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Shouldn't we do something?


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#1

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 07:31 PM


Is it just a feeling or nothing is being done in Israel?
Shouldn't we do something? advertising? activism?

I belive many of us are joining to study life science to try and promote SENS.

But isn't there more we should/could do?

#2 Cyberbrain

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 08:37 PM

Israel is a complicated topic and I’m glad someone brought it up.

While the land originally belonged to the Palestinians, it is not to say that both Israelis and Muslims can share it. And I for one support the peace process through diplomatic methods.

However there are problems.

One is the ongoing clashes between Fatah and Hamas.

Two is the fact that during every cease fire that Israel and Palestine have, some militant group always manages to fire some rockets to nearby Israeli settlements, thus ending the cease fire.

Three, Palestine seems to have enormous support from Syria, which allows the smuggling of weapons across the border and into the west bank.

Four, the evacuations from the Gaza strip seem to have had no affect in negotiations towards peace.

Five, the Fatah al-Islam militants besieged in the Nahr al-Bared Palestinian refugee camp in Tripoli seem to be a testament to the endless violence that Islam militant groups won’t go down without a fight.

Six, Palestine seems to be gaining popularity from Islam militant groups such as Hezbollah, thus strengthen anti-Zionist philosophies.

While Palestinians have the right to be angry, terrorism and uncalled rocket attacks is not the answer. The best thing that Israel can do now is to evacuate the whole West Bank and to recognize the country of Palestine. And in time Palestinians will recognize Israel as a country.

Now how does all this relate to life extension issues?

In a way, it doesn’t. However! The philosophies behind life extensions could bring this world towards an era of peace. Without religion (or at least the downsizing of it), there won’t be a need for wars. Right wing radicals won’t have to base their decisions on the bible thus they won't ban stem cell research and abortion.

And with our line of thought, a new world order could be brought upon the world. One which will be based on democracy, the free market, peace, but most importantly logic and reasoning…!

Oops! I took it to far … lol … but seriously these are issues which we have to address if we are to live for thousands of years in a peaceful society.

#3

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 08:51 PM

Well I meant more into activism of us Israelis in order to help reach extension..

But yes, as someone who lives in Israel, I don't like our social situation at all.

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#4 Cyberbrain

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 09:21 PM

Oh…my fault. I’m sorry, I get carried away sometimes. Yes, well, what you are saying is a problem which I think every country is facing. It's not only religious activist that denounce SENS, but it’s the fact that not even college students have heard about it. As a promoter of SENS, I think we should have more publications. Print more articles relating to SENS. Make more documentaries and distribute them for free. Advertise as much as possible.

However, it will be difficult to do this in Israel since it is the holy ground for the three biggest religions on earth.

This is all the more reason to begin radical activism - and not only in Israel but also in the US and right here in Greece where I live. I don’t know if it’s just me, but as you have pointed out wbreeze, we have to begin radical activism. Peaceful of course.

We (or at least most of us) have waited in the shadows for to long, coming to forums such as this to find meaningful conversations. Afraid of what others in our community would have to say on our beliefs! Well no more!

wbreeze I’m all the way with you on this! So as to answer your question, you either have to form some sort of club which does publications or get Aubrey de Gray to give a talk in your community or college. [tung]

#5

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 08:40 AM

Yes.. something must be done.

#6 Infernity

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 12:49 PM

-_-


Our state seems like it isn't so bad, which makes it all even more sad, we actually got used to it, just as happened in the dragon fable...

However, yes, something must be done.

We should arrange another meeting, I cannot see when though, I drown.

-Inf.

#7 ilia

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 01:30 PM

Thanks, Adi, Shai.

We do need to meet to discuss whether we are going to do anything (the presentation at the sci-fi conference, Tel Aviv U, Bar Ilan U, the websites, etc.). I will be soon contacting people trying to solicit presentations for future meetings.

If anybody wishes to present, please let know!!!

Until July 10 (the new semester end), I am pretty busy too. But I am sure we can schedule a meeting. When can you guys attend?

And thanks, Kostas. You are absolutely right. Life-extensionism/immortalism is perhaps the only ideology that can unite people regardless of faith, nation or social system. The real problem is how to get through to more people.

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Posted 17 June 2007 - 11:46 PM

The problem is mostly where, not when.

#9 ilia

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 03:24 PM

Hi, Wbreeze.
The past meetings took place in Bar Ilan University. This is a central place, which was more or less convenient for most people. We can always get together there at any time, if there is interest.

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#10 dave111

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 04:31 PM

Good luck with this. I think israel is one of the easier countries to get an active life extension movement started, because it's one of the most secular and technological countries. I think Israel has by far the highest # of engineers per capita in the world. The same with any scientific/technical degree, education, or licensing.

#11 Infernity

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Posted 22 June 2007 - 11:04 AM

Indeed, Dave, though the problem's going to be all the religious movements who will probably claim we insult god or so :\

-Infernity

#12

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Posted 22 June 2007 - 11:25 AM

I don't think the religious movements would have much of objections..
Speaking of which, I don't think the so called religious people would have much of a problem or effect..

And if they do, we just have to tell them to read the bible which says life are sacred and humans are to use whatever resources they got in the world after being dismissed from the heavens.

Or something like that :)

#13 John Schloendorn

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Posted 22 June 2007 - 07:48 PM

This is great, thanks! It sounds like you guys have many good people with the right interests and qualifications. If helping the SENS effort is the objective, I think it would be helpful to let us know who you all are. What are you doing where? What is the basic anatomy of the study programs you're in? When will you graduate? Do you know local senior scientists, or institutes with a potential interest in SENS? How available are you to go elsewhere, when? If you have a meeting about how to help SENS, then it might make a useful agenda item to compile this information & send it over to us. This could be hosted at the Mforums in the collaborations section, where Wbreeze already started a thread.

#14 ilia

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Posted 23 June 2007 - 07:07 PM

This is great, thanks! It sounds like you guys have many good people with the right interests and qualifications. If helping the SENS effort is the objective, I think it would be helpful to let us know who you all are. What are you doing where? What is the basic anatomy of the study programs you're in? When will you graduate? Do you know local senior scientists, or institutes with a potential interest in SENS? How available are you to go elsewhere, when? If you have a meeting about how to help SENS, then it might make a useful agenda item to compile this information & send it over to us. This could be hosted at the Mforums in the collaborations section, where Wbreeze already started a thread.



Hi, John! Thanks!!


Always happy to hear about any new ways to help.

Edited by ilia, 26 June 2007 - 02:25 PM.


#15 Blablaman

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Posted 29 June 2007 - 03:16 PM

Hello everyone,

There are two things that need to happen before we actually start doing something. We have to decide what to do, but before that, we have to decide what we believe and what we want.

This, I believe, should be on the agenda of the next meeting. Presentations are fun and interesting, but let's first more or less agree on what is transhumanism/immortalism, what concrete goals we want to achieve, etc.

Eli.

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#16 ilia

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Posted 29 June 2007 - 06:21 PM

Hi, Eli.
I absolutely agree with you. Perhaps in the next meeting we could have a brief presentation, and in the second part an extensive discussion of our goals and plans.

I think “Immortalism” or its adapted form “Life-extensionism” is the most reasonable affiliation. And the motto is of course “Advocacy and Research for Unlimited Life-Spans” (or “Radical life-extension”).

I am personally not too crazy about the word “transhumanism”. When you mention it in polite society, people immediately think about the Ubermensch, transgenderism and heavy piercing. But, since radical life extension is a central declared goal of the transhumanist philosophy (and no other philosophy dares to set it as a goal), there seems to be no problem calling ourselves “transhumanists”.

What can we do at this stage (with our present numbers)? Probably just “spread the meme” – trying to convince people that radical life-extension is desirable and possible. If we just succeed in raising these questions, making people think about them, legitimizing them -- then we have done a lot. And there seem to be 2 practical ways to do this: both through presentations and internet postings. And by presentations, I don’t mean only the meetings of our group. We should also think where else we can present (Yoni and Tal had some ideas). And the internet presence is your strong suit, Eli. There seems to be much inertia with postings at the new blogs. But what if we concentrate our postings here at ImmInst?! We can definitely post here in Hebrew. For example Adi’s book “Nizchon Hachaim” or my “History of LE” had hundreds of downloads. In fact, right now, ImmInst Israel is one of highest ranking places on the net regarding Imm/LE in Hebrew. So why not post more stuff here?

What do you think?




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