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non-essential ingredients


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9 replies to this topic

Poll: extras (21 member(s) have cast votes)

silica

  1. yes (17 votes [80.95%])

    Percentage of vote: 80.95%

  2. no (4 votes [19.05%])

    Percentage of vote: 19.05%

strontium

  1. yes (9 votes [42.86%])

    Percentage of vote: 42.86%

  2. no (12 votes [57.14%])

    Percentage of vote: 57.14%

vanadium

  1. yes (12 votes [57.14%])

    Percentage of vote: 57.14%

  2. no (9 votes [42.86%])

    Percentage of vote: 42.86%

Vote

#1 ajnast4r

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 10:53 PM


it had been suggested that silica, strontium, vanadium be added to to the mix. im not too familiar with these ingredients other than the basics and am unsure of their benefit to healthy adults. so if someone could post some studies, make suggestions on form or dose, etc it would be appreciated.

please keep in mind any extras should have proven benefit in healthy adults.

#2 niner

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Posted 31 October 2009 - 06:40 AM

There have been several studies with BioSil. (Choline-stabilized silicic acid) It has shown utility in bone parameters, skin wrinkle reduction, and hair quality. Strontium also plays a role in bone. It's cheap, while a bioavailable silicon source might not be. Here are some refs on BioSil.

BMC Musculoskelet Disord. 2008 Jun 11;9:85. Free Full Text
Choline-stabilized orthosilicic acid supplementation as an adjunct to calcium/vitamin D3 stimulates markers of bone formation in osteopenic females: a randomized, placebo-controlled trial.

Spector TD, Calomme MR, Anderson SH, Clement G, Bevan L, Demeester N, Swaminathan R, Jugdaohsingh R, Berghe DA, Powell JJ.

Twin Research and Genetic Epidemiology Unit, St Thomas' Hospital, Kings College, London, UK. tim.spector@kcl.ac.uk

BACKGROUND: Mounting evidence supports a physiological role for silicon (Si) as orthosilicic acid (OSA, Si(OH)4) in bone formation. The effect of oral choline-stabilized orthosilicic acid (ch-OSA) on markers of bone turnover and bone mineral density (BMD) was investigated in a double-blind placebo-controlled trial. METHODS: Over 12-months, 136 women out of 184 randomized (T-score spine < -1.5) completed the study and received, daily, 1000 mg Ca and 20 microg cholecalciferol (Vit D3) and three different ch-OSA doses (3, 6 and 12 mg Si) or placebo. Bone formation markers in serum and urinary resorption markers were measured at baseline, and after 6 and 12 months. Femoral and lumbar BMD were measured at baseline and after 12 months by DEXA. RESULTS: Overall, there was a trend for ch-OSA to confer some additional benefit to Ca and Vit D3 treatment, especially for markers of bone formation, but only the marker for type I collagen formation (PINP) was significant at 12 months for the 6 and 12 mg Si dose (vs. placebo) without a clear dose response effect. A trend for a dose-corresponding increase was observed in the bone resorption marker, collagen type I C-terminal telopeptide (CTX-I).Lumbar spine BMD did not change significantly. Post-hoc subgroup analysis (baseline T-score femur < -1) however was significant for the 6 mg dose at the femoral neck (T-test). There were no ch-OSA related adverse events observed and biochemical safety parameters remained within the normal range. CONCLUSION: Combined therapy of ch-OSA and Ca/Vit D3 had a potential beneficial effect on bone collagen compared to Ca/Vit D3 alone which suggests that this treatment is of potential use in osteoporosis. NTR 1029.

PMID: 18547426


Arch Dermatol Res. 2007 Dec;299(10):499-505. Epub 2007 Oct 25.
Effect of oral intake of choline-stabilized orthosilicic acid on hair tensile strength and morphology in women with fine hair.

Wickett RR, Kossmann E, Barel A, Demeester N, Clarys P, Vanden Berghe D, Calomme M.

College of Pharmacy, University of Cincinnati, Cincinnati, OH, USA.

The appearance of hair plays an important role in people's overall physical appearance and self-perception. Silicon (Si) has been suggested to have a role in the formation of connective tissue and is present at 1-10 ppm in hair. Choline-stabilized orthosilicic acid ("ch-OSA") is a bioavailable form of silicon which was found to improve skin microrelief and skin mechanical properties in women with photoaged skin. The effect of ch-OSA on hair was investigated in a randomized, double blind, placebo-controlled study. Forty-eight women with fine hair were given 10 mg Si/day in the form of ch-OSA beadlets (n = 24) or a placebo (n = 24), orally for 9 months. Hair morphology and tensile properties were evaluated before and after treatment. Urinary silicon concentration increased significantly in the ch-OSA supplemented group but not in the placebo group. The elastic gradient decreased in both groups but the change was significantly smaller in the ch-OSA group (-4.52%) compared to placebo group (-11.9%). Break load changed significantly in the placebo group (-10.8%) but not in the ch-OSA supplemented group (-2.20%). Break stress and elastic modulus decreased in both groups but the change was smaller in the ch-OSA group. The cross sectional area increased significantly after 9 months compared to baseline in ch-OSA supplemented subjects but not in the placebo group. The change in urinary silicon excretion was significantly correlated with the change in cross sectional area. Oral intake of ch-OSA had a positive effect on tensile strength including elasticity and break load and resulted in thicker hair.

PMID: 17960402


Calcif Tissue Int. 2006 Apr;78(4):227-32. Epub 2006 Apr 13.
Partial prevention of long-term femoral bone loss in aged ovariectomized rats supplemented with choline-stabilized orthosilicic acid.

Calomme M, Geusens P, Demeester N, Behets GJ, D'Haese P, Sindambiwe JB, Van Hoof V, Vanden Berghe D.

Department of Pharmaceutical Sciences, Faculty of Pharmaceutical, Biomedical and Veterinary Sciences, University of Antwerp, Universiteitsplein 1, B-2610 Wilrijk-Antwerp, Belgium. microfar@ua.ac.be

Silicon (Si) deficiency in animals results in bone defects. Choline-stabilized orthosilicic acid (ch-OSA) was found to have a high bioavailability compared to other Si supplements. The effect of ch-OSA supplementation was investigated on bone loss in aged ovariectomized (OVX) rats. Female Wistar rats (n = 58, age 9 months) were randomized in three groups. One group was sham-operated (sham, n = 21), and bilateral OVX was performed in the other two groups. OVX rats were supplemented orally with ch-OSA over 30 weeks (OVX1, n = 20; 1 mg Si/kg body weight daily) or used as controls (OVX0, n = 17). The serum Si concentration and the 24-hour urinary Si excretion of supplemented OVX rats was significantly higher compared to sham and OVX controls. Supplementation with ch-OSA significantly but partially reversed the decrease in Ca excretion, which was observed after OVX. The increase in bone turnover in OVX rats tended to be reduced by ch-OSA supplementation. ch-OSA supplementation increased significantly the femoral bone mineral content (BMC) in the distal region and total femoral BMC in OVX rats, whereas lumbar BMC was marginally increased. Femoral BMD was significantly increased at two sites in the distal region in OVX rats supplemented with ch-OSA compared to OVX controls. Total lumbar bone mineral density was marginally increased by ch-OSA supplementation. In conclusion, ch-OSA supplementation partially prevents femoral bone loss in the aged OVX rat model.

PMID: 1660428


Arch Dermatol Res. 2005 Oct;297(4):147-53. Epub 2005 Oct 26.
Effect of oral intake of choline-stabilized orthosilicic acid on skin, nails and hair in women with photodamaged skin.

Barel A, Calomme M, Timchenko A, De Paepe K, Demeester N, Rogiers V, Clarys P, Vanden Berghe D.

Faculty of Physical Education and Physiotherapy, Vrije Universiteit Brussel, Brussels, Belgium.

Erratum in:

* Arch Dermatol Res. 2006 Apr;297(10):481. Dosage error in article text.
* Arch Dermatol Res. 2006 Feb;297(8):381. Paepe, K De [corrected to De Paepe, K].

Chronic exposure of the skin to sunlight causes damage to the underlying connective tissue with a loss of elasticity and firmness. Silicon (Si) was suggested to have an important function in the formation and maintenance of connective tissue. Choline-stabilized orthosilicic acid ("ch-OSA") is a bioavailable form of silicon which was found to increase the hydroxyproline concentration in the dermis of animals. The effect of ch-OSA on skin, nails and hair was investigated in a randomized, double blind, placebo-controlled study. Fifty women with photodamaged facial skin were administered orally during 20 weeks, 10 mg Si/day in the form of ch-OSA pellets (n=25) or a placebo (n=25). Noninvasive methods were used to evaluate skin microrelief (forearm), hydration (forearm) and mechanical anisotropy (forehead). Volunteers evaluated on a virtual analog scale (VAS, "none=0, severe=3") brittleness of hair and nails. The serum Si concentration was significantly higher after a 20-week supplementation in subjects with ch-OSA compared to the placebo group. Skin roughness parameters increased in the placebo group (Rt:+8%; Rm: +11%; Rz: +6%) but decreased in the ch-OSA group (Rt: -16%; Rm: -19%; Rz: -8%). The change in roughness from baseline was significantly different between ch-OSA and placebo groups for Rt and Rm. The difference in longitudinal and lateral shear propagation time increased after 20 weeks in the placebo group but decreased in the ch-OSA group suggesting improvement in isotropy of the skin. VAS scores for nail and hair brittleness were significantly lower after 20 weeks in the ch-OSA group compared to baseline scores. Oral intake of ch-OSA during the 20 weeks results in a significant positive effect on skin surface and skin mechanical properties, and on brittleness of hair and nails.

PMID: 16205932



#3 Blue

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 02:50 AM

These elements are in ortho-core.

Silicon looks quite interesting. Besides skin, hair, and bone it may also be good against CVD and Alzheimers. But difficult to find a bioavailable form. AOR has metasilicate which is GRAS but likely not a good bioavailability. Here is a somewhat flawed study on bioavailability for supplemental forms (It cuts of studying absorption after 6 hours when some of forms has not yet peaked in the blood.)
http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC2744664/

A few mgs of strontium is part of a normal diet. But does it do anything below the hundreds of mg used in osteoporosis studies?
http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/6897396

Vanadium affect glucose in superhigh doses beyond the safe UL but again does it do anything at dietary levels? Albion has an amino acid chelate of vanadium.

Edited by Blue, 01 November 2009 - 02:59 AM.


#4 Blue

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 02:57 AM

A popular form of silicon seems to be the herb horsetail but is looks nasty containing among other things a substance breaking down b1 and nicotin.
http://www.nlm.nih.g...-horsetail.html

Edited by Blue, 01 November 2009 - 02:57 AM.


#5 Blue

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 03:20 AM

Here is a review of vanadium:
http://dialnet.uniri...l...1&info=link

"A daily dietary intake of 10 µg or less probably would meet any postulated normative requirement"

#6 spaceistheplace

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 03:57 AM

A trace mineral blend would be useful in filling in the gaps that a modern diet grown in nutrient depleted soils (even organic) creates.

a little bit about trace minerals:

1
2

#7 Blue

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 06:52 AM

Swanson has silicon in two unusual forms for which there is very little if any information.

Silicon aminoate
http://www.swansonvi...W984/ItemDetail

Bamboo extract
http://www.swansonvi...emDetail?n=1603

#8 Blue

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Posted 02 November 2009 - 03:24 PM

Sodium metasilicate is bioavailable in animals but there seem to be no human studies. It is GRAS and should be inexpensive. Here is one study on rats using sodium metasilicate (50 mg Si/100 g of diet). Looks quite interesting with silicon preventing osteopenia caused by ovariectomy.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/10602845
http://sili.cium.fre...nia_CTI2000.pdf

Edited by Blue, 02 November 2009 - 03:27 PM.


#9 shazam

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Posted 05 November 2009 - 07:52 AM

Yes on the vanadium (25 mcg or less, above 10mcg), no on the strontium (probably won't do shit in low amounts), maybe on the silica (eeehh.... I'd rather go with biosil for that).

A glycinate for vanadium would be cool. AACs for every mineral that's going to be included would be awesome.

#10 Onomj

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Posted 05 November 2009 - 03:08 PM

I know i've stumbled across information in regards to high levels of vanadium being associated with manic depression.
So if you or anyone else has had some bipolar episodes, maybe stay away from it.

Edited by Onomj, 05 November 2009 - 03:10 PM.





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