on Porn" (2014): A German study which found 3 significant addiction-related brain changes that correlated with the amount of porn consumed. It also found that the more porn consumed the less activity in the reward circuit, indicating desensitization, and increasing the need for greater stimulation (tolerance).

2) "Neural Correlates of Sexual Cue Reactivity in Individuals With and Without Compulsive Sexual Behaviours (2014): The first in a series of Cambridge University studies found the same brain activity as seen in drug addicts & alcoholics. It also found that porn addicts fit the accepted addiction model of wanting "it" more, but
not liking "it" more. The researchers also reported that 60% of subjects (average age: 25) had difficulty achieving erections/arousal with real partners, yet could achieve erections with porn.

3) "Enhanced Attentional Bias Towards Sexually Explicit Cues in Individuals With and Without Compulsive Sexual Behaviours" (2014); Quote - "Our findings of enhanced attentional bias... suggest possible overlaps with enhanced attentional bias observed in studies of drug cues in disorders of addictions."

[platypus]

Of course porn addiction exists and excessive masturbation (several times a day) is probably bad for you. Still, for the majority porn does not cause this kind of problems. Also it's not surprising that sexual activity (like masturbation) activates some of the same neural circuits as drugs of abuse. 

Edited by platypus, 24 August 2015 - 07:09 AM.

[Baten]

Took 5-HTP for the first time yesterday. Slept like a baby. Interesting effect: seem to think of nothing but sex today.

 

Serotonin might be just as important as dopamine for libido. Will do some more testing.

[Flex]

did You had the same effects just after taking the 5-htp ?

 

Could be due to desentitation because when I use rhodiola, my libido goes down.

This is caused by my slight PSSD. Prior this, rhodiola increased it.

Edited by Flex, 27 August 2015 - 11:15 AM.

[crazepharmacist]

Selegiline is another option to raise dopamine and lower prolocatin which may help libido. I strongly recommend seeing a doctor and getting a full hormone panel done.

 

Testosterone (total+free)

SHGB

E2 (sensitive assay for males)

prolactin

dht

lh+fsh

cortisol

thyroid hormones

vitamin d

 

 

 

Edited by crazepharmacist, 27 August 2015 - 01:49 PM.

[Baten]

Yes crazepharmacist I plan to get a more detailed hormone panel and will report back.

 

About serotonin/5HTP, the initial effects were pretty short-lived and did not last, pretty quickly I noticed a severe drop in erection quality, as if all my progress from past months was instantly set back. 5HTP can have SSRI-like effects, so I will stay far away from it for now on. I actually tried in since it came with a work-out formula ('blue growth'), but I'll be throwing it in the bin. Will try some more selegiline/cabergoline/memantine ++ horny goat weed 60% and indian berberine 98% (ebay powder) which is what I was playing with these past months with good progress.

Edited by Baten, 28 August 2015 - 08:26 PM.

[perplex]

Low Dose Naltrexone

[Baten]

So, looks like I'm actually back to normal. Good libido. Immensely relieved. What worked:

 

-Resensitizing dopamine. This is a really long progress, and I'm not sure exactly what did the trick. Time might be the most important thing. Cordyceps, gymnostemna (jiaogulan) tea or supplement, and perhaps shilajit could have all helped. Running, exercising might have too.

I also abstained from porn with very few regressions. Currently not even interested in it anymore, since I'm too obsessed with staying healthy in all departments, and heavy dopamine stimulation is, in my opinion at least, never good for you.

 

-Raising testosterone. I'm currently at around 800ug/dL. Testosterone wasn't the problem per sé, but given the complex relationship between dopamine and testosterone, having high test surely doesn't hurt. I work out 3 days a week now. Nothing too heavy, but it still feels good to stay fit.

 

-I think all the (2.5mg EOD) memantine cycles helped. I tried phenylpiracetam+memantine for 2-3 weeks (didn't do much); memantine + cabergoline (very rarely, now and then, I'm not sure caber is really the kind of thing to help long-term since without it you're back to baseline) and finally just took memantine+tribulus EOD (other herbs like longjack the other day) which surprisingly worked really well.

 

-A 2-month regimen of taking 100mg niacin + Garlic (I took 'Garlicin HC'), plus perhaps some arginine before sleep seems to have helped with erection quality too. Don't think I need to take any of that anymore, though. Perhaps every now and then

 

-Finally, I used up 10g of berberine power over the past months(1-2months I think), along with high doses of cialis. Right now I feel PDE5 enzymes along with some liver enzymes are either down- or upregulated in such a way that my erection quality is pretty damn good across the line, with the added benefit that nowadays I just take 2.5mg (quarter generic tablet) which works as well as much higher doses I took in the past. I reckon I even need it anymore at all.

Note: perhaps not a coincidence, I was feeling a little sick/ill during this time, berberine probably isn't the most gentle supplement. I'd advise not to take it for too long.

 

There might be other things that helped along the line, and I still have a lot of other supplements which I was going to try; but considering I'm feeling pretty good I'm not sure I want to take the risk of doing my current state any harm, heh.

Edited by Baten, 30 November 2015 - 08:55 AM.

[BasicBiO]

Great to hear, Baten. I'm currently in the same boat as you were and came to a lot of the same conclusions you did prior to finding this thread.  I am trying to resensitize my dopaminergic system, eliminate stress, and raise test/DHT. I can pinpoint my crash to about 3 years ago when I lost a job then took on an extremely stressful contract, had marital issues then my wife got pregnant with complications, etc etc.  I went from being highly sexual to absolutely no interest at all for the first time in my adult life..and the issue has lasted until recently.

 

Like yourself I have tried most of same supplements with little effect. Currently running toremifene which is helping but may also delve into DHT cream and HCG. High grade cordycepts should be here this week.

 

I've had no interest in porn during this time, but I was not a porn addict prior IMO.

[Baten]

Wish you the best BasicBiO. I know the frustrations you're going through, hope it gets better little by little. It did for me, eventually.

 

Some other stuff that might have helped me:

-I take cold showers quite often. When I take a shower it actually takes time for the water to warm up, so I deal with it and just thrust myself in the cold water. Supposedly cold showers have all kinds of health benefits (including circulation benefits and more).

-Eating, living healthy in general, specifically healthy kidney, liver and thyroid function, with emphasis on the latter two. I have been taking milk thistle these past months, as well as iodine and selenium (+ was taking zinc already). I'm finally within a healthy range of magnesium and I'm sure I 'fixed' other possible deficiencies.

[BasicBiO]

Thanks Baten and best of luck to you as well.  

 

Two days into high grade cordycepts has been interesting. Can definitely feel a boost in energy and dopamine..better mood and motivation. I will try to stay consistent with dosing and take it for several months or longer.

 

Lifestyle definitely plays major role and like you, I focus on a lot of the little things that I used to take for granted like consistently good sleep, healthy diet, and workouts. 

[chrisp2]

Prescript assist.. It's The best probiotic that has humic and fulvic acids. Humic and fulvic modulate the opioid system and facilitate the transfer of minerals into and out of the cell.. Believe me it'll bring meaning wood back better than anything.

 

I can find VERY little out there about fulvic acid helping with erection quality.  Basically nothing reputable.

[Baten]

 

Prescript assist.. It's The best probiotic that has humic and fulvic acids. Humic and fulvic modulate the opioid system and facilitate the transfer of minerals into and out of the cell.. Believe me it'll bring meaning wood back better than anything.

 

I can find VERY little out there about fulvic acid helping with erection quality.  Basically nothing reputable.

 

 

I've tried three fulvic sources, including the prescript product mentioned. Debunked. Did nothing.

Edited by Baten, 04 December 2015 - 03:59 PM.

[kurdishfella]

Get sick. That has someway of resetting your body maybe not fully but could regain some partial libido. When im sick my libido is zero almost which is weird youd think that your libido would always be high no matter what becus its vital for human being to carry on

[kurdishfella]

 

The release of all the hormones related to touching as a female can do wonders for your climax.

 

 

The female ''climax'' is just a combination of weak bladder, pee, vaginal fluid and losing control of yourself.