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High Fat + high sugar doesn't cause weight gain?

weight gain

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#1 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 14 November 2016 - 01:25 PM


I am trying to gain weight because I know it will force my bones to develop in certain ways as well as causing an increase in enzymatic conversion of some hormones. Basically I am "bulking" but not that much interested in gaining muscle mass.

However, I am unable to gain serious weight.

 

I am at almost 130kg with a bodyfat around 16% (my fat distribution is odd). I've been eating large quantitites of butter (high fat, around 250g a day) with lots of sugar, cocoa powder and oatmeal (for taste, obv.) every day yet my weight hasn't increased. I've also tried eating large quantities of meat and rice yet again nothing seems to happen. Though I know some claim that to be successful in bulking you have to eat constantly and very high amounts, I don't think I'd be able to do it like that.

 

Why do people claim that it's "extremely bad" to mix a high fat source with a high carb source because it should lead to rapid weight gain when clearly it does not (in most, I assume)? If it did then eating high amounts of chocolate should be fattening but it's not.

Those who gain weight easily gain weight easily on almost anything, and those who don't gain weight easily don't do so on almost anything they eat.


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#2 aconita

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Posted 14 November 2016 - 05:21 PM

I don't think going much above 16% is a smart choice in the first place.

 

In order to bulk at this point is just a matter of quantities.

 

Chocolate is fattening because is full of added sugar, plain cacao isn't fattening but not necessarily everybody likes its  taste.

 

130kg at 16% means you are a really big guy therefore the amount of food you'll need is not likely to resemble that of someone whom is more "normally" sized, ramp up calories and you'll get your goal...but to me it doesn't make any sense.

 

 

 

 



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#3 BobbyDick

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Posted 14 November 2016 - 08:04 PM

Yes, it's causes.



#4 mccoy

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Posted 14 November 2016 - 10:16 PM

Ratherbe, you are not interested in gaining muscle mass, but sometimes that's the only way to gain significant weight, in glucose-tolerant people. Your diet is supposed to be higly insulinogenic, hence anabolic and fattening, yet it doesn't have that effect in your system as you relate. It is the same in my system. Bodyweight in lack of a metabolic syndrome and other extreme events often tends to remain the same. Bottom line is that probably you need to lift weights to trigger an healthy anabolic response. You may even try and stimulate mTOR and IGF-1 with an high protein, high carbs diet together with weight training. Natural proteins, not powders, are best. 


Edited by mccoy, 14 November 2016 - 10:17 PM.


#5 mccoy

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Posted 15 November 2016 - 07:48 AM

More ruminations about your situation. As previously stated, even though it is known that the combination of sugars+fats is a powerful insuline booster, it appears that your body is pretty much insulin tolerant and does not accumualte fat notwithstanding this insuline signaling. You are trying to activate one anabolic switch.

But, recent nutritional research also contends that protein boosts IGF-1, an anabolic hormone, plus contributes to boost insuline, even though less than carbs. Moreover, protein is an activating signal of the mTOR pathway, another powerful anabolic booster.

 

From the above, the solution to achieve anabolism would seem to be straightforward: Eat abundant protein (upregulation of mTOR+IGF-1 and partly of insulin) and abundant carbohydrates (upregulation of insulin). Add some fats to contribute to the energy substratum, but not too many that you satiate too soon. You are now activating 3 anabolic switches, not just one.

 

To top it off, compel the skeletal muscles to MPS (muslce protein synthesis) by weight training. If you followed the above You already have a very favourable environment to MPS since you upregulated some main anabolic pathways and axes in the body. So it will take really little to increase muscle size. By a few exercises (ex leg-press, bench-press) you can increase some large muscle groups and easily gain over 5 kg in mass, plus the ancillary bodyfat.

 

The above is what I'd do, taking advantage of recent sicentific knowledge, if I wished to gain significant weight.

 

Best anabolic protein is natural ricotta cheese, cottage cheese, milk, yogurt, cheese in general: foods rich in Leucine, Cystine, methiopnine, tryptophan.

Best anabolic carbs are fresh and dried fruit, cereals, honey.


Edited by mccoy, 15 November 2016 - 07:49 AM.


#6 platypus

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Posted 15 November 2016 - 08:39 AM

Are you still growing or how you think gaining fat will help you develop bone? One thing to consider is that once you have created a large number of new fat cells they tend to stick around for a *very* long time afterwards even if you lose weight.



#7 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 15 November 2016 - 12:21 PM

I must have heavy bones because unclothed and prior to having eaten/rehydrated I weigh 127kg.

I stopped growing around the start of my puberty. I'm in my 20s. Increased bodyweight will force the bones to widen (especially around the shoulder area), that's a known fact in bodybuilding (repetitive weight lifting causes bone maturation independent of growth hormone increases) and this will happen even if your growth plates have shut. Of course there probably is a limit to how much the bones can keep widening and developing, or so it seems in people with growth hormone disorders. But why I want to achieve a higher bf% it is irrelevant anyway. Unfortunately I can't take weight lifting because of various issues with quasi-migraines. I also think protein loading might be unwise because of potentially heightened liver enzymes.

Don't they say that fat cells don't multiply but only expand?

 

I've literally done every mistake in the book in terms of preventing fat gain and still I am not overweight at all.

I've eaten high amounts of chocolate every day, including fatty meals, added with sugary (but not necessarily caffeinated) beverages. I've been sedentary for years (while other years I've exercised). 

I'm starting to believe that these claims to rapid fat gain if you do X Y and Z are just myths for people who are genetically predisposed to obesity. There is an entire industry built on fat and sugar causing rapid weight gain but it doesn't seem to prove true in many populations.


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#8 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 15 April 2017 - 02:29 PM

I've gained a little weight since my last comment. I am now at 133kg. Maybe I dropped a few kilograms in between.

Gaining weight really is not as easy as people think, overweight people clearly have genetic mutations and it's not just a matter of overeating.


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#9 pamojja

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Posted 15 April 2017 - 03:45 PM

I've gained a little weight since my last comment. I am now at 133kg. Maybe I dropped a few kilograms in between.

Gaining weight really is not as easy as people think, overweight people clearly have genetic mutations and it's not just a matter of overeating.

 

My goodness. I weight about 60kg at 1,73 cm, you would have to double my height to have a similar stature. And I've normal BMI. Excuse me, but I can't other than image you terribly obese, and you still want to gain more?

 

Try to help me understand your situation better. At the moment it's sounds rather bizarre to me.

 

Have you ever had a HbA1c serum tested?
 


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#10 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 15 April 2017 - 03:49 PM

No, I am not diabetic. I am not overweight maybe more than say 1-2% too much fat, which is a non-issue. I have no belly, my stomach is flat when I stand up. Have a little bit of fat on my arms and chest area as well as thighs but it's very minimal. 


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#11 pamojja

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Posted 15 April 2017 - 04:42 PM

I am not overweight ..

 

690px-Body_mass_index_chart.svg.png
 

So your height would have to be far above 2 meters to consider yourself not obese, or even much taller not to consider yourself overweight?


Edited by pamojja, 15 April 2017 - 04:50 PM.

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#12 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 15 April 2017 - 05:47 PM

If I am overweight in the traditional sense of the word then I must have some weird place I hide all my excessive fat. Maybe my skull hides most fat and that explains why it's not showing elsewhere on my body?  ;) 

 

I'm a broad-boned and tall guy (yes, over 2 meters) so.. I guess people at this height and broadness start getting a belly at around anywhere between 150-180kg?

 

If overweight is measured as it usually is by taking fat-prone areas and seeing how far you can stretch fat off the muscle layer under the skin then I am not overweight. I think I just have heavy bones. 


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