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Nicotinamide Riboside [Curated]

nicotinamide riboside nicotinamide nad boosting charles brenner david sinclair leonard guarente niagen niacinamide nicotinamide mononucleotide

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#1621 bluemoon

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 07:21 PM

 It's all good together, and I strongly feel that these compounds are synergistic together.

 

 

This is what Lenny Guarente also said in a 2015 interview as well as he takes 250mg of resveratrol and either 50mg or 100mg of  pterostilbine with NR:

 

 I would expect both polyphenols and NAD+ precursors, both of which comprise Elysium’s initial product BASIS, to activate SIRT1.  In this regard, the polyphenol pterostilbene shows promise and may be more bioavailable than resveratrol, meaning the body is more readily able to absorb and utilize the product.  The combination of pterostilbene and NR might be particularly effective by providing sirtuin activation via two different mechanisms.  This is the rationale for BASIS, which contains pure forms of both NR and pterostilbene. 

 

 

I wonder why he also adds the 250 mg of resveratrol.

 

Finally, Elysium could do what Chromadex did and put the results of its 8 week trial up beyond just how much NAD+ is raised in blood since they have known the results for four months. Any idea why they aren't doing this apart from maybe the results are 1) not great at either 250mg NR or 500mg NR or 2) good results for the higher dose but now wonder how they market BASIS at the much higher price.



#1622 Daniel Cooper

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 07:32 PM

 

 It's all good together, and I strongly feel that these compounds are synergistic together.

 

 

This is what Lenny Guarente also said in a 2015 interview as well as he takes 250mg of resveratrol and either 50mg or 100mg of  pterostilbine with NR:

 

 I would expect both polyphenols and NAD+ precursors, both of which comprise Elysium’s initial product BASIS, to activate SIRT1.  In this regard, the polyphenol pterostilbene shows promise and may be more bioavailable than resveratrol, meaning the body is more readily able to absorb and utilize the product.  The combination of pterostilbene and NR might be particularly effective by providing sirtuin activation via two different mechanisms.  This is the rationale for BASIS, which contains pure forms of both NR and pterostilbene. 

 

 

I wonder why he also adds the 250 mg of resveratrol.

 

Finally, Elysium could do what Chromadex did and put the results of its 8 week trial up beyond just how much NAD+ is raised in blood since they have known the results for four months. Any idea why they aren't doing this apart from maybe the results are 1) not great at either 250mg NR or 500mg NR or 2) good results for the higher dose but now wonder how they market BASIS at the much higher price.

 

 

 

He could just be covering his bases.  There has been a lot more studies on resveratrol.  We *think* that pterostilbene does the same thing only better, but we actually don't have as much concrete evidence for that as we'd like.


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#1623 bluemoon

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 07:48 PM

 

 

He could just be covering his bases.  There has been a lot more studies on resveratrol.  We *think* that pterostilbene does the same thing only better, but we actually don't have as much concrete evidence for that as we'd like.

 

 

I thought at first he is covering his bases as well but then remembered resveratrol and ptersotilbine do have some different effects as well. David Sinclair is known to take 1,000 mg of resveratrol and "a NAD precursor". He says it isn't NR  but would be very tempted to take it if not taking the other NAD+ precursor molecule, which is almost certainly NMN, right?

 

With respect to resveratrol studies on humans, I've only seen very small trials and at relatively small doses of 100 mg. For example, a few years ago 11 obese men were given 100 m of resveratrol for 4 or 6 weeks and no weight loss was reported, although it may have lowered glucose levels - I forget. Still, I don't recall any extensive resveratrol study like what Elysium did this summer where I think we will know much more when the results are made available. 

 

 


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#1624 trakker

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Posted 10 December 2016 - 08:35 AM

I've been curious about Elysium's trial compared to Chromadex's trial. Elysium limited the age of participants from 60 to 80 years old while Chromadex's 12 participants were not, right? 

 

250 mg of NR with 50 mg of pterostilbine increased NAD+ in blood by 40%. Chromadex showed 100 mg of NR alone increased NAD+ by 30%.  If both studies used the same ages then it would be reasonable for someone to take just 125 mg of NR (what I take) and no pterostilbine for $0.75 a day to get nearly the same boost as taking Elysium's Basis 250 mg of NR with 50 mg of pterostilbine for $1.70 a day. Yet, the age group isn't the same so...

 

I've wondered ever since Guarente told reporters what he was taking, Basis, along with 250 mg of resveratrol and 2500 IU of vitamin D, if he was taking a double dose of Basis or the dose that his company recommends. To get the 90% increase in NAD+ at $3.30 a day is well beyond what most will pay among those who are willing to try NR in the first place unless the results come back are a health home run, which I doubt - but maybe. 

 

My thought is the single dose of Basis probably raised NAD+ more than 40% initially, but by the 4 week point it had dropped down to 40%.

 

Note that the double dose of 500mg NR in Elysium trial raised NAD+ 90% at 4 weeks, but that wasn't maintained throughout - they state it remained "significantly higher" than 40%.  They would have stated the number if it was good.

 

So the bodies tendency to homeostasis is limiting the long term increase in NAD+ somewhat, but "significantly higher" than 40% is not bad imo.

 

The Chromadex/Brenner trial didn't measure the long term NAD+ increase.

 

Edited by trakker, 10 December 2016 - 08:37 AM.

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#1625 bluemoon

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Posted 10 December 2016 - 10:32 AM

Thanks for reminding me that the Chromodex trial only measured for a day, something I remembered while reading the Elysium report but then forgot when posting above.

 

That "significantly higher than 40%" also got my attention since a percentage wasn't given.  

 

If the detailed results on blood pressure, serum glucose and lipid profile, etc. were very good, you'd think they would release that information now.  



#1626 Bryan_S

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Posted 10 December 2016 - 03:17 PM

 

 

Dietary proanthocyanidins boost hepatic NAD+ metabolism and SIRT1 expression and activity in a dose-dependent manner in healthy rats

http://www.nature.co...es/srep24977#f3

 

rReceived 21 October 2015

Accepted: 08 April 2016
Published online: 22 April 2016
 
 

 

It looks like there is now a discussion thread for a grape seed extract product whose extract was used in this study. I'm not sure if it will be an 'open' discussion on the merits and efficacy or a 'sales' thread but I know that I'm definitely interested in another pathway. :-D

 

 

Thanks Thell for digging that out of the archives.

 

I think there are more avenues to reenforce our NAD pathways and we've talked about Grape Seed Extract for awhile now. The discussion you reference is a sales thread but there is plenty of information to support this notion. I firmly believe polyphenols in general offer us a route to epigenetic and disease targets as can be seen in this search. Plants offer us a chance to investigate a host of epigenetic activating and silencing compounds


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#1627 Iporuru

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Posted 10 December 2016 - 05:39 PM

The Circadian NAD+ Metabolism: Impact on Chromatin Remodeling and Aging
Yasukazu Nakahata and Yasumasa Bessho

 

https://www.hindawi....i/2016/3208429/

 

 

Also this mentions nicotinamide riboside:

  [PDF] Natural Products of Fungal Endophytes and their Therapeutic Potential: A Fo-cus on Cardiovascular Disease

Edited by Iporuru, 10 December 2016 - 05:41 PM.

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#1628 Thell

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Posted 11 December 2016 - 03:12 AM

 

Pathway linked to slower aging also fuels brain cancer

http://medicalxpress...ging-fuels.html

 

We don't know what this study will reveal since it doesn't seem to be listed anywhere on pnas.org even though the 'press statement' states it was published Dec. 5 in Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. The primary author's lab publications list indicates it will be named 'NAMPT controls tumor growth and therapy responsiveness in glioblastoma'.

 

This study now shows up in the early edition listing... http://www.pnas.org/...921114.abstract

Unfortunately I don't have access to get behind his paywall. If anyone does and can post a link or summary...



#1629 hawk

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Posted 11 December 2016 - 05:06 AM

Interesting old study resurrected by Sandy Shaw connecting the degree of loss of NAD+ and NADH to irreversible cardio damage after infarct, from http://www.life-enha...d-nad-nad-world (Dec 2016).

"Under the conditions of their study, the researchers found a loss of total NAD+ of about 60-70% when they diagnosed irreversible cell injury by electron microscopy. Total NAD, the sum of NAD+ and NADH, “started to decrease significantly in the ischemic subendocardium 1 hour after onset of ischemia” and “... started ... to become significant after two hours of ischemia.” The researchers summed up their results: “We conclude from our data that the loss of the nicotinamide coenzymes is crucial for the irreversibly ischemic injury.” They note that in rat hearts a loss of 60% of NAD could theoretically mean that either the mitochondria or the cytoplasm is totally without NAD, with the result being a severe decrease in the ability to produce ATP."

"Reference
Klein et al. Loss of canine myocardial nicotinamide adenine dinucleotides determines the transition from reversible to irreversible ischemic damage of myocardial cells. Basic Res Cardiol. 76:612-21 (1981)."

Edited by hawk, 11 December 2016 - 05:20 AM.

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#1630 Harkijn

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Posted 11 December 2016 - 07:07 AM

 

 

Pathway linked to slower aging also fuels brain cancer

http://medicalxpress...ging-fuels.html

 

We don't know what this study will reveal since it doesn't seem to be listed anywhere on pnas.org even though the 'press statement' states it was published Dec. 5 in Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. The primary author's lab publications list indicates it will be named 'NAMPT controls tumor growth and therapy responsiveness in glioblastoma'.

 

This study now shows up in the early edition listing... http://www.pnas.org/...921114.abstract

Unfortunately I don't have access to get behind his paywall. If anyone does and can post a link or summary...

 

file:///C:/Users/Eigenaar/Downloads/10.1073@pnas.1610921114.pdf



#1631 Iporuru

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 09:52 AM

Replicatively senescent human fibroblasts reveal a distinct intracellular metabolic profile with alterations in NAD+ and nicotinamide metabolism

http://www.nature.co...icles/srep38489


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#1632 Harkijn

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 03:42 PM

Replicatively senescent human fibroblasts reveal a distinct intracellular metabolic profile with alterations in NAD+ and nicotinamide metabolism

http://www.nature.co...icles/srep38489

 

The researchers have found that this type of senescent cells 'clings to life' by hoarding NMN and NR and antioxidants. So, I conclude, when trying to clean out senescent cells by means of fasting and senolytics, we should stop taking NADprecursors and antioxidants a few days in advance. Am I right?



#1633 Phoebus

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 04:49 PM

this thread is 56 pages now, so it's hard finding basic information

 

Two questions

 

Has anybody discussed the absolutely least expensive per milligram Nicotinamide Riboside supplement on the market?

 

What is the minimum amount in milligrams I should take per day to get actual benefits from?

 

even if you just tell me what page on this thread to look at I would be appreciative, thank you

 

 



#1634 Harkijn

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 05:13 PM

this thread is 56 pages now, so it's hard finding basic information

 

Two questions

 

Has anybody discussed the absolutely least expensive per milligram Nicotinamide Riboside supplement on the market?

 

What is the minimum amount in milligrams I should take per day to get actual benefits from?

 

even if you just tell me what page on this thread to look at I would be appreciative, thank you

Hi Phoebus,  Just assuming you live in the US or close to it I would advise you to partake in the group buys here on Longecity.

http://www.longecity...oup-buy/page-24

 

Your second question: there is no certainty about dosage, but it might seem that 200 to 300 mgs/day will considerably raise NAD+.  Whether it's a good a idea to raise your NAD+ permanently is in debate. I take 300mgs daily, but please take the time to read the personal experiences thread for some people suspect NR of causing/exacerbating their tendonitis:

http://www.longecity...erience-thread/


Edited by harkijn, 13 December 2016 - 05:14 PM.

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#1635 Thell

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 05:16 PM

this thread is 56 pages now, so it's hard finding basic information

 

Two questions

 

Has anybody discussed the absolutely least expensive per milligram Nicotinamide Riboside supplement on the market?

 

What is the minimum amount in milligrams I should take per day to get actual benefits from?

 

even if you just tell me what page on this thread to look at I would be appreciative, thank you

 

You won't find pricing details in this thread; though Brian just posted a bunch of posts in the vendor/vetting thread with price/gram for quite a few sources.

 

Min amount for benefits? I'd try the personal experiences thread as the results are so individual (weight, age, health condition) with, what seems to be, thee majorly dependent thing being what your current nad pool condition is.



#1636 bluemoon

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 05:23 PM

The ChromaDex study of 12 people reported that  just 100mg of NR increased NAD+ in blood by 30% (I think for one day) whereas 300mg increased it on average 50%. Vendors seem to sell NR around the same price, except for the group by above which is around 20% to 25% cheaper.



#1637 Bryan_S

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 05:38 PM

Come one come all, refreshments will be served ;)

Fall 2016 Seminar Series

Posted on December 12, 2016 by jmolaski

Nicotinamide riboside: From Discovery to Human Translation

seminar22-200x300.jpg

Dr. Charles Brenner
Carver College of Medicine, University of Iowa

Thursday, December 15, 2016
11:00 – Noon
290 Nutritional Sciences

Refreshments will be served.

Sponsored by the Molecular and Applied Nutrition Training Program (MANTP) with funds from the Dept. of Nutritional Sciences; the Dept. of Biochemistry; the College of Agricultural and Life Sciences; the School of Medicine and Public Health; the Dept of Surgery; and the Cellular and Molecular Biology Program.

Department of Nutritional Sciences
Interdepartmental Graduate Program in Nutritional Sciences
http://www.nutrisci.wisc.edu

 


Edited by Bryan_S, 13 December 2016 - 05:39 PM.

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#1638 Phoebus

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 06:06 PM

 

this thread is 56 pages now, so it's hard finding basic information

 

Two questions

 

Has anybody discussed the absolutely least expensive per milligram Nicotinamide Riboside supplement on the market?

 

What is the minimum amount in milligrams I should take per day to get actual benefits from?

 

even if you just tell me what page on this thread to look at I would be appreciative, thank you

 

You won't find pricing details in this thread; though Brian just posted a bunch of posts in the vendor/vetting thread with price/gram for quite a few sources.

 

Min amount for benefits? I'd try the personal experiences thread as the results are so individual (weight, age, health condition) with, what seems to be, thee majorly dependent thing being what your current nad pool condition is.

 

 

great, thank you very much!

 



#1639 prophets

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 06:11 PM

How they do not webcast these events is beyond me.

 

Dept. of Nutritional Sciences @ Wisconsin-Madison has an online graduate degree in clinical nutrition.  They like to announce these special seminar speakers on their website (like Brenner/NR), but they can't somehow put these speakers online for the public.

 

However, they can offer an entire graduate degree program online somehow.  You would think these speakers would be a draw to get people interested in their university, interested in their online program, instead they speakers are not even available.  This is a public sector operation for you.  No concept of how to run a business.  Anywhere else the managers would be reamed over something like this.


Edited by prophets, 13 December 2016 - 07:25 PM.

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#1640 bluemoon

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 06:24 PM

There are two days before the talk. Maybe Bryan or someone could email him and ask his presentation be put up on youtube.


Edited by bluemoon, 13 December 2016 - 06:35 PM.


#1641 Bryan_S

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 06:58 PM

Nicotinamide riboside: From Discovery to Human Translation

I put in a request for you all and we'll see if they can stream the presentation.   ;)

 

Edit: I spoke with the Chair of the Department of Nutritional Sciences University of Wisconsin-Madison and he said they would put up a link for a few days after the event. No live stream but it appears we can see the event after the fact. I'll post more when I'm given the link.


Edited by Bryan_S, 14 December 2016 - 05:21 PM.
update

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#1642 bluemoon

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 12:30 AM

Actually, I'll be in Madison Thursday and can probably go listen. My guess is that there won't be much new from what is already on youtube, but I'll try to take notes of what I can understand and post any highlights in the afternoon.

 

I just reread the above. I thought it would take a few days to put up the link. Never mind about the notes...


Edited by bluemoon, 14 December 2016 - 12:31 AM.


#1643 bluemoon

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 03:53 PM

 

Nicotinamide riboside: From Discovery to Human Translation

I put in a request for you all and we'll see if they can stream the presentation.   ;)

 

Edit: I spoke with the Chair or the Department of Nutritional Sciences University of Wisconsin-Madison and he said they would put up a link for a few days after the event. No live stream but it appears we can see the event after the fact. I'll post more when I'm given the link.

 

 

Has Dr. Brenner ever addressed the concerns about cancer promotion?

 

I would be great if he were to speak about that study on NAD+ and glioblastoma.

 

 

A friend who has been following NAAD and NR that he started a couple of weeks ago is probably going to hear him as well. One of us can ask Brenner about this during the Q & A if there is one or after his talk.


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#1644 Daniel Cooper

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 03:55 PM

 

 

Nicotinamide riboside: From Discovery to Human Translation

I put in a request for you all and we'll see if they can stream the presentation.   ;)

 

Edit: I spoke with the Chair or the Department of Nutritional Sciences University of Wisconsin-Madison and he said they would put up a link for a few days after the event. No live stream but it appears we can see the event after the fact. I'll post more when I'm given the link.

 

 

Has Dr. Brenner ever addressed the concerns about cancer promotion?

 

I would be great if he were to speak about that study on NAD+ and glioblastoma.

 

 

A friend who has been following NAAD and NR that he started a couple of weeks ago is probably going to hear him as well. One of us can ask Brenner about this during the Q & A if there is one or after his talk.

 

 

 

Excellent.  Let us know what he says.



#1645 bluemoon

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 04:09 PM

Dr. Brenner covered a lot of ground in the interview with Bryan_S so maybe not much new but since my friend (who knows more about NAD+ and NR than I do) is also going, we could ask a couple of questions. Does anyone have one or two more? If more than one,we can try to ask him at the reception.



#1646 Harkijn

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 04:29 PM

Dr. Brenner covered a lot of ground in the interview with Bryan_S so maybe not much new but since my friend (who knows more about NAD+ and NR than I do) is also going, we could ask a couple of questions. Does anyone have one or two more? If more than one,we can try to ask him at the reception.

Yesterday Ipororu (in post # 1657) pointed to a study suggesting that senescent cells use NMN and NR as protection against cell death and  can thereby prolong their pro-aging activities. It would be interesting to hear dr. Brenner's views: is NADboosting always positive or at certain times or for certain cells also deleterious?


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#1647 Daniel Cooper

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 04:34 PM

 

Dr. Brenner covered a lot of ground in the interview with Bryan_S so maybe not much new but since my friend (who knows more about NAD+ and NR than I do) is also going, we could ask a couple of questions. Does anyone have one or two more? If more than one,we can try to ask him at the reception.

Yesterday Ipororu (in post # 1657) pointed to a study suggesting that senescent cells use NMN and NR as protection against cell death and  can thereby prolong their pro-aging activities. It would be interesting to hear dr. Brenner's views: is NADboosting always positive or at certain times or for certain cells also deleterious?

 

 

 

Yes, that's another good topic.  I would suggest that part of this question would be his stance on taking periodic "NR Holidays", and if he favors them how long they should be.  That's a topic about which there as been a lot of back and forth in the absence of any really solid data or argument.


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#1648 VP.

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 10:11 PM

Long-Term Administration of Nicotinamide Mononucleotide Mitigates Age-Associated Physiological Decline in Mice Highlights

 

  • NMN suppresses age-associated body weight gain and enhances energy metabolism
  • NMN improves insulin sensitivity, eye function, and other features with no toxicity
  • NMN prevents age-associated gene expression changes in a tissue-specific manner
  • NMN is an effective anti-aging intervention that could be translated to humans

 

 
Summary

NAD+ availability decreases with age and in certain disease conditions. Nicotinamide mononucleotide (NMN), a key NAD+ intermediate, has been shown to enhance NAD+biosynthesis and ameliorate various pathologies in mouse disease models. In this study, we conducted a 12-month-long NMN administration to regular chow-fed wild-type C57BL/6N mice during their normal aging. Orally administered NMN was quickly utilized to synthesize NAD+ in tissues. Remarkably, NMN effectively mitigates age-associated physiological decline in mice. Without any obvious toxicity or deleterious effects, NMN suppressed age-associated body weight gain, enhanced energy metabolism, promoted physical activity, improved insulin sensitivity and plasma lipid profile, and ameliorated eye function and other pathophysiologies. Consistent with these phenotypes, NMN prevented age-associated gene expression changes in key metabolic organs and enhanced mitochondrial oxidative metabolism and mitonuclear protein imbalance in skeletal muscle. These effects of NMN highlight the preventive and therapeutic potential of NAD+ intermediates as effective anti-aging interventions in humans.

fx1.jpg

 


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#1649 midas

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Posted 15 December 2016 - 01:04 AM

Long-Term Administration of Nicotinamide Mononucleotide Mitigates Age-Associated Physiological Decline in Mice Highlights

 

  • NMN suppresses age-associated body weight gain and enhances energy metabolism
  • NMN improves insulin sensitivity, eye function, and other features with no toxicity
  • NMN prevents age-associated gene expression changes in a tissue-specific manner
  • NMN is an effective anti-aging intervention that could be translated to humans

 

 
Summary

NAD+ availability decreases with age and in certain disease conditions. Nicotinamide mononucleotide (NMN), a key NAD+ intermediate, has been shown to enhance NAD+biosynthesis and ameliorate various pathologies in mouse disease models. In this study, we conducted a 12-month-long NMN administration to regular chow-fed wild-type C57BL/6N mice during their normal aging. Orally administered NMN was quickly utilized to synthesize NAD+ in tissues. Remarkably, NMN effectively mitigates age-associated physiological decline in mice. Without any obvious toxicity or deleterious effects, NMN suppressed age-associated body weight gain, enhanced energy metabolism, promoted physical activity, improved insulin sensitivity and plasma lipid profile, and ameliorated eye function and other pathophysiologies. Consistent with these phenotypes, NMN prevented age-associated gene expression changes in key metabolic organs and enhanced mitochondrial oxidative metabolism and mitonuclear protein imbalance in skeletal muscle. These effects of NMN highlight the preventive and therapeutic potential of NAD+ intermediates as effective anti-aging interventions in humans.

fx1.jpg

 

 

http://www.cell.com/...4131(16)30495-8


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#1650 Richard McGee

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Posted 15 December 2016 - 04:44 PM

 

 

Dr. Brenner covered a lot of ground in the interview with Bryan_S so maybe not much new but since my friend (who knows more about NAD+ and NR than I do) is also going, we could ask a couple of questions. Does anyone have one or two more? If more than one,we can try to ask him at the reception.

Yesterday Ipororu (in post # 1657) pointed to a study suggesting that senescent cells use NMN and NR as protection against cell death and  can thereby prolong their pro-aging activities. It would be interesting to hear dr. Brenner's views: is NADboosting always positive or at certain times or for certain cells also deleterious?

 

 

 

Yes, that's another good topic.  I would suggest that part of this question would be his stance on taking periodic "NR Holidays", and if he favors them how long they should be.  That's a topic about which there as been a lot of back and forth in the absence of any really solid data or argument.

 

More generally, is it advisable to take autophagic compounds and mitochondrial growth stimulators at the same time?


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