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The big thread on upregulating GABA activity "Naturally"

gaba activity gabaa gabab

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#1 onemanatatime

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Posted 06 January 2016 - 02:47 PM


Ok so i'm sure there are probably similar threads like this one, but i decided to make a new one. Being the start of a new year and all, new research is flowing in, people doing basement experimentation on a daily basis and what have ya. 

 

This thread is all about upregulating GABA receptors naturally , either after damage done by Benzodiazepines or due to a genetic low GABA high glutamate neurotransmitter problem. We all know, or at lease some of us, that good old benzos just about helps with anything from a cold, to aches and pain, muscle spasm , General anxiety, restlessness, social anxiety, panic attacks, lack of motivation fear etc. They may work in different ways for some individuals , but on a regular basis that is what some of it covers at least. So in that aspect i think we can probably all say that having optimal GABA receptor function is quite important.

 

Now when im talking about gene / dna testing im talking about the 23andme.com test, wich i preformed to se how my genetic predispositions where at, and i think that this 99$ test i highly underrated for most biohackers. I believe that the root of all diseases - at least almost - could be traced back to some chain of events either initiated by the subjects lack of knowledge about certain elements of their health aspects, and a fucked up GUT microbiome + pore diet + fucked up methylation etc . 

 

I got sent some interesting info from another member this article : http://link.springer...064-014-1291-5 

Anybody got some experiences using this ?

 

Annyways im looking for potential GABA helpers, anxiety decreasing substances, Pro GABAergic compounds that can or have shown promise in healing or upregulating the GABA response or function without causing anny noticable reduction over semi to long periods of use.

 

Couple of substances im looking into myself and would love some input on :

 

Gotu Kola

L-theanine

Kava Kava 

Taurine

Glysine

Potentially some of the racetam´s - Aniracetam . but these seem to interact or piggyback the Glutamate and that may not be such a great thing for people high in Glutamate low gaba response. 

 

 

Various genotypes involved RSID:

rs701492

rs3791878

rs3791851

rs3749034

rs2241165

rs1978340

rs6269

rs165722

rs578776

rs2072743

rs6323

 



#2 YimYam

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 12:08 PM

I definitely want to work on this too.  Good start OP! 


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#3 maxwatt

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 12:27 PM

see also http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC3292407/

 

 

Dihydromyricetin As A Novel Anti-Alcohol Intoxication Medication

Author information  Copyright and License information 

 

Abstract

 

Alcohol use disorders (AUD) constitute the most common form of substance abuse. The development of AUD involves repeated alcohol use leading to tolerance, alcohol withdrawal syndrome (AWS), physical and psychological dependence, with loss of ability to control excessive drinking. Currently there is no effective therapeutic agent for AUD without major side-effects. Dihydromyricetin (DHM, 1 mg/kg, i.p. injection), a flavonoid component of herbal medicines, counteracted acute alcohol (EtOH) intoxication, and also withdrawal signs in rats including tolerance, increased anxiety and seizure susceptibility; DHM greatly reduced EtOH consumption in an intermittent voluntary EtOH intake paradigm in rats. GABAAreceptors (GABAARs) are major targets of acute and chronic EtOH actions on the brain. At the cellular levels, DHM (1 μM) antagonized both acute EtOH-induced potentiation of GABAARs and EtOH exposure/withdrawal-induced GABAAR plasticity, including alterations in responsiveness of extra- and post-synaptic GABAARs to acute EtOH, and most importantly, increases in GABAAR α4 subunit expression in hippocampus and cultured neurons. DHM anti-alcohol effects on both behavior and CNS neurons were antagonized by flumazenil (10 mg/kg in vivo, 10 μM in vitro), the benzodiazepine (BZ) antagonist. DHM competitively inhibited BZ-site [3H]flunitrazepam binding (IC50, 4.36 μM), suggesting DHM interaction with EtOH involves the BZ-sites on GABAARs. In summary, we determined DHM anti-alcoholic effects on animal models, and determined a major molecular target and cellular mechanism of DHM for counteracting alcohol intoxication and dependence. We demonstrated pharmacological properties of DHM consistent with those expected to underlie successful medical treatment of AUD; therefore DHM is a therapeutic candidate.

 


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#4 onemanatatime

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 04:26 PM

I definitely want to work on this too.  Good start OP! 

yes i think it is time to take this area into some serious research and digging. As you can see above MaxWatt might be onto something big so far with Dihydromyricetin.

 

It´s sad but understandable that here is way too much negativity in this field. If you look at benzo forums and sufferers you see that almost everyone starts out by trying something similar to heal themselves somewhat naturally. They get quickly shot down by "experienced" users / abusers that they themselves tried something similar but nothing works except tapering down and dealing with the side effect over a longer period of time. To me that all sounds a bit outdated, and is likely due to a negative cycle of doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results .

 

And it's also highly individually if you ask me. People have pore health, pore diets , genetic pre dispositions like decrease Neurological gene expressions, lacking nutrients etc. all this needs to be taken into account, along with heavy metal toxicity which may just turn out to be the new elephant in the room for maaany people. And that in itself causes a MASSIVE neurotoxicity, anxiety, organ strain even been linked to autism and parkinson's and AD and the list goes on and on. So for some people to say to another over the internet with simply no other evidence than theire own experience and from reading others is poor at best .

 

 

And to be clear this thread is for benzo sufferers and others, but also "normal" people wanting to feel better, cause we all know that having optimal levels of gaba is a good thing.

 

Together we can find and collect new evidence of a potential non harmful way of dealing with this upregulation in the long run.



#5 onemanatatime

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 04:38 PM

 

see also http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC3292407/

 

 

Dihydromyricetin As A Novel Anti-Alcohol Intoxication Medication

Author information  Copyright and License information 

 

Abstract

 

Alcohol use disorders (AUD) constitute the most common form of substance abuse. The development of AUD involves repeated alcohol use leading to tolerance, alcohol withdrawal syndrome (AWS), physical and psychological dependence, with loss of ability to control excessive drinking. Currently there is no effective therapeutic agent for AUD without major side-effects. Dihydromyricetin (DHM, 1 mg/kg, i.p. injection), a flavonoid component of herbal medicines, counteracted acute alcohol (EtOH) intoxication, and also withdrawal signs in rats including tolerance, increased anxiety and seizure susceptibility; DHM greatly reduced EtOH consumption in an intermittent voluntary EtOH intake paradigm in rats. GABAAreceptors (GABAARs) are major targets of acute and chronic EtOH actions on the brain. At the cellular levels, DHM (1 μM) antagonized both acute EtOH-induced potentiation of GABAARs and EtOH exposure/withdrawal-induced GABAAR plasticity, including alterations in responsiveness of extra- and post-synaptic GABAARs to acute EtOH, and most importantly, increases in GABAAR α4 subunit expression in hippocampus and cultured neurons. DHM anti-alcohol effects on both behavior and CNS neurons were antagonized by flumazenil (10 mg/kg in vivo, 10 μM in vitro), the benzodiazepine (BZ) antagonist. DHM competitively inhibited BZ-site [3H]flunitrazepam binding (IC50, 4.36 μM), suggesting DHM interaction with EtOH involves the BZ-sites on GABAARs. In summary, we determined DHM anti-alcoholic effects on animal models, and determined a major molecular target and cellular mechanism of DHM for counteracting alcohol intoxication and dependence. We demonstrated pharmacological properties of DHM consistent with those expected to underlie successful medical treatment of AUD; therefore DHM is a therapeutic candidate.

 

very interesting . i also found a patent for it , being used as Alcohol withdrawal method:

Now how they could claim a patent on a natural compound beats me, but here it is

 

https://patentscope....Id=WO2012027326

 

"GENEVA, March 5 -- Publication No. WO/2012/027326 was published on March 1.

Title of the invention: "METHODS OF TREATING ALCOHOL INTOXICATION, ALCOHOL USE DISORDERS AND ALCOHOL ABUSE WHICH COMPRISE THE ADMINISTRATION OF DIHYDROMYRICETIN." Applicants: THE REGENTS OF THE UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA (US).

Inventors: Jing Liang (US), Richard W. Olsen (US) and Igor Spigelman (US).

 

http://www.google.co...ZKlBoyUdlhhDew 

 

Maybe somebody has access to research gate ? this article should be good then.

 

 

"However, it was recently reported that dihydromyricetin (3,5,7,3,4,5- hexahydroxyflavanone) (Figure 5) is a positive modulator of GABA type A receptors at benzodiazepine binding sites that competitively inhibited [3H]flunitrazepam binding with moderate affinity. Dihydromyricetin is a flavonoid compo- nent of Hovenia dulcis, an herbal medicine listed among the premier antihangover plants in China that ameliorates alcohol-induced liver injuries and relieves hangover. "

 

Now being a positive modulator Dihydromyricetin (DHM) has been compared to Flumazenil in a way that it competes for the same sites of BZ receptor, only Flumazenil is not a positive modulator, does this mean there is no negative effects of DHM but with same possibly better effects than Flumazenil. Also leading to long term positive effects. This seems by far the best option for regaining receptor density and size . 


Edited by onemanatatime, 07 January 2016 - 04:39 PM.

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#6 Blackkzeus

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 07:15 PM

http://area1255.blog...s-gaba.html?m=1

#7 onemanatatime

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Posted 08 January 2016 - 09:23 PM

 

 

Brilliant! thanks for the share.

 

its just becoming more and more clear that there is in fact several ways of reducing harm and restoring the GABA receptor, naturally research in this area is somewhat limited , as this involves clinical trials and most certainly natural products don`t have a high regards in sponsorships and finances when it comes to research. And i believe that most of the articles that show promise is in foreign language , i would suspect that most of the very useful articles regarding natural occurring substances that could be beneficial in this quest and thread is in Chinese.

 

They have a long tradition and experience in treating with Traditional Chinese Medicine herbs etc . But there are answers out there, and a lot of people are sitting on it aswell, so i hope this thread can go on and on and really unveil hidden "secrets" that may work in healing damage or restoring optimal function of the GABA signaling and receptor network



#8 stefan_001

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Posted 08 January 2016 - 11:09 PM

The natural products magnolol and honokiol are positive allosteric modulators of both synaptic and extra-synaptic GABA(A) receptors.

We found that magnolol and honokiol enhanced both phasic and tonic GABAergic neurotransmission in hippocampal dentate granule neurons. In addition, all recombinant receptors examined were sensitive to modulation, regardless of the identity of the α, β, or γ subunit subtype, although the compounds showed particularly high efficacy at δ-containing receptors.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22445602

 

Effect of honokiol on activity of GAD(65) and GAD(67) in the cortex and hippocampus of mice.

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/21561750



#9 onemanatatime

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Posted 09 January 2016 - 03:18 PM

The natural products magnolol and honokiol are positive allosteric modulators of both synaptic and extra-synaptic GABA(A) receptors.

We found that magnolol and honokiol enhanced both phasic and tonic GABAergic neurotransmission in hippocampal dentate granule neurons. In addition, all recombinant receptors examined were sensitive to modulation, regardless of the identity of the α, β, or γ subunit subtype, although the compounds showed particularly high efficacy at δ-containing receptors.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22445602

 

Effect of honokiol on activity of GAD(65) and GAD(67) in the cortex and hippocampus of mice.

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/21561750

 

 

Thanks alot for your input stefan_001 have you had any positive effects using this yourself or maybe you just read the study ? Anyway really great job.


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#10 onemanatatime

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Posted 09 January 2016 - 03:24 PM

One thing i have been pondering the last couple of days is the fact that some people say that when you have low GABA, or in GABA withdrawal , from benzo use or by genetic factors it is ill advised to take any GABAergic drugs in form of Agonist´s.

 

BUT this includes such herbs or adaptogens as Ashwagandha, Rhodiola (possibly) , lemon balm, taurine, skullcap, passion flower, valerian root, st john's worth etc.

 

My thought is that although these may have a similar effect, it wouldn't be half as bad being stuck on a benzo, and probably a lot les bad for your body in total. 

 

I´ve also thought about tapering regimens where you switch to herbs completely after tapering ofc, and then you start to say mixing and cycling on and off while taking a possibly restoring agent alongside like Bacopa M. anybody have any inputs on that ? maybe somebody has tried it 



#11 stefan_001

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Posted 12 January 2016 - 08:27 PM

The natural products magnolol and honokiol are positive allosteric modulators of both synaptic and extra-synaptic GABA(A) receptors.
We found that magnolol and honokiol enhanced both phasic and tonic GABAergic neurotransmission in hippocampal dentate granule neurons. In addition, all recombinant receptors examined were sensitive to modulation, regardless of the identity of the α, β, or γ subunit subtype, although the compounds showed particularly high efficacy at δ-containing receptors.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22445602

Effect of honokiol on activity of GAD(65) and GAD(67) in the cortex and hippocampus of mice.
https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/21561750


Thanks alot for your input stefan_001 have you had any positive effects using this yourself or maybe you just read the study ? Anyway really great job.
Hello, yes I am using Honokiol now for some months but for a different reason. It seems to have also great properties wrt sirt3 up regulation, reducing inflammation, anti cancer etc. The reason I researched the GABA part is because I read some concern it acts similarly to benzo's which I would not like for the reasons that you started this thread. But as you can read the mechanism is completely different. I believe it does do something on the GABA modulation as anxiety is somewhat down and when taken before sleeping it helps falling asleep. My parents have started to try it as well and my mom reported her sleep is better. Ofcourse this is just anecdotal. It's a cheap supplement and you can buy it in many places e.g. Swansons so why not try.

Edited by stefan_001, 12 January 2016 - 08:32 PM.


#12 Flex

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Posted 18 January 2016 - 10:53 PM

Look into:

Some plants with compounds, acting on Benzodiazepine-receptors:

http://www.shaman-au...showtopic=33149

 

my few comments & references on this:

http://www.longecity...ensis/?p=758574


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#13 Wingless

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Posted 19 January 2016 - 02:51 AM

I am very curious to find out about the effect L-Theanine has on GABA regulation over a long period.

 

I've heard many times that Theanine causes an upregulation of GABA, but I've never find any sources which indicate that.


Edited by Wingless, 19 January 2016 - 02:52 AM.

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#14 onemanatatime

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Posted 21 January 2016 - 03:39 PM

 

 

The natural products magnolol and honokiol are positive allosteric modulators of both synaptic and extra-synaptic GABA(A) receptors.
We found that magnolol and honokiol enhanced both phasic and tonic GABAergic neurotransmission in hippocampal dentate granule neurons. In addition, all recombinant receptors examined were sensitive to modulation, regardless of the identity of the α, β, or γ subunit subtype, although the compounds showed particularly high efficacy at δ-containing receptors.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22445602

Effect of honokiol on activity of GAD(65) and GAD(67) in the cortex and hippocampus of mice.
https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/21561750


Thanks alot for your input stefan_001 have you had any positive effects using this yourself or maybe you just read the study ? Anyway really great job.
Hello, yes I am using Honokiol now for some months but for a different reason. It seems to have also great properties wrt sirt3 up regulation, reducing inflammation, anti cancer etc. The reason I researched the GABA part is because I read some concern it acts similarly to benzo's which I would not like for the reasons that you started this thread. But as you can read the mechanism is completely different. I believe it does do something on the GABA modulation as anxiety is somewhat down and when taken before sleeping it helps falling asleep. My parents have started to try it as well and my mom reported her sleep is better. Ofcourse this is just anecdotal. It's a cheap supplement and you can buy it in many places e.g. Swansons so why not try.

 

Hello and thanks for the contribution!

 

Its great that so many people come with different inputs and views, i will definitely check this out, thanks again for your input hope to see you here again.

 

 

 


Edited by onemanatatime, 21 January 2016 - 03:39 PM.


#15 onemanatatime

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Posted 21 January 2016 - 03:43 PM

I am very curious to find out about the effect L-Theanine has on GABA regulation over a long period.

 

I've heard many times that Theanine causes an upregulation of GABA, but I've never find any sources which indicate that.

i think it has a positive in-direct effect. if you can find ScienceGuy he has a post where he explains the mechanism and actions, but generally L-Theanine works for some and not so good for others, i think it is important to choose the SunTheanine version, as some have or is extracted from decaf green tea, and has a amount of this in the capsule as well. For me personally, i think that could be a somewhat big factor. I also believe that the long term use, especially in combination with Bacopa, could have potential "healing" effects on GABA receptor effects.



#16 onemanatatime

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Posted 21 January 2016 - 03:49 PM

Look into:

Some plants with compounds, acting on Benzodiazepine-receptors:

http://www.shaman-au...showtopic=33149

 

my few comments & references on this:

http://www.longecity...ensis/?p=758574

 

 

Thanks alot for the input, that's quite a comprehensive list. i`m glad to see so many involved in this, together we can indeed help ourselves and others find information and means to live a better life.

 

I want to point out that Meditation and Exercise does indeed have theire place in a mission to better function as a human. But for some it is very hard due to conditions that make it hard in the first place - that is exercising. But everyone can probably do something,

 

Thanks again, great input , to everyone else in here looking - got some links or info laying around , please join us in the discussion and post it!

 

Have a great day



#17 nicklesprout

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Posted 22 January 2016 - 06:50 PM

the list on the shaman site - is it mainly things that are GABA or BzD agonists? which ones actually upregulate the receptor? i don't want BZD agonist or GABA agonist for sure because that would be counterproductive to my PAWS...


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#18 normalizing

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Posted 23 January 2016 - 02:44 AM

PAWS....


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#19 Flex

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Posted 23 January 2016 - 11:45 PM

the list on the shaman site - is it mainly things that are GABA or BzD agonists? which ones actually upregulate the receptor? i don't want BZD agonist or GABA agonist for sure because that would be counterproductive to my PAWS...

 

I would re-check that thing with down-regulation.

 

From what I believe to remeber there is a normal type, which causes a reversible downregulation by just activating a receptor.

The other type would be a persistent down-regulation.

 

Other way arround: if Benzos do down-regulate persistently one or several gaba receptors, would any natural or OTC´s do the same ?

If so, You would find some reports of chronic withdrawal symptoms caused by them e.g. kava-kava, Magnolia.

 

I´ve looked into the down-regulation thing allready but it takes time to find the corresponding papers to know whether if simple downregulation happens by activation or not. 

 

Edit: I was just reffering about the principes. I don´t know whether it´s better to avoid them in Your case.

Would ask an Doc


Edited by Flex, 23 January 2016 - 11:47 PM.


#20 onemanatatime

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Posted 23 January 2016 - 11:52 PM

the list on the shaman site - is it mainly things that are GABA or BzD agonists? which ones actually upregulate the receptor? i don't want BZD agonist or GABA agonist for sure because that would be counterproductive to my PAWS...

have you tried the standards like L-Theanine and Bacopa ? both these are GRAS especially in Benzo withdrawl and PAWS in the long run. They may actually assist a great deal and speed up recovery.

 

Also im looking into trying DHM - Dihydromyricetin, that is what actually looks most promising in assisting with quitting Benzos as it actually can heal, or at least have the potential to heal the receptor place in and by itself. http://link.springer...-1291-5#page-1 



#21 nicklesprout

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Posted 24 January 2016 - 02:14 AM

DHM looks real interesting. Question: i read here: http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC3292407/ that it is a positive modulator of the BZD site on the GABA-A receptor.  aren't positive modulators to be avoided for benzo recovery? that is what i've read. thoughts? i just ordered the wild jujube extract, hopefully that helps...



#22 onemanatatime

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Posted 24 January 2016 - 11:40 PM

DHM looks real interesting. Question: i read here: http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC3292407/ that it is a positive modulator of the BZD site on the GABA-A receptor.  aren't positive modulators to be avoided for benzo recovery? that is what i've read. thoughts? i just ordered the wild jujube extract, hopefully that helps...

 

Yes they are , but the mechanism of this particular action could be argued has a positive effect and similar to those of Flumazenil just without some of the side effects associated with it. in the case that it is actually patented as a Withdrawal therapy method for alcohol as well , even though it is a natural substance, i think it can show hope and potentially be a major trick when it comes to upregulation of GABA activity, especially after BZD abuse and PAWS. As you can see by others, some that have used Flumazenil report some interesting reviews of it, but of course it has pore bio A. and it probably isn't very smart to use, but this seems like the best natural alternative i have seen to date. I'm certainly no expert, but i will give it shot and see if it works out. Can't really see any reason not to try it, can't really cause any down regulation and it has other positive effects regarding anti cancer etc. it has been used in chinese medicine for 100´s of years, and is heavily researched but most of the articles are in chinese.



#23 nicklesprout

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Posted 25 January 2016 - 01:07 AM

awesome, please report your experience if you do try it!



#24 YimYam

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Posted 28 January 2016 - 09:58 PM

BUMP



#25 nicklesprout

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Posted 29 January 2016 - 02:40 PM

i started taking wild jujube extract, ziziphus spinosa.  swanson vitamins.  seems to help a little with anxiety when i take 12 capsules.  each capsule is 250mg.  :)



#26 nicklesprout

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Posted 29 January 2016 - 04:38 PM

what do you guys think about the Swiss Protocol/Bravo Yogurt or GcMAF in general for upregulating GABA/healing the brain?

 

http://www.autismone...ctrum-disorders

 

it seems to be helpful for more than just autism/cancer.

 

 



#27 Introspecta

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Posted 31 January 2016 - 10:08 PM

At one point during my deepest Phenibut use I was able to arrest all withdrawal with Natural Supplements. A combo of Valerian, ashwaghanda, passionflower, theanine and others I don't remember. I remember mega dosing them and at one point felt as if I took a benzo.

 

So people may think these herbs are subtle but when taken in significant doses they def have noticeable effects. There are only a few that are known to upregulate gaba though. The others either bind to gaba a or act in a way the could downregulate gaba.

 

Theanine and Bacapo are the only known ones for upregulation. Then there is Fasoracetam known for upregulating Gaba B but I experiemented with it for Phenibut withdrawal and it didn't help.

 

For Benzo WD sufferers I'd say there best best is Theanine, exercise and yoga and time. It doesn't seem like there is any magic cure for upregulation. I know for me my body and mind works best when I'm keeping a good attitude, getting some exercise and not paying attention to the anxiety and trying to change it because wanting to change things causes resistance which in turn causes more negative effects like anxiety. It sounds crazy but I def think healing will be improved in half the time using psychology teqniques and exericise as opposed to taking supplements. Just my experience.



#28 Wingless

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Posted 31 January 2016 - 10:34 PM

At one point during my deepest Phenibut use I was able to arrest all withdrawal with Natural Supplements. A combo of Valerian, ashwaghanda, passionflower, theanine and others I don't remember. I remember mega dosing them and at one point felt as if I took a benzo.

 

So people may think these herbs are subtle but when taken in significant doses they def have noticeable effects. There are only a few that are known to upregulate gaba though. The others either bind to gaba a or act in a way the could downregulate gaba.

 

Theanine and Bacapo are the only known ones for upregulation. Then there is Fasoracetam known for upregulating Gaba B but I experiemented with it for Phenibut withdrawal and it didn't help.

 

For Benzo WD sufferers I'd say there best best is Theanine, exercise and yoga and time. It doesn't seem like there is any magic cure for upregulation. I know for me my body and mind works best when I'm keeping a good attitude, getting some exercise and not paying attention to the anxiety and trying to change it because wanting to change things causes resistance which in turn causes more negative effects like anxiety. It sounds crazy but I def think healing will be improved in half the time using psychology teqniques and exericise as opposed to taking supplements. Just my experience.

 

Where did you hear that Theanine causes upregulation?



#29 Introspecta

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Posted 31 January 2016 - 10:50 PM

I remember coming across a few things in the past about possible gaba B upregulation or improvement in the gaba system. It may have just been theory though. Its been awhile since I've done research I just remember these where the two that seemed to have success in withdrawal without causing more of a withdrawal.

 

I know Theanine effects Dopamine and there has been theory about possible upregulation of dopamine but I don't know if there have been studies. I know it significantly helped my Deprenyl withdrawal and also potentiated the dopaminergic effects of wellbutrin causing a large increase in the brightness of colors and a low level of euphoria. It actually reminded me of my early years of Phenibut. This seems to suggest there could be some possible interaction with gaba b and the dopamine system.

 

Theanine has never been shown to have withdrawal so it seems clear it is not an agonist.

 

Its hard to find concrete evidence with alot of these supplements. The actual tests themselves can be flawed. I'll make sure to no mention something though unless there is proof because I believe alot of internet knowledge is peoples opinions that spread.


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#30 Wingless

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Posted 03 February 2016 - 03:10 AM

I remember coming across a few things in the past about possible gaba B upregulation or improvement in the gaba system. It may have just been theory though. Its been awhile since I've done research I just remember these where the two that seemed to have success in withdrawal without causing more of a withdrawal.

 

I know Theanine effects Dopamine and there has been theory about possible upregulation of dopamine but I don't know if there have been studies. I know it significantly helped my Deprenyl withdrawal and also potentiated the dopaminergic effects of wellbutrin causing a large increase in the brightness of colors and a low level of euphoria. It actually reminded me of my early years of Phenibut. This seems to suggest there could be some possible interaction with gaba b and the dopamine system.

 

Theanine has never been shown to have withdrawal so it seems clear it is not an agonist.

 

Its hard to find concrete evidence with alot of these supplements. The actual tests themselves can be flawed. I'll make sure to no mention something though unless there is proof because I believe alot of internet knowledge is peoples opinions that spread.

 

As far as I know, Theanine just modulates glutamate receptors, which is why it can prevent neurotoxicity from alcohol and possibly other drugs which function as NMDA antagonists.

 

The reason there isn't a lot of evidence on downregulation, upregulation, or the effects it has monoamine transporters (dopamine, serotonin, norepinephrine) is because it doesn't seem to have have any significant effects on them. In fact I don't even think it has a significant effect on GABA, despite how strongly GABA is tied to glutamate...

 

The reason I asked is because I've heard many times that Theanine causes an upregulation of GABA, but I haven't seen one single piece of evidence which states that. I wish it was true, but I don't think it is.


Edited by Wingless, 03 February 2016 - 03:13 AM.

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