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libido only during/after sleep (wtf?)

libido sleep sex drive

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#1 existence

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Posted 01 February 2019 - 05:46 AM

I posted about this once before, but the thread devolved into other people arguing about TRT, steroids, and other crap that doesn't apply to me. Additionally, I would like to ask about the topic this time with only two variables to start (primarily sleep, and perhaps secondarily marijuana usage), as I have reasons to believe that other common libido-related factors are not the issue. For the TLDR, see the first bolded question below.


So, in a nutshell... I'm a hetero guy in my thirties. I have zero spontaneous libido during waking life. No matter how attractive a girl is and no matter how hard she is trying to flirt with me, I have no interest. I can force a solo session if I really want to test myself, but I really have to try hard. However, during and immediately after sleep, I have a very, very healthy libido.


This sleepytime libido has increased even further since my original posting, perhaps since I am now on bupropion (Wellbutrin). When I wake up in the middle of the night, I am physically aroused (which is to say 100% erect) probably 90-95% of the time. This is a way higher percentage of the time than at any other point in my life, including when I was a teenager and when I was having regular amazing sex in my twenties. This physical arousal is accompanied by psychological arousal much of the time, and if it's not there immediately upon awakening, I can summon it within 10 seconds or so as long as the physical arousal is switched on. I've recently quit using marijuana (day 36), so I'm dreaming for the first time in a long time (extra vividly due to withdrawal) and they are sometimes quite erotic dreams. If I manage to stay in a sleepy semi-awake state while lying in bed on weekend mornings, I can lie around aroused for a long time until I finally get up or do some wakeful activity in bed. I can also get these strong libido instances on the rare occasions that I sleep during the day.


However, as soon as I do something associated with waking life, even while in bed (e.g., read the news on my phone or check my chess game), the libido dies. If I wake up and walk around for two minutes, it dies. So question #1 is this: What are the possible reasons one would have a very strong libido during and immediately after sleeping, but not during waking life?


I'd like to explain why I do not think this is caused by a few particular things, but if you think my reasoning is faulty, please let me know:


  • I do not think the reason could be something psychological like 'subconscious anxiety'. (And since anxiety is a mental state, I'm not even sure that's a thing. If you can settle your mind, free yourself from distractions, and really think about your mental state, you can determine whether or not you currently have anxiety.) I also don't think the reason is 'underlying anxiety' that starts up when I wake up. The reason for this belief is that the problem persists even when I am quite happy and relaxed, with no anxiety whatsoever, and also not thinking about the problem. Furthermore, I've known plenty of anxious people with healthy sex drives.
  • I do not think the problem is testosterone. To quote my last post... "A recent test came back with total testosterone of 1240 ng/dL (normal range: 240-950). My free testosterone was 17.4 ng/dL (normal range: 4.85 - 19.0 ng/dL). So my free testosterone is high normal and my total is off the chart, so to speak." I behave like someone with high testosterone. I have very little fear of any physical harm (though some social stuff, like public speaking, does make me nervous) and I'm never intimidated by others, even when I should be. When nobody else is on the roads, I drive fast and somewhat recklessly. I'll walk in any desolate or crime-ridden place at any time of night alone and look at any guy who seems like he could kick my ass and greet him confidently. I'm sometimes irritable, but not aggressive as I do not let it affect my actions towards others (except for asshole moshers interrupting my flow at concerts; they learn to stay away). As for DHT, I'm told that testing is very unreliable, but it was normal the one time I got it checked. I was on creatine for a while (which raises DHT, IIRC), and while I did feel more 'manly', it didn't solve the libido problem. Perhaps it helped a little bit, but it's been so long now that I don't really remember. I quit taking it for fear of accelerating hair loss. One strange thing about the high testosterone, however, is that my voice is sometimes crazy low, but most often not, and sometimes high and scratchy. I've no idea what that's about. I would think SHBG, but again my free testosterone is high.
  • I do not think the problem is a lack or excess of some other hormone. Because why (and how) would the levels change so suddenly upon waking? If someone has a theory, I'd love to hear it. Maybe it would also explain the voice thing.
  • I do not think the problem is a lack of dopamine, though I am less sure about this one. I show signs of both high and low dopamine. I don't know of any reason it would almost immediately switch off completely once I wake up. The reason I'm not entirely sure is that phenibut does seem to give me waking libido, and other gaba b agonists don't at all, so I don't know what phenibut-related mechanism it would be other than dopamine.
  • I know the problem is not related to watching pornography or masturbating. I do not watch porn videos, and maybe look at soft-core photos once every few months just as a test to see if I get any daytime reaction. Despite the whole 'nofap' craze, I've read just as often that not engaging in sexual activity can lead to atrophy of those abilities and desires. I have tried long periods of complete abstinence from masturbation, and periods of doing it semi-regularly. It makes no difference. I currently allow myself to when I wake in the middle of the night or first thing in the morning, as the endorphins or whatever one gets from that is such a high and a welcome relief from my celibacy. However, like I said, I've gone long periods without engaging in it. One thing I will note in this regard is that more 'extreme' sexual thoughts definitely elicit more of a response, both upon awakening and in the rare instances when I force myself to have a daytime session as a test.
  • I'm not just naturally asexual. Until recent years, I had a very healthy sex life. Furthermore, the fact that I no longer do is a cause of great concern for me. I still find beautiful women intoxicating, but in a "I want to take care of her and keep her safe and cuddle with her, yadda yadda" sort of way, rather than a "I want to bang her right now" sort of way. Plus, I can date successfully with no complaints from the girl if I use phenibut, but this is obviously not sustainable once you reach the point where you're hanging out and staying over often. That's why I haven't tried to date anyone since I broke my last relationship off.

Question #2: Could this be caused by my previous long-term, near-daily marijuana usage, and if so, how? This was discussed some in my previous thread. I know it's ability to lower testosterone is not the issue, due to the reasons stated above. Even though I know a ton of stoners who have no libido problems, and rarely find reports of any who do, I did quit hoping that this is indeed the problem. But I'm not sure how long I would have to be off to know. (I'm now effectively treating my life-long insomnia with high-CBD hemp oil, btw.) In reading others' stories of withdrawal and 'recovery' (for lack of a better word), I've been disappointed to learn that many actually get depressed libido after quitting. However, I have atypical, and atypically strong, reactions to many drugs - both recreational and medicinal. I sometimes wonder if I was essentially in a constant state of withdrawal, even when I was using. Could this be possible? Is there any reason to think that CBD would prolong the problem? If anything, I think hemp oil with CBD has lead to even better sleep than marijuana, and may have increased my sleepytime libido even more.


My final question is: What should I do?? I've seen one endocrinologist and he was stumped, but should I try another? Should I see a sexual psychologist/psychiatrist? Should I go to a sleep clinic? I doubt they could/would measure levels of anything throughout the night.


Anyways, sorry to re-post on the same problem, but I really wanted to narrow it down to the two variables (primarily sleep, and secondarily marijuana) and get away from the irrelevant argument that was going on in the other thread. Thank you in advance for any responses.

#2 metabrain

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Posted 01 February 2019 - 03:20 PM

I get the exact same reaction to Wellbutrin


Speculation below (haha):


1 - Lying prone will force the blood down.


2 - The medication can be increasing neurotransmitters at certain times. Some of these will increase blood flow and some arousal.


3 - When you get sleepy you increase and decrease neurotransmitters naturally anyway, these could be potentiated further. Some of these are involved in arousal.


4 - The medication could be causing a rebound if you take it at certain times, it will start wearing off and you might be rebounding neurotransmitters.


You might want to look into other neurotransmitters for daytime results.



#3 existence

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Posted 01 February 2019 - 08:17 PM

Thanks, interesting thoughts.


I've wondered about the lying down aspect, but nothing changes when I lie down fully awake. I've only done this for up to an hour or so, so perhaps I should try longer. It would be a strange cause and not a super practical solution, but better than nothing.


Yes I should do more research about other neurotransmitters and arousal. I've read some conflicting things about some of their roles on the sort of non-scientific sites one tends to find when googling, so I need to get their true roles cleared up.


Your other comments make me wonder if I should try the bupropion / Wellbutrin at night rather than in the morning. However, even though mine is extended release, it still seems it should be at maximum effect during the day with morning dosing.



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