HOT-ROX
macdog 07 Apr 2004
Initially, I was attracted to ROX because they put out a 6 page spread in the GNC magazine whihc in addition to the usual hype, carefully explained the chemistry of how the products in ROX worked separately and individually. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to find that description again, and the ROX website is pathetic. What I'll do here is to list what I remember of that description, and the ingredients in ROX. Maybe some of you chemists can point out what is supposed to happen. Any mistakes in the description of the chemical activity is my fault. Here goes:
ROX inhibits the hormone that causes the body to take calories from the bloodstream and deposit them in fat cells.
ROX stimulates the release of fats from storage sites.
ROX is thermogenic, causing some calories to be burned as heat energy
Hemodilation speeds the delivery of nutrients to muscle tissue, and helps to wash lactic acid from the muscles, reducing fatigue and supporting calorie burning muscle. ROX does not stimulate the heart, and may even reduce blood pressure through this hemodilation.
Those are the basic point. Here are the ingredients.
Thiamin 20mg
Niacin 20mg\
Pantothenic Acid 20mg
Pyridoxal-5-phosphate 50mg
B12 (methylcobalamin) 995mcg
The following is listed as the Thermogenic formula
totalling 950mg
N-acetyl-L-tyrosine
MDX complex (3,17-dihydrox-delta-5-etiocholane-7-one-diethylcarbonate)
Sclaremax (a proprietary Salvia sclerea extract)
guggulsterone-Z
guggulsteron-E
caffeine
5-hydroxl-L-tryptophan
I personally vouch for this product's safety and effectiveness. The first time I took this, I did a huge weight lifting regime, and then spent 5 hours doing statistical clustering analysis of four digit lottery numbers by hand FOR FUN! I'd really be interested in hearing other people's reaction to this product.
Kalepha 07 Apr 2004
Edited by Nate Barna, 07 April 2004 - 08:21 PM.
bacopa 07 Apr 2004
As someone who has no choice but to take certain medications for a nuerological disorder, it was very common for me to have to take a nap in mid-afternoon, sometimes even if I did have a late afternoon cup of coffee.
I have OCD which causes me to need more sleep and loss of consistent thought trains every now and than, but not that bad...tell me if you hated ephedra, which I do as well....how does hot rox contribute to weight loss without the amphetamine rapid heart problem?
I do take Piracatem and I'm STILL not sure what kind or to what degree of an effect it has on me cognitively.. [huh]
shpongled 08 Apr 2004
macdog 08 Apr 2004
In any case, I decided to call Biotest Labs who make ROX, and their going to send me a pamphlet on the exact chemical actions of ROX. I should get it by Friday, and will try to have it transcribed and posted by the end of the weekend.
macdog 08 Apr 2004
I just really love the avatar, and wanted to say thanks to my anonymous benefactor.
On another note while talking to the people at Biotest they indicated that they think ROX may in fact, permanently reset the metabolic rate. Exactly how they don't know yet. This is a very new product, and they've just begun to explore all of the potential benefits. They have many reports of it acting nootropically and becoming more effective with time rather than less, a common downfall for many supplements.
I'd be very interested to hear of the product being used in conjuction with other supplements. Right now I can't afford to, but I really want to try it with Gingko, NO2, and St. John Wort, and maybe Kava. Melatonin as well might be interesting. I have experimented with using it conjunction with yohimbe, an herbal product I have found to be quite powerful. the problem with yohimbe for me has been a tendency to anxiety, but the last time I took it with ROX while I was definitely "amped" it wasn't anxiety. However, there was some mild chest discomfort that didn't seem to heart rate related, and a tingling feeling in my face. Still, while I'm all too willing to absorb some risks in self-experimentation, yohimbe is pretty powerful stuff in my experience, and I don't add to my daily regime lightly.
I'd really, really like to hear from some other who decide to try this out. Just remember that it seems to work best by slowly building to an attack dose over three days, taking it regularly for 6 weeks, and then downdosing.
shpongled 09 Apr 2004
Thiamin 20mg
Niacin 20mg\
Pantothenic Acid 20mg
Pyridoxal-5-phosphate 50mg
B12 (methylcobalamin) 995mcg
Just B vitamins (definitely good ones), you should be taking a B complex anyway
-N-acetyl-L-tyrosine
Less bioavailable than L-tyrosine. More expensive. See:
Topall G, Laborit H. Brain tyrosine increases after treating with prodrugs: comparison with tyrosine. J Pharm Pharmacol 1989 Nov;41(11):789-91.
Wykes LJ, House JD, Ball RO, Pencharz PB. Aromatic amino acid metabolism of neonatal piglets receiving TPN: effect of tyrosine precursors. Am J Physiol 1994 Nov;267(5 Pt 1):E672-9.
-3,17-dihydrox-delta-5-etiocholane-7-one-diethylcarbonate
I don't know anything about this. There is no scientific literature on it that I know of. That in itself is enough to warrant quite a bit of caution. According to Biotest it increases T3 levles. This is good for fat loss, not so good for muscle preservation, and won't have any nootropic effects.
-Guggulsterones E & Z
These increase the peripheral T4-T3 conversion rate. A few trials show guggul to cause mild weight loss, only one had adequate design. The same stuff as above applies.
-Caffeine
I'm pretty sure we are all familiar with this ingredient.
-5-HTP
Definitely not "thermogenic," but appetite suppressant. Definitely not nootropic either, likely the opposite, may lead to inability to concentrate.
-Salvia sclerea
Potentially toxic, and it is just an acetylcholinesterase inhibitor. There are much better ones out there. Huperzine A is the best choice IMO. No reason why this would lead to fat burning.
If you are looking for fat burning, there are much better products out there. If you are looking for a nootropic, there are much better products out there. This is mediocre from both points of few and from the point of few of safety.
shpongled 09 Apr 2004
On another note while talking to the people at Biotest they indicated that they think ROX may in fact, permanently reset the metabolic rate. Exactly how they don't know yet. This is a very new product, and they've just begun to explore all of the potential benefits. They have many reports of it acting nootropically and becoming more effective with time rather than less, a common downfall for many supplements.
What do you expect them to say? "We think our product sucks?" Seriously they need to offer some good science. They don't. Good science doesn't mean promotional literature with a bunch of big words. You can't base whether a supplement works by user reports, and certainly not by user reports provided by the company.
And, Biotest is among the more dishonest supplement companies out there.
shpongled 09 Apr 2004
Acetyl-L-carnitine (with ALA)
Choline, lecithin
Fish oil
Green tea
Creatine
Whey protein
And in some circumstances, phosphatidylserine
macdog 10 Apr 2004
The Sclaremax, a proprietary extract of Salvia sclerea, is not to my knowledge available elsewhere. As for it being potentially toxic so is vitamin C. Further, Salvia sclerea is in the same genus as Salvia divinorum, and both are members of the sage family. This family of plants is characterized for producing powerful chemicals. Divinorum extract is one of the most potent hallucinagenic substances ever discovered, and for those of you who haven't tried it, I reccomend doing so before they make it illegal. A word of caution though, you better be sitting down when you do, because for a minute or two you will not be able to control your body. The idea that there MAY be some effect from sclaremax which is nootropic is not totally out there in left feild. I'm not even saying any of this is definite, and I don't work on commision for Biotest or anybody else, but I have been using supplements for well over ten years now, and I'm telling you in my experience there's something to this stuff. That's all.
shpongled 12 Apr 2004
shpongled I totally object to the tone you use in your post. Granted I'm not always innocent of that either, but I'm not a moron. I know those are B vitamins, and I know what caffeine is.
I never implied otherwise. Nor was my post directed at you, the information was meant for everyone.
tlc1018 21 Apr 2004
shpongled 22 Apr 2004
jolly 08 May 2004
mikep 14 May 2004
shpongled 14 May 2004
mikep 14 May 2004
shpongled 17 May 2004
shpongled do you think it is its possible to speed up your metabolism without the use of pills ?
Sure. Exercise.
jolly 03 Jun 2004
lynx 03 Jun 2004
-3,17-dihydrox-delta-5-etiocholane-7-one-diethylcarbonate
I don't know anything about this. There is no scientific literature on it that I know of. That in itself is enough to warrant quite a bit of caution. According to Biotest it increases T3 levles. This is good for fat loss, not so good for muscle preservation, and won't have any nootropic effects.
Hey, I tried to look into this compound too. I knew they were using some obscure naming convention to hide it's true identity.
I think they are using etiocholane, when it should be Androstane.
http://www.researchp...m/steroid1.html
Then I got to thinking about the claims of T3 increase and bingo.
I am pretty sure that this is 7-keto DHEA in some ancient, precolombian nomenclature.
More BS and obfuscation from a supplement company. What a surprise.