12 replies to this topic

[buziaczek]

First of all I would like to say hi to everyone. Few informations about me: about 2 years ago I noticed a significant decrease in my cognitive abilities. I couldn't focus on text for longer than few minutes and then I got sleepy and fatigue, I had problems with remembering and I had troubles with finding words to describe my minds. I have tried some supplements such as: tyrosine, ALC, lecithin, rhodiola, piracetam, bupropion, venlafaxine, tianeptine and lately mofainil so I am not a totally newbie at nootropics. It turns out that modafinil was a bullseye. It allow me to stay focused on text for much longer, I feel more awake. But as we can guess it didn't improved my memory and my language intelligence. So I though that galantamine, as AchE inhibitor with hippocampus stimulating properties, in combination with alpha GPC would be a good choice to improve my memory and noopept would improve my language intelligence. My question: Is this combination relatively safe ? The mostly I am worried about a intracranial hypertension and all its pathophysiological consequences. Will galantamine or noopept raise a intracranial tension which will have already been raised by modafinil ? Does anyone use such combination and could share his experiances ? What is a galantamine proper dosage in a cognitive enhention usage ?

Edited by buziaczek, 18 September 2011 - 06:54 PM.

[Dirk_Diggler]

You don't really need to boost choline levels with alpha gpc and then use galantamine (a acetylcholineserase inhibitor). You would probably get tension in your shoulders. I would choose one or the other, and personally I would choose the galantamine. alpha gpc is just way too hyped. Usually when you have more than one variation of a substance, they all do the same thing. Choline bitartrate is cheap and it works. Alpha GPC is expensive and it works. If you had to use a superior form of choline, I would go with CDP choline (citicoline) because it is an excellent source of choline and also has nootropic qualities in and of itself.

Don't get me wrong, Alpha GPC does work. If you have money to spend, then go ahead and use it. But cheap choline bitartrate will be just as good. And lecithin would work too.

Keep in mind also that modafinil is a short term cognitive enhancer. The benefits of it last as long as it's in your body. A true nootropic, in my opinion, will build with time and continue to provide benefit even after discontinuation.

When people start trying nootropics, it's easy to be swept away by the more exotic and expensive forms. I was. Hell I was taking lecithin, citicoline, AND alpha gpc when I spent a ton on nootropics in the beginning. That, along with piracetam, oxiracetam, aniracetam, alcar, theanine, melatonin, ANYTHING that was labeled nootropic I had to have. But I learned the same lesson most people do: more isn't always better and keep it simple. Piracetam and aniracetam are plenty enough for racetams. And they're safe and well studied. And cheap. I don't even take choline anymore. I was having incredibly severe muscle tension in my neck when I took those exotic choline sources.

Anything gained in the short term probably isn't going to last long-term. If you truly want to be healthier, smarter, and age slower, keep it simple and be patient. You might not notice benefits immediately, but the ones you do get will be healthier and last longer.

Modafinil is definately safer than amphetamines, but it's still relatively new and it is a short term solution. I would only use it when you really needed it to focus and not make it a common practice.

But I understand you want the best for yourself. This is just my opinion and what your goals are may not be the same as mine. So I could be completely wrong here, but that's the way I would do it. Just my $.02

Edited by Dirk_Diggler, 18 September 2011 - 08:06 PM.

[Dirk_Diggler]

Oh, and welcome to Longecity!

[buziaczek]

Thank you very much for reply. The reason that I'm going to use alpha GPC is a shortage of pure galantamine at cerebralhealth so I'm forced to buy a product cold Memoron which contains 8mg galantamine and 600 mg alpha GPC. But I've also heard that racetams require an extra choline source in order to avoid headache, so maybe going with Memeron will turn out to be a good choice.I would be grateful if you can elaborate about my real question which runs as follows if this combinations of supplements is relatively safe ? Wouldn't it damage my liver or brain in a longer period of time ? I know that modafinil cause slight hypertension, but whether modafinil with noopept, galantamine and alpha GPC will lift intracranial blood pressure to the dangerous level ? What is a proper dosage of galantamine in cognitive enhention usage ? Maybe you know some better supplements than galantamine, noopept and alpha GPC which will help with my cognitive problems mentioning in my first post ?
PS. Piracetam doesn't work for me at all.

Edited by buziaczek, 18 September 2011 - 09:14 PM.

[Dirk_Diggler]

I don't think it would have a serious impact on intracranial pressure. That's just my opinion and I should note that I'm not a doctor or professional, just from what my knowledge is on nootropics it doesn't sound dangerous.

Memeron by Cerebral Health? Ok, I see why you're using both together, because they're in the same product. I was curious as to where you got the notion to take both galantamine and alpha gpc.

I don't have any personal experience with Noopept, though it is one of the nootropics I do want to try. It's somewhat hard to find (Cerebral Health seems to be the only distributor that I'm aware of) and looks very interesting.

I wouldn't go anywhere over 8mg of galantamine. 4mg seems to be the dosage I'm comfortable with.I also read that choline is needed to avoid a headache when I was researching it. So I ordered lecithin. Then read more and found that some people use a choline source, and some don't. It should be noted that when Piracetam was used in most studies, there was no choline source administered with it. So I would try the racetams without choline first and if you get headaches then take choline. I took choline sources when I started taking racetams but I no longer need them. It has been postulated that once your body gets used to the racetam, then you don't need extra choline.

The well-studied racetams don't cause any liver damage that I'm aware of. Modafinil doesn't significantly affect the liver, but the parent compound, adrafinil, does. So long term use of modafinil's effect on the liver isn't really well known.

If fatigue is a major concern, you could try Sulbutiamine or Pyritinol (brain specific B1 and B6). They have nootropic qualities as well as a slight energizing effect.

I don't mean to sound insulting, but have you tried caffeine? That's a lot cheaper than modafinil and it's long-term safety profile is much more known. I take a 200mg caffeine pill when I need an extra pick-me up.

I know you said piracetam doesn't work, but could you elaborate? How long did you take it for? Most people don't "feel" piracetam. It's pretty benign and subtle, but it has pretty good nootropic effects. I couldn't "feel" it either but continued to take it. After a few weeks/months I could definately tell a difference.

[buziaczek]

Thanks for your reply again. Ok, as you don't see any danger in this stack and you can't recommend any better nootropics to replace these mentioned by me I would go with galantamine, noopept, aGPC and modafinil.
Yes I've tried caffeine and it makes me angry and sleepy.
I was taking piracetam for a month at a dosage of 3 grams and after this period I didn't notice any improve in my cognitive abilities, so I implied that it's in high measure a placebo.
I believe that the liver toxicity of adrafinil is caused by the fact that it's primarily metabolize to modafinil and modafinil doesn't pass by this process.
Could you tell me why it's highly recommend to take a month break after a 3 months treatment of noopept ?

Edited by buziaczek, 19 September 2011 - 01:12 PM.

[Dirk_Diggler]

I don't know much about Noopept, other than I do want to try it.

I would recommend Aniracetam in your stack instead of Noopept. Just for the simply fact that Aniracetam is more studied and Noopept hasn't. Best to go with something that is proven to work and is safe. Also Aniracetam has a pretty potent anxiolytic effect that builds over time. And it's very powerful. For me one 750mg capsule is more than enough.

So I'd go with Galantamine, Aniracetam, choline source (if needed) and modafinil (if you MUST have it). I'd also highly recommend either one of the brain specific B vitamins (sulbutiamine and pyritinol) since they are good nootropics with a stimulant effect you can pretty much feel right away.

But as I pointed out previously, over time you will require higher dosages of modafinil and any stimulant for that matter. But I have noticed with Aniracetam that initially I was taking it 4x a day, and now I only take it 1x a day in the morning. So over time I was able to lower my dosage. You don't see that a lot with many supplements/drugs. Usually things require higher dosages but I have become more sensitive to the racetams after continued use.

[buziaczek]

Yes modafinil is definitely my must have.
I hesitated between aniracetam and noopept but look and the dosage. The proper dosage of noopept is about 40 times smaller so I imply that noopept is 40 times stronger. And why should I go with a worse drug when I can go with a stronger ? I know that aniracetam is more studied than noopept but noopept doesn't seem to be a dangerous drug and if you don't see any danger in this stack I'm motivated to give it a try.
If you wish I can share with you my experiences with Noopept.

Edited by buziaczek, 19 September 2011 - 04:17 PM.

[Dirk_Diggler]

Yes I would be very appreciative if you would keep me updated with your experiences with Noopept.

Not trying to discourage you from experimenting. But why is Aniracetam considered a worse drug than Noopept? I know it does seem logical that the smaller the dosage the better off you'll be. And I am awaiting more experiences with Noopept from users before I actually invest in it.

Yeah, give the stack a try. And please keep the community updated on your experiences with it. Looks interesting, and I'm also interested in seeing the synergy of Alpha-GPC and Galantamine. Memeron looks pretty potent and I'd like to see some justification for what seems like an inflated price.

[buziaczek]

Ok, I will update this thread when I will have first impressions. Thanks again for your help.

Edited by buziaczek, 20 September 2011 - 07:46 PM.

[zodiac]

And.. look at that. No additional posts, haha -- guessing this turned out positively for 'im, in that sense. ;P
Sorry for the bump.

[saltyjohn1]

I'm going to mix noopept and modafinil in a weeks time and I'll tell you how it goes. I've found noopept to be much better than aniracetam in terms of cognitive enhancement, and even motivation. I'm reletively new to modafinil; I've taken 200mg modvigil three or four times and I've found it's effects to be proportional to how tired you are; So I only use it when I'm tired/hungover/on the comedown.

Aniracetam and noopept have no marked synergy IMHO, I've done it a few times and the sum of the two parts is considered greater than their sum.

Noopept's value is rediculous. I bought 10g for 70 pound It's lasted months. Aniracetam is the same price for 300g and It last for aproximately the same amount of time; but with lesser effects.

I use the same supplier (intellimeds) for both nootropics so I can't put the difference in quality down to the supplier.

[Climactic]

Under no circumstances should you want to take any choline bitartrate. Per https://www.ncbi.nlm...ubmed/28438808/ itis prothrombotic due to it leading to TMAO formation. I occasionally take all of armodafinil, noopept, citicoline, alpha GPC, and a racetam e.g. phenylpiracetam on a given day without any issue. I would be afraid to add galantamine to this mix, however. For now I will add it only if I take out the armodafinil.