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Silicon and DNA


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#1 SiliconAnimation

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Posted 04 June 2003 - 06:39 AM


I think that we all here can agree that "life" is truely subjective. Both machines and humans are capable of "living"

There will be an inevitable conflict between DNA systems and silicon systems in the future. The direction this will go is uncertian to me. However it is most likely one of two scenarios: The phasing out of dna systems -or, silicon systems will integrate with genetic creatures. (cyborg if you will)

I believe it will be integration.

I am posed with this problem of morality. What is survival, and how do I stay alive?

The reason I consider this a moral problem is because survival is in context of the creature who wishes to survive. In this case I, am human. How do I know what a human is when the day comes that technology mimics my every movement? When my mind is only unique because of its substance and location...

In such circumstances, I recoil in the assumption that to be human one must be what we have conservatively been in history to unknown history. Mentally and physically human. In the extreme, no rape of the dna system by alien design. No reformatting by metal hand or digital mind.

Must I survive by following the path of genetics? I certianly feel I must. Enhancements to compete with technology only appeal to me in genetic form. Is this an insecurity? Am I oversensitive?

I think of history unknown. We were not always human, we were not always dna. Once dirt and stone, but death is to turn into ash- so much like... dirt and stone. Never before have I been able to imagine that I might be metal and plastic. This is not in imaginable history. Perhaps a few bangs and crunches in the past I was metal, but I do not think I have been in this particular bang. So is the dirt, stone and dust more human than the metal and plastic? If I were 80 years old and offered survival from that digital mind that mimics my fellow humans, maybe even steel that mocks the existence of a past friend, would I take survival? Or embrace the path which my race has claimed exists at the end of a tunnel of light? Each future is equally uncertain if you ask me... A blinding tunnel of the singularity or a blinding tunnel of death. What is death? It has never been answered from a subjective point of view. I am a subjective creature like all creatures who do not encompass the whole of reality.

It would be easy to join the wave, if it were not so electronic. I fear with the genetic research restrictions on the increase, politicians are indirectly ensuring my death in favor of a rise of machines. They are so unaware. Damn their concerns about genetic morality while the very ability to participate in the economy on humanities part dwindles in the shadow of Intel and Athlon, Microsoft and Linux. Apple... The names of our future. The future senate.

Evolution cannot compete on the side of our ancestors who give us identity, who made us human. Yet sometimes I think we are diverse enough to create a solution to anything. We have not wiped the earth out yet.

Maybe I will survive, maybe... I will be convinced that to implant part after part into myself that I will be the same person and I will no longer fear my silicon death. I get a mental picture of a man using a crutch, and think of the man with the processor installed into his mind. Where are we going, humanity?

#2 Discarnate

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Posted 04 June 2003 - 01:02 PM

I think that we all here can agree that "life" is truely subjective.  Both machines and humans are capable of "living"


Well, I'll agree with you that machines MIGHT be capable of 'living', but we've not seen that capability as of this time. Minor quibble, but certainly IMO an important one.

There will be an inevitable conflict between DNA systems and silicon systems in the future.  The direction this will go is uncertian to me.  However it is most likely one of two scenarios:  The phasing out of dna systems -or, silicon systems will integrate with genetic creatures.  (cyborg if you will)

I believe it will be integration.


Well, I won't argue with belief. However, this makes several critical assumptions - that 'silicon' or other such material doesn't overcome DNA, or that life as we know it doesn't end. Malthusian solutions are always available.

I am posed with this problem of morality.  What is survival, and how do I stay alive?

The reason I consider this a moral problem is because survival is in context of the creature who wishes to survive.  In this case I, am human.  How do I know what a human is when the day comes that technology mimics my every movement?  When my mind is only unique because of its substance and location...

In such circumstances, I recoil in the assumption that to be human one must be what we have conservatively been in history to unknown history.  Mentally and physically human.  In the extreme, no rape of the dna system by alien design.  No reformatting by metal hand or digital mind.

Must I survive by following the path of genetics?  I certianly feel I must.  Enhancements to compete with technology only appeal to me in genetic form.  Is this an insecurity?  Am I oversensitive?


IMO, it's both a practical question and a moral question. The practical question tells you what options are physically available, or are likely to become available in the time frame needed. The moral question is to ask which of these paths you should take to best satisfy your moral precepts.

As far as 'must' surviving via one technology or the other, it's awful early days yet to set your hat firmly in one place or another. There's lots of progress in lots of different fields, and there is (IMO) no clear winner yet. . .

-snip religious concepts-won't argue belief-

Maybe I will survive, maybe... I will be convinced that to implant part after part into myself that I will be the same person and I will no longer fear my silicon death.  I get a mental picture of a man using a crutch, and think of the man with the processor installed into his mind.  Where are we going, humanity?


I for one don't know - but I sure look forward to the trip. *smile* IMO it's like a roller coaster in the dark - scary as hell, but also a lot of fun.

-Discarnate

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#3 Lazarus Long

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Posted 19 August 2003 - 02:22 PM

I think it is premature to count organic beings out of the "competition" to survive. DNA is vastly more complex in function than is understood by those that are focused exclusively on synthetic alternatives. I am a proponent of the fusion of these anyway because I firmly believe that we need to also learn and grow as we create technologies that are ever more complex or we will inevitably make ourselves obsolete with respect to our creations. This is a challenge that will not go away and DNA is underestimated for its potential and I am interested int he findings of researchers that are working on DNA computation as is described in the article referenced here:
http://www.imminst.o...t=0




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