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Is there a way to kill libido w/o impairing normal function?

libido ssri testosterone antipsychotic sexuality

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#61 Elus

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 05:21 AM

Libido is however connected with drive due to testosterone and other mechanisms. I would argue that fighting against your sex drive would either reduce you to what people have said about hormone therapy, in that you will lack motivation. A worse result would be something you see in priests who try to destroy their libido, and end up creating a more vicious and vile form of attraction. I'm pretty sure what I mean by this goes without saying. Do not try to base it on this.

I'll have you know orgasms are barely comparable to heroin by experience whatsoever. If anything Freud said was right, fighting against libido is going to doom you to suffering. If we think rationally about the underlying necessity of procreation and how everything is ultimately an evolutionary add-on to assure this, we can also feel great discomfort when thinking about the consequences of such actions.

As another poster in this thread has said before, libido has nothing to do with your perception of beauty and associated cognitive distortions. Even without a libido you will still be susceptible to this. These things are so deeply encoded you cannot walk around them. Try meditation and entheogens in order to learn to control your own psyche. Do not pick such a narrow and pathological goal. Messing with libido has the potential to cause unpredictable deficits. Don't focus on libido lest you accidentally turn yourself into a walking gaping corpse or worse.


Libido and motivation are two separate things. You could in theory knock libido out while preserving motivation (see the studies I posted on the 1st page of this thread).

Edited by Elus, 05 March 2012 - 05:21 AM.

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#62 hooter

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 10:42 AM

Libido and motivation are two separate things. You could in theory knock libido out while preserving motivation (see the studies I posted on the 1st page of this thread).


Yes. But you see in practice how much people screw themselves over.
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#63 nowayout

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 12:27 PM

You might be happier with a partner with compatible libido. I am sure there are many potential partners who would be absolutely thrilled.

Would you tell a pedophile he would be happier once he finds a child who appreciates him?


So you mean you are a sex offender, correct?

Unless you are, you are making an absolutely an idiotic and crazy comparison. In that case you have bigger problems.

I would recommend that you find a different psychiatrist who doesn't go along with and enable your craziness.

Edited by viveutvivas, 05 March 2012 - 12:35 PM.

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#64 khemix

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 03:37 PM

You might be happier with a partner with compatible libido. I am sure there are many potential partners who would be absolutely thrilled.

Would you tell a pedophile he would be happier once he finds a child who appreciates him?


So you mean you are a sex offender, correct?

Unless you are, you are making an absolutely an idiotic and crazy comparison. In that case you have bigger problems.

I would recommend that you find a different psychiatrist who doesn't go along with and enable your craziness.

... no, why do you keep bringing that up? Are you hiding something?

Why is it an idiotic comparison? It's just a more extreme form of social deviance. But libido is only problematic if I'm a sex offender or rapist right? I've already told you that mine is in insane overdrive and your response was essentially to find someone with the same problem.

Really, my psychiatrist enables my craziness? And what would you have him do? Talk therapy? I tried that for over three years. With different doctors. And I get the same old crap I got from you... "libido is healthy" and "you're young, you can expect it to get a little out of whack". I went from the guy who wouldn't touch a multivitamin for fear of liver problems to someone on HRT. Going at it for up to 12 hour marathons seems to have gone over your head. I said there is a problem. It intereferes with my life, it doesn't fit my morality, and I want it fixed. I don't know why you needed the details.

#65 1thoughtMaze1

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 03:49 PM

Having a healthy libido is normal functioning, so the answer is no.
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#66 brainslugged

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 10:08 PM

Physical castration and estrogen.

From what I hear, that is pretty effective. (Most transsexuals lose most if not all of their libido if I am not mistaken.)

Of course, look at what you would be losing. Your appearance, part of your personality, possibly your happiness.



As far as anything that kills libido goes, I think it needs to be thought through more than just at a simple "What would be most effective?" level. By giving up libido, you are giving up part of what makes you human, giving up part of your emotions. Don't let yourself get so caught up success that you forget how to enjoy yourself.

I tried that with chemical castration as outlined above, and while effective there was such a profound loss of energy that all I could do was lay in bed and vegetate with an impaired memory.

Actually I'm on dutasteride 0.5mg (Avodart) right now and the results are very similar although nowhere near as severe. That is, my energy levels are non-existant to the point that I can't even feel Adderall. Libido is slightly reduced and there is a kind of "eunuch calm" that I kind of like. But the side effects are just not worth it, I can't get any work done feeling this exhausted, so its likely I'll be ditching this too.

I'm getting a little tired of these "libido is healthy" comments. I wouldn't be taking powerful medications and making this post if there wasn't a more serious issue behind the scenes. I won't go into the details, but let me just say that it has affected my life quite negatively.



I recommended physical castration coupled with Hormone Replacement Therapy, because, unlike simply reducing testosterone, it would be increasing estrogen as well, which I think would at least partially recover some mental functioning.

Just as an idea or experiment, maybe you could try the Avodart alongside estrogen? If that doesn't work, you could try an anti-androgen alongside estrogen. It will really screw with your appearance, but I am guessing you don't care too much.

As a side note, I would not simply reduce testosterone if I were you. I believe it leads to weak bones.

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#67 Destiny's Equation

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 02:21 AM

CDP choline replaced my uncontrollable urge to sexually relieve myself with an uncontrollable urge to learn new things. (I suspect that abusing Benadryl as a teenager caused the hyper sexuality I had for several years by throwing my acetylcholine-to-dopamine ratio out of whack.)

Now that I am off of it I am no longer skewed in either direction :) problem solved!

Bacopa is worth a shot but you'll have to try whether it will affect motivation/energy a lot...


Bacopa enhanced my sex drive.

#68 khemix

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 02:53 AM

CDP choline replaced my uncontrollable urge to sexually relieve myself with an uncontrollable urge to learn new things. (I suspect that abusing Benadryl as a teenager caused the hyper sexuality I had for several years by throwing my acetylcholine-to-dopamine ratio out of whack.)

Now that I am off of it I am no longer skewed in either direction :) problem solved!

Bacopa is worth a shot but you'll have to try whether it will affect motivation/energy a lot...


Bacopa enhanced my sex drive.

Thanks,

I already take CDP choline 250mg and Alpha GPC 300mg to improve cognition but can't say it has had any effect on libido. How much are you taking?

Physical castration and estrogen.

From what I hear, that is pretty effective. (Most transsexuals lose most if not all of their libido if I am not mistaken.)

Of course, look at what you would be losing. Your appearance, part of your personality, possibly your happiness.



As far as anything that kills libido goes, I think it needs to be thought through more than just at a simple "What would be most effective?" level. By giving up libido, you are giving up part of what makes you human, giving up part of your emotions. Don't let yourself get so caught up success that you forget how to enjoy yourself.

I tried that with chemical castration as outlined above, and while effective there was such a profound loss of energy that all I could do was lay in bed and vegetate with an impaired memory.

Actually I'm on dutasteride 0.5mg (Avodart) right now and the results are very similar although nowhere near as severe. That is, my energy levels are non-existant to the point that I can't even feel Adderall. Libido is slightly reduced and there is a kind of "eunuch calm" that I kind of like. But the side effects are just not worth it, I can't get any work done feeling this exhausted, so its likely I'll be ditching this too.

I'm getting a little tired of these "libido is healthy" comments. I wouldn't be taking powerful medications and making this post if there wasn't a more serious issue behind the scenes. I won't go into the details, but let me just say that it has affected my life quite negatively.



I recommended physical castration coupled with Hormone Replacement Therapy, because, unlike simply reducing testosterone, it would be increasing estrogen as well, which I think would at least partially recover some mental functioning.

Just as an idea or experiment, maybe you could try the Avodart alongside estrogen? If that doesn't work, you could try an anti-androgen alongside estrogen. It will really screw with your appearance, but I am guessing you don't care too much.

As a side note, I would not simply reduce testosterone if I were you. I believe it leads to weak bones.

My condition isn't so severe that I would want physical castration. Also the procedure isn't exactly reversible. I think I'm feeling the estrogen effects now that my DHT levels are low. Its a nice calm. But I lose my edge and competitveness and don't really feel like getting a whole lot done. Interestingly, I feel my communication skills have improved particularily when talking... I don't get stumped or have those DUH DERRRR moments. And it takes a lot of effort to get angry LOL. Memory is down and I can't do math to save my life which is unlike me.

Edited by khemix, 06 March 2012 - 03:03 AM.


#69 Ampa-omega

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 05:01 AM

CDP choline replaced my uncontrollable urge to sexually relieve myself with an uncontrollable urge to learn new things. (I suspect that abusing Benadryl as a teenager caused the hyper sexuality I had for several years by throwing my acetylcholine-to-dopamine ratio out of whack
Now that I am off of it I am no longer skewed in either direction :) problem solved!

Bacopa is worth a shot but you'll have to try whether it will affect motivation/energy a lot...


Bacopa enhanced my sex drive.


has the CDP choline worked long term? do you have to take high doses?
were you able to fully remove libido when you didnt want it?
do you think its the choline?

you may have been a special case since you abused Benadryl so i dont know if the cdp would work for everyone.

Edited by Ampa-omega, 06 March 2012 - 05:10 AM.


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#70 nowayout

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 07:45 PM

So you mean you are a sex offender, correct?

Unless you are, you are making an absolutely an idiotic and crazy comparison. In that case you have bigger problems.

I would recommend that you find a different psychiatrist who doesn't go along with and enable your craziness.

... no, why do you keep bringing that up?


You were the one who compared yourself to a pedophile, not me.

Why is it an idiotic comparison? It's just a more extreme form of social deviance.


High libido is not a form of social deviance in any modern society.

I suspect you are spoiled, lonely, starved for attention, and fishing for it here with your self-destructive behavior. You won't get any more from me. Do yourself a favor and get a life.

Edited by viveutvivas, 06 March 2012 - 07:46 PM.

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#71 Ampa-omega

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 08:40 PM

I think if its bothering someone that must mean something is not right, it shouldn't be getting in the way of normal living, if it has those are indicators of a pathology.

if you guys have no problem with libido leave this thread to those who are having a issue, if its interrupting with normal life then i think its something that should get addressed.

#72 Tarantantino

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 12:54 AM

dont know if someone said it already, but take ciproterone acetate: your libido will be gone in 24 hours.

Edit: ok, you already tryied. and seen you wanna try dutasteride. let me tell you i tryied both (for hair loss), and androcur is way more potent, muuuuuuuuch more. Bromide could help too, Ritalin, etc

But if you wanna go hardcore...estradiol.

Edited by Tarantantino, 07 March 2012 - 01:00 AM.


#73 Destiny's Equation

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 02:31 AM

Thanks,

I already take CDP choline 250mg and Alpha GPC 300mg to improve cognition but can't say it has had any effect on libido. How much are you taking?


You’re welcome :)

I was taking 500 mg/day (I stopped taking it ages ago).

has the CDP choline worked long term? Do you have to take high doses?
Were you able to fully remove libido when you didn’t want it?


Yes it did work long-term.

It did not fully remove my libido, it just normalized it. Now I am able to get turned on when the time is right, but also able to turn it off and focus on other things when I need to.

Do you think it’s the choline?

You may have been a special case since you abused Benadryl so I don’t know if the cdp would work for everyone.


Perhaps acetylcholine-to-dopamine imbalances can be caused by other things too? (genetics, weird supplement regimens, etc.)

For individuals who try the CDP choline and find that it doesn’t do the trick I would suggest neurotransmitter testing to see if something else is out of whack.

#74 Destiny's Equation

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 02:34 AM

High libido is not a form of social deviance in any modern society.


Yes, it can be. Needing to relieve oneself constantly is an extremely time-consuming condition. Don’t we all need to have the time to work, go to school, contribute to life extension, develop our minds, have a life?

I suspect you are spoiled, lonely, starved for attention, and fishing for it here with your self-destructive behavior. You won't get any more from me. Do yourself a favor and get a life.


Khemix asked a straightforward question and deserves a straightforward answer, not hurtful accusations.

He has never judged you (has he?). So he does not deserve to be judged by you.

Please stop bullying him!

@Khemix: If it makes you feel any better I have been in your shoes many times. Many people on other forums live in a distorted version of reality and mistake me for a troll, then make cruel horrible stinging comments. Trying to make peace with them only adds fuel to the fire, because at that point they are not even listening to what I am saying; they have already judged me and made up their minds that I am something that I am not. It is enough to make me want to pull my hair out.

(Pats you on the back)
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#75 Ampa-omega

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 03:28 AM

Thanks for the update Destiny's Equation! I will be trying out doses of CDP choline.
I never meant make libido permanently gone. i sent you a pm.
why did you stop taking it?

Edited by Ampa-omega, 07 March 2012 - 03:35 AM.


#76 Orajel

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 02:48 AM

DXM will ruin your libido

#77 gamesguru

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 03:52 AM

DXM will ruin your libido

I suspect it will ruin more than just your libido. People have been complaining for years now about cognitive impairment and dysfunction which they think is attributable to DXM abuse. DXM is also an NDMA receptor antagonist, which are known to cause Olney's lesions in rodent brains via vacuolization (a most undesirable, and often irreversible process). They haven't been proven in monkeys or humans, suggesting something potentially fundamentally unique in the neurochemistry of all animals after primates.

Though it is thought to operate via the same mechanism of cyproterone or medroxyprogesterone, glycyrrhetinic acid (a compound naturally occurring in licorice) is a milder option for someone seeking lower testosterone and an anaphrodisiac effect (http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/2850159). But it may have negative effects if used excessively (http://www.nejm.org/...199110243251706). If I was getting urges and unable to masturbate for days or weeks, I might try to get ahold of some of these licorice extracts. The water lily (nymphaea alba) is also purported to have anaphrodisiac-like properties (in both men and women), though other sources cite it as an aphrodisiac.

Edited by dasheenster, 08 March 2012 - 03:55 AM.


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#78 Solthar

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 08:23 AM

I'm an Asexual with a grand total of zero libido, so I can offer a viewpoint from the other side of the fence.  Also, I find this thread and the arguments contained within to be quite fascinating.

The funny thing is, sex is so prevalent in today's societies that it is difficult to find a person to even accept the possibility of asexuality.  A high portion of people I've talked to always spout lines such as, "Oh, it's a phase. You'll grow out of it." (going on 30, I doubt I will) and "Did your parents rape you as a child?" (From a therapist my parents sent me to when I was in high school), and the "Go see a Doctor/Therapist - something's wrong with you!" (And just to be safe - I did.) . Also, while I understand the basic concepts of lust and sexual attraction, I've never felt either.  

You do view people differently than, from what I've observed, most people do. The easiest way to describe it would be to compare people to furniture.  You don't get sexually excited by furniture, do you? (if so, you're in the wrong area of the internet!)  To me, everyone is like a chair, table, or sofa.

If you have any questions on the topic, I'd be more then happy to expound.  Anyways, back to the topic at hand.  How about some more common anaphrodisiacs.

Chasteberry was said to be used by monks to reduce their sex drives.  It seems to build slowly over time.

Similar to above, Persicaria Odorata or Vietnamese Coriander was used by Buddhist monks to supress their sex drives.  Let me tell you as someone who cooks a lot of Vietnamese food - it STINKS.  There's a reason for that Odorata suffix :-P

Some people say L-Phenylalanine and L-Tyrosine work as an Anaphrodisiac.

Some people have reported that removing milk and wheat from their diet has helped somewhat.


All in all a reliable, safe, and effective way to reduce any given persons sex drive seems to be currently out of reach.  I do wish you luck, though.  Hope you get through whatever it is you're going through.
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#79 Republican0fHeaven

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 08:41 AM

Do you ever find the desire to be sexual? What you described is pretty much what I want. And thanks for the supplement recommendations.

#80 Solthar

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Posted 09 March 2012 - 05:07 AM

Do you ever find the desire to be sexual? What you described is pretty much what I want. And thanks for the supplement recommendations.

Personally? Not really. I've accepted that I am what I am quite a while ago, and moved on from there. Now, it'd be nice to have the social acceptance that is inherent from being a 'sexual'. Just understand that you likely will still have your urges, even if you find a supplement that works for you. It will just be toned down - hopefully to manageable levels.Anyways, I wish you luck on your quest - and heartily advise you to avoid doing anything permanent out of desperation.

#81 Tarantantino

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Posted 09 March 2012 - 06:43 PM

I repeat... Two caps of ciproterone per day and your libido dies sin 24-48 hours.
Estradiol and your libido dies ASAP

That said........... Losing your libido basicly means lowering testosterone levels in your body. Ok. Is that good? NO. What defines us as men? Testosterone, and not just phisically. What makes men competitive? Testosterone. It is proven that generally men with more testosterone levels achieve more things in life, including higher job positions, higher living standards, etc.Moreover, our endocrine system is extremly complex and we shouldnt not play with it, unless we have a prostate cancer or we have a serious sexual disfunction.

Another reason to be carefull is that I personally had a huge brain fog taking avodart (dutasteride) for hair loss. It seems that blocking DHT production harms your brain function somehow. There is not much info about this on internet, but I can tell you from other forums that this has happened to many people.

http://en.wikipedia....tase_deficiency

So... If you wanna reduce your libido for a reason, I would suggest doing it in a way that won't mess your endocrine system.

#82 manic_racetam

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Posted 10 March 2012 - 07:18 AM

Very interesting radio show on testosterone!

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#83 hooter

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Posted 10 March 2012 - 10:05 AM

Another reason to be carefull is that I personally had a huge brain fog taking avodart (dutasteride) for hair loss. It seems that blocking DHT production harms your brain function somehow. There is not much info about this on internet, but I can tell you from other forums that this has happened to many people.

So... If you wanna reduce your libido for a reason, I would suggest doing it in a way that won't mess your endocrine system.


So... If you wanna reduce your libido for a reason, I would suggest doing it in a way that won't mess your endocrine system.


So... If you wanna reduce your libido for a reason, I would suggest doing it in a way that won't mess your endocrine system.


So... If you wanna reduce your libido for a reason, I would suggest doing it in a way that won't mess your endocrine system.


So... If you wanna reduce your libido for a reason, I would suggest doing it in a way that won't mess your endocrine system.


This.

Edited by hooter, 10 March 2012 - 10:05 AM.


#84 khemix

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Posted 10 March 2012 - 08:40 PM

I repeat... Two caps of ciproterone per day and your libido dies sin 24-48 hours.
Estradiol and your libido dies ASAP

I took Cyproterone acetate (we call it androcur) 50mg up to two times daily after hearing it was the most potent antiandrogen. And yes, there was a massive reduction in libido (though it was never completely irradiated). However, the effects of low T were horrendous and not worth living with. The biggest problem was I had zero energy to do anything and slept all day and still felt tired all the time. I felt very senile too, my memory was horrible, and my thinking was a lot slower.

I think I tried estradiol once but for a very short period of time, ~1 week. I didn't notice much of a reduction in libido. In fact, the only thing I believe I noticed was that my face got all oily.

That said........... Losing your libido basicly means lowering testosterone levels in your body. Ok. Is that good? NO. What defines us as men? Testosterone, and not just phisically. What makes men competitive? Testosterone. It is proven that generally men with more testosterone levels achieve more things in life, including higher job positions, higher living standards, etc.Moreover, our endocrine system is extremly complex and we shouldnt not play with it, unless we have a prostate cancer or we have a serious sexual disfunction.

I agree. It is not possible to live with the reduced energy and cognition of low T.

Another reason to be carefull is that I personally had a huge brain fog taking avodart (dutasteride) for hair loss. It seems that blocking DHT production harms your brain function somehow. There is not much info about this on internet, but I can tell you from other forums that this has happened to many people.

I am with you, my mind was not as sharp while on avodart. This is very surprising, as it was almost as bad as the more potent androcur. The reduction is libido was also marginal at best which leads me to believe DHT is not all that important in maintaining it.

So... If you wanna reduce your libido for a reason, I would suggest doing it in a way that won't mess your endocrine system.

I am open to anything. Anything that won't screw with cognition. I don't care about weight gain, etc. Just let me keep my brain and I'll trade my libido.


This.

Go back to your shrooms, hooter.

Edited by khemix, 10 March 2012 - 08:42 PM.


#85 Destiny's Equation

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Posted 10 March 2012 - 10:17 PM

So... If you wanna reduce your libido for a reason, I would suggest doing it in a way that won't mess your endocrine system.

I am open to anything. Anything that won't screw with cognition. I don't care about weight gain, etc. Just let me keep my brain and I'll trade my libido.


I'm sorry to say this, but messing with your endocrine system will screw with cognition.

There must be some imbalance somewhere that is causing the problem; I would suggest you invest in some tests (neurotransmitter testing, for starters).

#86 Elus

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Posted 10 March 2012 - 11:34 PM

If you have any questions on the topic, I'd be more then happy to expound.


Hi,

Do you think your asexuality has had a positive impact on keeping you productive and focused?

Thanks.

#87 Lufega

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Posted 11 March 2012 - 02:30 AM

Two capsules of this product killed my libido for a week. Oddly enough, 1 capsule enhances that and erection rigidity.

#88 ta5

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Posted 11 March 2012 - 10:37 PM

Asian J Androl. 2002 Dec;4(4):295-8.
Effect of Withania somnifera root extract on the sexual behaviour of male rats.
AIM: To determine the effect of a methanolic extract of Withania somnifera (L.) Dunal roots on sexual competence of male rats.
METHODS: Male rats were orally administered 3000 mg.kg-1.day-1 of root extract for 7 days. Their sexual behaviour was evaluated 7 days prior to treatment, day 3 and 7 of treatment, and day 7, 14 and 30 post-treatment by pairing each male with a receptive female.
RESULTS: The root extract induced a marked impairment in libido, sexual performance, sexual vigour, and penile erectile dysfunction. These effects were partly reversible on cessation of treatment. These antimasculine effects are not due to changes in testosterone levels or toxicity but may be attributed to hyperprolactinemic, GABAergic, serotonergic or sedative activities of the extract.
CONCLUSION: Use of W. somnifera roots may be detrimental to male sexual competence.

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#89 ta5

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 11:31 AM

Effect of Withania somnifera root extract on the sexual behaviour of male rats.

In men at lower doses it may to do the opposite.

Evid Based Complement Alternat Med. 2009 Sep 29.
Withania somnifera Improves Semen Quality in Stress-Related Male Fertility.
Stress has been reported to be a causative factor for male infertility. Withania somnifera has been documented in Ayurveda and Unani medicine system for its stress-combating properties. However, limited scientific literature is available on this aspect of W. somnifera. We undertook the present study to understand the role of stress in male infertility, and to test the ability of W. somnifera to combat stress and treat male infertility. We selected normozoospermic but infertile individuals (N = 60), further categorized in three groups: normozoospermic heavy smokers (N = 20), normozoospermics under psychological stress (N = 20) and normozoospermics with infertility of unknown etiology (N = 20). Normozoospermic fertile men (N = 60) were recruited as controls. The subjects were given root powder of W. somnifera at a rate of 5 g/day for 3 months. Measuring various biochemical and stress parameters before and after treatment, suggested a definite role of stress in male infertility and the ability of W. somnifera to treat stress-related infertility. Treatment resulted in a decrease in stress, improved the level of anti-oxidants and improved overall semen quality in a significant number of individuals. The treatment resulted in pregnancy in the partners of 14% of the patients.
http://pmid.us/19789214

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#90 gamesguru

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 08:37 PM

Even though we've tentatively agreed that testosterone suppression isn't the best way to reduce libido, I'll repost this: http://medherb.com/M...estosterone.htm. Licorice has other helpful effects, and harmful effects at high doses. I've been experimenting with it lately for its ability to help with my acid reflux/poor stomach lining/intestines, asthma/lungs, and my viral infections, but I haven't noticed effects upon my libido. I will keep note for a few more weeks to see if I can discern an anaphrodisatic effect.



Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: libido, ssri, testosterone, antipsychotic, sexuality

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