10 replies to this topic

[Bruce Klein]

On Sunday September 1, 2002, Susan an I went to a the DesotoCaverns Park http://www.desotocav...k.com/index.htm locacated about 40 miles outside of Birmingham, AL.

We had a nice time while there watching the people and children enjoy the wall climbing, inflatable slide, and water amusements.. then we purchased tickets (10$each) for the main attraction, a 100 yard long, and 120 ft high cave.

The cave tour is 1 hr with a guide pointing out specific cave formations and telling us about the history of the cave. Then the guide asked that we take a seat for the laser show... Basically the laser show is about 10 minutes of flashing lights and a booming deep voiced narrative recounting the genesis story in the bible of how god created the earth in 6 days.

Now I don't think i would have had an real problem with this except that there was no indication that the show would entail any Christian theme. The brochure said nothing about this and there was no hint that the theme of the park was Christian in any way.

The main problem I see is that the park is privately owned, and therefore not subject to the same laws of separation of church and state as any other publicly funded organization.

There is one bright spot.. the cave tour took us passed an archaeological dig in which the archaeologist had unearth the remains of an ancient Indian burial plot... For many years there existed an exhibit with the bones of the Indians on display…. until a group of Indians rejected.. the owner of the park willingly agreed with the request of the Indians to rebury the bones in an undisclosed location in the cave..

So, it appears the owner is somewhat open-minded...

Anyway, before I send a letter to the Park about my concern.. I was wondering if anyone had a comment about the best course of action or it there is any example for me to follow…also, I’ll check with the American Atheist website for more on this..

Thanks

[wall]

wow, according to the page they offer different school group tour packages that include the laser show... Deffinitly write a letter to them. I tried to send them an email to very politely notify them that preaching christianity without prior warning can offend people who choose to belief differently - but contact forum on the web site just gives me errors all the time. Deffinitly mail them a letter. I think snail mail is the best method. Also you might want to consider calling them on the phone and asking to set up a meeting with the owner of the place, when they ask what you want to talk to him about, reply saying the content of the laser light show. Deffinitly notify aithiest orginizations and try and get their support. I really hate seeing things like this - im offended by it and I havn't even seen the show!

[wall]

also, contact these people: Freedom From Religion - tell them your story. - these guys have been doing this stuff since 1978 and they don't mess around. They take people/orginaztions to court all the time over things like this.

here are some of the accomplishments they list on the web site:

The Foundation keeps several challenges in the courts at all times, and has ended a variety of violations of the First Amendment, including:

winning a legal challenge of 51 years of illegal bible instruction in Rhea County (Dayton, Tennessee) schools (February 2002)
winning the first federal case challenging "faith-based funding" of a pervasively sectarian social agency (January 2002)
barring direct subsidy to parochial schools, in a federal lawsuit upheld by the 7th Circuit Court of Appeals in Chicago (April 2001)
declaring unconstitutional the creation of a state post to "assist clergy" (May 2000)
Other legal accomplishments include:
winning a federal court decision overturning a law declaring Good Friday to be a state holiday
winning a court order to erect a fence and disclaimer over a huge private religious shrine surrounded by a public park
going to federal court to halt the practice of giving cancellations to a Catholic group by the U.S. Postal Service
stopping public financing of an annual nativity pageant at a state capitol
ending commencement prayers at a Top Ten University
halting federal subsidy of the "Virgin of the Rockies" chapel.

[Bruce Klein]

Wall, Thank you for the help. I'll keep ya posted.

[Mind]

Is the Cave publicly or privately owned? From your post I cannot tell if the "Park" means the water slides and stuff or the cave.

[Bruce Klein]

It is private.. no public funds... the whole park is private.

[Bruce Klein]

Here's a draft...

Dear Mr. Allen W. Mathis,

Thank you for providing the state of Alabama with a safe and enjoyable recreational destination. My wife and I made the quick trip from Birmingham to your park recently and found ourselves having a wonderful time.

However, there was one event that sparked a rather philosophical dialogue between my wife and I. After paying the ten dollar admission fee, we followed the tour guide into the cave and were pleasantly overwhelmed with the experience. Yet, when the time came for the laser show, we were under whelmed slightly disappointed by the religious theme.

I understand the park is privately owned, and that you receive no outside funding from the state or national government. However, it seems missleading in that there was no indication on the brochure or cave entrance that the laser show would be religious in nature.

Please take into consideration, in future enhancements to the park, altering the laser show so that it embraces all people from all religious or non-religious backgrounds. Actually, a scientific or nature themed show would seem to be much more appropriate. And if this should take some time, you may want to consider informing potential patrons of the content of the laser show before they purchase tickets and enter the cave.

Best Regards,
Bruce J. Klein



Let me know if that sounds ok... and if i misspelled or made any grammar errors.. thanks.

[Mind]

It sounds pretty good. Not abrasive. Not condescending. "Under whelmed by the Christian Theme" is probably the most biting comment and it isn't that bad either. If you wanted to be even more cordial you might want to re-write that portion.

Have you ever heard the saying "You catch more bees with honey". Meaning, the sweeter you are, the more likely someone will listen to you.

Overall, I think it is a fair and direct letter.

[Bruce Klein]

Mind,
Thanks.. I've always been inclined to be polite when asking someone to change something. It's a southern tradition. And yes, the "honey" saying gets its fare use down here.

[Mind]

lol...yes I kinda of forgot...the south does have a tradition of being polite. It is one thing that is sadly missing in many other areas of the U.S.

[chestnut]

the letter is much much nicer than i would have done. B)
Wall and Mind thank you so much for your comments.