12 replies to this topic

[blaine_11]

Does anyone know if daily coffee or caffeine supplement intake is effecting my opioid receptors recovery post opiate use?

any help or advice would be appreciated, thanks

[Galaxyshock]

Coffee does contain mu-opioid receptor antagonists:

http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/6296693

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15088081

 

This could in theory help upregulate mu opioid receptors.

I remember tea also contains opioid receptor ligands, many flavonoids work like that.

[blaine_11]

 

Coffee does contain mu-opioid receptor antagonists:

http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/6296693

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15088081

 

This could in theory help upregulate mu opioid receptors.

I remember tea also contains opioid receptor ligands, many flavonoids work like that.

 

thanks very much. the reason i was asking is because im 13 months post opiate use and still dont believe i have recovered, just wondering if my morning coffee is slowing progress?

[Flex]

Look into Berberine

Effect of Berberine on Depression- and Anxiety-Like Behaviors and Activation of the Noradrenergic System Induced by Development of Morphine Dependence in Rats

http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC3526741/

 

and Rhizoma Corydalis/Yan Huo Suo

Medication of l-tetrahydropalmatine significantly ameliorates opiate craving and increases the abstinence rate in heroin users: a pilot study.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/18565275

 

But Coridalis is a dopamine antagonist with lasting effects like an usual antipsychotic.

So depending on the dosis: decreased cognition (i.e. kind of brainfog) and sexual side effects for weeks to months

 

[blaine_11]

i'd rather not take any other drugs, i just want my brain/receptors to recover and im becoming frustrated, it feels like i'll never recover

[Galaxyshock]

That long post-acute withdrawal symptoms sound quite unusual. What do you do on daily basis to support your recovery, is it possible it could be partially psychological and not a "failure of receptors"? Exercise releases endogenous opiates that should make you feel better, do you experience this effect?

 

Consider Proglumide or the herb Gotu Kola as a cholecystokinin-B antagonist for opiate tolerance if you think that is still an issue. Gotu Kola is overall healthy mood lifting "cure-all" herb that you could enjoy.

[blaine_11]

That long post-acute withdrawal symptoms sound quite unusual. What do you do on daily basis to support your recovery, is it possible it could be partially psychological and not a "failure of receptors"? Exercise releases endogenous opiates that should make you feel better, do you experience this effect?

 

Consider Proglumide or the herb Gotu Kola as a cholecystokinin-B antagonist for opiate tolerance if you think that is still an issue. Gotu Kola is overall healthy mood lifting "cure-all" herb that you could enjoy.

yes i exercise, i lift weights and do cardio. yes i also feel good after exercise. i try to eat as healthy as possible. surely i must have opiate tolerance still as like i said still no rewarding effect from alcohol? maybe i am someone who will never recover? or take many years?

i know its hard to tell, but i appreciate any advice

[nowayout]

That long post-acute withdrawal symptoms sound quite unusual. What do you do on daily basis to support your recovery, is it possible it could be partially psychological and not a "failure of receptors"? Exercise releases endogenous opiates that should make you feel better, do you experience this effect?

Consider Proglumide or the herb Gotu Kola as a cholecystokinin-B antagonist for opiate tolerance if you think that is still an issue. Gotu Kola is overall healthy mood lifting "cure-all" herb that you could enjoy.

yes i exercise, i lift weights and do cardio. yes i also feel good after exercise. i try to eat as healthy as possible. surely i must have opiate tolerance still as like i said still no rewarding effect from alcohol? maybe i am someone who will never recover? or take many years?

i know its hard to tell, but i appreciate any advice

I doubt not feeling rewarding effects from alcohol had anything to do with opioid tolerance. If you had been on benzos that would maybe make sense. Also if you had abused alcohol in the past it may make sense. But not so much opioids. It sounds like you feel rewarding effects from other things so i really wouldn't worry about it.

This is not a symptom of PAWS. Do you have any PAWS symptoms?

I never felt reward from alcohol even long before i ever took opioids. This lack of attraction to alcohol runs in my family. It is in large part a genetic thing. It is a separate system from the opioid circuits. You should be glad. The people who get a very rewarding effect from alcohol are the ones who are in trouble, not you.

Edited by nowayout, 25 May 2015 - 09:27 PM.

[blaine_11]

 

 

That long post-acute withdrawal symptoms sound quite unusual. What do you do on daily basis to support your recovery, is it possible it could be partially psychological and not a "failure of receptors"? Exercise releases endogenous opiates that should make you feel better, do you experience this effect?

Consider Proglumide or the herb Gotu Kola as a cholecystokinin-B antagonist for opiate tolerance if you think that is still an issue. Gotu Kola is overall healthy mood lifting "cure-all" herb that you could enjoy.

yes i exercise, i lift weights and do cardio. yes i also feel good after exercise. i try to eat as healthy as possible. surely i must have opiate tolerance still as like i said still no rewarding effect from alcohol? maybe i am someone who will never recover? or take many years?

i know its hard to tell, but i appreciate any advice

I doubt not feeling rewarding effects from alcohol had anything to do with opioid tolerance. If you had been on benzos that would maybe make sense. Also if you had abused alcohol in the past it may make sense. But not so much opioids. It sounds like you feel rewarding effects from other things so i really wouldn't worry about it.

This is not a symptom of PAWS. Do you have any PAWS symptoms?

I never felt reward from alcohol even long before i ever took opioids. This lack of attraction to alcohol runs in my family. It is in large part a genetic thing. It is a separate system from the opioid circuits. You should be glad. The people who get a very rewarding effect from alcohol are the ones who are in trouble, not you.

 

the only other thing i had very briefly when i came off opiates was lowered libido, which returned completely to normal.

yes opiates/opiate tolerance have effected my pleasure of alcohol, before i ever touched opiates, alcohol worked very well. it seems my mu opioid receptors are desensitized but i thought after 13 months of abstinence i would of recovered by now, im frustrated 

[nowayout]

yes opiates/opiate tolerance have effected my pleasure of alcohol, before i ever touched opiates, alcohol worked very well. it seems my mu opioid receptors are desensitized but i thought after 13 months of abstinence i would of recovered by now, im frustrated 

 

If it is just alcohol, I really wouldn't worry about it.

 

Many people very quickly get tolerant to any euphoric effects of alcohol they may have had in the beginning, and that happens without ever taking opioids.  By the way, the same tolerance and lack of euphoria develops very quickly with caffeine in most people, also without any opioids in the picture.  FWIW many of us never got euphoria from alcohol in the first place - from what my friends tell me, most of them don't get euphoria from alcohol at all... most people use it as a relaxant, not a euphoriant.  For people who want euphoria, alcohol is seldom the drug of choice, because it just doesn't sustainably do that for most.  So it sounds like you are still in the range of normal.  Worrying about this won't make it any better.
 

[blaine_11]

 

yes opiates/opiate tolerance have effected my pleasure of alcohol, before i ever touched opiates, alcohol worked very well. it seems my mu opioid receptors are desensitized but i thought after 13 months of abstinence i would of recovered by now, im frustrated 

 

If it is just alcohol, I really wouldn't worry about it.

 

Many people very quickly get tolerant to any euphoric effects of alcohol they may have had in the beginning, and that happens without ever taking opioids.  By the way, the same tolerance and lack of euphoria develops very quickly with caffeine in most people, also without any opioids in the picture.  FWIW many of us never got euphoria from alcohol in the first place - from what my friends tell me, most of them don't get euphoria from alcohol at all... most people use it as a relaxant, not a euphoriant.  For people who want euphoria, alcohol is seldom the drug of choice, because it just doesn't sustainably do that for most.  So it sounds like you are still in the range of normal.  Worrying about this won't make it any better.
 

 

i understand what you are saying and i appreciate your input. however im not in the range of normal, relaxant is definitely a better term, i meant lowered inhibitions - which i do not get. for some this wouldnt be much of a big deal, theyd use other drugs. its a different story for me, but again i appreciate your thoughts

[nowayout]

relaxant is definitely a better term, i meant lowered inhibitions - which i do not get. for some this wouldnt be much of a big deal, theyd use other drugs. its a different story for me, but again i appreciate your thoughts

 

I think a lot of the lowering of inhibitions effect is either placebo or context-dependent.  Alcohol makes people a little slow and stupid (or a lot, depending on dose) - an effect that relaxes me if I'm with certain people I know well but makes me anxious and depressed when I'm with strangers.  So I think a lot of what it does for you depends on what you expect it to do for you.  Maybe your expectations have changed due to your anxiety about the opioids. 

 

Edited by nowayout, 26 May 2015 - 05:27 PM.

[blaine_11]

 

relaxant is definitely a better term, i meant lowered inhibitions - which i do not get. for some this wouldnt be much of a big deal, theyd use other drugs. its a different story for me, but again i appreciate your thoughts

 

I think a lot of the lowering of inhibitions effect is either placebo or context-dependent.  Alcohol makes people a little slow and stupid (or a lot, depending on dose) - an effect that relaxes me if I'm with certain people I know well but makes me anxious and depressed when I'm with strangers.  So I think a lot of what it does for you depends on what you expect it to do for you.  Maybe your expectations have changed due to your anxiety about the opioids. 

 

i first thought that months ago, but it doesnt matter what social situation, or even alone, there are no rewarding or enjoyable effects. i still wobble on my feet and also have slurred speech, but mentally there is no buzz. i guess my GABA receptors are ok in that regard, but obviously my opioid receptors are damaged