LONGECITY

Choline

Yes, BUT reduce from 550 mg to 50 mg and switch to phosphatidylcholine.

Yes, BUT reduce from 550 mg to 50 mg and switch to phosphatidylcholine.

I tend to agree with this statement. Please see this thread as well.

I see standard Choline to be kind of pointless, but I guess AGPC and CDP Choline are too extreme for what is essentially a multi...
Edited by nupi, 28 January 2012 - 03:45 PM.

Reduced dose still leaves issues for those who react badly to it and probably those who want it are still going to supplement additional choline even if you put in a small amount, so why bother.

It seems to me that maybe this time a little more attention to potential customers should be paid. Last time I got the feeling that purchasers were railroaded over the interests of a select group. This is how we landed up with too much choline and a lot of lost potential sales. I really think that there are some big unanswered questions about just who this multi is targeting.

I see no point to adding choline at 50mg. As I mentioned in the related choline form thread, the multi design is somewhat at odds with itself from the start. It's designed so levels are reasonably safe at full doses, yet everyone here probably knows they shouldn't be taking a full dose of any multi. So some doses will be so small that it may not be worth bothering with.

So if you reduce choline to 50mg. Then if the avg. person takes 1/3rd dose daily -- will 16mg of choline even matter anymore? It's just taking up space for not much benefit. And if using choline bitartrate, it could in fact be harming people. Michael also brought up a point in a previous thread of having a problem even finding a clean source of phosphatidylcholine to begin with (no idea if this is still true or not).

I'd rather see choline taken out entirely, and not have Vimmortal go down the path of one of those "kitchen sink" multis. Keep it to a multivitamin/multimineral - that's it. Things like lycopene (eat more tomatoes), green tea extract (drink green tea, though I know it's not currently in Vimmortal) and choline (eat more eggs) are all easily obtained from specific foods that can be added to one's diet. The stress, as always, should be fixing your nutrient intake through diet first before resorting to supplementation.

That's why I'd rather see Vimmortal remain as a strict basics-covering multi, nothing more. People in the general public might see the choline in Vimmortal and wonder what it is, or it might even prevent them from buying in the first place. I also strongly feel the lithium should be removed, but I'll make that comment in the lithium thread.

I'd rather see choline taken out entirely, and not have Vimmortal go down the path of one of those "kitchen sink" multis. Keep it to a multivitamin/multimineral - that's it. Things like lycopene (eat more tomatoes), green tea extract (drink green tea, though I know it's not currently in Vimmortal) and choline (eat more eggs) are all easily obtained from specific foods that can be added to one's diet. The stress, as always, should be fixing your nutrient intake through diet first before resorting to supplementation.

That's why I'd rather see Vimmortal remain as a strict basics-covering multi, nothing more. People in the general public might see the choline in Vimmortal and wonder what it is, or it might even prevent them from buying in the first place. I also strongly feel the lithium should be removed, but I'll make that comment in the lithium thread.

I disagree with this reasoning. You cannot compare lycopene, GTE, and then choline. The former two are plant phytonutrients, choline is an essential daily nutrient, with well documented deficiency in the general population.

Overall I feel it should be included, but am agnostic to its form and dosage. I also appreciate some of the concerns about its supplementation (which I have not had a chance to delve into).

Perhaps the Choline issue could be solved later in the development, where it could be the difference between say 2 or 3 capsules for a full dose. With a better idea of the final formulation, maybe we could take into account numbers of caps, or cap size, the form to use. So as an arbitrary example if we got Vimmortal down to 2 caps and it meant we could only include 200mg then the general consensus might be yes to that amount.

I'd really rather see the Choline removed entirely regardless of form. I've seen several people on this board report sensitivities to choline so including it would make the 2.0 unsuitable for them. Personally, I don't seem to take too well to AGPC so I guess I'm one of that group.

Besides, choline supps are relatively cheap and many of us are already supplementing it in some form so including it here might just be overkill..

I think if it was included, it'd be in an 'optional/exotic' separate capsule. Some people don't to well on it.

This is one of the more controversial nutrients in Vimmortal. Make sure to get your vote in.

Polls will be closing tomorrow afternoon. Thanks for all your input so far on Choline.