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Michael Rae Says Nothing but CR Can Really Slow Aging

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#1 Nate-2004

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Posted 24 July 2017 - 01:18 PM


And that's a limited thing as well...

 

I guess we should take this as a suggestion to fund SENS with all the money we spend on things like Gym Memberships, supplements and so on.

 

https://emerge.me/bl...-to-stay-young/

 

 

 

Contrary to what is often said in popular books and promoted on TV and the internet, neither antioxidants, nor resveratrol, nor human growth hormone, nor any exercise or conventional dietary regimen even “slow down” the aging process, let alone reverse it; and, actually, I’m afraid your options are limited even in terms of slowing it down.

It’s important to understand that no conventional diet, no fitness regimen, no supplement affects the aging process “itself,” or will have more than a marginal impact on life expectancy or years of end-stage frailty and decay.

The only possible exception to this is calorie restriction (CR) — i.e., eating a diet that is unnaturally low in calories, but carefully engineered to have 100% of the organism’s requirements for vitamins, minerals, protein, and essential fatty acids — which as you may know is the most robust of the very small number of interventions available now that is known to slow down biological aging in mammals. Aside from that uncertain gamble, and to have a really substantial effect in people who are already of middle age and above, we need radical anti-aging biomedicine.

Aging is, by its nature, a product of basic metabolic processes which aren’t appreciably altered by environmental influences, and it’s for this reason that, whereas genes only account for about 25% of your chances of reaching an age of about 75, they are a HUGE factor in your odds of becoming a centenarian once you have already lived that long, rather than dying shortly thereafter: at that point, it’s all about basic aging, with little influence of environmental factors.

That doesn’t mean that taking care of yourself is worthless. Eating well and exercising will greatly reduce your odds of suffering “prematurely” with many “age-associated” disabilities and diseases (such as heart disease, diabetes, and some cancers), and because of that, lifestyle factors are major predictors of your odds of reaching what was once ‘old age’ — 75 years or so, which is now actually below average. However, this has relatively little to do with aging, and a lot to do with killing yourself early with self-abuse.

As to what to do to avoid hastening age-related disease: boring as it sounds, the best advice is the stuff on which the public health people and all the diet gurus from Atkins to Ornish all basically converge: not smoking, lots of fruits and vegetables, lean protein, keeping yourself slim, olive oil as your main fat source along with  fatty fish or a little  flax oil, a glass or 2 of wine with dinner, avoidance of trans- and (over Atkins’ equivocations) saturated fat, “moderate” cardio and resistance training, a positive outlook, and so on.



#2 Oakman

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Posted 24 July 2017 - 03:20 PM

"What is the best habit for staying physically or mentally young that most people do not know?"

 

Those mini op-eds make me laugh...experts you say? "Most people do not know" .... Eating right, exercising, sleeping enough, and living right are good habits to live by.. ???

 

Bo-oh-boy! How much do they get paid anyway?? I could use a good gig as an "expert".


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#3 pamojja

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Posted 24 July 2017 - 03:31 PM

 

I guess we should take this as a suggestion to fund SENS with all the money we spend on things like Gym Memberships, supplements and so on.

 

Guess then I would already be death, by now (http://www.longecity...nal-remissions/)



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#4 Benko

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Posted 24 July 2017 - 03:43 PM

Nothing can ...slow down....or reverse the aging process

 

Has Michael commented on FMD (fasting mimicking dieting)?  Some of the research by Prolon looks promising. 



#5 sthira

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Posted 24 July 2017 - 04:51 PM

What else can be said? Grandmotherly boilerplate from "...the best minds in the world for helpful and practical advice on how to stay physically, mentally and financially healthy..." are clearly not up to the task of figuring out how to repair degenerative aging.

Eventually we'll get non-human intelligence interventions to help implement aging repairs to human bodies. We're already there, in some aspects of medicine. And I'm thinking Calico must be a big player here, they have resources and luxury, billionaires with insider motivation and the gambler's experimentation, blah blah blah Wild West, but I'm usually wrong, too.

#6 Nate-2004

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Posted 24 July 2017 - 05:14 PM

I really wish I were a billionaire, but maybe what I could try to do is figure out how to synthesize glucosepane or pentosidine on my own haha. Or maybe just get really good at fund raising. I'd love to have more details on how much funding specific SENS research projects would cost.



#7 sthira

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Posted 24 July 2017 - 05:48 PM

I wish you were a billionaire, too, Nate. And wish everyone else was a billionaire; but even if we were and SENS had infinite funding -- Calico may have nearly infinite funding already -- how would human minds solve the complexities of human biology?

I don't know -- we're just throwing it out for fun -- but it seems to me that the advice offered in the article you linked is the same advice I've heard my whole life. We need better intelligence. Human minds aren't enough.

#8 Nate-2004

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Posted 24 July 2017 - 08:02 PM

I'm reading a book right now called Superintelligence on the development of Artificial General Intelligence. I agree it may provide the answers we want. I'm not through the book yet though but I bet in the end my opinion remains the same, that it's worth the risk considering the benefits. 

 

That said, I'd be up for some off the grid, garage style research. I'm not sure what equipment or chemicals would be needed or how to obtain them but surely there's a way. You can get pentosidine from lightly roasted peanuts but glucosepane is harder to come by. I don't know how to isolate the first or synthesize the latter but that's the goal I think, and what they're trying to accomplish. Personally I think GlycoSENS is the most important of all efforts in anti-aging and I don't get why we aren't focusing all our efforts there. The problem is metabolic as Michael says above, and that's one of the biggest problems of the metabolic process that leads to aging.



#9 Michael

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Posted 30 July 2017 - 09:28 PM

Nothing can ...slow down....or reverse the aging process

 
I should point out that the question I was asked was about lifestyle stuff (and that's the subforum we're in): obviously, there is now quite a bit of evidence that rapamycin slows aging in rodents, and some promising dog data. Also good evidence for acarbose, though only in males, and the evidence isn't yet as extensive as rapa.
 

but even if we were and SENS had infinite funding -- Calico may have nearly infinite funding already -- how would human minds solve the complexities of human biology?

 

We don't have to solve the complexities of human biology: we just need to repair the damage of aging that buggers it up.
 

Has Michael commented on FMD (fasting mimicking dieting)?  Some of the research by Prolon looks promising.


See here on Longo's human FMD study. Intermittent fasting only slows aging to the extent that it cuts Calories (and see this followup post).


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#10 Nate-2004

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 01:32 PM

Well damn. This is such a let down. I guess in some sense at least FMD or a 5 day water fast every month or so where possible could at least, in mice and maybe humans, increase youthspan? Though according to your followup post you seem to think that even that is useless without including overall CR. Which really really sucks.

 

I've been hoping some form of IF such as FMD or a cycle of 5 day fasts for a year may help with essential tremor.  IF is easier to me than CR and regular CR probably just makes life seem longer because it's just lower energy, more boring and miserable.

 

What's up with Calico? Never heard of them.

 

I'm frustrated with the lack of funding going into GlycoSENS. Where are the billionaires? 

 

I really wish I could think of something that could get me rich enough to help make a dent in funding, or think of a marketing idea for crowdfunding SENS. We need a poster child or something. 


Edited by Nate-2004, 31 July 2017 - 01:42 PM.


#11 Nate-2004

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 02:17 PM

I looked up Calico and found this: https://www.fightagi...netic-research/

 

Apparently Calico began in 2013 and I'm not sure what they've turned up but I assume nothing. They're unlikely to tackle what SENS is working, with limited funding, to tackle. It's baffling to me really, utterly baffling, till you consider pharmaceuticals and the entire healthcare industry thrive off age.



#12 Oakman

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 02:52 PM

Well damn. This is such a let down. I guess in some sense at least FMD or a 5 day water fast every month or so where possible could at least, in mice and maybe humans, increase youthspan? Though according to your followup post you seem to think that even that is useless without including overall CR. Which really really sucks.

 

I've been hoping some form of IF such as FMD or a cycle of 5 day fasts for a year may help with essential tremor.  IF is easier to me than CR and regular CR probably just makes life seem longer because it's just lower energy, more boring and miserable.

......

 

Thanks for the hearty laugh I got this morning from you saying that, just so, Nate!  

 

I'd say think of all the autophagy and/or mitophagy you are enabling through IF, and how that's going to make your boring, miserable life just that much more healthy... while it lasts at least!


Edited by Oakman, 31 July 2017 - 02:55 PM.

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