8 replies to this topic

[JR7]

Per this article, quercetin facilitates the body's process of removing senescent cells. How accurate is this and do most people supplement quercetin long term for this reason? https://www.lifespan...-out-the-trash/

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Edited by JR7, 18 February 2017 - 10:55 PM.

[ta5]

More here:

http://www.longecity...ends-healthspan

[JR7]

More here:

http://www.longecity...ends-healthspan

Thank you! 

[Dorian Grey]

I'm a fan of the Q, but I prefer low doses and don't want a lot of bromelain (though some is apparently important for absorption).  

 

Previously, on standard (500mg) dose Q with 250mg bromelain, I'd get a sore tongue after a week or so of daily use, so I would cycle it.  The sore areas would be on the side of my tongue like a sharp area of a tooth had irritated it.  This would occur on both sides of my tongue and I never experienced this before, so I don't believe I have overly spiky teeth.  

 

I finally found Swanson brand Quercetin with Bromelain in lower dose caps 250/Q with 78 of Bromelain (lowest bromelain ratio than any others I've seen)

 

The directions say to take 2 caps, two to three times/day (total up to 1500mg/Q with 468mg/B), which I find a bit extreme.  I'm doing quite well on a single cap/day, and no more sore tongue!  I also drink quite a bit of tea which is rich in Quercetin, so hopefully I'm filling in the gaps in my low dose regime.  

 

From what I understand, quercetin doesn't last long in the body before it is metabolized, so I recon lower doses a couple of times/day are better than a single big dose.  I really don't like mega-dosing anything.  Don't know if I'm getting therapeutic levels this way, but it's the best I can do without the sore tongue side effect.  

[Richard McGee]

My naive question is whether using senolytics concurrently with proposed mitochondrial biogenesis agents (like NR) a good idea. Should they be cycled, or can these processes occur at the same time without mutual interference?

Edited by Richard McGee, 19 February 2017 - 07:22 AM.

[PeaceAndProsperity]

Has anyone ever had any success with this supplement in terms of rejuvenation?

[Dorian Grey]

I expect true "rejuvenation" would likely involve multiple factors.  One of the problems with supplement studies is that they tend to look at singularities and not synergistic therapeutic effects. 

 

Eliminating senescent cells is all well and good, but what becomes of the cells that replace them?  How healthy are the membranes and mitochondria?  How long before these new cells begin incurring damage, and at what pace is this damage occurring?  

 

I doubt anyone will ever find a singular magic bullet Fountain of Youth therapy or supplement (though iron homeostasis may come close!).  

 

I believe once science starts looking at the effect of various "cocktails" of supplements, better results will start to be seen through synergy than forever pondering singularities.  

[PeaceAndProsperity]

I expect true "rejuvenation" would likely involve multiple factors.  One of the problems with supplement studies is that they tend to look at singularities and not synergistic therapeutic effects. 

 

Eliminating senescent cells is all well and good, but what becomes of the cells that replace them?  How healthy are the membranes and mitochondria?  How long before these new cells begin incurring damage, and at what pace is this damage occurring?  

 

I doubt anyone will ever find a singular magic bullet Fountain of Youth therapy or supplement (though iron homeostasis may come close!).  

 

I believe once science starts looking at the effect of various "cocktails" of supplements, better results will start to be seen through synergy than forever pondering singularities.  

I am thinking growth hormone (more cell division) + anything that removes senescent skin cells should at least make the skin look younger temporarily.

Do we even know what cell types this chemical works on? Does it kill all senescent cell types or only a specific type?

 

There's so much talk about telomerase activators and this and that but when you dig into the studies all they indicate is that some very specific cell type shows a change in vitro.

[ta5]

I worry about high-dose Quercetin, and others, being Topoisomerase inhibitors: 

 

Topoisomerase inhibitors are chemical compounds that block the action of topoisomerase[1] (topoisomerase I and II), which are enzymes that control the changes in DNA structure[2] by catalyzing the breaking and rejoining of the phosphodiester backbone of DNA strands during the normal cell cycle.

 

In recent years, topoisomerases have become popular targets for cancer chemotherapy treatments. It is thought that topoisomerase inhibitors block the ligation step of the cell cycle, generating single and double stranded breaks that harm the integrity of the genome. Introduction of these breaks subsequently leads to apoptosis and cell death.

[...]

Numerous plant derived natural phenols (ex. EGCG,[6][7][8][9][10] genistein, quercetin, resveratrol) possess strong topoisomerase inhibitory properties affecting both types of enzymes. They may express function of phytoalexins - compounds produced by plants to combat vermin and pests.

 

Use of topoisomerase inhibitors for antineoplastic treatments may lead to secondary neoplasms because of DNA damaging properties of the compounds. Also plant derived polyphenols shows signs of carcinogenity, especially in fetuses and neonates who do not detoxify the compounds sufficiently.[11][12][13] An association between high intake of tea (containing polyphenols) during pregnancy and elevated risk of childhood malignant central nervous system (CNS) tumours has been found.[14][15]

 

Also:

 

Mutagenesis. 2006 Sep;21(5):321-5. Epub 2006 Sep 1.
Topoisomerase II inhibition and high yield of endoreduplication induced by the flavonoids luteolin and quercetin.
Cantero G1, Campanella C, Mateos S, Cortés F.
Luteolin and quercetin are widely distributed plant flavonoids that possess a variety of chemical and biological activities, including free-radical scavenging and antioxidant activity. Recently, both flavonoids have been reported to inhibit DNA topoisomerases I and II (topo I and topo II), a property that, together with their ability to induce DNA and chromosome damage, has made them candidate anticancer compounds. In the present study, we confirmed that both compounds are topo II inhibitors by conducting a comparative study of their effect on topo II activity from Chinese hamster ovary AA8 cells. Because interference with the function of topo II to resolve DNA entanglement at the end of replication results in chromosome malsegregation at mitosis, we investigated whether luteolin and quercetin are effective in inducing endoreduplication in AA8 cells. Concentrations of luteolin and quercetin that inhibited topo II catalytic activity resulted in extraordinarily high yields of metaphases showing diplochromosomes. Given the established relationship of polyploidy with tumor development via aneuploidy and genetic instability, these results question the usefulness of luteolin and quercetin in cancer therapy.
PMID: 16950806

Edited by ta5, 19 February 2017 - 07:24 PM.