36 replies to this topic

[bixbyte]

An enlightened and open discussion is the best way to accompany experimental data.
BTW, I do concur on the great interest of cyclodextrins in steroid and steroid-like molecule biodisponibility.

JFS

I have 100 grams of Cyclodextrin I purchased to self test but I am slightly fearful of the side effects.

2-hydroxypropyl-beta-cyclodextrin

I might be a lab rat, but I am waiting to make sure it is safe.
Plus the compound takes many hours to mix.

[niner]

I have been looking everywhere for the solubility of resveratol in limonene, and I can't find it. I did find that limonene and ethanol are soluble in all portions, www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9924496

This implies to me, that it should have about the same solubility in limonene.

Where do people by the resveratol to put in their ethanol solutions? Almost all of the resveratol I have found is in pill form, mixed with many other ingredients. I did find some from Sigma Aldrich. At $1 / mg, it seems overpriced.

I am looking for another source. I can measure the solubility in limonene myself, if I can just find some pure resveratol somewhere.

The miscibility of ethanol and limonene doesn't necessarily mean that resveratrol will dissolve in limonene, though it probably would to at least some extent. $1000/gm is, as you surmised, a bit overpriced. RevGenetics sells resveratrol in (micronized) powder form. Because it is micronized, the powder is pretty expensive- $3.00/gm. It would be cheaper to buy a capped non-micronized version, dissolve it in something, and filter out the insoluble flow agents.

I dislike the idea of drinking vodka. I am OK with the limonene, but am unsure that it would actually dissolve in the limonene. I am only guessing it would dissolve.

Hmm. You're ok with an unsaturated hydrocarbon, but not with good ol' ethanol? That wouldn't be my choice. You might be able to get it to dissolve in limonene at some level, though I suspect you'd have better luck with ethanol. Maybe you could start with an ethanol solution, using a high concentration of ethanol (95.5%; 191 proof, e.g. Everclear), then drip it into limonene while stirring. That would probably be easier than trying to get it to dissolve in limonene from the solid state.

[ClarkSims]

Hmm. You're ok with an unsaturated hydrocarbon, but not with good ol' ethanol? That wouldn't be my choice.

The only side effects that I have found for limonene, are that some people are allergic to it, and that it dries out the skin. Ethanol impairs judgement, is addictive, and can stress the liver. Am I missing something? Isn't limonene a much better choice, assuming it dissolves the resveratol?

Oh, and I forgot, ethanol is full of empty calories.

[niner]

Hmm. You're ok with an unsaturated hydrocarbon, but not with good ol' ethanol? That wouldn't be my choice.

The only side effects that I have found for limonene, are that some people are allergic to it, and that it dries out the skin. Ethanol impairs judgement, is addictive, and can stress the liver. Am I missing something? Isn't limonene a much better choice, assuming it dissolves the resveratol?

Oh, and I forgot, ethanol is full of empty calories.

Ethanol has some well known negatives, that's true, but if it's used properly, the long term epidemiology looks pretty good. If you're only using it as a vehicle for resveratrol, the effect on the liver and the calories aren't likely to be a problem. I admit that starting the day with a vodka shot probably isn't a good idea, and there are certainly people who shouldn't drink at all due to addiction issues. Limonene might be ok, but alkenes are reactive, and from a chemist's perspective, it doesn't look like something that I'd want to ingest. I don't know how much we know about the long term toxicity in humans, but I'm guessing not all that much.

[ClarkSims]

Ethanol has some well known negatives, that's true, but if it's used properly, the long term epidemiology looks pretty good. If you're only using it as a vehicle for resveratrol, the effect on the liver and the calories aren't likely to be a problem. I admit that starting the day with a vodka shot probably isn't a good idea,

I have come around to your way of thinking, after I did a little math. Given a saturated solution of resveratrol in ethanol,
50g / litter = 50 ml / ml

given 1 teaspoon of of this solution
4.92 ml => 246 mg of resveratrol

1/2 teaspoon in the morning and 1/2 teaspoon in the evening wont even be noticeable as far as intoxication is concerned. The bacteria in the intestines produce a few grams per day anyway. This is just above baseline dosage that everyone is already getting from the bacteria in their gut.

This is a lot less than one shot of vodka.
In the US there is about 90 ml in a shot. The sizes vary from about 50 ml, to 100 ml

http://en.wikipedia....hot_glass#Sizes

Edited by ClarkSims, 17 March 2013 - 12:36 PM.

[niner]

Well, there's still a problem though. That level of saturation would only be for very high strength (if not anhydrous) ethanol, and you wouldn't be able to drink it. If you dilute it enough to be drinkable, then the solubility will drop a lot. Further, as soon as it hits your stomach, it will mostly come out of solution anyway, as the alcohol is further diluted. I think you'd be better off with micronized resveratrol, either straight or mixed with an emulsifier. The only way that I think alcohol really makes sense is if you're shooting for buccal absorption by swishing it around in your mouth for a few minutes. People have reported big psychotropic effects from that. This could be done as an adjunct to oral dosing.

[hav]

Clark,

I occasionally mix a teaspoon of resveratrol in about a quarter shot of 151 proof rum and either swish it around my mouth or mix that into baileys. Strictly as an occasional adjunct to oral supplementation by capsule.

I've also experimented with dissolving it into dmso. Seems to dissolve as well as with alcohol. But it drops out of solution as soon as it encounters any water... much quicker that if dissolved in alcohol. And the taste of dmso is so horrid I didn't have the guts to put it into my mouth. You can get it into a veggie-cap if you take it immediately. But if it drops out of solution in your stomach as soon as the capsule dissolves, there's probably nothing gained.

You might want to check out this gummy bear thread. I haven't tried it myself but if you want to avoid the alcohol it might be a good alternative.

Howard