7 replies to this topic

[Ampamet]

Despite all of the nootropics and stimulants I've tried, I never bothered with the prototypical piracetam. Last week I ordered some authentic Geratam and began to take it in varying amounts. I also have a fair amount of metadoxine that I ordered a while back. Alone both products do have an effect. Piracetam is rather mild and metadoxine does provide a lucid and anti-fatigue effect over a 1-2 hour period. But just today I discovered the combination of 2400 mg of Piracetam with 1000 mg of Metadoxine provides an extremely lucid mindset. I tried it around 5pm and as of now I still feel the effects. It manifests as high amounts of motivation (just cleaned parts of my apartment I've been putting off for months) and a clear mind that makes it easy to focus.

Pharmacologically, I could not say what is going on here. Both drugs share a pyroglutamate structure (metadoxine is a salt of vitamin B6 and pyroglutamic acid). I've read that pyroglutamic acid combines synergistically with racetams, but metadoxine research done recently for ADHD shows that metadoxine acts differently than its constituent vitamin B6 and pyroglutamic acid components. That is, it has been observed to be a 5-HT2B receptor antagonist.

If this combination is anything like metadoxine extended release (http://www.alcobra-p...roductID=142236), I can see why Alcobra is pursuing it for ADHD. I recommend others to try this out if they have metadoxine and piracetam on hand.

[Alpha_Master]

Can you tell me more on how Metadoxine is working for you? What is metadoxine like on its own? And how does it compared to Modafinil if you've tried it before?

I've been following Metadoxine XL (Alcobra) and it looks extremely promising.

[formergenius]

Interesting.. It seems to suppress CREB.

[Ampamet]

Metadoxine is very interesting, I've tried to get a group buy going on the drug but no one seems interested. It's cheap to source from China and safer than more exotic nootropics. I had a hard time noticing its effects when combined with other stimulants (be it caffeine, modafinil, or amphetamine) but on its own I notice an effect. I get a natural feeling anti fatigue effect from it. Basically the best way I can describe is that any drowsiness or tiredness I have goes away within an hour after taking metadoxine. It only lasts for at most 3 hours though. The feeling is anti-fatigue in a stricter sense than even modafinil. By that I mean there are no side effects or any artificial feeling from it whatsoever. 

 

Currently metadoxine is used for acute alcohol intoxication or the hepatotoxic effects of chronic alcoholism. I have noticed the antagonistic effects on alcohol intoxication this drug has as well. If I take 1000mg after having a few drinks, the alcohol's effects are dulled and my body seems to eliminate it faster. 

 

All of its effects, whether on liver regeneration, ethanol antagonism, and cognitive enhancement, are due to 5-HT2B receptors in different parts of the body. These receptors are actually present in the damaged livers of alcoholics and in everyone's brain. The 5-HT2B receptor antagonism of metadoxine exerts downstream effects on increasing dopamine levels in the PFC while decreasing them in the NAc (desired for cognitive enhancement), and favorably modulating the GABA-glutamate brain balance. I read a detailed paper on serotonin receptor subtypes where researchers tested another 5-HT2B antagonist and found these effects. If I can find it again, I'll post it here. 

 

 

[Ampamet]

Basically Alcobra has found for the ADHD-PI subtype that metadoxine works faster, and as good as if not better than stimulant medication. It does not require any dose titration, is not addictive, and they did not mention any tolerance after 6 weeks of the phase IIb trials. They are enrolling/starting phase III trials; if you are diagnosed ADHD and have the time I'd say try to enroll. I also tried to see if any manufacturer would make an ER form of metadoxine (Alcobra's patents have several forms) but haven't had luck. This is definitely something a lab that synthesizes NSI-189 or EVP-6124 could make. 

[Alpha_Master]

Very interesting. I have some on order (non-ER) from all day chemist coming in about 4 weeks. Have you heard of dihydromyricetin? It has similar anti-intoxication effects though it seems to work on antagonizing GABA-A receptors. I have since tried a 150mg of this stuff and have noticed a very calm and clear headed feeling for only about 1-2 hours after ingesting it. 

I think metadoxine *ER may be the next non-stimulant adhd drug on the market that will have similar success to guanfacine / intuniv. 

[Ampamet]

Very interesting. I have some on order (non-ER) from all day chemist coming in about 4 weeks. Have you heard of dihydromyricetin? It has similar anti-intoxication effects though it seems to work on antagonizing GABA-A receptors. I have since tried a 150mg of this stuff and have noticed a very calm and clear headed feeling for only about 1-2 hours after ingesting it. 

I think metadoxine *ER may be the next non-stimulant adhd drug on the market that will have similar success to guanfacine / intuniv. 

I haven't heard of dihydromyricetin, looks interesting though. Metadoxine doesn't bind to any receptor besides 5-HT2B. I actually think metadoxine ER could be the best ADHD-PI drug on the market when it comes out, even better than stimulant medication. And ADC is where I purchased mine. 

Edited by Ampamet, 09 April 2014 - 06:24 PM.

[MankindRising]

Any legit european source for metadoxine? All Ive found is some dodgy ebay vendors.