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Why do these supplements have the most noticable effect on me?

lyme glutamate glycine supplements magnesium

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#1 birthdaysuit

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Posted 26 March 2017 - 06:10 AM


Basically, I have Lyme disease and a few other disseminated infections including Bartonella, Babesia and Mycoplasma. I've tried hundreds of supplements, nootropics and herbs for many years. Here are a few that impacted me in both positive and negative ways.

 

Magnesium Glycinate/Malate/Threonate w/ (Zinc)- I've taken this for many years and it has helped tremendously. The problem is acutely it make me feel dull but the cumulative effect of taking it over a long period of time has noticeably increase my cognitive ability. I understand it has NMDA antagonistic properties, so a possible negative feedback loop or some sort of re-sensitization of the NMDA receptors? Keep in mind neurologically I suffered from encephalopathy and short-term memory problems, which negatively impacted my behavior and personality. I also had a messed up SPECT scan and high levels of QUIN in the brain which directly agonizes the NMDA receptors.

 

QUIN is neurotoxic and can cause problems. IDO inhibitors seemed to help acutely by blocking the pathway needed to metabolize L-tryptophan into Kynerenine and then QUIN. Kynerenine might have also been causing some problems because of the counterbalance and the demand for the production of QUIN in the brain from macrophages and microglia so as to inhibit the dissemination of the infection. I also ended up having ANTI-NMDA receptors in my serum, which hadn't passed the blood brain barrier. Might this have to do with the overabundance of QUIN and where my own body creates anti-nuclear antibodies against the over-firing of the NMDA receptors from the secretion of QUIN in order to reach some sort of equilibrium? 

 

I understand high levels of  Kynerenine can causes Asperger like symptoms. I was diagnosed with Asperger syndrome a year after me Lyme diagnosis and as of today my symptoms have lessened to a noticeable degree. Keep in mind I never had any neurological problems prior to my Tick bite. I was psychologically sound my entire life.

 

Nonetheless, Magnesium seemed to inhibit QUIN mechanism of action while re-sensitizing the NMDA receptors that might have suffered damage from the QUIN as well as the excessive amount of calcium in the synapse, which directly over-fired them. I'm sure it has a lot to do with being in a hyperglutaminergic state because MSG, milk or any sort of high glutatmate foods added to the problem and caused significant acute neurological problems. I understand that the glutamate system is not simple. Ionotropic including Kainate, AMPA, Delta, Metabotropic receptors, etc.

 

Memantine - Helped like magnesium but prolonged usage after several months gave me brain fog.

 

 

L-tryptophan also added to the problem and was probrobably metabolized into QUIN and only a small amount Serotonin.

 

5htp, which does not use the L-tryptophan pathway helped significantly to lessen my depression and anxiety. However, it seemed to lose effect and the neurological symptoms pursued. Possibly because I wasn't addressing the root cause, i.e. the infection and the autonomic immune response to said infection.

 

Intravenous Rocephin antibiotic - Helped tremendously but was not a cure. I have ceased the IV and my symptoms have returned. This helped me acutely and led me to normalcy, so much so I nearly cried. I looked into its mechanism of action and weirdly enough it has a potent anti-inflammatory effect.

 

((It increases the expression and activity of the GLT-1 (EAAT2) glutamate transporters in the brain, and thereby enables these glutamate transporters to pull excess glutamate out of the brain. This reduces glutamate toxicity and glutamate overstimulation in the brain. Refs: 1 2 3))

 

Ceftriaxone (Rocephin) an injectable beta-lactam antibiotic that increases GLT-1 glutamate transporter expression and activity by a factor of 3, which is a huge increase.1 2 3 4 5 6 Ceftriaxone half life is around 7 hours. If glutamate levels were rapidly altered by rocephin then on withdrawal perhaps it could cause severe symptoms?

 

ALA -  Helped a lot. Alpha lipoic acid at dose of around 270 mg to 1370 mg increases glutamate uptake by 20%. 1 Alpha lipoic acid bioavailability is around 30%. Half life is around 30 minutes.

 

Exercising - The increase in blood flow to the extracellular matrix increased my immune response, whilst taking antibiotics at the time caused horrendous neurological effects, plus the cytokine cascade. This Increased inflammation and pain as my ROS increased as well. This of course helps kill the pathogens.

 

Ursolic Acid - Helped

Creatine - Helped a lot, possibly because it has some sort of mechanism of action on the Glutamate receptors.

 

Cordyceps and Ginseng - Worsened my anxiety and neurological symptoms as does caffeine. No idea why. Tried them for many weeks and continued to get worse before stopping. I understand Cordyceps has some sort of effect on AMPA.

 

Whey protein - Terribly made me worse, has Immunoglobulins which I need because I'm low. Aspartic acid, glutamic acid and cysteine together in high amounts might be the reason for the worsening symptoms.

 

NAC - Made me worse and I have NO IDEA WHY was it some sort of negative feed back loop? God how I HATE NAC. I've tired three brands and all of them had the SAME effect.

 

NAG n-acetyl glucosamine - Eradicated my anxiety worked very much like Rocephin, however started to cause problems with my heart, could have been the infection.

 

Choline - Made me feel terrible, increased depression and dullness. Eggs do the same thing.

 

Psilocybin - Helped my depression, micro-dosing every week worked great. I stopped recently but it has helped a lot.

 

 


Edited by birthdaysuit, 26 March 2017 - 06:12 AM.


#2 jack black

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Posted 26 March 2017 - 02:31 PM

RE: "I understand high levels of Kynerenine can causes Asperger like symptoms."

 

This is news to me. Any references for that?

On the other hand, I know that high levels of kynurenic acid have been identified in patients suffering from tick-borne encephalitis,[8]schizophrenia and HIV-related illnesses.

https://en.wikipedia.../Kynurenic_acid

 


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#3 RYAN474

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Posted 03 April 2017 - 02:15 AM

Regarding NAC making you feel worse, fwiw it is apparently known to inhibit one of the life stages of Chlamydia Pneumoniae

Stratton Protocol

Dr Stratton recommends that you start by taking 600mg of N-Acetyl Cysteine (NACi) a day; this is a supplement which you can buy over the counter.   Taking NAC may reveal the extent of the Cpn load.   You may get the flu like symptoms described here.  If the reactions are severe you may need to take 5mg of prednisone a day for the first few weeks of therapy.   If there are no reactions increase the dose of NAC to 1200mg a day and continue to take this for the duration of the treatment and beyond. From <http://www.cpnhelp.o...tment_protocols

 



#4 Duchykins

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Posted 03 April 2017 - 04:29 PM

Stop taking 5-HTP.  Full stop, don't play with it until it's been on the market another 20 years and we can gather more information about its long-term effects.

 

Why do you still have Lyme disease after knowing about it for years, and after treatment? 

 

Were you told that you have "chronic lyme disease"?

 

 

 

"I understand high levels of  Kynerenine can causes Asperger like symptoms. I was diagnosed with Asperger syndrome a year after me Lyme diagnosis and as of today my symptoms have lessened to a noticeable degree. Keep in mind I never had any neurological problems prior to my Tick bite. I was psychologically sound my entire life."

 

 

You're not on the spectrum if you didn't have symptoms before the bite.  And Asperger's is not a mental illness (referring to your "psychologically sound" comment).  Strongly advise that you get a different set of doctors.

 

Glutamate and histamine are involved in autism and autistic symptoms.

 

 

 

 

"Whey protein - Terribly made me worse, has Immunoglobulins which I need because I'm low.  Aspartic acid, glutamic acid and cysteine together in high amounts might be the reason for the worsening symptoms"

 

 

Your glutamatergic system is on a hair trigger for some reason.  This is why magnesium and creatine helps (assist with mitochondrial function, which aids in NMDA processes) and why serotonergics seem to help (serotonin is an inhibitory neurotransmitter).  The phenylalanine and tyrosine content of the protein powder are probably contributing to your problems as well.

 

 

"Choline - Made me feel terrible, increased depression and dullness. Eggs do the same thing."

 

 

Cholinergics and related foods do this in people who already have a highly active acetylcholine system for whatever reason (happens to me).  It could be from your body making more ACh than it needs, or not making normal amounts of acetylcholinesterase, or both.

 

 

 

"Cordyceps and Ginseng - Worsened my anxiety and neurological symptoms as does caffeine. No idea why. Tried them for many weeks and continued to get worse before stopping. I understand Cordyceps has some sort of effect on AMPA."

 

 

Don't know about the cordyceps but the ginseng and caffeine fall right in line with a hair-trigger glutamatergic system.  As well as histamine. 

 

 

 

 

"NAC - Made me worse and I have NO IDEA WHY was it some sort of negative feed back loop? God how I HATE NAC. I've tired three brands and all of them had the SAME effect"

 

 

NAC has a way of triggering a strong systemic histamine release (not the same as allergic reaction).  This histamine is one of the reasons why some people love NAC and feel pepped-up on it.   I have no tolerance for it, no matter how low the dose.  NAC is notorious in the medical community for producing histamine-related side effects in certain patients.

 

 

________

 

 

What's the pattern here?   Your excitatory neurotransmitters are out of control for some reason(s).  This involves more than just glutamate. 

 

Glutamate has very interesting and not-fully-understood relationships with dopamine and histamine, both of which are also major excitatory neurotransmitters.  Acetylcholine also has relationships with histamine and glutamate.

 

​Forget all the bullshit about MSG and glutamate in food - MSG doesn't have the effects it's claimed to, your body treats it like ordinary dietary glutamate as you would get with any food containing protein.  Problems with the glutamatergic system cannot be caused or solved with diet.  Eg migraineurs can try to avoid all the protein and MSG they can - it will have no overall positive effect on the severity or frequency of their migraines, and probably leave them worse from low amino acid intake.

 

​Why aren't you taking any B vitamins to assist in the recovery of your neurological symptoms?

 

 

And lastly, due to all of the above plus your inflammatory symptoms, what kind of anti-histamine are you on?  You should be on at least one (they all work differently and on different histamine receptors).


Edited by Duchykins, 03 April 2017 - 04:56 PM.


#5 birthdaysuit

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Posted 03 April 2017 - 05:52 PM

Thanks for the comment!

I stopped taking the the 5htp and I've been diagnosed with a bunch of things. FIBRO, CFS, RA was a possibility but I wasn't diagnosed with that. Interesting the connection with glutamate and autism. To add something, when I took a course of doxy the second time after seeing an LLMD I had horrific neuro symptoms. I couldn't look people in the eyes or talk to my parents. Once I stopped i returned to normal, I'm still taking herbal ANTIOBTICS and was taking rocephin and other ANTIOBTICS up until a month ago.

I should note that I had neuroborreliosis and had excessive QUIN in brain with abnormal SPECT scan. I never treated for lyme, or Bartonella, mycoplasma and Babesia for two years because doctors refused to order the diagnostic testing and when they finally did, I was negative. However because of my memory loss and meningitis like symptoms they put me on 10 days of doxy. When the lyme test came back negative (ELISA), which is less sensitive than other antibody tests and these tests alone were designed only for surveillance purposes, they told me to stop. Many bands of which were taken out to prove lyme vaccines efficacy, although I'm unsure why they haven't used these bands as of today since the vaccine wasn't used by a lot of people.

So, I tested negative and got better for a few months before coming down with a 105.1 degree fever in the winter from then on my symptoms progressed. I continued to see doctors and try different things. I was put on steroids which made me worse. I was told I had FIBRO, CFS but really I had infections mostly from tick bites I've gotten over the years. I later took IGeneX test and IFa as well as another, all positive for lyme, and IND by cdc standards which is hard enough to get considering the falsified diagnostic cutoff they changed in 1994 under Dearborn.

After the test, the IDSA doctor was of no help and one doctor refused to treat even though I ONLY did 10 days of doxy. He said it was adequate enough. I've researched extensively on this topic and I have realized that there are snake oil scammers in the Lyme community but not only that, the cdc uses outdated research based on conflicts of interests and biased, albeit coming to preconceived conclusions that are meant only to comply to guidelines.

I know the disease sometimes persists beyond treatment, microbiologists know this, for if you have CNS lyme and are only treated a week well after the initial bite or bites in my case, treatment can become more costly for insurance companies. Not only that but in a test tube doxy alone kills off some of the viable cells but nothing else. It has zero effect on cystic forms of the bacteria. So why were my doctors sure that I do not have lyme even though I have migrating joint pain and the same symptoms I had prior to the start of treatment.

Even Rocephin can not kill cystic forms or CWD forms which are all seen under a microscope. In animal models after following the current CDC guidelines, the regimine for eradication and treatment is not adequate and the Lyme will persist and the animals will relapse because of persister cells.

The current up to date research knows that a three antibiotic combo is needed to address all forms of the Borrelia burgdorferi bacteria. Cell wall inhibitor, intercellular antibiotic and an anti-persister. This is in the case of a disseminated brain and CNS infection. Long term is another controversy altogether and it makes more sense to pulse as the current research has pointed out.

Persistence and chronic infection occurs, this isn't post treatment Lyme disease syndrome; what a dumb name to begin with anyway. Two weeks of doxy has never shown to eradicate lyme in vivo. Let alone fully kill all viable cells in a test tube, yet the CDC is so sure that this is an adequate enough treatment and anything over and you would have to be a cook.

In my case, 10 days is enough, which is redicilous! Lyme has more genomic sequences with various ways to trick the immune response. It's relatively smart and can persist and hide from the immune system, where not even ANTIOBTICS can reach them. So, to say we know everything about lyme is dishonest. I hope in the coming years there will be a breakthrough!

But currently I'm trying everything I can. I just bought.

Organic B-complex vitamin

I take a little extra b12

Magnesium glycinate and malate

Zinc glycinate

Monolaurin - causes herx

Vitamin k2 with vitamin d3

Turmeric

Milk thistle

And I've recently bought reishi, cordyceps and a few other mushrooms as well as polygala root, rALA, and acetyl l caretine.

#6 birthdaysuit

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Posted 03 April 2017 - 05:56 PM

For cordyceps I meant to say mitake or however you spell that mushroom name. So Reishi and mitake or whatever it's called. I know Reishi is good for NK cells.

#7 birthdaysuit

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Posted 03 April 2017 - 06:02 PM

What kind of anti histamine drugs or herbs are there? No I don't believe I'm on any.
What kind of anti histamine drugs or herbs are there? No I don't believe I'm on any.

#8 monowav

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 04:20 PM

The chronic symptoms of Lyme aren't lyme. You're not still fighting bacteria but more of disruption of mitochondria, endoplasmic reticulum stress, and improper protein folding. An epigenetic switch has been turned on. Look into CIRS.


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#9 birthdaysuit

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Posted 08 September 2017 - 07:50 AM

That makes sense, except blood analysis by my UNI professor illustrates Borrelia spirochetes and cyst forma in my blood. It still could be infection induced autoimmunity.





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