LONGECITY

Originally posted by bghtn


Forgive me if this is off topic. Seems like I remember reading some time ago about a nootropic(s) that increases motivation. I did a search on Google and only came up with one article that references Deprenyl.
Can anyone reccomend a product or combination of products that may help me with my motivation?
I am an avid supplement taker and have been for several years. As a foundation I take multi-vitamin, enzyymes, and pycnogenols, on top of that I will cycle in herbs and other supplements depending on the current need. I have tried ephedra but I do not tolerate it very well. Also I don't think my lack of motivation is anything that a CNS stimulant will help.
Thank you for any replies.

Welcome bghtn,
Here's a product that may help... I don't take myself, I take 4 individual nootropics separately, however, this new product may be of interest to those just getting into nootropics.


In terms of motivation specifically... motivation is naturally a subjective feeling, and in that capacity, difficult to measure and/or change as there are a many outside influences that would effect ones desire... however, I think I know what you're asking... and I hope this helps.


Originally Posted By LifeMirage

GET SMART is a new Nootropic combination that contains: Vinpocetine, Idebenone, Galantamine, Huperzine A, Pyritinol, and other brain nutrients like DMAE, Gingko, Bacopa, and Rhodiola root. It costs $15-30 a month.



Source: See Nootropic Sources.


(Notice: the Immortality Institute is not affiliated in any way with Smart-Nutrtition, nor do we take any responsibility for the safety or effectiveness of their products. Thanks)



Follow up by LifeMirage:

Hello all, I tried the Get Smart formula with moderate results. For the most part it worked very well but for me it took 2-4 a day to have those results. (Mind you I take most of these compounds individually, in higher doses). So I would recommend the product for beginner's in those interested in Nootropics or those who want a simple nootropic combination (If you don't want to take ten pills a day this may be for you).

LifeMirage
Quote: Trial and Error

Hello Of all the Nootropics I have tried only 2 have increased my motivation; Deprenyl and Galantamine. Those are the ones I can recommend.

Thank you B)

Many times lack of motivation can be linked to mild depression.

Recent articles state that the majority of the population experience at least mild depression at least a few times in their lives. Many people probably have mild cases and aren't even aware of it.

Instead of going the prescription Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor route which is rife with negative side effects, I would recommend over the counter SAM-e and 5-HTP three times a day.

These are not recognized as nootropics in the true sense. But since they stimulate and increased production or serotonin in the brain, work for me at least is perceived as being more of a pleasureful and the sense of anxiety that often accompanies tasks that require great amount of time and effort are dramatically reduced.

One potential side-effect of this regimin can be an increased level of Homocystine in the bloodstream. For that reason it is recommended that you take a good B-Complex at least once a day to modulate the Homocystine.

Adrafinal is motivational without being a traditional CNS stimulant.

Instead of going the prescription Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor route which is rife with negative side effects, I would recommend over the counter SAM-e and 5-HTP three times a day.

I'm sure the recommendation is well-intentioned, but depression isn't that simple. Not all depression has anything to do with serotonin reuptake, and taking a serotonin supplement doesn't fix the type of depression that does involve reuptake.

I'm sure everyone here is full of zeal at sharing the results of their chemical binges, but bear in mind that you're not a physician (or, if you are, you're being careless with your advice).

If you're going to give people treatment advice for serious medical conditions, I would hope you have the decency to give them all the relevant warnings associated with the substances you are recommending. It is only ethical.

Let me fill in the blanks, in the interests of safety and completeness:

5-hydroxytryptophan (5-HTP) is the chemical precursor to serotonin (as tryptophan is the chemical precursor to niacin (which is why many of you get strange and abnormally lucid dreams after Thanksgiving dinner)) and is only useful in depression treatment as a way to boost serotonin. There's nothing more I need to clarify about it. Read on, though, to see why this won't necessarily do anything for your depression.

S-adenosylmethionine (SAMe) is a methyl donor that naturally occurs in your body. When the SAMe is done donating its methyl group it has decomposed into homocysteine, as AIGuy mentioned. What he neglected to mention is that homocysteine is highly toxic. That means it is necessary to also take B6, B12, and folic acid supplements with SAMe so the homocysteine can be reintegrated into the methylation cycle. In short, taking SAMe supplements isn't safe just because the body naturally produces it. High homocysteine levels have been shown to cause depression. That means that taking SAMe supplements can potentially make your existing depression worse.

Depression is not caused by a SAMe deficiency, so it's not necessarily logically sound to try to treat depression with SAMe supplements. To be sure, there are studies that have showed that SAMe can treat depression, but, as yet, the exact nerochemical mechanism of this is unknown. Similar to Dramamine being used as an antiemetic, we feel justified in putting the chemical on the open market without actually knowing how it works. (The fact that Dramamine prevents nausea is actually a side effect. Dramamine is an antihistamine very closely related to Benadryl.)

No study on SAMe has ever shown it to be more effective in treating depression than a prescription antidepressant, and many studies have shown it to be significantly less effective. There is no dispute, however, that SAMe has far less side effects associated with prolonged use than any prescription antidepressant, and it has no side effects associated with sudden discontinuation. Note that SAMe should not be used by those with bipolar disorder, as it will only make your condition worse. (Bipolar disorder is characterized by periods of mania followed immediately by periods of severe depression. In bipolar disorder, the depression is a direct result of the mania, and SAMe can cause a manic episode.)

Everything I have said so far about SAMe being useful to treat depression has pertained to depression that is due to serotonin reuptake causing norepinephrine levels to fall. It is not necessarily so that serotonin reuptake is the mechanism by which YOUR case of depression depletes your norepinephrine. If it's not, SAMe and 5-HTP won't do jack for your depression (although they very well could give you a slight ecstacy-like high for a time). It is almost equally likely that there's nothing wrong with your serotonin levels at all. As I said before, depression isn't that simple. If it were, you wouldn't need a doctor to diagnose and treat it.


I realize I'm a newcomer to these fora and that this post seems harsh (and probably won't be received well as a result), but the reason that I was compelled to register and make this post is because I am also deeply interested in various nootropics, and I would like to see more factual data about those nootropics in this forum. I consider it to be extremely careless for people here to presume to diagnose someone they've never met with depression, let alone recommend a treatment for depression that has the capacity to make the condition worse. No, I don't moderate or administrate the forum and thus have no control over what is and is not tolerated (and I wouldn't have it any other way, in that respect), but when you start rendering amateur medical advice it really stops being a matter of rules and more a matter of ethics. Diagnosis and treatment options are a matter to be settled with medical doctors, in meatspace, after having been thoroughly examined. "What nootropic can potentially increase my motivation" doesn't, in my understanding of the English language, mean the same thing as "Do I have depression and if so what should I take for it?"

I came here because I want factual data and the citations of specific studies that support that data, not because I wanted to read the post of someone who read a leaflet once about 5-HTP and SAMe being used to treat depression, and as a result feels qualified to recommend them to anyone in lieu of prescription medication. That may not be the reality of the situation, but that's how I see it.


Oh, and as for the topic at hand, I would have to reinforce BJKlein's point. "Motivation" is not something that can be easily quantified, and as such no definite supplement can be recommended. It may be that the "Get Smart" formula BJKlein suggested will work for you, but I would favor a more simplistic approach first:

Many people feel a lack of motivation during the day because they have poor sleep habits. Don't get more or less than 7-8 hours of sleep a night. You may want to eat an apple when you wake up: it helps a great deal. Maintain a regular sleep schedule, and stay off your bed unless you intend to go to sleep. If you consume caffeine regularly, discontinue. Don't intake too much sugar in the first 12 hours you are awake. Doing (or not doing, as is appropriate) any one of these things will probably give you significantly more motivation, but obviously adhering to all of them is most likely to benefit you.

If your lack of motivation can be directly linked to something you consume (not that I would assume you smoke cannabis, or anything...), it goes without saying that the first thing you should do is discontinue that substance, notwithstanding prescription medication. If you think a prescription is causing you lethargy, tell your doctor.

Nootropics and CNS stimulants are not a substitute for proper sleep and dietary habits, and should not be used as such.

And, as always, you should ultimately do your own research and make up your own mind.

I realize I'm a newcomer to these fora and that this post seems harsh (and probably won't be received well as a result)

On the contrary, I think you will find many that welcome the time and effort you've spent sharing your thoughts and knowledge. Clarity and completeness are seldom found in open forums in individual posts and the contributions of everyone are essential in generating a truly useful overview of a topic.

I am certainly here to learn and share in the effort of working towards a longer healthier life. Please continue!
Edited by kperrott, 05 July 2003 - 09:57 PM.

I think someone should point out the obvious that these supplements don't really teach you how to think they just help with one's abilty to process and retain information am I right?

I think someone should point out the obvious that these supplements don't really teach you how to think they just help with one's abilty to process and retain information am I right?

First most of them are drugs not dietary supplements.

Second how could pills teach you anything?

They are do far more than just enhance one ability to process and retain info.

So, yes and no.

That was unclear. I guess I'm just afraid of the idea of reaching the limits of my human consiousness or at least trying to reach those limits. There are so many Nootropics that I want to try I am just intimidated because most people don't take these drugs. But i know that this is something I have to work out in me. Also do regular pharmacys carry these drugs?

That was unclear.

Your questions were not remarkably specific; please clarify your concern or statement.

I guess I'm just afraid of the idea of reaching the limits of my human consciousness or at least trying to reach those limits.

I believe one of the goals of humanity is reaching and exceeds our limits.


There are so many Nootropics that I want to try I am just intimidated because most people don't take these drugs.

Most people don’t, they usually do drugs or compounds that damage the brain or body.

But i know that this is something I have to work out in me.

Also do regular pharmacies carry these drugs?

In the US some carry them, but mostly compounding pharmacies. Examples: Deprenyl, Hydergine, Galantamine, Vasopressin, and Piracetam.

Over the counter in the US: Galantamine, Piracetam, Pyritinol, Picamilon, Idebenone, CDP-Choline, Alpha GPC, Vinpocetine, and Vincamine.

Only overseas: Centrophenoxine and Aniracetam.

HI all,

As some have mentioned, drugs or herbs are not magic bullets for any mental disorder. Mere suppresive methods, they must always be accompanied by therapy. And to mild depression-drugs will not cure it, you need to identify, isolate, and then erradicate the problem causing depression. Also excersise and diet have been proven to effect motivation as well as over all mental health. Only drug I would recommend are vitamins and minerals.

I've seen many piracetam users report that they get more things done while under influence. I intend to try piracetam and deprenyl for the purpose of increased motivation when I have some money .

Sulbutiamine helps

I came across this thread looking for ideas regarding motivation. In particular, I've used amantadine in the past on two separate occasions. I have MS and it was prescribed to help with fatigue, but I noticed this rush of motivation that was not stimulative.

I would see things and just do them and enjoyed the process and reward for lack of a better way of saying it. Like doing the dishes or taking out the trash. I have some form of ADHD, whether inattentive or combined or limbic and the effect of the amantadine was remarkable. The problem is that it loses its effectiveness after a week.

The second time around I tried the suspension in order to use a much lower dose but the same thing happens.

I'd be interested in anyone have any ideas as to supplements that might make it work for longer periods of time.

While I'm at it, years ago I took Strattera and the effect was amazing for about 18 months and then it stopped working. I've gone back and tried it again on numerous occasions, but was never able to see any positive results.

I've wondered if it was effective for a period of time because I was taking a combination of something else. What that something else is I don't know because having MS means lots of prescriptions.

Many thanks

Who bumps 10 a year old post,honestly?

Yeah I saw that, kinda funny, especially for such an abrupt post haha. But this guy above didn't, he was just following the trend. Now that we have resurrected this thread from the dead, we may as well add some meat to its bones. The fact that you responded so well to strattera indicates that this is a dopamine issue, which in the case of motivation almost always seems to be the case.

People who use the CILTEP stack have reported good motivational effects from that combination, as well as consistency through time. Personally I cannot use this, as it gives me insomnia, but I as far as I gather I am an unusual case in that pretty much every decent chemical nootropic gives me insomnia.

Another thing to consider in the dopamine case is that many, many things in contemporary daily life produce can direct and powerful dopamine hits, desensitising receptors. The biggest culprit for this is pornography/masturbation. That hit you get on orgasm? That's a massive chemical overload, and causes desensitisation on a massive scale, across many neurotransmitter systems. Personally I've had great effects from abstaining from all sexual gratification of any kinds, and especially pornography. Granted, this is difficult, as the male libido is one ravenous beast, but even a decent cut down will boost your motivational levels substantially.

Along with this, if you play a lot of video games/use a lot of social media/eat a lot of sugary/fatty foods, these also down-regulate receptors and hence reduce motivation. From a biological standpoint this makes sense - if your immediate desires are satisfied why would your brain secrete the chemicals which cause you to seek to do other things? As far as it's concerned, you've fulfilled your biological imperatives for now. I think this is a huge reason why motivation is a problem in today's generation, myself included. Gratification is mostly immediate, hence motivational pathways atrophy.

Now that we have resurrected this thread from the dead, we may as well add some meat to its bones. The fact that you responded so well to strattera indicates that this is a dopamine issue, which in the case of motivation almost always seems to be the case.

People who use the CILTEP stack have reported good motivational effects from that combination, as well as consistency through time. Personally I cannot use this, as it gives me insomnia, but I as far as I gather I am an unusual case in that pretty much every decent chemical nootropic gives me insomnia.

Another thing to consider in the dopamine case is that many, many things in contemporary daily life produce can direct and powerful dopamine hits, desensitising receptors. The biggest culprit for this is pornography/masturbation. That hit you get on orgasm? That's a massive chemical overload, and causes desensitisation on a massive scale, across many neurotransmitter systems. Personally I've had great effects from abstaining from all sexual gratification of any kinds, and especially pornography. Granted, this is difficult, as the male libido is one ravenous beast, but even a decent cut down will boost your motivational levels substantially.

Along with this, if you play a lot of video games/use a lot of social media/eat a lot of sugary/fatty foods, these also down-regulate receptors and hence reduce motivation. From a biological standpoint this makes sense - if your immediate desires are satisfied why would your brain secrete the chemicals which cause you to seek to do other things? As far as it's concerned, you've fulfilled your biological imperatives for now. I think this is a huge reason why motivation is a problem in today's generation, myself included. Gratification is mostly immediate, hence motivational pathways atrophy.

I was searching for this very issue and this post is the most honest assessment, even though a bitter pill to swallow. If anyone's a better idea I'm all ears.
Edited by jack black, 15 September 2016 - 12:17 PM.

Exercise, fish, rice, broccoli, uridine, forskolin, NAC, green tea, ginkgo, and ginseng.  With side effects: tobacco and amphetamine.  Without so much: Mu Gua, mucuna and shilajit.  Can also vouch for No video games, No marihuana, NoFB and NoPorn.  The ginkgo, ginseng, and tea are pretty effective on their own.

Phenylpiracetam in doses between 100-300mg.  Stacks well with a number of things if CNS stimulants ARE your thing.

 

Otherwise, there are a number of recent books I can recommend on motivation--

 

Rethinking the Science of Positive Thinking:  Inside the new science of motivation by Gabrielle Oettinger

 

Is just one.

 

Love this topic.  IMO the best way to crack the motivational code is to think more in terms of habit building and unconscious v. conscious thought, or even to couch it in terms of addiction and addictive behavior.

 

I remember explaining to my weight obsessed sister in law that she should NOT look down on obese people because they are not always "just lazy" and while she might ascribe her weight to "will power,"  I could easily prove "will power" had nothing to do with it; since, she would find it as difficult as many of those obese people to GAIN weight as they would to lose it.

 

While I was training for a marathon a few years ago, I reached a point where NOT running 4 plus miles would cause me more mental distress/loss of energy than running the 4 plus miles.

Nicotine

I've been combining in the last months Strattera (50 mg) and Moclobemide (150 mg). Strattera has been a great help for my ADD while Moclobemide helped a lot with motivation, alertness and sociability.

I always used Rhodiola for mental energy and ashwagandha for anxiety. Currently I'm on Modafinil and it gives amazing results.

HAPPY STACK:
Uridine
Super Omega 3-6-9
Alpha GPC 300 – Choline