20 replies to this topic

[Capa]

I'm in my mid 20's- a couple years ago, I was on quite a severe diet wherein I took in almost no fat (of any kind) for several months. My face became quite thin and gaunt, which i didn't notice until it was too late. I have always had an ectomorph body type (6'1" at 145), but my face was always very "filled out". I now eat a very conscientious vegetarian diet where I take care to get all the proper nutrients and vitamins (and fat) that I need...but I can't seem to regain my previous look.

Another thing is that I often do not seem to get enough sleep- and the sleep I do get is not exactly restful (I generally get about 6 hours or so). I take in plenty of good fats- but avocados and nuts do not seem to be enough for me. My body absolutely won't hold on to any of it.

I am quite frustrated at this point. Do you think it'd be worth it for me to re-evaluate my sleeping schedule? Does stress play a role in this? Any suggestions on other fats I should be eating and when I should be eating them? Any advice/suggestions are much appreciated! Thanks!

[nowayout]

It is not so bad to have a gaunt face. It is a fashionable aesthetic, and lots of actors and models make quite a good living with it. Also, as you get older, a lean face will sag less than a filled-out one, so you will look younger longer.

Edited by viveutvivas, 17 September 2012 - 08:11 PM.

[Capa]

You're right! I certainly don't think it's a bad look! I've noticed that sagging in people with a bit more fat, though subtle at first, does make one look much older (enhances NL folds, etc...) but being too thin can also enhance and highlight ones NL folds and things like this. Like I said, I've always been quite thin to begin with, but my current state looks almost unhealthy. One should have at least a little fat on their face right?

[1kgcoffee]

PABA might add a little volume to your face.

[niner]

Plastic surgeons and dermatologists make a lot of money injecting peoples' faces with fat or synthetic fillers. Other than that, you could eat more calories, but the fat would probably go to a lot of places you wouldn't want it, along with your face.

[JohnD60]

Beyond some natural self recovery, I would have to say no, Not without surgical fat transfer or injectables such as PMMA or Sculptra. This is less a comprehensive medical opinion than an observation that if such a remedy existed there would be no need for fat transfer surgery and injectables. Note: In spite of information on the internet, the collagen that you have lost in your skin is not fat, it is a protein based connective tissue, the actual fat probably does replace itself, the collagen does not.

[Eva Victoria]

Agree with Niner, you will have to eat more calories and gain weight to gain some fat on your face.
And people with "fatter" faces do not look older. On the contrary, since it is rounder consequently much less hollow, it will be perceived as younger.
And yes after a certain age one will have to choose between body and face.

[sthira]

Any advice/suggestions are much appreciated! Thanks!

Learn to love despite the natural imperfections. We aren't magazine covers. We're products of nature -- weird patchy-haired upright animals -- and just like every other plant and animal you'll see today, none of us are ideal forms. You're in your mid-20s. Don't spend your life suffering with body dysmorphic disorder; it's a horrible way to live. Following the basics is enough; vegetarianism is a great way to live.

Regarding sleep, not all of us were meant to sleep the industry standard eight hours per night. Some people sleep more, others less. If you're tired but cannot sleep, try less caffeine. Light a candle, sit in a cross legged position on the floor, and concentrate on your breathing. Your thoughts may soon exhaust you to sleep.

[hippocampus]

You should also sleep in a very dark place - since I put black curtains on my windows I sleep much better.

[Capa]

edit

Any advice/suggestions are much appreciated! Thanks!

Learn to love despite the natural imperfections. We aren't magazine covers. We're products of nature -- weird patchy-haired upright animals -- and just like every other plant and animal you'll see today, none of us are ideal forms. You're in your mid-20s. Don't spend your life suffering with body dysmorphic disorder; it's a horrible way to live. Following the basics is enough; vegetarianism is a great way to live.

Regarding sleep, not all of us were meant to sleep the industry standard eight hours per night. Some people sleep more, others less. If you're tired but cannot sleep, try less caffeine. Light a candle, sit in a cross legged position on the floor, and concentrate on your breathing. Your thoughts may soon exhaust you to sleep.

So glad you posted this. You're absolutely right. I agree that perfection is unattainable and that it's foolish to hold oneself to a standard that is unreachable (that has, for all intents and purposes been manufactured and sold to us), but it certainly doesn't hurt to look for simple, everyday ways to improve ones quality of life. It's a tricky balance of looking after and improving oneself, but also accepting and being content with oneself at the same time. I am only attempting to return to how I looked about 2 years ago- I looked so much healthier- which I think is a reachable goal- I just need to figure out how to achieve it. Thanks for the great advice!

Beyond some natural self recovery, I would have to say no, Not without surgical fat transfer or injectables such as PMMA or Sculptra. This is less a comprehensive medical opinion than an observation that if such a remedy existed there would be no need for fat transfer surgery and injectables. Note: In spite of information on the internet, the collagen that you have lost in your skin is not fat, it is a protein based connective tissue, the actual fat probably does replace itself, the collagen does not.

Interesting. Collagen is lost in ones face when fat is shed/weight is lost? I don't partake in any activities that might deplete or damage collagen (smoking, sun exposure, drinking etc...). This is news to me! Can you please tell me more about this?

Edited by Capa, 18 September 2012 - 08:37 PM.

[nowayout]

...the actual fat probably does replace itself, the collagen does not.

Collagen is replaced by cells called fibroblasts in the skin.

[Capa]

...the actual fat probably does replace itself, the collagen does not.

Collagen is replaced by cells called fibroblasts in the skin.

I'm still not quite clear on this- is the collagen lost along with the fat when one loses weight, or is the collagen lost when it is damaged from things like sun exposure, smoking, etc...?

Also, how can you be sure when collagen is lost and replaced by fibroblasts? What purpose and function do fibroblasts serve (what are they?)?

[JohnD60]

the specifics of why people lose collagen and fat in their skin, and why many people don't gain collagen and fat back naturally, are not well understood. The answers you seek are far from fully known to experts, and I am not an expert. I can explain one thing I do know, how PMMA and Sculptra injections stimulate collagen growth, the PMMA and Sculptra injections are aqueous solutions of plastic microspheres, the spheres being made uniformly larger than a blood vessel for safety reasons. When under the skin, the microspheres stimulate collagen growth around the sphere. The body sees the spheres as a foreign entity and encapsulates them with collagen. From this one could conclude that the older body reduces collagen production because of some reduction in the immune system response, that the fibroblasts are still there and functioning, but they not receiving a signal to produce collagen, that is speculation.

Edited by JohnD60, 20 September 2012 - 01:00 AM.

[Danail Bulgaria]

The best results are acheived only with implantation of synthetic material (rather than injecting synthetic fillers). There are methods for implanting synthetic fillers and/or fat tissue with cuts, that are made in the mouth, so no scars remain on the face.

[ViolettVol]

PABA might add a little volume to your face.

This is very interesting - how does that work exactly?
And what would be some good supplements to rebuild lost collagen?

Edited by ViolettVol, 26 September 2012 - 06:58 AM.

[Logic]

http://www.longecity...post__p__204828

[Geijutsu]

It is not so bad to have a gaunt face. It is a fashionable aesthetic, and lots of actors and models make quite a good living with it. Also, as you get older, a lean face will sag less than a filled-out one, so you will look younger longer.

A gaunt face only looks good on people who have attractive bone structure like pronounced high cheekbones, good chin projection...etc

[JohnD60]

It is not so bad to have a gaunt face. It is a fashionable aesthetic, and lots of actors and models make quite a good living with it. Also, as you get older, a lean face will sag less than a filled-out one, so you will look younger longer.

A gaunt face only looks good on people who have attractive bone structure like pronounced high cheekbones, good chin projection...etc

Agreed. Aside from character actors, some older male actors with very good bone structure can pull off the gaunt look, not many female actors can. Off the top of my head, two women with exceptional bone structure that have resorted to fat transfer, Madonna and Daryl Hanna

[Logic]

Some herbs, applied topically, are said to increase subcutaneous fat.
Most products that 'do' this are designed for woman wanting bigger boobs, but there is no reason they cant be tried on ones face.

Forum discussion:
http://www.essential...er=asc&&start=0

A product:
http://www.bio-asli....c/e_fc/e_f1.asp

Pueraria Mirifica Airy Shaw et Suvat aka: "White Kwao Krua" looks really interesting and might deserve a thread of its own:
http://www.sigmaphar...earch/index.htm

[diabeticNorm]

Hello everyone just thought I would add my two cents :-)

I think it's a complex problem and I hate to be a killjoy but i think it's best for our collective efforts in the long run to debate and have the most accurate information. :-)

The facial balance of a face that is attractive is very specific, if you just increase facial fat through some method, you may risk messing the shape up. I've seen horror stories online of people trying different methods and panicking after a month because it appears odd.

It's not just fat that is lost. It's also other tissues. You may if the conditions are right and you are a skilled artist, be able to produce a positive result.

I just feel sites like this are the best hope of a lot of people. I can't believe that with 7 billion people +technology we can't solve this problem well. I think a lot of info is just out there and just not shared, believe it or not google is just the tip of the human knowledge iceberg.

To seek a solution where you are restoring volume/fat with an appropriate shape to a more positive level as before by rebuilding what was already there, it's a monumental task but maybe where there is a will there is a way. I think fat pads atrophy, hormone levels change and how effective they are in the body changes, bone structure changes.

Here are some thoughts:

To rebuild subcutaneous fat appropriately you may have to have excellent knowledge (above the current literature as far as I can tell) of what hormones affect distribution and in what ratios you would have to keep them (I'd start with the hormones related to the reproductive system). You may then have to allow time to readjust the distribution which may take months to years. You'd need a method for increasing those levels and would need to be able to measure your hormone levels in order to do this.

I believe that fat loss also has to do with atrophy of fat pads due to damage. You would have to get that repaired in the appropriate ratios and also other tissues.

And that's only the stuff that I personally know. You may be able to just be happy with a solution which does not restore fat.

I think using stem cells would be an interesting solution to look at. These may do the job in it's entirety, what are other peoples thoughts on stem cells to repair facial structure?

I would also say, if you are even partially happy with your appearance, then just leave it and learn to be happy. Only improve if you are 100% certain it will work. If your not happy with appearance then I would just learn to be happy and have a crack at it anyway.


Best wishes.

[diabeticNorm]

Just wanted to add another thing. As we age the body's hormones system go haywire. This not only leads to changes on the surface but also on the inside (around the organs called visceral fat if you don't already know).

I believe from memory that fat shifts away from subcutaneous and toward visceral fat as a general trend. There are ofcourse many things one can do to change that balance. I think exercise changes it'll toward one or the other and id be willing to bet exposure to cold weather would cause a shift too but I don't know that. Differrnt hormones affect how much is stored around the organs .

I think if you lead a stressed lifestyle this will profoundly affect your fat distribution negatively. Take one avenue as an example. Studies show that cortisol leads to the accumulation of visceral fat, so I am guessing lowering stress (cortisol) may change the distribution back to subcutaneous somewhat.

If you are 30 or older, balance your hormones as best you can. There are several methods.