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Testosterone

testosterone aging antiaging life short hormon men male

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#1 Snejks

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Posted 10 February 2017 - 03:18 AM


Whether very high(mean so much more than normal) testosterone is short life or not? Some interesting and credible studies? Or maybe someone know? :)

#2 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 09 March 2017 - 09:02 PM

Testosterone does not extend human life, no. But estrogen has anti-aging (but doesn't prevent aging) and various health benefits. Obviously you need a bit of androgens to live at least a decent life. So lower testosterone but not too low.


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#3 Exception

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Posted 22 March 2017 - 03:36 PM

The science behind testosterone replacement therapy is not settled, with some studies showing an increased risk of death. However a 2017 meta-analysis of 39 RCTs and 10 observational studies found no evidence that TRT is dangerous.

 

Low testosterone in men is associated with muscle and bone loss, fat gain, low sex drive, every disease ever, and increased mortality from all causes. The fact that some studies have shown increased heart attack risk is a paradox. An article on LifeExtension magazine argued that this is because the body turns it into estrogen which blocks arteries, so the estrogen needs to be monitored.

 

Sources:

http://www.lifeexten...roversy/Page-01

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#4 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 22 March 2017 - 04:26 PM

The science behind testosterone replacement therapy is not settled, with some studies showing an increased risk of death. However a 2017 meta-analysis of 39 RCTs and 10 observational studies found no evidence that TRT is dangerous.

 

Low testosterone in men is associated with muscle and bone loss, fat gain, low sex drive, every disease ever, and increased mortality from all causes. The fact that some studies have shown increased heart attack risk is a paradox. An article on LifeExtension magazine argued that this is because the body turns it into estrogen which blocks arteries, so the estrogen needs to be monitored.

 

Sources:

http://www.lifeexten...roversy/Page-01

On the contrary estrogen protects against atherosclerosis. What you're thinking of is coagulation (technically that would be blocking arteries) but if your arteries are not narrowed to begin with there shouldn't be an issue, the reason why young women don't get heart attacks? So estrogen maintains normal blood pressure but increases pulse rate and increases risk of strokes.

 


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#5 normalizing

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 12:10 AM

i havent investigated this case of high compared to low testosterone and death and diseases and so on, but from personal experiences, high testosterone put me in a lot more problems that would have killed me compared to low testosterone. so, biologically, not sure how much testosterone can extend your lifespan, but in reality, that is real life associations and socializing, high testosterone almost killed me few times.


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#6 Keizo

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 12:51 AM

increased muscle mass can prevent cancer


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#7 ZuoCi

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 03:42 PM

Purely anecdotal, but I have noticed that larger framed men/more muscular men(both strongly correlate with higher test levels), don't seem to live as long. Most men who seem to clear 90 are on the smaller framed, and leaner side. It may be a coincidence, but I suspect higher testosterone levels do nothing to extent life, and may even cost a few years.

 

From a quality of life perspective, I think it's easily worth it. I'd rather die at 85, still feeling somewhat decent, than die at 91 having been in a nursing home for 15 years. I intend to take TRT when older, though I actually expect it to have a slightly negative effect on my life expectancy.

 

 


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#8 MikeDC

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 07:29 PM

Low testosterone reduce life expectancy due to its effect on heart and body functions. Too high testosterone causes prostate cancer. So moderate level of testosterone is good.
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#9 aconita

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 09:54 PM

It doesn't seem that high testosterone causes prostate cancer, if it was true teenagers should all have prostate cancer, reality is that prostate cancer develops at an age when testosterone is greatly declined and estrogens are very high, likely because more aromatization of the former.

 

Never heard of a male with naturally too low estrogens, the opposite is always the case, sooner or later.

 

A big framed man, heavy bones and tall, is much more likely the outcome of high HGH (IGF1) than high testosterone.

 

There are plenty of tiny framed men with high testosterone as there are plenty of "big guys" with low test..

 

High testosterone leads to low fat percentage and high muscular mass, especially if paired with training.

 

High testosterone in some individuals may tend to develop a taste for kind of dangerous behaviors (extreme sports, high speeds, getting into fights, etc...) but lowering testosterone in order to reduce risks is a dumb strategy, it would be like living in wheelchair in order to reduce chances of falling or castration in order to reduce chances of getting HIV...theoretically true but totally pointless.


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#10 MikeDC

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:14 PM

It doesn't seem that high testosterone causes prostate cancer, if it was true teenagers should all have prostate cancer, reality is that prostate cancer develops at an age when testosterone is greatly declined and estrogens are very high, likely because more aromatization of the former.

Never heard of a male with naturally too low estrogens, the opposite is always the case, sooner or later.

A big framed man, heavy bones and tall, is much more likely the outcome of high HGH (IGF1) than high testosterone.

There are plenty of tiny framed men with high testosterone as there are plenty of "big guys" with low test..

High testosterone leads to low fat percentage and high muscular mass, especially if paired with training.

High testosterone in some individuals may tend to develop a taste for kind of dangerous behaviors (extreme sports, high speeds, getting into fights, etc...) but lowering testosterone in order to reduce risks is a dumb strategy, it would be like living in wheelchair in order to reduce chances of falling or castration in order to reduce chances of getting HIV...theoretically true but totally pointless.


High testosterone is fine when young. Our body changes as we age. We have very high growth hormone when we were young. The same high level growth hormone will kill you at old age.
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#11 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:17 PM

There is an estrogen deficiency phenotype in men, it's caused by a genetic absence of aromatase. Results in various odd effects.


High testosterone is fine when young. Our body changes as we age. We have very high growth hormone when we were young. The same high level growth hormone will kill you at old age.

Not true, various old people inject youthful levels of various hormones including growth hormone as a longevity treatment.

 



#12 aconita

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:17 PM

The same high level growth hormone will kill you at old age

 

Any references?


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#13 aconita

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:30 PM

There is an estrogen deficiency phenotype in men, it's caused by a genetic absence of aromatase. Results in various odd effects.

 

Which is an extremely rare pathology...an overwhelming number of 20 cases (males and females) in the whole medical literature!

 

I am talking about "normal" men.

 

https://ghr.nlm.nih....ency#statistics


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#14 normalizing

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 05:08 AM

there is not a single study in the world in decades since testosterone has been known and understood by scientists to show a connection to low or high life expectancy. in fact, lots of obscure stuff comes out daily that shows more promise extending lifespan. why would you guys think testosterone is the pinnacle of long life at all? what gave you this idea? if anything, out of many herbs and vitamins and crap sold out there, im pretty sure scientists would have figured out if testosterone actually boosts lifespan in the 50s or so. being extensively studied and all that, and one of the most known things in men


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#15 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 10:56 AM

I disagree, low estrogen IS a possibility. But because it converts from testosterone and the relationship is as it is, it rarely gets to the point of menopause symptoms.


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#16 Matt

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 08:41 PM

There's some data in humans showing that low testosterone and castrated Korean eunuchs living much longer. Also, evidence in animals show that castration can lead to longer life. In mice or rats (I forgot), they tried cross sex hormones to see its effect on lifespan. Just tried to find the study now but I don't have much time to scroll through all the pubmed results.  But anyway, males were given estrogen and the females given testosterone...  The results: males who were given estrogen lived the longest of all groups. They lived longer than the control groups (m/f), longer than the females given testosterone. Even weak estrogen agonists (non feminizing) have been found to increase lifespan.

 

In the Okinawa 30 year study, they showed that Okinawan men's testosterone levels were much lower than the average american, but declined at a much more slower rate.

 

Low testosterone won't increase your risk of heart disease by itself in the context where you have a good diet, are lean and not suffering from diseases that may increase the risk, like autoimmune diseases. The association is not simple as yes or no.. but it depends on other factors. For example, when men practice calorie restriction, the risk factors that are measured show practically zero risk of heart disease, despite very low testosterone levels. Unlikely to further reduce the risk by increasing testosterone, which may itself accelerate aging. Or maybe it will increase muscle mass and protect from falls and early death. It's a bit of a balancing game, and will affect survival dependent on ones own genetic susceptibility, adaptability, and environment. 

 

In my opinion, if you're in a safe environment, not doing risky things, eating healthy and are lean, then higher life long testosterone will shorten your lifespan.

 

Low-dose estrogen supplementation improves vascular function in hypogonadal men.

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/11711490

 

Longer lifespan in male mice treated with a weakly estrogenic agonist, an antioxidant, an α-glucosidase inhibitor or a Nrf2-inducer

http://onlinelibrary...acel.12496/full

 


Edited by Matt, 22 April 2017 - 08:49 PM.

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#17 aconita

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 05:33 AM

A weak estrogen binds to receptors preventing stronger estrogen like estradiol to bind, plus signals testosterone to rise in order to keep proper balance.

 

it rarely gets to the point of menopause symptoms

 

I agree, menopause in males is quite rare indeed.:)


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#18 3mp0w3r

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Posted 27 April 2017 - 09:20 PM

There's some data in humans showing that low testosterone and castrated Korean eunuchs living much longer. 

 

Is that from the landmark article published in the Journal of Castration Issue 5, p2-10, 1742.?


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#19 ZuoCi

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Posted 29 April 2017 - 10:47 PM

I'd be interested to see the source study for this article.

 

One of the processes with aging is progressive shortening of telomeres, DNA-protecting structures at the ends of chromosomes. Telomeres are naturally lost during cell division. Over time, after we’ve lost too many telomeres, our cells lose their ability to divide into new cells. Without new cells, body tissue can’t be rebuilt, and we age.

The theory is that humans are extremely efficient machines throughout their reproductive years, but afterward, because their evolutionary purpose has been accomplished, they begin to breakdown or age. Scientists believe this breakdown is triggered by a loss in hormones. The obvious solution would be to replace the missing hormones. We know that hormone replacement helps to correct low libido and vitality to a variety og age-related diseases like Alzheimer’s, osteoperosis, arthriris, diabetes, and cardiovascular disease. There is another characteristic of hormone replacement, testosterone replacement in particular, that makes it truly anti-aging.

Some peopl’e telomeres become shorter at a faster rate because of a hereditary genetic defect. One symptom of this defect is anaemia. The cells in the bone marrow are unable to manufacture enough blood cells because the cells age too quickly. Some doctors prescribed anabolic steroids to combat this type of anaemia. Rsearchers wondered whether the anabolic steroids had asn effect on the length of the telomeres, slowing the aging process of the cells.

Researchers used two dozen patients for an experiment. All o fthem had telomeres that decreased in legth faster than normal as a result of a genetic defect, and were unable to produce enough blood cells. The test subjects were given two doses a day of 400mg of the steroid danazol. In the two years that the subjects were given the anabolic steroid, the length of their telomeres increased. A year after the administration stopped the effect had mostly disappeared.

 


Edited by ZuoCi, 29 April 2017 - 10:48 PM.


#20 MikeDC

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Posted 29 April 2017 - 11:35 PM


I'd be interested to see the source study for this article.

One of the processes with aging is progressive shortening of telomeres, DNA-protecting structures at the ends of chromosomes. Telomeres are naturally lost during cell division. Over time, after we’ve lost too many telomeres, our cells lose their ability to divide into new cells. Without new cells, body tissue can’t be rebuilt, and we age.
The theory is that humans are extremely efficient machines throughout their reproductive years, but afterward, because their evolutionary purpose has been accomplished, they begin to breakdown or age. Scientists believe this breakdown is triggered by a loss in hormones. The obvious solution would be to replace the missing hormones. We know that hormone replacement helps to correct low libido and vitality to a variety og age-related diseases like Alzheimer’s, osteoperosis, arthriris, diabetes, and cardiovascular disease. There is another characteristic of hormone replacement, testosterone replacement in particular, that makes it truly anti-aging.

Some peopl’e telomeres become shorter at a faster rate because of a hereditary genetic defect. One symptom of this defect is anaemia. The cells in the bone marrow are unable to manufacture enough blood cells because the cells age too quickly. Some doctors prescribed anabolic steroids to combat this type of anaemia. Rsearchers wondered whether the anabolic steroids had asn effect on the length of the telomeres, slowing the aging process of the cells.

Researchers used two dozen patients for an experiment. All o fthem had telomeres that decreased in legth faster than normal as a result of a genetic defect, and were unable to produce enough blood cells. The test subjects were given two doses a day of 400mg of the steroid danazol. In the two years that the subjects were given the anabolic steroid, the length of their telomeres increased. A year after the administration stopped the effect had mostly disappeared.


I read a paper long time ago. A doctor cured a child anaemia with DHEA. It was mentioned that the telomere length was increased.

#21 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 29 April 2017 - 11:51 PM

No hormone can increase telomere length past the shortening. This is an absolute fact. Well, unless you maybe megadose them in extreme amounts, like megadosing dhea at 500mg or estrogen (estradiol) at 100mg?

When they say that a thing increased telomere length they don't mean that taking that thing can make your telomere lengths youthful again. They simply mean that the length was increased relative to whatever it is.

 

I guess technically there may be exceptions to this, such as epitalon, although Bill Andrews implied that even epitalon is not enough.


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#22 MikeDC

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Posted 30 April 2017 - 12:04 AM

No hormone can increase telomere length past the shortening. This is an absolute fact. Well, unless you maybe megadose them in extreme amounts, like megadosing dhea at 500mg or estrogen (estradiol) at 100mg?
When they say that a thing increased telomere length they don't mean that taking that thing can make your telomere lengths youthful again. They simply mean that the length was increased relative to whatever it is.

I guess technically there may be exceptions to this, such as epitalon, although Bill Andrews implied that even epitalon is not enough.

Here you go again. Make conclusions without facts.
Telomerase is there to increase telomere length when they get too short.

https://www.ncbi.nlm...6206796/related

#23 PeaceAndProsperity

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Posted 30 April 2017 - 01:43 AM

Increased telomere activity does not mean that telomere length will increase over the constant decrease. It's not only sex hormones but a whole lot of different chemicals in the body (including melatonin) that increases telomerase activity, yet telomere lengths decrease with age.


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#24 Rocket

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Posted 01 May 2017 - 01:21 AM

It doesn't seem that high testosterone causes prostate cancer, if it was true teenagers should all have prostate cancer, reality is that prostate cancer develops at an age when testosterone is greatly declined and estrogens are very high, likely because more aromatization of the former.

Never heard of a male with naturally too low estrogens, the opposite is always the case, sooner or later.

A big framed man, heavy bones and tall, is much more likely the outcome of high HGH (IGF1) than high testosterone.

There are plenty of tiny framed men with high testosterone as there are plenty of "big guys" with low test..

High testosterone leads to low fat percentage and high muscular mass, especially if paired with training.

High testosterone in some individuals may tend to develop a taste for kind of dangerous behaviors (extreme sports, high speeds, getting into fights, etc...) but lowering testosterone in order to reduce risks is a dumb strategy, it would be like living in wheelchair in order to reduce chances of falling or castration in order to reduce chances of getting HIV...theoretically true but totally pointless.

High testosterone is fine when young. Our body changes as we age. We have very high growth hormone when we were young. The same high level growth hormone will kill you at old age.

At no point in youth are your hgh levels supraphysiologic. In other words the level is never dangerous regardless of age.

Furthermore, in youth DHEA levels are higher than in older years and this prevents insulin resistance. If you raise your hgh levels to youthful levels, you should supplement with DHEA.





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