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Is Lost Empire Herbs' LIONS MANE on par wih oRiveda's?

lionsmane

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#1 Forever21

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 04:37 PM


Is Lost Empire Herbs' LIONS MANE on par wih oRiveda's?



#2 EFTANG

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Posted 20 October 2017 - 07:58 PM

Lost Empire LM does not show a COA backing up their beta-glucan numbers. They also do not include mycelium, which is the most important part if you're after the NGF boosters. Those are negatives.

 

They are very cheap on the other hand. That's a positive. You decide what is most important for you. Assuming their beta-glucan numbers are legit, you get a product that will help you with your immune system, stomach problems and maybe cholesterol. Just like most other mushroom products, no need to buy Lion's Mane for that.

 

As soon as you have tried both - you tell us what worked best for you ! 



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#3 Forever21

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Posted 31 October 2017 - 05:51 AM

Lost Empire LM does not show a COA backing up their beta-glucan numbers. They also do not include mycelium, which is the most important part if you're after the NGF boosters. Those are negatives.

 

They are very cheap on the other hand. That's a positive. You decide what is most important for you. Assuming their beta-glucan numbers are legit, you get a product that will help you with your immune system, stomach problems and maybe cholesterol. Just like most other mushroom products, no need to buy Lion's Mane for that.

 

As soon as you have tried both - you tell us what worked best for you ! 

 

 

Thanks Vlad. I have Oriveda coming but it's so slow to arrive by post.

 

I'm just looking for a backup. What do you think of this one?

 

http://nootropicsdep...extract-powder/



#4 Forever21

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 06:16 PM

What are your thoughts on this Vlad? I thought that "hot water" extract is best???

 

 

 

 

 

copied/pasted from Empire of Herb's post/newsletter:

 

 

With the release of our second variation of lion’s mane extract, many people are asking which one is better, or what is the difference?

 

In this article, we aim to lay out all the details.

 

                    

 

First off, let’s start with a little background. Water and alcohol are used for their solvent properties. They draw out the various components of different herbs and mushrooms. Some herbs are best done with water. Some herbs are best done with alcohol.

 

In general, when it comes to the medicinal mushrooms, water and alcohol draw out different components. In general, here a dual extract is best.

 

  1. Polysaccharides, such as the immune system enhancing beta-glucans, are best drawn out with water.
  2. Terpenes, such as hericenones and erinacines, extract better in alcohol.

These classes of molecules are true across all different kinds of mushrooms.

 

So, this begs the question, is there an active component that we’re looking for?

 

The main benefit of lion’s mane is in its promotion of NGF (nerve growth factor). This is the main thing we’ve identified that sets this mushroom apart from others, including chagareishi andcordyceps. This is what is being looked into for helping with cognitive function and in various diseases where that declines.

 

In one study (1) the alcohol extract of lion’s mane increased NGF expression in 1321N1 human astrocytoma cells. Meanwhile, the water extract did not, nor did any of the other mushrooms tested.

                  

 

This study went on further to isolate hericenones C, D, and E. Despite other research pointing to these as being the “actives” they were not found to increase NGF here.

 

Later, they fed dry powdered Lion’s Mane to mice and found NGF in the hippocampus grew, but not in the cortex. This was dry powder, not an alcohol extract.

 

Other studies have further complicated the issue.

 

Another study only used a water extract of lion’s mane and they found “the aqueous extract of H. erinaceus contained neuroactive compounds which induced NGF-synthesis and promoted neurite outgrowth in NG108-15 cells.” (2)

 

Still other studies find erinacines in mycelia, though these have not been identified in the fruiting bodies. (Though they probably are there.) These have been shown to stimulate NGF. (3)

 

There are also plenty of other compounds too, some with very chemical-heavy names: (4)

  • ergosterol peroxide
  • cerevisterol
  • 3β,5α,9α-trihydroxy-ergosta-7,22-dien-6-one
  • inoterpene A
  • astradoric acid C
  • botulin
  • oleanolic acid
  • ursolic acid
  • hemisceramide
  • 3,4-dihydro-5-methoxy-2-methyl-2-(4'-methyl-2'-oxo-3'-pentenyl)-9(7H)-oxo-2H-furo[3,4-h]benzopyran (say this five times fast!)

In short, we have only scratched the surface of the science around lion’s mane.

 

We know with some pretty good certainty that it has NGF promoting effects.

 

But we don’t know much about what specifically does this, what is best in isolating it, what types of cells it affects, wherein the nervous system they work, or the whole host of possible synergistic effects.

 

So which extract is better?

 

My guess is that the 8:1 dual extract will have some stronger NGF effects and likely nootropic effects. This is because it is going to have pulled more of the components out from the mushrooms. Remember it is a dual extract so it is extracting with both water and alcohol. Then it is concentrated down.

 

But our 1:1 extract will still have some of these components, and thus, benefits. Here you’ll likely get greater immune system and digestive benefits (the other reasons people like lion’s mane) because there are more beta-glucans, and likely more of some other things too, simply because you can take a greater quantity.

 

Further research may reveal more, but that is how I’d make recommendations on which extract to get now.

 

Right now you can get one, the other, or both of our Lion's Mane Extracts for $5 off. Be sure to select the type of Lion's Mane you wish to purchase when selecting from the options drop down menu before adding to cart.

 

Sincerely,

Logan Christopher and the Lost Empire Herbs Team 

 

References:

 

  1. Mori, K., Obara, Y., Hirota, M., Azumi, Y., Kinugasa, S., Inatomi, S., & Nakahata, N. (2008). Nerve Growth Factor-Inducing Activity of Hericium erinaceus in 1321N1 Human Astrocytoma Cells. Biological & Pharmaceutical Bulletin, 31(9), 1727-1732. 
  2. Lai, P., Naidu, M., Sabaratnam, V., Wong, K., David, R. P., Kuppusamy, U. R., . . . Malek, S. N. (2013). Neurotrophic Properties of the Lions Mane Medicinal Mushroom, Hericium erinaceus (Higher Basidiomycetes) from Malaysia. International Journal of Medicinal Mushrooms,15(6), 539-554. 
  3. Lee EW, Shizuki K, Hosokawa S, Suzuki M, et al. Two novel diterpenoids, erinacines H and I from the mycelia of Hericium erinaceum. Biosci Biotechnol Biochem. 2000 Nov;64(11):2402-5. 
  4. Zhang, C., Yin, X., Cao, C., Wei, J., Zhang, Q., & Gao, J. (2015). Chemical constituents from Hericium erinaceus and their ability to stimulate NGF-mediated neurite outgrowth on PC12 cells. Bioorganic & Medicinal Chemistry Letters,25(22), 5078-5082. 

 

 



#5 EFTANG

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 04:57 PM

 

What are your thoughts on this Vlad? I thought that "hot water" extract is best??

 

 

 

Sounds good but they still don't include pure mycelium or show or supply a CoA for this extract. Too bad !!

 

I got in touch and requested some more information but the rep. had no clue what I was talking about or so it seems. What we have is on the website she said - and when I go there I find an authenticity test and information about heavy metals.

 

But no details about beta-glucan or terpenes (since this is supposed to be a dual extract it should be tested for terpenes, the NGF stimulants are terpenes). And there is no mycelium in this product.

 

The most recent research is pointing at pure mycelium (containing the erinacines) as being the most desirable part. That particular research was left out on the website of LostEmpire herbs.

 

And no, I don't think hot water extract is best.

 

Based on the research I 'd say alcohol extract is best, or at least a dual extract. And it should focus on terpenes, not beta-glucan. You choose Lion's Mane because you want the NGF stimulating effects the research is raving about, right ? Not so much because of the immune support - that's a nice extra.  NGF-boosting means standardised for non-water solubles, terpenes in particular.  

 

As a consumer being fooled too often I want to know the details of what I buy - I don't just take a statement on a website as the truth. I prefer to see backup of claims, in particular when it's about potentially 'ground-breaking' new supplements.

 

How are your results so far ?


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#6 ceridwen

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 12:17 AM

Hydergine made from ergo the fungus that grows on wheat also is said to increase NGF and furthermore the new nerve material that one grows with it does not die when you stop taking it unlike Lions Mane
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#7 ceridwen

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 10:11 AM

The problem with Hydergine though is it can weaken your heart valve. That's a serious side effect and possibly why it's not used much now.

#8 EFTANG

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 10:28 AM

Another source of NGF is sperm... 

 

https://en.wikipedia...actor#Ovulation



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#9 Forever21

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Posted 04 December 2017 - 06:00 AM

 

 

What are your thoughts on this Vlad? I thought that "hot water" extract is best??

 

 

 

Sounds good but they still don't include pure mycelium or show or supply a CoA for this extract. Too bad !!

 

I got in touch and requested some more information but the rep. had no clue what I was talking about or so it seems. What we have is on the website she said - and when I go there I find an authenticity test and information about heavy metals.

 

But no details about beta-glucan or terpenes (since this is supposed to be a dual extract it should be tested for terpenes, the NGF stimulants are terpenes). And there is no mycelium in this product.

 

The most recent research is pointing at pure mycelium (containing the erinacines) as being the most desirable part. That particular research was left out on the website of LostEmpire herbs.

 

And no, I don't think hot water extract is best.

 

Based on the research I 'd say alcohol extract is best, or at least a dual extract. And it should focus on terpenes, not beta-glucan. You choose Lion's Mane because you want the NGF stimulating effects the research is raving about, right ? Not so much because of the immune support - that's a nice extra.  NGF-boosting means standardised for non-water solubles, terpenes in particular.  

 

As a consumer being fooled too often I want to know the details of what I buy - I don't just take a statement on a website as the truth. I prefer to see backup of claims, in particular when it's about potentially 'ground-breaking' new supplements.

 

How are your results so far ?

 

 

 

Well I'm on my third bag of Orivedas. Is that your brand of choice as well? other than them, is Real Mushrooms another good brand to invest in?





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