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DRD2 reduced expression and density

dopamine

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#61 Xptriate

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Posted 19 November 2016 - 02:43 AM

Hi mate i signed to longecity just to write you.

Basically i want to say first that i have the same mutation as you do the DRD2 mutation which i assume is the taq1a1?

i have tried amytryptyline and had an awful awful reaction to it which made me sick as fuck and to this day i still have myoclonic issues due to it and cant tolerate many of the meds i could before.

I took metoclopramide as a kid and i had some sort of convulsions. This is how i know this mutation is making a lot of issues. I researched this a lot and took it to a psychiatrist and he had never heard abiut it

The second thing i want to tell you is your premise is wrong! The issue is not in the DRD2 receptor. Its in Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase!! basically this mutation was misidentified as being part of the dopamine 2 receptor gene but in fact it was part of the aromatic Amino acid decarboxylase gene, because the regions are so close they made this mistake.

I have not found out how to solve the issue. I think its a very hard to solve issue. Basically we would need the opposite of what everyone is after! To reduce the neurotransmitter excess in the presynatic neuron!

I have written all my research here, this is what i took to thr psychiatrist:

Http://pathwaystoinsomnia.blogspot.pt/2016/02/metoclopramide-why-it-gave-me.html?m=1

Edited by Xptriate, 19 November 2016 - 02:45 AM.

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#62 jack black

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Posted 19 November 2016 - 03:58 AM


tea

  • EGCG also inhibited hyperlocomotion and rearing activity induced by apomorphine, a D1/D2-like agonist.

 

 

this almost sounds like EGCG is D1/D2 antagonist?

 

 

 

Hi mate i signed to longecity just to write you.

Basically i want to say first that i have the same mutation as you do the DRD2 mutation which i assume is the taq1a1?

i have tried amytryptyline and had an awful awful reaction to it which made me sick as fuck and to this day i still have myoclonic issues due to it and cant tolerate many of the meds i could before.

I took metoclopramide as a kid and i had some sort of convulsions. This is how i know this mutation is making a lot of issues. I researched this a lot and took it to a psychiatrist and he had never heard abiut it

The second thing i want to tell you is your premise is wrong! The issue is not in the DRD2 receptor. Its in Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase!! basically this mutation was misidentified as being part of the dopamine 2 receptor gene but in fact it was part of the aromatic Amino acid decarboxylase gene, because the regions are so close they made this mistake.

I have not found out how to solve the issue. I think its a very hard to solve issue. Basically we would need the opposite of what everyone is after! To reduce the neurotransmitter excess in the presynatic neuron!

I have written all my research here, this is what i took to thr psychiatrist:

Http://pathwaystoinsomnia.blogspot.pt/2016/02/metoclopramide-why-it-gave-me.html?m=1

 

You got me confused here. Are you saying that DRD2 mutation Taq1a (aka rs1800497) is the same thing as Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase mutation? How could that be if DRD2 gene is on the chromosome 11 and Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase gene is on the chromosome 7?

 

Re: Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase (aka DOPA decarboxylase) from https://en.wikipedia...se#cite_note-10

 

 

In normal dopamine and serotonin (5-HT) neurotransmitter synthesis, AAAD is not the rate-limiting step in either reaction. However, AAAD becomes the rate-limiting step of dopamine synthesis in patients treated with L-DOPA (such as in Parkinson's Disease), and the rate-limiting step of serotonin synthesis in people treated with 5-HTP (such as in mild depression or dysthymia). AAAD is inhibited by Carbidopa outside of the blood brain barrier to inhibit the premature conversion of L-DOPA to Dopamine in the treatment of Parkinson's.

In humans, AAAD is also the rate-limiting enzyme in the formation of trace amines. Deficiency of AAAD is associated with various symptoms as severe developmental delay, oculogyric crises and autonomic dysfunction. The molecular and clinical spectrum of AAAC deficiency is heterogeneous. The first case of AADC deficiency was described in twin brothers 1990. Patients can be treated with dopamine agonists, MAO inhibitors, and pyridoxine (vitamin B6).[7] Clinical phenotype and response to treatment is variable and the long-term and functional outcome is unknown. To provide a basis for improving the understanding of the epidemiology, genotype/phenotype correlation and outcome of these diseases their impact on the quality of life of patients, and for evaluating diagnostic and therapeutic strategies a patient registry was established by the noncommercial International Working Group on Neurotransmitter Related Disorders (iNTD).[8]

 

Have you tried higher doses of B6 or active forms like P5P?

 

Edit: i read the linked blog and the reference to Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase here:  https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/15900211

 

you have the facts wrong, low DRD2 density leads to compensatory increase in Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase to keep the balance.
 


Edited by jack black, 19 November 2016 - 04:08 AM.

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#63 gamesguru

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Posted 19 November 2016 - 10:36 AM

Yes, there's evidence on a dopamine blockade for EGCG.  The authors of that study claim it lessens the stimulant and hyperactive effects of caffeine, and helps explain why coffee is trippier, with more divergent thinking than tea (it is worth noting that theanine reduces glutamate and increases dopamine, but there is some evidence it treats both positive and negative symptoms).

 

So EGCG is relevant to psychiatric patients, because not only does it offer antipsychotic effects, but it is paired with theanine, and it also has a cleaner profile of transcript changes as compared with haloperidol or risperidone.



#64 Xptriate

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Posted 19 November 2016 - 10:39 AM

Jack black i dont think i got the facts wrong. Where did you read they implied on the direction of the association?

in the abstract they just imply that there is a relationship. If you think about it it makes sense that the flow is:
- higher akkn expression leads to the d2 receptor changes.

Akkn is actually what synthesizes more dopamine so it makes sense that when there is more dopamine there is an adaptation of the receptors, not the other way around.

Then there is this :

"The rs1800497 SNP, or Taq1A, C>T,was considered a silent mutation located 10 kb from DRD2 gene, in the 3’ untranslated region. However recently the identification of a novel gene in the neighboring forward-strand region of DRD2 gene, named ANKK1 gene, showed that the rs1800497 SNP is located in exon 8 of the ANKK1 gene [PMID 15146457]."

This means that exact mutation, is in fact a mutation in the ANKK1 gene not the dopamine receptor d2 so the compensatory mechanism you are refering probably doesnt applt directly in this case.

This is the exact mutation I have and I would like to know if OP has it too?

Edited by Xptriate, 19 November 2016 - 11:10 AM.

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#65 gamesguru

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Posted 19 November 2016 - 01:35 PM

The problem is green tea inhibits COMT and DAT, and otherwise gives every indication of boosting dopamine.  But somehow it was reported to have a dopamine blockade?  So unless apomorphine prefers the presynaptic site (and lowers dopamine), how do you reckon it opposes green tea?

 

Also, the ANKK1/DRD2 is just a case of cause and effect.  Evidence for the connection is everywhere.  You can address either, the D2 happens to be easier to access.   For example, ANKK1 is associated to impulsive, but ginseng (a D2 agonist) lessens hyperactive and impulsive symptoms.



#66 jack black

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Posted 19 November 2016 - 04:27 PM

Akkn is actually what synthesizes more dopamine so it makes sense that when there is more dopamine there is an adaptation of the receptors, not the other way around.

Then there is this :

"The rs1800497 SNP, or Taq1A, C>T,was considered a silent mutation located 10 kb from DRD2 gene, in the 3’ untranslated region. However recently the identification of a novel gene in the neighboring forward-strand region of DRD2 gene, named ANKK1 gene, showed that the rs1800497 SNP is located in exon 8 of the ANKK1 gene [PMID 15146457]."

This means that exact mutation, is in fact a mutation in the ANKK1 gene not the dopamine receptor d2 so the compensatory mechanism you are refering probably doesnt applt directly in this case.


Well that story about the ANKK1 gene actually makes sense but it's not what you initially said:

"The issue is not in the DRD2 receptor. Its in Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase!! basically this mutation was misidentified as being part of the dopamine 2 receptor gene but in fact it was part of the aromatic Amino acid decarboxylase gene, because the regions are so close they made this mistake.he issue is not in the DRD2 receptor. Its in Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase!! basically this mutation was misidentified as being part of the dopamine 2 receptor gene but in fact it was part of the aromatic Amino acid decarboxylase gene, because the regions are so close they made this mistake."

So, basically too much dopamine down regulates receptors and creates too little dopamine signaling?

I don't have that but I do know someone who has a bunch of COMT mutations making her deficient in COMT activity creating access of dopamine I guess, so it would be similar.

I'll look into it closer.

Edited by jack black, 19 November 2016 - 04:33 PM.

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#67 normalizing

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Posted 20 November 2016 - 03:26 AM

i guess im more of a coffee person because coffee boosts dopamine for me and makes me high (likely because it contains harmaline alkaloids) but green tea just makes me hyper and irritable even though it has less caffeine than coffee.... interesting



#68 Xptriate

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Posted 20 November 2016 - 11:12 AM

Akkn is actually what synthesizes more dopamine so it makes sense that when there is more dopamine there is an adaptation of the receptors, not the other way around.

Then there is this :

"The rs1800497 SNP, or Taq1A, C>T,was considered a silent mutation located 10 kb from DRD2 gene, in the 3’ untranslated region. However recently the identification of a novel gene in the neighboring forward-strand region of DRD2 gene, named ANKK1 gene, showed that the rs1800497 SNP is located in exon 8 of the ANKK1 gene [PMID 15146457]."

This means that exact mutation, is in fact a mutation in the ANKK1 gene not the dopamine receptor d2 so the compensatory mechanism you are refering probably doesnt applt directly in this case.

Well that story about the ANKK1 gene actually makes sense but it's not what you initially said:

"The issue is not in the DRD2 receptor. Its in Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase!! basically this mutation was misidentified as being part of the dopamine 2 receptor gene but in fact it was part of the aromatic Amino acid decarboxylase gene, because the regions are so close they made this mistake.he issue is not in the DRD2 receptor. Its in Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase!! basically this mutation was misidentified as being part of the dopamine 2 receptor gene but in fact it was part of the aromatic Amino acid decarboxylase gene, because the regions are so close they made this mistake."

So, basically too much dopamine down regulates receptors and creates too little dopamine signaling?

I don't have that but I do know someone who has a bunch of COMT mutations making her deficient in COMT activity creating access of dopamine I guess, so it would be similar.

I'll look into it closer.
It may not have been you understood when you first read it but its what i initally said.

i even posted a citation from my blog, which i initially linked in my first post, into my second post.

The problem is green tea inhibits COMT and DAT, and otherwise gives every indication of boosting dopamine. But somehow it was reported to have a dopamine blockade? So unless apomorphine prefers the presynaptic site (and lowers dopamine), how do you reckon it opposes green tea?

Also, the ANKK1/DRD2 is just a case of cause and effect. Evidence for the connection is everywhere. You can address either, the D2 happens to be easier to access. For example, ANKK1 is associated to impulsive, but ginseng (a D2 agonist) lessens hyperactive and impulsive symptoms.

The ANKK1 is responsible for a lot of other neurotransmitters not just dopamine.
So are you saying that ANKK1 will reduce its expression if you change the dopamine receptors expression? If so can you provide a study or a citation please because if so this means it could be a solution.

Edited by Xptriate, 20 November 2016 - 11:19 AM.

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#69 gamesguru

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Posted 20 November 2016 - 02:32 PM

I regret I am reading the wikipedia page and finding no mention of anything other than dopamine.  The same wiki page even says this about dopamine itself interacting with other NTs (including GABA and glutamate),

"Dopamine (DA) is a neurotransmitter in the brain, which controls feelings of wellbeing. This sensation results from the interaction of dopamine and other neurotransmitters such as serotonin, the opioids, and other brain chemicals. Dopamine increases the motivation for food cravings and appetite mediation.[12]"

 

Plenty of things will be knocked down with D2: FosB, addiction, suicidality, BDNF, Akt, pi3k, and cAMP to name a few.  But whatever you may say it remains the case that there is little evidence to suggest the involvement of other neurotransmitters.  In particular, for serotonin, there is a pronounced delineation of symptoms (except that carriers of one are likelier to carry both):

"Our findings support the hypotheses that the 5-HTTLPR S allele may predispose to (performance) anxiety, while DRD2 Taq1 ANKK1 allele may predispose to the reward deficiency syndrome."

 

Since a carrier of one is likely to carry both, we see in this article, ANKK1 is also significantly associated to anxiety.  Moreover, everything in the research suggests ANKK1 just causes problems at dopamine sites... so by addressing that symptom (dopamine), you address 90% of the problem.  There are different ways of doing this but red ginseng is a cheap one.

Neurotox Res. 2016 Apr;29(3):345-50. doi: 10.1007/s12640-015-9545-9. Epub 2015 Jul 21.

The Addiction-Related Gene Ankk1 is Oppositely Regulated by D1R- and D2R-Like Dopamine Receptors.

Ponce G1,2, Quiñones-Lombraña A1,3, Martín-Palanco NG1,3, Rubio-Solsona E4, Jiménez-Arriero MÁ1,3, Palomo T1,3, Hoenicka J5,6,7.

Abstract

The ankyrin repeat and kinase domain containing 1 (ANKK1) TaqIA polymorphism has been extensively studied as a marker of the gene for dopamine receptor D2 (DRD2) in addictions and other dopamine-associated traits. In vitro mRNA and protein studies have shown a potential connection between ANKK1 and the dopaminergic system functioning. Here, we have investigated whether Ankk1 expression in the brain is regulated by treatment with dopaminergic agonists. We used quantitative RT-PCR of total brain and Western blots of specific brain areas to study Ankk1 in murine brain after dopaminergic treatments. We found that Ankk1 mRNA was upregulated after activation of D1R-like dopamine receptors with SKF38393 (2.660 ± 1.035-fold; t: 4.066, df: 11, P = 0.002) and apomorphine (2.043 ± 0.595-fold; t: 3.782, df: 8, P = 0.005). The D2R-like agonist quinelorane has no effect upon Ankk1 mRNA (1.004 ± 0.580-fold; t: 0.015, df: 10, P = 0.9885). In contrast, mice treatment with the D2R-like agonists 7-OH-DPAT and aripiprazole caused a significant Ankk1 mRNA downregulation (0.606 ± 0.057-fold; t: 2.786, df: 10, P = 0.02 and 0.588 ± 0.130-fold; t: 2.394, df: 11, P = 0.036, respectively). With respect the Ankk1 proteins profile, no effects were found after SKF38393 (t: 0.54, df: 2, P = 0.643) and Quinelorane (t: 0.286, df: 8, P = 0.782) treatments. In contrast, the D2R-like agonist 7-OH-DPAT (±) caused a significant increment of Ankk1 in the striatum (t: 2.718, df: 7; P = 0.03) when compared to the prefrontal cortex. The activation of D1R-like and D2-R-like leads to opposite transcriptional regulation of Ankk1 by specific pathways.

 

J Ginseng Res. 2014 Oct 15; 38(4): 256–263.

Korean Red Ginseng attenuates anxiety-like behavior during ethanol withdrawal in rats

ZhengLin Zhao,1,2, Young Woo Kim,2, YiYan Wu,1Jie Zhang,1Ju-Hee Lee,2XiaoHua Li,1Il Je Cho,2Sang Mi Park,2Dae Hwa Jung,2Chae Ha Yang,2Sang Chan Kim,2, and RongJie Zhao1,2,∗∗

Abstract

Background

Korean Red Ginseng (KRG) is known to have antianxiety properties. This study was conducted to investigate the anxiolytic effects of KRG extract (KRGE) during ethanol withdrawal (EW) and the involvement of the mesoamygdaloid dopamine (DA) system in it.

Methods

Rats were treated with 3 g/kg/d of ethanol for 28 d, and subjected to 3 d of withdrawal. During EW, KRGE (20 mg/kg/d or 60 mg/kg/d, p.o.) was given to rats once/d for 3 d. Thirty min after the final dose of KRGE, anxiety-like behavior was evaluated in an elevated plus maze (EPM), and plasma corticosterone (CORT) levels were determined by a radioimmunoassay (RIA). In addition, concentrations of DA and 3,4-dihydroxyphenylacetic acid (DOPAC) in the central nucleus of the amygdala (CeA) were also measured by high performance liquid chromatography (HPLC).

Results

The EPM test and RIA revealed KRGE inhibited anxiety-like behavior and the over secretion of plasma CORT during EW. Furthermore, the behavioral effect was blocked by a selective DA D2 receptor (D2R) antagonist (eticlopride) but not by a selective DA D1 receptor (D1R) antagonist (SCH23390). HPLC analyses showed KRGE reversed EW-induced decreases of DA and DOPAC in a dose-dependent way. Additionally, Western blotting and real-time polymerase chain reaction (PCR) assays showed that KRGE prevented the EW-induced reductions in tyrosine hydroxylase (TH) protein expression in the CeA and TH mRNA expression in the ventral tegmental area (VTA).

Conclusion

These results suggest that KRGE has anxiolytic effects during EW by improving the mesoamygdaloid DA system.

 

Int J Neuropsychopharmacol. 2013 Oct; 16(9): 2095–2101.

DRD2/ANKK1 Taq1A polymorphism (rs1800497) has opposing effects on D2/3 receptor binding in healthy controls and patients with major depressive disorder

Jonathan Savitz,1,2,3Colin A. Hodgkinson,4Chantal Martin-Soelch,5Pei-Hong Shen,4Joanna Szczepanik,3Allison C. Nugent,6Peter Herscovitch,7Anthony A. Grace,8David Goldman,4 and Wayne C. Drevets1,3,9


Abstract

The A1 allele of the DRD2/ANKK1 Taq1A polymorphism (rs1800497) is associated with reduced striatal D2/3 receptor binding in healthy individuals (Con) as well as depression and addiction. However, the effect of rs1800497 on D2/3 receptor binding in depressed patients as well as the SNP’s effect on D2/3 binding during reward-associated dopamine release is unknown. Twelve unmedicated patients with major depressive disorder (MDD) and 24 Con completed PET scans with [11C]raclopride, once without receiving monetary rewards (baseline) and once while winning money. In Con, the A1 allele was associated with reduced baseline binding potential (BPND) in the middle caudate and ventral striatum. However, in MDD patients the A1 allele was associated with increased baseline BPND in these regions. There were no significant associations between rs1800497 and change in BPND during reward-associated dopamine release. Conceivably, the A1 allele predisposes to depression and addiction via its effect on the post-synaptic D2 receptor.


Introduction

The majority of dopamine (DA) D2 receptors are densely distributed on post-synaptic, non-dopaminergic neurons in the striatum where D2 signalling modulates a variety of functional domains, including reward processing and appetitive behaviour. Additionally, D2 autoreceptors located in the somas, dendrites and terminals of DA neurons in the ventral tegmentum negatively regulate DA signalling by modulating firing rate (Ford et al., 2010), and DA release and synthesis (Wolf and Roth, 1990), respectively. A widely studied single nucleotide polymorphism (SNP), the so-called DRD2/ANKK1 Taq1A polymorphism (rs1800497, Glu713Lys) is located ~10 kb downstream from the DRD2 gene in the ankyrin repeat and kinase domain containing 1 (ANKK1) gene.

The A1 allele of rs1800497 has consistently been implicated in addiction disorders (Noble, 2000; Smith et al., 2008; Chen et al., 2011) and has also been reported to be a risk factor for depression, possibly via its impact on the quality of early parental interactions. Mills-Koonce et al. (2007) reported that children with the A1 allele showed more negative emotions during interactions with their parents, an effect that was attenuated by maternal sensitivity. Consistent with these data, the A1 allele was associated with ‘social problems’ as measured by the Child Behaviour Checklist questionnaire in children with reading disorders (Marino et al., 2004). In another study the A1 allele was associated with emerging symptoms of anxiety and depression as well as parent× child interactions characterized by negative emotions (Hayden et al., 2010). Similarly, children aged 10–12 yr with the A1 allele were more sensitive to negative feedback during a probabilistic learning task (Althaus et al., 2009). The putative effect of the A1 allele on childhood behaviour and depression may arise from basic physiological differences in the ability to regulate emotions that are present very early in development. Infants aged 3 and 6 months with the A1 allele, who were separated from their parents in an experimental setting, showed reduced ability to regulate vagal tone compared to infants without an A1 allele (Propper et al., 2008). In a longitudinal study of 2347 adult males, the A1 allele was associated with an increased risk of developing depressive symptoms at follow-up (odds ratio 2.55; Roetker et al., 2012). Consistent with these data, veterans with post-traumatic stress disorder who carried the A1 allele had more symptoms of anxiety, depression and social dysfunction than A2/A2 homozygotes (Lawford et al., 2006).

The Taq1A polymorphism or a variant in linkage disequilibrium with Taq1A appears to affect D2 receptor binding, perhaps explaining the reported associations between Taq1A and psychiatric and addiction disorders. Relative to the A2 allele, the A1 allele has been associated with reduced striatal glucose metabolism (Noble et al., 1997) and reduced binding of the D2/3 receptor antagonist, [11C]raclopride, in studies of healthy subjects (Thompson et al., 1997; Pohjalainen et al., 1998; Jonsson et al., 1999). In addition, the DRD2 C957T SNP, which may be in linkage disequilibrium (LD) with rs1800497 (Hirvonen et al., 2009), reportedly affects striatal D2/3 receptor binding in healthy volunteers (Hirvonen et al., 2004).

Although genetic studies have implicated the TaqA1 allele in susceptibility to depression and the TaqA1 allele has been associated with reduced D2 receptor binding in healthy controls, it is unknown how the TaqA1 allele would affect D2 receptor binding in patients with mood disorders. As we reported in our recent review of the positron emission tomography (PET) D2 literature, the data are contradictory and arguably the weight of data is suggestive of increased D2 receptor binding in mood disorders (Savitz and Drevets, 2013). For example, compared with healthy controls, unmedicated patients with major depressive disorder (MDD) and motor retardation displayed increased [11C]raclopride binding potential (BPND) in the caudate and striatum (Meyer et al., 2006) and Kestler et al. (2000) reported a positive correlation between [11C]raclopride binding in the striatum and the ‘depression’ subscale score of the NEO Personality Inventory. Similarly, an increase in striatal D2 receptor binding in depression was reported in single photon emission tomography studies using the radioligand, 123I-iodobenzamide (D’Haenen and Bossuyt, 1994; Shah et al., 1997). Potentially consistent with these data, rats exposed to chronic social stress display elevated D2 receptor binding in the striatum (Lucas et al., 2004); although see (Zhu et al., 2011) who report decreased stress-associated D2 mRNA expression in the striatum. Nevertheless, it is conceivable that the elevations of D2 receptor availability and increased [11C]raclopride binding observed in depressed humans and in rodent depression analogues may arise secondarily to reductions in baseline DA release, consistent with the decreased basal firing activity of DA neurons in rats studied in depression models (Chang and Grace, 2012).

In order to investigate the apparent contradiction between the genetic association studies that implicate the A1 allele in depression, and some of the in vivo human and animal studies that are suggestive of increased D2 receptor binding in MDD or rodent analogues thereof, we measured the effect of the Taq1A SNP on D2 receptor BPND in both healthy volunteers and unmedicated patients with MDD.

Furthermore, in contrast to previous studies that measured the effect of the Taq1A SNP on D2 receptor binding at rest only (i.e. during tonic DA release), we also tested the effect of the Taq1A SNP on D2 receptor BPND during receipt of unpredicted reward (i.e. during phasic DA release). We were able to do this by scanning subjects under two conditions during PET[11C]raclopride imaging. In the first condition the subjects played a slot machine task without receiving monetary rewards (baseline condition) and in the second, subjects received unpredictable monetary rewards while performing the identical slot machine task (reward condition). This approach yielded two measures of striatal DA transmission: (1) D2/3 receptor BPND in the striatum at baseline; (2) the effect of endogenous DA released from DA neurons, measured as the percentage decrease in [11C]raclopride BPND between baseline and reward PET images (ΔBPND).



#70 jack black

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Posted 20 November 2016 - 03:24 PM

Well that story about the ANKK1 gene actually makes sense but it's not what you initially said:

"The issue is not in the DRD2 receptor. Its in Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase!! basically this mutation was misidentified as being part of the dopamine 2 receptor gene but in fact it was part of the aromatic Amino acid decarboxylase gene, because the regions are so close they made this mistake.he issue is not in the DRD2 receptor. Its in Aromatic Amino Acid Decarboxylase!! basically this mutation was misidentified as being part of the dopamine 2 receptor gene but in fact it was part of the aromatic Amino acid decarboxylase gene, because the regions are so close they made this mistake."

It may not have been you understood when you first read it but its what i initally said.
Lol, I'm not going to argue with you because you are the type that always wants to have the last word.

Either way, thanks for the info on ANKK1 gene that was news to me.

Edited by jack black, 20 November 2016 - 03:28 PM.

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#71 Xptriate

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Posted 20 November 2016 - 08:05 PM

Takes one to know one i guess.

Gamesguru thanks for the info i will definitely try the red korean ginseng and ill report back.

I dont think this is my only issue but I think fixing this one will help me a lot

Edited by Xptriate, 20 November 2016 - 08:06 PM.

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#72 jack black

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Posted 24 November 2016 - 06:58 PM

http://www.hindawi.c...pd/2014/684973/

 

Parkinson’s Disease: Low-Dose Haloperidol Increases Dopamine Receptor Sensitivity and Clinical Response

 

 

Very interesting info.Thanks for posting. Too bad i don't have that haloperidol lying around.

 

 

 


Try this thread for more info on increasing D2:
http://www.longecity...on-and-related/

 

 

Excellent (and entertaining) read. Thanks for posting.

 

Here is my take. While i don't have that ANKK1 polymorphism, i do have sluggish MAOA and likely my D receptors are low too. After experimenting and adding modafinil (low doses for 3 days) to tianeptine (to help with ADHD symptoms) i ended up having a headache for a week.  Then i stopped tianeptine and avoided all stimulants (including caffeine and alcohol) and sure enough i recovered to a decent baseline, but got much worse (depressed, irritable,etc) after exhausting day of physical work on my landscape. I'm thinking the reason i don't tolerate strenuous exercise is the sudden dopamine release that down-regulates my D receptors.

 

Before reading the above, i started low dose memantine, and just now I took some inositol. if that doesn't help, i'm back on tianeptine.


Edited by jack black, 24 November 2016 - 07:04 PM.

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#73 normalizing

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Posted 24 November 2016 - 10:53 PM

this site can be a source for haloperidol http://brandmedicine...products_id=770

 

whats a low dose anyway, 1,5 mg seems quite small already so just take 500mcg?



#74 DomoTheHungry

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Posted 13 January 2017 - 02:36 AM

Sort of related but I'll just post it anyway as I am trying to fix my own dopamine problems.  I recently acquired BPC-157 peptide and tried it twice.  The first time I tried it I almost immediately received a relief of about 20 or 30 percent of my anhedonia.  I only used a dose of 50 mcg and i left it alone for over a week. The repairs it had on my dopamine system seems to have been permanent as it had not even slightly dropped for the past week.  I took another dose last night.  Give it a try.  I found out about it through another forum member and I found only a few other anectotal posts that people used it to repair themselves from amphetamine damage on reddit.   Here are some studies: 

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/11978191

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/9547930

 

I have more feelings right now then I have in about a year.



#75 normalizing

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Posted 13 January 2017 - 04:02 AM

Sort of related but I'll just post it anyway as I am trying to fix my own dopamine problems.  I recently acquired BPC-157 peptide and tried it twice.  The first time I tried it I almost immediately received a relief of about 20 or 30 percent of my anhedonia.  I only used a dose of 50 mcg and i left it alone for over a week. The repairs it had on my dopamine system seems to have been permanent as it had not even slightly dropped for the past week.  I took another dose last night.  Give it a try.  I found out about it through another forum member and I found only a few other anectotal posts that people used it to repair themselves from amphetamine damage on reddit.   Here are some studies: 

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/11978191

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/9547930

 

I have more feelings right now then I have in about a year.

 

very interesting. being a peptide, its probably really expensive and hard to find tho, no? thanks for the urls but as long as its hard to buy, its kind of teasing me only :S



#76 DomoTheHungry

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Posted 13 January 2017 - 07:27 AM

It's not expensive at all or hard to find. It's main use has been for torn ligaments and wounds by forums of body builders. Tons of people use it already and it's only $30 for quite a bit. Any peptide website will sell it but I will tell you where I got mine if you send a pm.

#77 dramachiavellian

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Posted 11 February 2017 - 10:28 PM

I have no genetic evidence to support low D2 receptor density but I have all the symptoms of Reward Deficiency Syndrome. When I was in my early 20s I used to believe the entire concept of achievement and delayed gratification was an attempt to brainwash and control the working population (i also have Histrionic Personality Disorder which was undiagnosed at the time, hence the somewhat overzealous fanaticism :laugh:). My chronic boredom is incredibly intense. I don't think society respects just how uncomfortably extreme boredom can be.

 

I'm going to start taking Memantine and Selegiline to prevent the breakdown of dopamine and also decrease acetylcholine levels, which indirectly elevates dopamine activity.

 

I'm also hopefully going to add NSI-189 to this regimen, but I would need to be completely confident that the source I buy it from stocks genuine and pure NSI-189 - otherwise I'll just stick to the Memantine/Selegiline combo. I shall, of course, be letting you know how it goes. None of us deserve the blank abyss of dopamine deficiency!

 

D R A M A C H I A V E L L I A N

X

 

 

 



#78 Autumn Knight

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Posted 12 February 2017 - 06:19 AM

I have no genetic evidence to support low D2 receptor density but I have all the symptoms of Reward Deficiency Syndrome. When I was in my early 20s I used to believe the entire concept of achievement and delayed gratification was an attempt to brainwash and control the working population (i also have Histrionic Personality Disorder which was undiagnosed at the time, hence the somewhat overzealous fanaticism :laugh:). My chronic boredom is incredibly intense. I don't think society respects just how uncomfortably extreme boredom can be.

 

I'm going to start taking Memantine and Selegiline to prevent the breakdown of dopamine and also decrease acetylcholine levels, which indirectly elevates dopamine activity.

 

I'm also hopefully going to add NSI-189 to this regimen, but I would need to be completely confident that the source I buy it from stocks genuine and pure NSI-189 - otherwise I'll just stick to the Memantine/Selegiline combo. I shall, of course, be letting you know how it goes. None of us deserve the blank abyss of dopamine deficiency!

 

D R A M A C H I A V E L L I A N

X

Please do let us know how you fare.

I am also taking Selegiline, beginning next week or thereabout. I am wanting to take it along with the peptide Domo mentioned, but I'm unsure of how they will react with each other.



#79 DomoTheHungry

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Posted 12 February 2017 - 08:39 PM

Doesn't selegine have a amphetamine metabolite? I think you should do them separately. I was coming off of a tiny dose of amphetamine 3 days before, took the bpc and made me a lil anxious but felt better same time. I think I would have reaped more benefits from bpc if I was more clean lol
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#80 Autumn Knight

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Posted 13 February 2017 - 01:40 AM

Doesn't selegine have a amphetamine metabolite? I think you should do them separately. I was coming off of a tiny dose of amphetamine 3 days before, took the bpc and made me a lil anxious but felt better same time. I think I would have reaped more benefits from bpc if I was more clean lol

 

It does, but it is not the same as normal amphetamine (from what I read). It has never caused neurological damage in any dose, so I don't think it is the same.

 

It was less effective because you took amphetamine recently beforehand? I would not know why that would happen. It would seem equally likely it would be more effective in that case.







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