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How Often To Take C60OO?

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#1 Sith

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 01:15 AM


Hey everyone. I was wondering how often should C60OO be taken? I currently take a small syringe of C60OO once every 2-3 days but I was increasingly concerned about a double effect. Taking it sparingly may not have a big enough effect on longevity but taking it too often may lead to autophagy so I am slightly confused.  :wacko:



#2 Turnbuckle

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 04:07 AM

Except for the first week, the mice in the original study were treated once every two weeks. This sort of intermittent treatment may be best, as many, including myself, saw the effects wane when taken every day. I now take around 4 mg once a week, though this varies. Sometimes shorter (when I need a boost for a run), and sometimes longer. C60 appears to increase the ATP production of mitochondria, and this produces a two-pronged effect. More energy, and at least initially, an effect that may be due to activation of stem cells (stimulated by an increased in oxidative phosphorylation generated ATP of their mitochondria--OXPHOS). I believe it's this latter stem cell effect that produces the most noticeable anti-aging effects initially, and also the effect that seems to wane.


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#3 Junk Master

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 04:28 AM

I tend to go a bit higher than Turnbuckle, but run a "cycle" more infrequently.  

 

I especially like c60OO to help recover more quickly from respiratory infections, colds, etc.

 

Right now I'm taking about 10 mg a week and will run that for a couple weeks, then take a few months off.



#4 mikey

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 06:34 AM

I take C60oo every morning - 7-15 mg since Aug. 2012.

 

And I look 20 years younger than I did 5 years ago, according to friends...


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#5 mikey

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 06:39 AM

Except for the first week, the mice in the original study were treated once every two weeks. This sort of intermittent treatment may be best, as many, including myself, saw the effects wane when taken every day. I now take around 4 mg once a week, though this varies. Sometimes shorter (when I need a boost for a run), and sometimes longer. C60 appears to increase the ATP production of mitochondria, and this produces a two-pronged effect. More energy, and at least initially, an effect that may be due to activation of stem cells (stimulated by an increased in oxidative phosphorylation generated ATP of their mitochondria--OXPHOS). I believe it's this latter stem cell effect that produces the most noticeable anti-aging effects initially, and also the effect that seems to wane.

 

As Dr. Moussa basically said in the video interview - "the rats would suffer lipid overload" but "humans don't have the same problem."

 

He said that C60oo is "absolutely" not toxic, "even taken long term."

 

I keep hearing brilliant, highly educated people, like Turnbuckle, hypothesizing about complex biochemical reasons to do intermittent dosing... but THE world authority on C60 said it's "absolutely not toxic."

 

Sorry, guys, I don't want to be rude, but that doesn't pass my smell test.


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#6 sthira

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 06:49 AM

^^^ you're not wondering if it might accumulate in your spleen?

And it seems like if you look 20-years younger (according to your friends) then you'd be excited to post pictures? I know I would...
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#7 Turnbuckle

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 11:38 AM

...THE world authority on C60 said it's "absolutely not toxic."

 

 

 

You seem to have imprinted on this statement and now repeat it as a mantra, but you need to examine it more closely. He said C60 was nontoxic, not that C60 compounds are nontoxic. We really don't know what is in C60 EVOO, but likely a witches brew of adducts that will vary according to the oil, its age, and the manner of preparation. In particular, if the oil is rancid or the method includes high temperatures, or is exposed to UV, the C60 EVOO combination could do more harm than good. 

 

 Moussa had studied the toxicology of C60 and his papers make the distinction between pristine C60 and C60 compounds--

 

 
Toxicity studies of fullerenes and derivatives.
 
Abstract
 
...Available data clearly shows that pristine C60 has no acute or sub-acute toxicity in a large variety of living organisms, from bacteria and fungal to human leukocytes, and also in drosophila, mice, rats and guinea pigs. In contrast to chemically--either covalently or noncovalently--modified fullerenes, some C60 derivatives can be highly toxic. Furthermore, under light exposure, C60 is an efficient singlet oxygen sensitizer. Therefore, if pristine C60 is absolutely nontoxic under dark conditions, this is not the case under UV-Visible irradiation and in the presence of O2 where ffullerene solutions can be highly toxic through 1O2 formation. 

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/12167314

 

 

 

In the above paper, Moussa is an author, so there is no question of what he really thinks about it.


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#8 mikey

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 03:45 PM

^^^ you're not wondering if it might accumulate in your spleen?

And it seems like if you look 20-years younger (according to your friends) then you'd be excited to post pictures? I know I would...

 

I prefer some anonomity.

 

But I will post photos of facial parts and hair as soon as I get some time -- say within two weeks.

 

Thank you!


Edited by mikey, 09 March 2016 - 03:51 PM.

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#9 mikey

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 03:50 PM

 

...THE world authority on C60 said it's "absolutely not toxic."

 

 

 

You seem to have imprinted on this statement and now repeat it as a mantra, but you need to examine it more closely. He said C60 was nontoxic, not that C60 compounds are nontoxic. We really don't know what is in C60 EVOO, but likely a witches brew of adducts that will vary according to the oil, its age, and the manner of preparation. In particular, if the oil is rancid or the method includes high temperatures, or is exposed to UV, the C60 EVOO combination could do more harm than good. 

 

 Moussa had studied the toxicology of C60 and his papers make the distinction between pristine C60 and C60 compounds--

 

 
Toxicity studies of fullerenes and derivatives.
 
Abstract
 
...Available data clearly shows that pristine C60 has no acute or sub-acute toxicity in a large variety of living organisms, from bacteria and fungal to human leukocytes, and also in drosophila, mice, rats and guinea pigs. In contrast to chemically--either covalently or noncovalently--modified fullerenes, some C60 derivatives can be highly toxic. Furthermore, under light exposure, C60 is an efficient singlet oxygen sensitizer. Therefore, if pristine C60 is absolutely nontoxic under dark conditions, this is not the case under UV-Visible irradiation and in the presence of O2 where ffullerene solutions can be highly toxic through 1O2 formation. 

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/12167314

 

 

 

In the above paper, Moussa is an author, so there is no question of what he really thinks about it.

 

 

He does show C60 being toxic in some iterations. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18217343

 

However, if one makes C60oo the same way they made it in the rat study --- he says "absolutely" no toxicity.

 

Aren't we talking about C60oo?


Edited by mikey, 09 March 2016 - 03:53 PM.


#10 Turnbuckle

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 04:15 PM

However, if one makes C60oo the same way they made it in the rat study --- he says "absolutely" no toxicity.

 

 

Aren't we talking about C60oo?

 

 

 

Did he actually say that? Absolutely no toxicity for humans taking C60EVOO? At any dose? On any schedule? For oil of any age? Even if it's gone rancid? If not, what were his exact words?

 

As for making it the same way the study did, very few are doing that. They aren't getting fresh Tunisian oil and are using grocery store oil for the most part, even though olive oil is the most adulterated oil there is. They aren't centrifuging. Many aren't magnetically stirring. Some aren't too worried about light exposure, and very few are filtering, even fewer are centrifuging. Some, like SES, are using sonic energy, and results from rat trials here--though they have been incredibly sloppy and thus all but worthless--haven't shown any dramatic improvements in lifespan. In fact, at least one has shown an apparent increase in cancer. Which wouldn't be surprising as the oil--leftover oil from the original trial--was likely several years old and quite rancid by that point.

 

BTW, here is a link to a company selling oils that are likely far fresher than what is sold in grocery stores. There are probably many others. I'm not pushing this one, just pointing out an alternative to grocery stores. While many here falsely believe that EVOO is good for years, this vendor doesn't. They say: Olive oil does not improve with age like great Barolo, fresher is always better. Our olive oils have high amounts of polyphenols and will easily last 6 to 12 months in the bottle if stored properly. However, once opened the oxidation process accelerates. We recommend using an opened bottle of oil within 30 days and never more than 60 days after opening. 


Edited by Turnbuckle, 09 March 2016 - 04:28 PM.

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#11 sthira

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Posted 09 March 2016 - 07:58 PM

^^^ you're not wondering if it might accumulate in your spleen?

And it seems like if you look 20-years younger (according to your friends) then you'd be excited to post pictures? I know I would...


I prefer some anonomity.

But I will post photos of facial parts and hair as soon as I get some time -- say within two weeks.

Thank you!

Fair enough. So you're 40 and look 20? 50 and look 30? 60/40? 70/50? That's an extraordinary claim.
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#12 Junk Master

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Posted 10 March 2016 - 03:47 AM

I can't imagine anyone who takes c60OO for more than two weeks not seeing an improvement in their skin.  

 

I also can't imagine anyone not experiencing an immediate endurance boost (though how significant, and how long lasting is a different story.)

 

As for longevity...who knows?


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#13 Adaptogen

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Posted 10 March 2016 - 07:13 AM

I can't imagine anyone who takes c60OO for more than two weeks not seeing an improvement in their skin.  

 

I also can't imagine anyone not experiencing an immediate endurance boost (though how significant, and how long lasting is a different story.)

 

As for longevity...who knows?

 

i've gone through a few 50ml bottles of c60-oo without noticing any subjective effects at all.


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#14 mikey

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Posted 11 March 2016 - 03:35 PM

 

However, if one makes C60oo the same way they made it in the rat study --- he says "absolutely" no toxicity.

 

 

Aren't we talking about C60oo?

 

 

 

Did he actually say that? Absolutely no toxicity for humans taking C60EVOO? At any dose? On any schedule? For oil of any age? Even if it's gone rancid? If not, what were his exact words?

 

As for making it the same way the study did, very few are doing that. They aren't getting fresh Tunisian oil and are using grocery store oil for the most part, even though olive oil is the most adulterated oil there is. They aren't centrifuging. Many aren't magnetically stirring. Some aren't too worried about light exposure, and very few are filtering, even fewer are centrifuging. Some, like SES, are using sonic energy, and results from rat trials here--though they have been incredibly sloppy and thus all but worthless--haven't shown any dramatic improvements in lifespan. In fact, at least one has shown an apparent increase in cancer. Which wouldn't be surprising as the oil--leftover oil from the original trial--was likely several years old and quite rancid by that point.

 

BTW, here is a link to a company selling oils that are likely far fresher than what is sold in grocery stores. There are probably many others. I'm not pushing this one, just pointing out an alternative to grocery stores. While many here falsely believe that EVOO is good for years, this vendor doesn't. They say: Olive oil does not improve with age like great Barolo, fresher is always better. Our olive oils have high amounts of polyphenols and will easily last 6 to 12 months in the bottle if stored properly. However, once opened the oxidation process accelerates. We recommend using an opened bottle of oil within 30 days and never more than 60 days after opening. 

 

 

It is known that C60 can produce toxicity in different iterations.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/18217343

 

Let's stay on point and not distract from the focus. 

 

Moussa said "absolutely not toxic" and "even taken long term" in his interview about C60oo that was made a specific way in his study.

 

"Absolutely not toxic" was shown when they tried to overload the rats to find toxicity. They found that the rats lived far longer than rats have every lived.

 

Many of us are making it the way he made it, minus the centrifuging. We can buy what appears to be excellent C60oo from http://www.carbon60oliveoil.com/.

 

While the cautions about improperly making it or letting it get rancid or poorly manufactured C60oo are warranted, any notion that properly made and stored C60oo causes mitochondrial toxicity is at odds with the words, experience and studies of Dr. Moussa.

 

I read brilliant theories about how it could potential cause some kind of toxicity, but I respectfully find those notions to be curious if we are talking about properly made C60oo and that is the focus of this forum.


Edited by mikey, 11 March 2016 - 03:37 PM.

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#15 mikey

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Posted 11 March 2016 - 03:41 PM

 

 

^^^ you're not wondering if it might accumulate in your spleen?

And it seems like if you look 20-years younger (according to your friends) then you'd be excited to post pictures? I know I would...


I prefer some anonomity.

But I will post photos of facial parts and hair as soon as I get some time -- say within two weeks.

Thank you!

Fair enough. So you're 40 and look 20? 50 and look 30? 60/40? 70/50? That's an extraordinary claim.

 

 

62 and look early 40's I am told by multiple people. The photos will tell the story. However, this is just an anecdote of one subject.


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#16 Turnbuckle

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Posted 11 March 2016 - 04:03 PM

 


Moussa said "absolutely not toxic" and "even taken long term" in his interview about C60oo that was made a specific way in his study.

 

 

 

 

While I think it unlikely that C60 in fresh EVOO is dangerous for most people, we don't know that based on one trial on a handful of rats. Humans and rats are too different to say that long term treatment of humans is absolutely safe, and six months in rats might be long term for rats, but is hardly long term for humans. If Moussa had any long term data on humans, he certainly didn't share it in that interview.


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#17 IP3

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Posted 12 March 2016 - 04:58 AM

For me it is amazing how you can handle so big doses of c60. Currently I am taking circa 0,1-0,2 ml of olive oil with c60 daily (42,8mg/60ml). 1ml put me asleep for two days, and give me brain fog for next two. But small doses give me more energy and arousal.


Edited by IP3, 12 March 2016 - 04:59 AM.

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#18 mikey

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Posted 16 March 2016 - 08:10 AM

For me it is amazing how you can handle so big doses of c60. Currently I am taking circa 0,1-0,2 ml of olive oil with c60 daily (42,8mg/60ml). 1ml put me asleep for two days, and give me brain fog for next two. But small doses give me more energy and arousal.

 

It's interesting the difference in effects that we experience.

 

I find that optimal doses of most "nutrients" are higher doses.

 

It's the same with vitamins. Optimal effects are found at specific doses.

 

Low potencies of vitamins, such as the RDAs, only keep one from having deficiency syndrome diseases.

 

"Thriving" is usually seen with specific higher potencies.

 

Reading about C60oo I was surprised to find that people were experiencing adverse effects.



#19 IP3

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Posted 16 March 2016 - 10:06 PM

C60 strongly inhibit cognitive enchancing effects of methylphenidate (the "edge"). i feel like my head been stuck in the jar. Perhaps its side effects are far more pronounced in pepole with ADD.



#20 Junk Master

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Posted 20 March 2016 - 05:14 AM

I should have said I can't imagine anyone over the age of 45 not noticing a difference in skin and and endurance boost.

 

Also, I can't imagine anyone familiar with the effects of alcohol or benzos not noticing C60oo lowering the effect of the two.

 

Then again, there are some people on this site who seem to react in wildly different ways to our "research."  1ML of C60oo making someone sleep for two days with brain fog for two v. people who seemingly can take 10-20 times that with little effect.  Go figure.

 

Also, I can say in my case that C60oo has no interaction with NSI-189, Tianeptine, or Modafinil.


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#21 ROBST3R

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Posted 14 April 2016 - 08:40 PM

Hi Mikey,
Which brand do of c60 do you use and did you already posted some pictures of your face somewhere?

Cheers

#22 mikey

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Posted 17 April 2016 - 02:59 AM

Hi Mikey,
Which brand do of c60 do you use and did you already posted some pictures of your face somewhere?

Cheers

 

I have consistently used the C60oo that is produced by https://carbon60oliveoil.com/shop/ since August, 2012.

 

Although I am setting up shop to make it at home soon.

 

I attach photos from 2007, when I had gone through a period of accelerated aging and 2015, after using 7-15 mg of C60oo daily since August, 2012, although C60oo has not been the only anti-aging substance that I have used.

 

I continue to investigate Khavinson's peptides and anything else that has substantial data showing age-reversal effects.

 

So, there's no control for C60oo and the photo from 2007 is of much poorer quality than the photo from 2015.

 

However, neither has been touched up. 

 

I am documenting "medically impossible" things that I have resolved with third parties now, such as MRI's and high res photos.

 

I am reversing rheumatoid arthritis in my (swollen) right hand middle finger joint with photos documenting the difference currently. The pain reduction alone tells the story, but photos will show the swollen area to return to normal shortly. I am half way there.

 

I hope that this contributes to our knowledge base in a practical way.

Attached Files


Edited by mikey, 17 April 2016 - 03:00 AM.

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#23 boylan

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Posted 19 April 2016 - 08:01 PM

Mikey,

 

Did your hair re-pigment or was it the lighting that caused the different color?

 



#24 mikey

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Posted 21 April 2016 - 04:52 PM

Mikey,

 

Did your hair re-pigment or was it the lighting that caused the different color?

 

Numerous people have told me that it is darker - and more dense, more hair count.

 

I will post eye wrinkle photos taken two days ago and in 2011 as soon as I have time.



#25 Nate-2004

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 08:42 PM

Except for the first week, the mice in the original study were treated once every two weeks. This sort of intermittent treatment may be best, as many, including myself, saw the effects wane when taken every day. I now take around 4 mg once a week, though this varies. Sometimes shorter (when I need a boost for a run), and sometimes longer. C60 appears to increase the ATP production of mitochondria, and this produces a two-pronged effect. More energy, and at least initially, an effect that may be due to activation of stem cells (stimulated by an increased in oxidative phosphorylation generated ATP of their mitochondria--OXPHOS). I believe it's this latter stem cell effect that produces the most noticeable anti-aging effects initially, and also the effect that seems to wane.

 

In the original Baati study I think it was 1.7mg/kg right?  This may be a stupid question but if I'm ~70kg doesn't that mean a proper dose for a full size human would be more like ~120 mg?  The Ichor study is going with 8mg/kg which is 500mg for a 70kg guy.  Why 4mg?  Are you taking this orally I assume via dropper? 



#26 Turnbuckle

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 09:44 PM

 

Except for the first week, the mice in the original study were treated once every two weeks. This sort of intermittent treatment may be best, as many, including myself, saw the effects wane when taken every day. I now take around 4 mg once a week, though this varies. Sometimes shorter (when I need a boost for a run), and sometimes longer. C60 appears to increase the ATP production of mitochondria, and this produces a two-pronged effect. More energy, and at least initially, an effect that may be due to activation of stem cells (stimulated by an increased in oxidative phosphorylation generated ATP of their mitochondria--OXPHOS). I believe it's this latter stem cell effect that produces the most noticeable anti-aging effects initially, and also the effect that seems to wane.

 

In the original Baati study I think it was 1.7mg/kg right?  This may be a stupid question but if I'm ~70kg doesn't that mean a proper dose for a full size human would be more like ~120 mg?  The Ichor study is going with 8mg/kg which is 500mg for a 70kg guy.  Why 4mg?  Are you taking this orally I assume via dropper? 

 

 

 

I have tried higher doses but have not found any advantage to it. In fact, I believe that the phenols in the olive oil may be the actual active agent, or at least a large portion of it, with C60 serving to transport one or more phenols more efficiently to the mitochondria. I have prepared C60 solutions with olive oils of varying polyphenol content, and have found that the higher the content and the fresher the oil, the better the effect on exercise. Presumably this means better functioning mitochondria, which ought to translate to longevity as well. 

 

Hydroxytyrosol is a major phenol in olive oil, is known to improve exercise performance and chronological lifespan as well. Oleuropein is another that has known antioxidant, anti-cancer, and longevity enhancing properties. Another dozen phenols are present in addition to these two.


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#27 Nate-2004

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 10:32 PM

I have prepared C60 solutions with olive oils of varying polyphenol content, and have found that the higher the content and the fresher the oil, the better the effect on exercise. 

 

Wait, first, how do you do this? Where do you get the C60? Also what's good a quality OO? That thread you linked has some details on how you did it, but it doesn't look easy. As a computer engineer with no experience in chemistry, but who's an ok cook in the kitchen, can I pull this off?

 

EDITED: Read the thread you linked.


Edited by Nate-2004, 26 April 2016 - 10:34 PM.


#28 Turnbuckle

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 11:48 PM

There are threads on preparation here, and I have some advice on my profile page. See section 5.


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#29 TheFountain

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Posted 03 February 2018 - 06:57 AM

My question is, how does it interact with other supplements? 

 

Any known aversions to taking it alongside Cognitive support supps like St. Johns wort? ALCAR? Or supplements that can get past the blood brain barrier like some forms of SOD and Agmatine sulfate? 



#30 sensei

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Posted 03 February 2018 - 04:36 PM

Answer -- nobody actually knows -- since the regimens people take can be so varied


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