• Log in with Facebook Log in with Twitter Log In with Google      Sign In    
  • Create Account
  LongeCity
              Advocacy & Research for Unlimited Lifespans

Photo
* * * * * 1 votes

No dairy, low-fat versus full-fat dairy. Which is best?


  • Please log in to reply
91 replies to this topic

#31 TheFountain

  • Guest
  • 5,362 posts
  • 257

Posted 07 June 2010 - 11:13 AM

Circulating concentrations of insulin-like growth factor I (IGF-I) and IGF binding proteins (IGFBP) have been associated with the risk of several types of cancer. Dietary correlates of IGF-I and IGFBPs are not yet well established. The objective of this study was to assess the association between dietary intake and serum concentrations of IGF-I, IGFBP-1, IGFBP-2, and IGFBP-3 in a cross-sectional analysis of 4,731 men and women taking part in the European Prospective Investigation into Cancer and Nutrition. Diet was assessed using country-specific validated dietary questionnaires. Serum concentrations of IGF-I, IGFBP-1, IGFBP-2 and IGFBP-3 were measured, and the associations between diet and IGF-I and IGFBPs were assessed using multiple linear regression adjusting for sex, age, body mass index, smoking status, and alcohol and energy intake. Each 1 SD increment increase in total and dairy protein and calcium intake was associated with an increase in IGF-I concentration of 2.5%, 2.4%, and 3.3%, respectively (P for trend <0.001 for all) and a decrease in IGFBP-2 of 3.5%, 3.5%, and 5.4% (P for trend <0.001 for all), respectively. There were no significant associations between the intake of protein or calcium from nondairy sources and IGF-I. The results from this large cross-sectional analysis show that either the intake of dairy protein or calcium is an important dietary determinant of IGF-I and IGFBP-2 concentrations; however, we suggest that it is more likely to be protein from dairy products.

I wonder if the dairy used in this study was treated with Bovine growth hormones? I know it's an epidemiological study but I think it still warrants erring on the side of caution since elevated IGF-1 is associated with increased cancer risks. Maybe people should only consume dairy in moderation?

http://www.ncbi.nlm....4?dopt=Abstract

Edited by TheFountain, 07 June 2010 - 11:14 AM.


#32 TheFountain

  • Guest
  • 5,362 posts
  • 257

Posted 07 June 2010 - 11:57 AM

Skot didn't you inform us some time ago that you had your IGF-1 levels checked and that they were elevated following a diet high in protein/dairy?

sponsored ad

  • Advert
Click HERE to rent this advertising spot for NUTRITION to support LongeCity (this will replace the google ad above).

#33 Skötkonung

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,556 posts
  • 33
  • Location:Västergötland, SE

Posted 07 June 2010 - 05:19 PM

Skot didn't you inform us some time ago that you had your IGF-1 levels checked and that they were elevated following a diet high in protein/dairy?

Yeah that is right, but I was consuming a lot of casein from pasteurized sources. I haven't had them checked since consuming little bits of raw dairy, most of which is fat. I do want to get these tested again.

But I agree with you on the account that dairy protein (casein) should probably be consumed in moderation. The fact that diary consumption (whole fat dairy consumption in particular -- where fat holds the bulk vitamin content) reduces certain instances of disease more or less indicates most people on the standard western diet have some sort of vitamin deficiency, not that dairy itself is particularly amazing (except for its ability to maybe correct some of these deficiencies).

Ideally, the best way to consume dairy (particularly dairy with significant protein content) would be to eat it in the form of high nutrient value artisan raw cheeses. Likely as a garnish to other meals, not as a primary protein / calorie source. If for whatever reason you can't stomach cheeses (ethically or allergy, etc), then making sure you are receiving sufficient K from other sources is important.

Here are how the K sources line up (I'm not quite clear on all of this just yet, but in the research K2 seems better than K1):

K1 - Plant sources (kale, cabbage, cauliflower, broccoli)
K2 (MK4) - Animal products (meat, eggs, un-fermented dairy)
K2 (MK7) - Bacteria / Fermentation (cheese, vegetarian-natto / tempeh / tahini)

K2 seems superior to K1 because it is more strongly correlated to reduction of osteoporosis and CVD. MK7 seems superior to MK4, although getting K in a breadth of different formulations is probably best.

Intake of fermented soybeans, natto, is associated with reduced bone loss in postmenopausal women: Japanese Population-Based Osteoporosis (JPOS) Study.

Usual dietary intake of fermented soybeans (Natto) is associated with bone mineral density in premenopausal women.

Vitamin K2 (menatetrenone) induces iNOS in bovine vascular smooth muscle cells: no relationship between nitric oxide production and gamma-carboxylation.

Vitamin K2 May Help Reduce Women's Risk of Coronary Heart Disease

In addition to the Rotterdam study I posted earlier.

For someone like you, who does not wish to consume meat or much dairy, you could get your K easily from natto / tempeh / tahini, small amounts of artisan raw cheeses (might be unnecessary), eggs, lots of leafy greens. The fermentation also appears to reduce the goitrogenic aspect of soy if that is something you are particularly worried about.

One interesting idea I've been throwing around is that people could have a K2 (MK7) deficiency due to use of anti-biotics, hormonal imbalances, and bad foods. We naturally produce MK7 in our intestines, many lifestyle factors disrupt the bacteria that does this. A K-deficit can even disrupt insulin function and might contribute to the obesity problem. So there may be more of a standard western diet / lifestyle damages ability to create MK7, and that is corrected by consumption of fermented foods. K2 is fat soluble.

Edited by Skötkonung, 07 June 2010 - 05:52 PM.


#34 Skötkonung

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,556 posts
  • 33
  • Location:Västergötland, SE

Posted 07 June 2010 - 06:05 PM

Goat cheese may also be an option for the casein sensitive. Evidence suggests goat casein is easily hydrolyzed due to similar structure to human casein. From WHFoods:

"Some initial studies suggested that specific proteins known to cause allergic reactions may have been present in cow's milk in significant quantities yet largely absent in goat's milk. The alpha-casein proteins, including alpha s1-casein, and the beta-casein proteins were both considered in this regard. However, more recent studies suggest that the genetic wiring for these casein proteins is highly variable in both cows and goats and that more study is needed to determine the exact role these proteins might play in the tolerability of goat's milk versus cow's milk. Other research has found some anti-inflammatory compounds (short-chain sugar molecules called oligosaccharides) to be present in goat's milk. These oligosaccharides may make goat's milk easier to digest, especially in the case of compromised intestinal function."

Also:
The challenge of cow milk protein allergy
"Several studies have reported real and dramatic benefits from using goat, camel, mare or even soy milk as alternatives in cases of cow milk allergy and they can be considered hypoallergenic. However, therapeutic benefits vary with the degree of severity of the allergy and may be only around 60% of all cases, since other studies revealed allergenicity to occur also for any of those other milks."

But based on other research, there is probably no need to consume dairy so long as you are getting your nutrients elsewhere.

#35 Sillewater

  • Guest
  • 1,076 posts
  • 280
  • Location:Canada
  • NO

Posted 12 June 2010 - 07:02 PM

High fat:

Ann N Y Acad Sci. 2010 Mar;1190(1):42-9.
Phytanic acid--an overlooked bioactive fatty acid in dairy fat?
Hellgren LI.

Center for Biological Sequence Analysis and Center for Advanced Food Studies, Department of System Biology, Technical University of Denmark, Lyngby, Denmark. lih@bio.dtu.dk
Abstract
Phytanic acid is a multibranched fatty acid with reported retinoid X receptor (RXR) and peroxisome proliferator-activated receptor-alpha (PPAR-alpha) agonist activity, which have been suggested to have preventive effects on metabolic dysfunctions. Serum level in man is strongly correlated to the intake of red meat and dairy products and the concentration in these products is strongly correlated to the chlorophyll content in the feed of the cattle. Available data suggest that phytanic acid is a natural agonist for RXR at physiological concentrations, while it is more likely that it is the metabolite pristanic acid, rather than phytanic acid itself, that acts as PPAR-alpha agonist. Animal studies show increased expression of genes involved in fatty acid oxidation, after intake of phytol, the metabolic precursor of phytanic acid, but it is at present not possible to deduce whether phytanic acid is useful in the prevention of ectopic lipid deposition. Phytanic acid is an efficient inducer of the expression of uncoupler protein 1 (UCP1). UCP1 is expressed in human skeletal muscles, were it might be important for the total energy balance. Therefore, phytanic acid may be able to stimulate energy dissipation in skeletal muscles. Phytanic acid levels in serum are associated with an increased risk of developing prostate cancer, but the available data do not support a general causal link between circulating phytanic acid and prostate cancer risk. However, certain individuals, with specific single-nucleotide polymorphisms in the gene for the enzyme alpha-methylacyl-CoA racemase, might be susceptible to raised phytanic acid levels.

PMID: 20388135 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]



#36 ajnast4r

  • Guest, F@H
  • 3,925 posts
  • 147
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 12 June 2010 - 11:58 PM

as a sidenote, im very intolerant to dairy/casein but have been playing with goats milk and raw cows milk... neither have caused me any issue with over a week of 2x daily consumption.

#37 TheFountain

  • Guest
  • 5,362 posts
  • 257

Posted 14 June 2010 - 01:17 PM

I just decided to try some raw milk cheese from an Amish farm and to be consistent with it for at least two weeks to note the effects. Thus far I have been eating it for 3 days at two servings per day and I have not noticed the extremely amount of post prandial abdominal sensitivity as with normal, pasteurized dairy.

#38 Delorean

  • Guest
  • 78 posts
  • 23

Posted 14 June 2010 - 11:02 PM

You will have to forgive me because despite being a member of this site i'm not particularly knowledgable in the things that are common knowledge on here. I use this site just to get tips on supplements everyone seems to agree on!

So, i mentioned these studies to my dad who is under the impression that he needs to cut out things like full fat cheese for his slightly high cholesterol. Do these studies prove that philosophy to be wrong or is cholesterol a seperate issue?

#39 ajnast4r

  • Guest, F@H
  • 3,925 posts
  • 147
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 15 June 2010 - 09:43 PM

So, i mentioned these studies to my dad who is under the impression that he needs to cut out things like full fat cheese for his slightly high cholesterol. Do these studies prove that philosophy to be wrong or is cholesterol a seperate issue?


whether or not cheese is good for you, imo, is dependent on how the cows were raised and the cheese was processed... grassfed, raw type cheeses are the best.

as far as saturated fat and cholesterol i believe this is mostly determined by a) genetics and b) the rest of your diet...some people see no increase in ldl and increases in hdl with moderate saturated fat intakes and some people see their ldl go through the roof. i think the best thing to do experiments with different proportions of different fats for a few months each and see where your biomarkers go.

I, and most imminsters (i think) are eating or are aiming towards a 2:2:1 intake of mufa:sfa:pufa with a 2:1 or 1:1 ratio of n6:n3

imo, the average person isnt going to have the discipline or know-how to include higher amounts of sfa and still remain healthy.

#40 Delorean

  • Guest
  • 78 posts
  • 23

Posted 16 June 2010 - 07:50 PM

Thanks for that

#41 Sillewater

  • Guest
  • 1,076 posts
  • 280
  • Location:Canada
  • NO

Posted 18 June 2010 - 09:03 AM

Yogurt FRIES your BRAIN!, Opales told me to phrase it that way

Anyone remember this thread? (I found it while doing some research on lactose, we're surprisingly searchable in google).

Consensus?

Edited by Sillewater, 18 June 2010 - 09:04 AM.


#42 James Cain

  • Guest, F@H
  • 229 posts
  • 57
  • Location:Illinois

Posted 21 June 2010 - 01:55 AM

I think Infernity's post at the end sums it up nicely. Ultimately it probably depends more on other dietary factors, similar to fructose. Sure, galactose has similar effects on on glycation and liver metabolism as fructose does, but just like fructose I think it's fine in moderation, and probably better for you in yogurt in the disaccharide lactose than it is in the monosaccharide form used in research.

Are we going to start the galactose debate now that fructose is pretty much done for?

#43 ajnast4r

  • Guest, F@H
  • 3,925 posts
  • 147
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 21 June 2010 - 10:33 PM

as a sidenote, im very intolerant to dairy/casein but have been playing with goats milk and raw cows milk... neither have caused me any issue with over a week of 2x daily consumption.


update: it did cause the same problems, it just took about twice as long... and oddly enough my thyroid swelled up for a bit which doesnt happen w/ pasteurized milk.

#44 mike250

  • Guest
  • 981 posts
  • 9

Posted 21 June 2010 - 11:43 PM

looks like you may to reduce or drop all milk consumption

#45 Skötkonung

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,556 posts
  • 33
  • Location:Västergötland, SE

Posted 22 June 2010 - 02:18 AM

looks like you may to reduce or drop all milk consumption

For anti-aging purposes, I'm not crazy about milk consumption because of sugars mentioned by other users. Fortunately, fermentation takes care of that problem for us!

#46 Forever21

  • Guest
  • 1,918 posts
  • 122

Posted 22 June 2010 - 04:27 PM

looks like you may to reduce or drop all milk consumption

For anti-aging purposes, I'm not crazy about milk consumption because of sugars mentioned by other users. Fortunately, fermentation takes care of that problem for us!


What does fermentation do to dairy?

#47 Forever21

  • Guest
  • 1,918 posts
  • 122

Posted 22 June 2010 - 04:36 PM

I'm 28 who looked like 22 before the summer began. But after consuming dairy (kefir, goat yogurt, greek yogurt, raw goat brie, raw milk, grassfed milk) recently, people say I changed the way I look. Some say I looked older. Some guess I'm 35 year old. I did go on a 100% dairy for a week though until I reached the sickening disgust of it all. Which was my intention! I was tempted to eat raw goat brie from France so I gave in and indulged myself by going 100% dairy. And now I look old. :(
  • like x 1

#48 ajnast4r

  • Guest, F@H
  • 3,925 posts
  • 147
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 22 June 2010 - 05:00 PM

looks like you may to reduce or drop all milk consumption

For anti-aging purposes, I'm not crazy about milk consumption because of sugars mentioned by other users. Fortunately, fermentation takes care of that problem for us!


What does fermentation do to dairy?


the bacteria consume the sugar. that why theres little to on sugar in cheese.

#49 Forever21

  • Guest
  • 1,918 posts
  • 122

Posted 22 June 2010 - 05:04 PM

So my CR books are wrong on low fat dairy eh?

#50 sdxl

  • Guest
  • 391 posts
  • 47
  • Location:Earth

Posted 22 June 2010 - 07:00 PM

the bacteria consume the sugar. that why theres little to on sugar in cheese.

Most of the lactose is eliminated with the whey. Dairy products that do not involve some form of separation like yogurt, still have quite some sugars.

#51 Skötkonung

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,556 posts
  • 33
  • Location:Västergötland, SE

Posted 22 June 2010 - 08:31 PM

I'm 28 who looked like 22 before the summer began. But after consuming dairy (kefir, goat yogurt, greek yogurt, raw goat brie, raw milk, grassfed milk) recently, people say I changed the way I look. Some say I looked older. Some guess I'm 35 year old. I did go on a 100% dairy for a week though until I reached the sickening disgust of it all. Which was my intention! I was tempted to eat raw goat brie from France so I gave in and indulged myself by going 100% dairy. And now I look old. :(

Why were you consuming so much dairy? The devil is in the details, and in the case of dairy, I don't think going overboard on any kind of dairy product is great for longevity. Cheese for instance can be high in exogenous AGEs, casein (perhaps even raw) can stimulate excess IGF1 when present in high enough amounts, and milk / yogurt have sugars that easily form endogenous AGEs.

I think if you want dairy fat, you might eat whole cream that has had the protein and carbohydrate portions filtered out. If you want the K2 benefit, I would stick to a raw aged goat cheese (and only in small amounts, like a topping or broken up in a salad). K2 can also gotten from several fermented plant foods. Check your Asian grocer, they have a lot of variety. Also check my reply to TheFountain (above) for a partial list of K2 containing plant and animal foods.

Here is a good article on the value of K2:
http://heartscanblog...vitamin-k2.html

the bacteria consume the sugar. that why theres little to on sugar in cheese.

Most of the lactose is eliminated with the whey. Dairy products that do not involve some form of separation like yogurt, still have quite some sugars.

Specifically, separating the milk into solid curds and liquid whey is usually done by acidifying (souring) the milk and adding rennet. Souring the milk is done by starter bacteria( from the lactococci, lactobacilli, or streptococci families) that convert milk sugars into lactic acid.

Yogurt manufacturing uses a different (albeit similar) bacteria culture. As you've said, the difference is that a separation between the whey and curds hasn't occurred. That said, the fermentation process removes some of the lactose, and it will continue to diminish it with storage. Most yogurts are loaded with sugars to cover the tangy / bitter taste of the lactic acid. On their own, they aren't overly loaded with sugars.

Fage Total Greek Yogurt (full fat) has only 7g per cup:
http://www.thedailyp...ic-greek-yogurt

This (in my mind) is much better than milk, which has roughly double the sugar per equivalent serving. The more complete the fermentation, the better the end product in my opinion. Aged raw cheese has low sugars and maintains a great K2 profile.

Edited by Skötkonung, 22 June 2010 - 08:46 PM.


#52 TheFountain

  • Guest
  • 5,362 posts
  • 257

Posted 23 June 2010 - 03:04 PM

as a sidenote, im very intolerant to dairy/casein but have been playing with goats milk and raw cows milk... neither have caused me any issue with over a week of 2x daily consumption.


update: it did cause the same problems, it just took about twice as long... and oddly enough my thyroid swelled up for a bit which doesnt happen w/ pasteurized milk.


And you were consuming 100% raw non-pasteurized dairy, right? I had the very same issue regarding the thyroid gland when consuming pasteurized dairy, but have not yet noticed this problem with non-pasteurized dairy. And I have been going through a bar of raw cheddar every 3-4 days. Again, this is an experiment. I do not plan to consume dairy non-stop for long term usage.

#53 TheFountain

  • Guest
  • 5,362 posts
  • 257

Posted 23 June 2010 - 03:13 PM

I'm 28 who looked like 22 before the summer began. But after consuming dairy (kefir, goat yogurt, greek yogurt, raw goat brie, raw milk, grassfed milk) recently, people say I changed the way I look. Some say I looked older. Some guess I'm 35 year old. I did go on a 100% dairy for a week though until I reached the sickening disgust of it all. Which was my intention! I was tempted to eat raw goat brie from France so I gave in and indulged myself by going 100% dairy. And now I look old. :(


I had the same problem once. People usually guess me to be around 19 and when I consumed alot of pasteurized dairy for many months they thought I was closer to my chronological age (25). Interestingly enough when I stopped consuming so much dairy after a couple of weeks I regained my former appearance and people guessed my age around 19 again. What I think happens is people who are casein/lactose sensitive probably exhibit skin irritations which reveal themselves in the form of dry, irritated and red skin that can often be mistaken as lines and wrinkles. The good news is that it is temporary. If you take twice the amount of your glycation inhibitors (which I think is necessary for someone eating dairy) for a couple of weeks you might see yourself return to normal sooner. Did you really eat nothing but dairy for a week straight? That will definitely do it. Especially if alot of that dairy was pasteurized. And I know this seems a bit anecdotal but I find consuming some soy with testosterone precursor foods such as dairy helps to limit its effects. But then I also take soy isoflavones too. It also might be related to what someone mentioned earlier about how grass fed raw dairy contains a different kind of casein than non-organic, pasteurized dairy. You said some of the dairy was not raw so that might be related. But my guess is that this is a temporary thing related to irritation.

Edited by TheFountain, 23 June 2010 - 03:17 PM.


#54 FunkOdyssey

  • Guest
  • 3,443 posts
  • 166
  • Location:Manchester, CT USA

Posted 23 June 2010 - 03:35 PM

Fage Total Greek Yogurt (full fat) has only 7g per cup:
http://www.thedailyp...ic-greek-yogurt

This (in my mind) is much better than milk, which has roughly double the sugar per equivalent serving. The more complete the fermentation, the better the end product in my opinion. Aged raw cheese has low sugars and maintains a great K2 profile.


I bought some after reading your post yesterday, and had a cup this morning with a cup of wild blueberries and a packet of splenda in it along with my eggs. Really really good.

Not for people with fat-phobia because you exceed the RDA of saturated fat before leaving the house in the morning.

Edited by FunkOdyssey, 23 June 2010 - 03:37 PM.


#55 Forever21

  • Guest
  • 1,918 posts
  • 122

Posted 23 June 2010 - 04:02 PM

I'm 28 who looked like 22 before the summer began. But after consuming dairy (kefir, goat yogurt, greek yogurt, raw goat brie, raw milk, grassfed milk) recently, people say I changed the way I look. Some say I looked older. Some guess I'm 35 year old. I did go on a 100% dairy for a week though until I reached the sickening disgust of it all. Which was my intention! I was tempted to eat raw goat brie from France so I gave in and indulged myself by going 100% dairy. And now I look old. :(


I had the same problem once. People usually guess me to be around 19 and when I consumed alot of pasteurized dairy for many months they thought I was closer to my chronological age (25). Interestingly enough when I stopped consuming so much dairy after a couple of weeks I regained my former appearance and people guessed my age around 19 again. What I think happens is people who are casein/lactose sensitive probably exhibit skin irritations which reveal themselves in the form of dry, irritated and red skin that can often be mistaken as lines and wrinkles. The good news is that it is temporary. If you take twice the amount of your glycation inhibitors (which I think is necessary for someone eating dairy) for a couple of weeks you might see yourself return to normal sooner. Did you really eat nothing but dairy for a week straight? That will definitely do it. Especially if alot of that dairy was pasteurized. And I know this seems a bit anecdotal but I find consuming some soy with testosterone precursor foods such as dairy helps to limit its effects. But then I also take soy isoflavones too. It also might be related to what someone mentioned earlier about how grass fed raw dairy contains a different kind of casein than non-organic, pasteurized dairy. You said some of the dairy was not raw so that might be related. But my guess is that this is a temporary thing related to irritation.




Yeah I hope you're right. If you are then its good news. I can't wait to gain my "youth" look back.

Yes I did do a 100% dairy for a while. As in I eat ONLY dairy products. Raw and not, goat and cows, variety of fancy cheese, kefirs, everything to an enormous amount. It did the intended purpose though. I'm disgusted of dairy now and no more pro-dairy posts here is going to make me eat that crap again.
  • like x 1
  • dislike x 1

#56 Forever21

  • Guest
  • 1,918 posts
  • 122

Posted 23 June 2010 - 04:11 PM

Fage Total Greek Yogurt (full fat) has only 7g per cup:
http://www.thedailyp...ic-greek-yogurt

This (in my mind) is much better than milk, which has roughly double the sugar per equivalent serving. The more complete the fermentation, the better the end product in my opinion. Aged raw cheese has low sugars and maintains a great K2 profile.


I bought some after reading your post yesterday, and had a cup this morning with a cup of wild blueberries and a packet of splenda in it along with my eggs. Really really good.

Not for people with fat-phobia because you exceed the RDA of saturated fat before leaving the house in the morning.


Taste wise, yeah, it is really really good. Taste wise.



Milk Destroys Antioxidant Benefits in Blueberries

Mauro Serafinia, Maria Francesca Testaa, Debora Villañoa, Monia Pecoraria, Karin van Wierenb, Elena Azzinia, Ada Brambillac and Giuseppe Maiania



aAntioxidant Research Laboratory, Unit of Human Nutrition, Istituto Nazionale di Ricerca per gli Alimenti e la Nutrizione, 00178 Rome, Italy

<a name="aff2" style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 255); ">bFriesland College, Leeuwarden, The Netherlands

cConsiglio per la Ricerca e la Sperimentazione in Agricoltura, Istituto Sperimentale per la Valorizzazione Tecnologica dei Prodotti Agricoli, Milan, Italy

Received 22 May 2008; revised 25 November 2008; accepted 27 November 2008. Available online 11 December 2008.

Abstract
The antioxidant properties of dietary phenolics are believed to be reduced in vivo because of their affinity for proteins. In this study we assessed the bioavailability of phenolics and the in vivo plasma antioxidant capacity after the consumption of blueberries (Vaccinium corymbosum L.) with and without milk. In a crossover design, 11 healthy human volunteers consumed either (a) 200 g of blueberries plus 200 ml of water or (b) 200 g of blueberries plus 200 ml of whole milk. Venous samples were collected at baseline and at 1, 2, and 5 h postconsumption. Ingestion of blueberries increased plasma levels of reducing and chain-breaking potential (+ 6.1%, p < 0.001; + 11.1%, p < 0.05) and enhanced plasma concentrations of caffeic and ferulic acid. When blueberries and milk were ingested there was no increase in plasma antioxidant capacity. There was a reduction in the peak plasma concentrations of caffeic and ferulic acid (− 49.7%, p < 0.001, and − 19.8%, p < 0.05, respectively) as well as the overall absorption (AUC) of caffeic acid (p < 0.001). The ingestion of blueberries in association with milk, thus, impairs the in vivo antioxidant properties of blueberries and reduces the absorption of caffeic acid.

Keywords: Blueberry; Milk; Antioxidant capacity; Caffeic acid; Bioavailability; Proteins; Free radicals

Abbreviations: AUC, area under the curve; FRAP, ferric reducing antioxidant potential; TAC, total antioxidant capacity; TRAP, total radical-trapping antioxidant parameter


  • like x 1

#57 Forever21

  • Guest
  • 1,918 posts
  • 122

Posted 23 June 2010 - 04:24 PM

. The good news is that it is temporary. If you take twice the amount of your glycation inhibitors (which I think is necessary for someone eating dairy)


what is this? what do u take? benfo?
  • like x 1

#58 sdxl

  • Guest
  • 391 posts
  • 47
  • Location:Earth

Posted 23 June 2010 - 04:29 PM

Fage Total Greek Yogurt (full fat) has only 7g per cup:
http://www.thedailyp...ic-greek-yogurt

This (in my mind) is much better than milk, which has roughly double the sugar per equivalent serving. The more complete the fermentation, the better the end product in my opinion.

Greek yogurt is strained, which removes some of the naturally occurring sugars. Depending on the brand plain yogurt has about twice as much sugars per serving.

#59 TheFountain

  • Guest
  • 5,362 posts
  • 257

Posted 23 June 2010 - 04:36 PM

. The good news is that it is temporary. If you take twice the amount of your glycation inhibitors (which I think is necessary for someone eating dairy)


what is this? what do u take? benfo?


I think galactose is an indirect route to glycation end products. So the method of dealing with this to my understanding would be extra glycation inhibitors. Double or triple doses of L-carnnosine, taurine, benfotiamine, etc.

#60 Skötkonung

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,556 posts
  • 33
  • Location:Västergötland, SE

Posted 23 June 2010 - 04:43 PM

Fage Total Greek Yogurt (full fat) has only 7g per cup:
http://www.thedailyp...ic-greek-yogurt

This (in my mind) is much better than milk, which has roughly double the sugar per equivalent serving. The more complete the fermentation, the better the end product in my opinion. Aged raw cheese has low sugars and maintains a great K2 profile.


I bought some after reading your post yesterday, and had a cup this morning with a cup of wild blueberries and a packet of splenda in it along with my eggs. Really really good.

Not for people with fat-phobia because you exceed the RDA of saturated fat before leaving the house in the morning.


Taste wise, yeah, it is really really good. Taste wise.



Milk Destroys Antioxidant Benefits in Blueberries

Mauro Serafinia, Maria Francesca Testaa, Debora Villañoa, Monia Pecoraria, Karin van Wierenb, Elena Azzinia, Ada Brambillac and Giuseppe Maiania



aAntioxidant Research Laboratory, Unit of Human Nutrition, Istituto Nazionale di Ricerca per gli Alimenti e la Nutrizione, 00178 Rome, Italy

<a name="aff2" style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 255); ">bFriesland College, Leeuwarden, The Netherlands

cConsiglio per la Ricerca e la Sperimentazione in Agricoltura, Istituto Sperimentale per la Valorizzazione Tecnologica dei Prodotti Agricoli, Milan, Italy

Received 22 May 2008; revised 25 November 2008; accepted 27 November 2008. Available online 11 December 2008.

Abstract
The antioxidant properties of dietary phenolics are believed to be reduced in vivo because of their affinity for proteins. In this study we assessed the bioavailability of phenolics and the in vivo plasma antioxidant capacity after the consumption of blueberries (Vaccinium corymbosum L.) with and without milk. In a crossover design, 11 healthy human volunteers consumed either (a) 200 g of blueberries plus 200 ml of water or (b) 200 g of blueberries plus 200 ml of whole milk. Venous samples were collected at baseline and at 1, 2, and 5 h postconsumption. Ingestion of blueberries increased plasma levels of reducing and chain-breaking potential (+ 6.1%, p < 0.001; + 11.1%, p < 0.05) and enhanced plasma concentrations of caffeic and ferulic acid. When blueberries and milk were ingested there was no increase in plasma antioxidant capacity. There was a reduction in the peak plasma concentrations of caffeic and ferulic acid (− 49.7%, p < 0.001, and − 19.8%, p < 0.05, respectively) as well as the overall absorption (AUC) of caffeic acid (p < 0.001). The ingestion of blueberries in association with milk, thus, impairs the in vivo antioxidant properties of blueberries and reduces the absorption of caffeic acid.

Keywords: Blueberry; Milk; Antioxidant capacity; Caffeic acid; Bioavailability; Proteins; Free radicals

Abbreviations: AUC, area under the curve; FRAP, ferric reducing antioxidant potential; TAC, total antioxidant capacity; TRAP, total radical-trapping antioxidant parameter

In that study, specially prepared blueberry extract was mixed with an equal volume of whole milk. Measures of antioxidant potential were checked in vitro (in a test tube) and in human subjects. The part using human subjects involved 11 young, lean study subjects who had refrained from having any fresh fruits and vegetables for two days, and they were given the berry/water or berry/whole milk test mixtures after an overnight fast. The study reported that mixing the berry extract with the whole milk resulted in a reduced absorption of certain antioxidants. The effect was believed to involve an interaction with the milk fat. The authors commented that 2 percent milk had less of an effect than whole milk, and skim milk had less of an effect than 2 percent. The study used a specially prepared extract that was consumed under controlled circumstances. Fruits are not normally eaten this way. Berries, including blueberries, are wonderful food. When consumed with or without milk, they provide a great array of healthful phytochemicals and fiber. A study such as this can provide grist for scientific debate, but it shouldn’t be given undue weight to steer people away from eating and enjoying healthful foods like yogurt or blueberries (even together). I would simply keep in mind that the two might be best consumed separately to maximize the antioxidant component, but the necessary research to substantiate such a claim is still lacking.

  • like x 1




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users