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omega-3s + uridine + choline


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#1 opales

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 10:12 PM


Combination of Omega3s + choline + uridine is believed to be an effective dietary intervation for Alzheimer patients.

http://www.physorg.c...ws65366858.html

After adding those supplements to the diets of gerbils, the researchers observed a dramatic increase in the amount of membranes that form brain cell synapses, where messages between cells are relayed. Damage in brain synapses is believed to cause the dementia that characterizes Alzheimer's disease.


I wonder if the above combo could be effective against normal age related cognitive decline? Especially since..

Omega3 + uridine treatment is also believed to be effective against depression (the combo therapy has been tested thus far in mice only)
http://www.forbes.co...cout523918.html

#2 beej

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Posted 01 June 2006 - 05:17 AM

I have tried mollases (a rich source of uridine) and fish oil and noticed a definete boost. Apparently there is only certain kinds of mollasses that is good though. Also I belive orthic acid is related to uridine

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#3 kottke

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Posted 07 June 2006 - 04:51 AM

I just recently found a very interesting article on raising Uridine in your bloodstream.

It looks like Citicoline may theoretically be better for cognitive decline/brain repair then alpha GPC if based on the Omega 3+Uridine+Choline combo theory. Citicoline apparently not only increases cytidine, but Uridine as well. I dont remember reading the level of uridine it increases, but the way he expresses it, it seems this its significant.

http://64.233.161.10...lient=firefox-a

#4 opales

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Posted 07 June 2006 - 09:14 AM

I just recently found a very interesting article on raising Uridine in your bloodstream.

It looks like Citicoline may theoretically be better for cognitive decline/brain repair then alpha GPC if based on the Omega 3+Uridine+Choline combo theory. Citicoline apparently not only increases cytidine, but Uridine as well. I dont remember reading the level of uridine it increases, but the way he expresses it, it seems this its significant.

http://64.233.161.10...lient=firefox-a


AOR's Ortho-Mind has citicoline, I believe because of its potential value in enhancing phospolipid production, and yes, this is in my understanding the exact hypothesized mechanism behind of the above mentioned combo also. Anyway, if AOR chose it over alpha GPC, I am confident it is because it has either more relevant research, better results in studies or both.

http://www.aor.ca/re.../ortho_mind.php

Edited by opales, 07 June 2006 - 09:55 AM.


#5 kottke

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Posted 08 June 2006 - 12:28 AM

AOR is also a big supporter of their Alpha GPC from what i see.

The only supplement available on the market that increases uridine is Nucleomaxx[B], and it does it at very high levels. In the small description paragraphs on the AOR website it says under Alpha GPC that it repairs or reverses in specific areas such at the hipocampus and the prefrontal cortex; it doesnt for the CDP. CDP is also a direct precursur to acetylcholine, while GPC uses another pathway making the process slower and possibly less stimulating and possibly umm repairing/sustaining those pathways.

You could combine Omega 3s+A-GPC+Uridine and possibly get even better results.There has to be more studies though to show which is better then the other, and what combination is the most beneficial.

#6 Jacovis

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Posted 11 July 2008 - 01:34 PM

Some updates on studies combining these three ingredients since this thread was last active...

1: Neuroscience. 2007 Aug 24;148(2):421-31. Epub 2007 Aug 1. Links
Chronic administration of docosahexaenoic acid or eicosapentaenoic acid, but not arachidonic acid, alone or in combination with uridine, increases brain phosphatide and synaptic protein levels in gerbils.Cansev M, Wurtman RJ.
Department of Brain and Cognitive Sciences, Massachusetts Institute of Technology, 43 Vassar Street, Building 46, Room 5023b, Cambridge, MA 02139, USA.

Synthesis of phosphatidylcholine, the most abundant brain membrane phosphatide, requires three circulating precursors: choline; a pyrimidine (e.g. uridine); and a polyunsaturated fatty acid. Supplementing a choline-containing diet with the uridine source uridine-5'-monophosphate (UMP) or, especially, with UMP plus the omega-3 fatty acid docosahexaenoic acid (given by gavage), produces substantial increases in membrane phosphatide and synaptic protein levels within gerbil brain. We now compare the effects of various polyunsaturated fatty acids, given alone or with UMP, on these synaptic membrane constituents. Gerbils received, daily for 4 weeks, a diet containing choline chloride with or without UMP and/or, by gavage, an omega-3 (docosahexaenoic or eicosapentaenoic acid) or omega-6 (arachidonic acid) fatty acid. Both of the omega-3 fatty acids elevated major brain phosphatide levels (by 18-28%, and 21-27%) and giving UMP along with them enhanced their effects significantly. Arachidonic acid, given alone or with UMP, was without effect. After UMP plus docosahexaenoic acid treatment, total brain phospholipid levels and those of each individual phosphatide increased significantly in all brain regions examined (cortex, striatum, hippocampus, brain stem, and cerebellum). The increases in brain phosphatides in gerbils receiving an omega-3 (but not omega-6) fatty acid, with or without UMP, were accompanied by parallel elevations in levels of pre- and post-synaptic proteins (syntaxin-3, PSD-95 and synapsin-1) but not in those of a ubiquitous structural protein, beta-tubulin. Hence administering omega-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids can enhance synaptic membrane levels in gerbils, and may do so in patients with neurodegenerative diseases, especially when given with a uridine source, while the omega-6 polyunsaturated fatty acid arachidonic acid is ineffective.

PMID: 17683870 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
PMCID: PMC2048660 [Available on 08/24/08]


1: Behav Brain Res. 2008 Aug 5;191(1):11-6. Epub 2008 Mar 18. Links
Chronic administration of DHA and UMP improves the impaired memory of environmentally impoverished rats.Holguin S, Huang Y, Liu J, Wurtman R.
Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Department of Brain and Cognitive Sciences, 43 Vassar Street, 46-5023, Cambridge, MA 02139, USA.

Living in an enriched environment (EC) during development enhances memory function in adulthood; living in an impoverished environment (IC) impairs memory function. Compounds previously demonstrated to improve memory among IC rats include CDP-choline and uridine monophosphate (UMP). Brain phosphatidylcholine (PC) synthesis utilizes both the uridine formed from the metabolism of exogenous CDP-choline and UMP, and the choline formed from that of CDP-choline. It also uses the polyunsaturated fatty acid (PUFA) DHA, a precursor for the diacylglycerol incorporated into PC. DHA administration also improves cognition in young and aged rodents and humans; its effects on cognitively impaired IC rats have not been characterized. We have thus examined the consequences of administering DHA (300 mg/kg) by gavage, UMP (0.5% in the diet), or both compounds on hippocampal- and striatal-dependent forms of memory among rats exposed to EC or IC conditions for 1 month starting at weaning, and consuming a choline-containing diet. We observe that giving IC rats either dietary UMP or gavaged DHA improves performance on the hidden version of the Morris water maze (all P<0.05), a hippocampal-dependent task; co-administration of both phosphatide precursors further enhances the IC rats' performance on this task (P<0.001). Neither UMP nor DHA, nor giving both compounds, affects the performance of EC rats on the hidden version of the Morris water maze (P>0.05), nor the performance by IC or EC rats on the visible version of the Morris water maze (all P>0.05), a striatal-dependent task. We confirm that co-administration of UMP and DHA to rats increases brain levels of the phosphatides PC, PE, SM, PS, PI, and total brain phospholipid levels (all P<0.05), and show that rearing animals in an enriched environment also elevates brain PC, PS, and PI levels (all P<0.01) and total brain phospholipids (P<0.01) compared with their levels in animals reared in an IC environment. These findings suggest that giving DHA plus UMP can ameliorate memory deficits associated with rearing under impoverished conditions, and that this effect may be mediated in part through enhanced synthesis of brain membrane phosphatides.

PMID: 18423905 [PubMed - in process]


1: FASEB J. 2008 Jul 7. [Epub ahead of print] Links
Dietary uridine enhances the improvement in learning and memory produced by administering DHA to gerbils.Holguin S, Martinez J, Chow C, Wurtman R.
Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Department of Brain and Cognitive Sciences, Cambridge, Massachusetts, USA.

This study examined the effects on cognitive behaviors of giving normal adult gerbils three compounds, normally in the circulation, which interact to increase brain phosphatides, synaptic proteins, dendritic spines, and neurotransmitter release. Animals received supplemental uridine (as its monophosphate, UMP; 0.5%) and choline (0.1%) via the diet, and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA; 300 mg/kg/day) by gavage, for 4 wk, and then throughout the subsequent period of behavioral training and testing. As shown previously, giving all three compounds caused highly significant (P<0.001) increases in total brain phospholipids and in each major phosphatide; giving DHA or UMP (plus choline) produced smaller increases in some of the phosphatides. DHA plus choline improved performance on the four-arm radial maze, T-maze, and Y-maze tests; coadministering UMP further enhanced these increases. (Uridine probably acts by generating both CTP, which can be limiting in phosphatide synthesis, and UTP, which activates P2Y receptors coupled to neurite outgrowth and protein synthesis. All three compounds also act by enhancing the substrate-saturation of phosphatide-synthesizing enzymes.) These findings demonstrate that a treatment that increases synaptic membrane content can enhance cognitive functions in normal animals.-Holguin, S., Martinez, J., Chow, C., Wurtman, R. Dietary uridine enhances the improvement in learning and memory produced by administering DHA to gerbils.

PMID: 18606862 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]

#7 neogenic

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Posted 11 July 2008 - 02:52 PM

LEF's Cognitex product has 50mgs. of Uridine-5'-Monophosphate (disodium).
http://www.lef.org/n.../item00921.html
Supplement Facts
Serving Size 3 softgels

Servings Per Container 30

Amount Per Serving
Alpha-Glyceryl Phosphoryl Choline (A-GPC)
600 mg
Phosphatidylserine [Sharp-PS™ GOLD Conjugated Phosphatidylserine-DHA]
100 mg
Vinpocetine
20 mg
Leucoselect® Phytosome™ [containing 50 mg grape seed (Vitis vinifera) procyanidin extract complexed with soy (Glycine max) phospholipids (bean)]
150 mg
VitaBlue® Wild Blueberry (Vaccinium angustifolium) 130:1 Extract (fruit) [std. to 4.9% Total Anthocyanins (7.35 mg)]
150 mg
Sensoril® Ashwagandha (Withania somnifera) Extract (root and leaves) [standardized to 8% withanolide glycoside conjugates (10 mg)]
125 mg
Uridine-5'-Monophosphate (disodium)
50 mg
Proprietary NeuroProtection Complex Blend
125 mg
Perluxan™ Hops (Humulus lupulus) Standardized Extract (cones),
Ginger (Zingiber officinale) Standardized Extract (rhizome),
Rosemary (Rosmarinus officinalis) Standardized Extract (leaves)

#8 glasswizard

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Posted 12 August 2008 - 05:58 AM

I've been reading alot about the uridine cocktail(uridine + omega-3 and choline) and recently bought a few bottles of Uridine Triacetyluridine from bayho.com. I've been taking the cocktail for a few weeks now with some interesting effects. Anybody else out there trying this combo too?...


I've been reading alot about the uridine cocktail(uridine + omega-3 and choline) and recently bought a few bottles of Uridine Triacetyluridine from bayho.com. I've been taking the cocktail for a few weeks now with some interesting effects. Anybody else out there trying this combo too?...

#9 luv2increase

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Posted 12 August 2008 - 06:45 AM

I posted this on M&M. Can't believe I forgot to post it here as well.


I'm sure everything has read all the studies on how good uridine is for you. Like the Omega-3 and uridine being just as good as anti-depressants for, you guessed it, depression. It also makes gerbils smarter and all kinds of other good stuff. Well, after searching for a long time, I found a source.

http://www.bayho.com/p/846192.html


It is made by Cardiovascular Research Ltd. and is Uridine in the form of Triacetyluridine (TAU). Do you all think this will work well? Would it be worth taking daily to boost all the goodness in all which we all already take?


60 caps at 25mg for $20.35 before shipping cost....



edit: omg i think this stuff may be the holy grail for increasin uridine in ya bodd

http://www.springerl...384k09502n15j3/

QUOTE
Abstract Purpose: PN401, an oral prodrug of uridine yields more bioavailable uridine than oral administration of uridine itself.


PN401 is triacetyluridine


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#10 Jacovis

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Posted 12 August 2008 - 01:32 PM

I've been reading alot about the uridine cocktail(uridine + omega-3 and choline) and recently bought a few bottles of Uridine Triacetyluridine from bayho.com. I've been taking the cocktail for a few weeks now with some interesting effects. Anybody else out there trying this combo too?...


Thanks for the link luv2increase.

Glasswizard, what kind of interesting effects are you seeing from adding the Uridine Triacetyluridine?
How much are you using per day of each substance (uridine + omega-3 and choline)?

#11 Jacovis

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Posted 25 October 2008 - 04:55 AM

A recent study on Triacetyluridine is pasted below. Note they were using up to 18 grams a day - at 25 mg a capsule the Cardiovascular Research product that was mentioned before would only have 1.5 grams of this substance in the entire bottle...

1: Exp Clin Psychopharmacol. 2008 Jun;16(3):199-206. Links
Triacetyluridine (TAU) decreases depressive symptoms and increases brain pH in bipolar patients.
Jensen JE, Daniels M, Haws C, Bolo NR, Lyoo IK, Yoon SJ, Cohen BM, Stoll AL, Rusche JR, Renshaw PF.
Brain Imaging Center, McLean Hospital, Belmont, Massachusetts 02478-9106, USA. ejensen@mclean.harvard.edu

Eleven patients with bipolar depression were given doses of up to 18 g per day of triacetyluridine (TAU) over 6 weeks to test the effect of uridine on symptoms of depression via Montgomery-Asberg Depression Rating Scale (MADRS; Asberg, Montgomery, Perris, Schalling, & Sedvall, 1978) scores and on cellular bioenergetics using phosphorus magnetic resonance spectroscopic imaging (31P-MRSI). All patients and comparison participants (n = 9) completed baseline 31P-MRSI scans, and 9 patients completed posttherapy scans. The percentage changes for MADRS scores (Week 2, -23.8; Week 3, -34.9; Week 4, -42.5) and the time effects of TAU on MADRS scores (Week 2, z = -2.07, p = .039; Week 3, z = -4.28, p < .001; Week 4, z = -4.54, p < .001) may reflect TAU effects on early symptom improvement. TAU responders (patients who had a 50% or greater reduction in MADRS scores from baseline at any time) demonstrated a significant difference from nonresponders in pH changes from baseline (effect size = 150). These results suggest that TAU treatment may decrease symptoms of depression and improve mitochondrial functioning.

PMID: 18540779 [PubMed - in process]

#12 luv2increase

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Posted 25 October 2008 - 07:18 PM

WoW! 18 grams a day at the source I posted above, which I still believe is the only source of TAU available would cost a person $244.20 a day or $7326 a month!!!!!
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#13 imhotep

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Posted 28 October 2008 - 11:46 PM

So then to duplicate the effects seen in the lab animals we would need to take the Uridine Triacetyluridine 25mg capsules , a handful of fish oil capsules and a dose of lecithin for Choline? Any particular dosage or ratio? I understand Dannon has a cocktail in clinical trials. I am mixing a couple of tablespoons of lecithin with my blueberry smoothie every morning now. I wonder what How much Uridine I would have to add to duplicate Dannon's product?

http://web.mit.edu/n...umans-0729.html

#14 sUper GeNius

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Posted 29 October 2008 - 05:00 PM

I don't know whether this is allowed on the forum, but I have a bunch of this stuff that I ordered a few months back but never used:

http://www.nucleomax...hp?id=63&type=0

It's all unopened. I'm not sure how much I have, as I have the box on a shelf in my closet. If you have any interest at all, PM me and we can discuss.

#15 saddlesblazing

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Posted 04 December 2008 - 06:42 AM

Brewer's yeast is high in uridine. I take about 5 grams a day along with CDP Choline, A-GPC, and Carlson's DHA gems. I read that high doses of Brewer's Yeast can produce too much uric acid and that 5 grams should be enough to significantly increase uridine without the harmful effects. I just started so I haven't noticed much difference yet. I'll post back if I do.

#16 K Complex

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Posted 04 December 2008 - 09:25 AM

Brewer's yeast is high in uridine. I take about 5 grams a day along with CDP Choline, A-GPC, and Carlson's DHA gems. I read that high doses of Brewer's Yeast can produce too much uric acid and that 5 grams should be enough to significantly increase uridine without the harmful effects. I just started so I haven't noticed much difference yet. I'll post back if I do.


Thanks for the info!

I've been looking for a source of uridine.
It turns out I've been taking it all along.

I've been taking ~10g of Diamond V XPC for a little while now.

#17 Jacovis

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Posted 15 March 2009 - 06:56 AM

Some more updates on studies combining these three ingredients since this thread was last active...

1: FASEB J. 2008 Nov;22(11):3938-46. Epub 2008 Jul 7.
Dietary uridine enhances the improvement in learning and memory produced by administering DHA to gerbils.
Holguin S, Martinez J, Chow C, Wurtman R.
Massachusetts Institute of Technology, 43 Vassar St., 46-5023, Cambridge, MA 02139, USA.

This study examined the effects on cognitive behaviors of giving normal adult gerbils three compounds, normally in the circulation, which interact to increase brain phosphatides, synaptic proteins, dendritic spines, and neurotransmitter release. Animals received supplemental uridine (as its monophosphate, UMP; 0.5%) and choline (0.1%) via the diet, and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA; 300 mg/kg/day) by gavage, for 4 wk, and then throughout the subsequent period of behavioral training and testing. As shown previously, giving all three compounds caused highly significant (P<0.001) increases in total brain phospholipids and in each major phosphatide; giving DHA or UMP (plus choline) produced smaller increases in some of the phosphatides. DHA plus choline improved performance on the four-arm radial maze, T-maze, and Y-maze tests; coadministering UMP further enhanced these increases. (Uridine probably acts by generating both CTP, which can be limiting in phosphatide synthesis, and UTP, which activates P2Y receptors coupled to neurite outgrowth and protein synthesis. All three compounds also act by enhancing the substrate-saturation of phosphatide-synthesizing enzymes.) These findings demonstrate that a treatment that increases synaptic membrane content can enhance cognitive functions in normal animals.

PMID: 18606862 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


1: Alzheimers Dement. 2008 Jan;4(1 Suppl 1):S153-68. Epub 2007 Dec 21. Links
Oral administration of circulating precursors for membrane phosphatides can promote the synthesis of new brain synapses.
Cansev M, Wurtman RJ, Sakamoto T, Ulus IH.
Department of Brain and Cognitive Sciences, Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Cambridge, MA, USA.

Although cognitive performance in humans and experimental animals can be improved by administering omega-3 fatty acid docosahexaenoic acid (DHA), the neurochemical mechanisms underlying this effect remain uncertain. In general, nutrients or drugs that modify brain function or behavior do so by affecting synaptic transmission, usually by changing the quantities of particular neurotransmitters present within synaptic clefts or by acting directly on neurotransmitter receptors or signal-transduction molecules. We find that DHA also affects synaptic transmission in mammalian brain. Brain cells of gerbils or rats receiving this fatty acid manifest increased levels of phosphatides and of specific presynaptic or postsynaptic proteins. They also exhibit increased numbers of dendritic spines on postsynaptic neurons. These actions are markedly enhanced in animals that have also received the other two circulating precursors for phosphatidylcholine, uridine (which gives rise to brain uridine diphosphate and cytidine triphosphate) and choline (which gives rise to phosphocholine). The actions of DHA aere reproduced by eicosapentaenoic acid, another omega-3 compound, but not by omega-6 fatty acid arachidonic acid. Administration of circulating phosphatide precursors can also increase neurotransmitter release (acetylcholine, dopamine) and affect animal behavior. Conceivably, this treatment might have use in patients with the synaptic loss that characterizes Alzheimer's disease or other neurodegenerative diseases or occurs after stroke or brain injury.

PMID: 18631994 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
PMCID: PMC2344157


1: Neurosci Res. 2008 Nov;62(3):206-9. Epub 2008 Aug 3. Links
Restorative effects of uridine plus docosahexaenoic acid in a rat model of Parkinson's disease.
Cansev M, Ulus IH, Wang L, Maher TJ, Wurtman RJ.
Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Department of Brain and Cognitive Sciences, Cambridge, MA 02139, USA.

Administering uridine-5'-monophosphate (UMP) and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) increases synaptic membranes (as characterized by pre- and post-synaptic proteins) and dendritic spines in rodents. We examined their effects on rotational behavior and dopaminergic markers in rats with partial unilateral 6-hydroxydopamine (6-OHDA)-induced striatal lesions. Rats receiving UMP, DHA, both, or neither, daily, and intrastriatal 6-OHDA 3 days after treatment onset, were tested for d-amphetamine-induced rotational behavior and dopaminergic markers after 24 and 28 days, respectively. UMP/DHA treatment reduced ipsilateral rotations by 57% and significantly elevated striatal dopamine, tyrosine hydroxylase (TH) activity, TH protein and synapsin-1 on the lesioned side. Hence, giving uridine and DHA may partially restore dopaminergic neurotransmission in this model of Parkinson's disease.

PMID: 18761383 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
PMCID: PMC2592845 [Available on 2009/11/01]


1: J Nutr Health Aging. 2009 Mar;13(3):189-97.
Synapse Formation Is Enhanced by Oral Administration of Uridine and DHA, the Circulating Precursors of Brain Phosphatides.
Wurtman RJ, Cansev M, Ulus IH.
R.J. Wurtman, MIT, 77 Massachusetts Ave., Room l46-5023, Cambridge, MA 02139 USA, Phone No.: 617 253 6731, Fax No.: 617 253 6882; Email: dick@mit.edu.

Objective: The loss of cortical and hippocampal synapses is a universal hallmark of Alzheimer's disease, and probably underlies its effects on cognition. Synapses are formed from the interaction of neurites projecting from "presynaptic" neurons with dendritic spines projecting from "postsynaptic" neurons. Both of these structures are vulnerable to the toxic effects of nearby amyloid plaques, and their loss contributes to the decreased number of synapses that characterize the disease. A treatment that increased the formation of neurites and dendritic spines might reverse this loss, thereby increasing the number of synapses and slowing the decline in cognition. Design setting, Participants, Intervention, Measurements and Results: We observe that giving normal rodents uridine and the omega-3 fatty acid docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) orally can enhance dendritic spine levels (3), and cognitive functions (32). Moreover this treatment also increases levels of biochemical markers for neurites (i.e., neurofilament-M and neurofilament-70) (2) in vivo, and uridine alone increases both these markers and the outgrowth of visible neurites by cultured PC-12 cells (9). A phase 2 clinical trial, performed in Europe, is described briefly. Discussion and Conclusion: Uridine and DHA are circulating precursors for the phosphatides in synaptic membranes, and act in part by increasing the substrate-saturation of enzymes that synthesize phosphatidylcholine from CTP (formed from the uridine, via UTP) and from diacylglycerol species that contain DHA: the enzymes have poor affinities for these substrates, and thus are unsaturated with them, and only partially active, under basal conditions. The enhancement by uridine of neurite outgrowth is also mediated in part by UTP serving as a ligand for neuronal P2Y receptors. Moreover administration of uridine with DHA activates many brain genes, among them the gene for the m-1 metabotropic glutamate receptor [Cansev, et al, submitted]. This activation, in turn, increases brain levels of that gene's protein product and of such other synaptic proteins as PSD-95, synapsin-1, syntaxin-3 and F-actin, but not levels of non-synaptic brain proteins like beta-tubulin. Hence it is possible that giving uridine plus DHA triggers a neuronal program that, by accelerating phosphatide and synaptic protein synthesis, controls synaptogenesis. If administering this mix of phosphatide precursors also increases synaptic elements in brains of patients with Alzheimer 's disease, as it does in normal rodents, then this treatment may ameliorate some of the manifestations of the disease.

PMID: 19262950 [PubMed - in process]


1: World Rev Nutr Diet. 2009;99:71-96. Epub 2009 Jan 9.
Administration of docosahexaenoic acid, uridine and choline increases levels of synaptic membranes and dendritic spines in rodent brain.
Wurtman RJ, Cansev M, Sakamoto T, Ulus IH.
Department of Brain and Cognitive Sciences, Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Cambridge, MA 02139, USA. dick@mit.edu

PMID: 19136840 [PubMed - in process]

#18 NDM

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Posted 15 March 2009 - 03:15 PM

I wonder why no supplement producer is selling uridine. Guys from AOR and NOW foods, wake up!
Another one we need to get is methylene blue. Hurry up, for God's sake, before our brains rust...

#19 desperate788

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Posted 15 March 2009 - 10:20 PM

I wonder why no supplement producer is selling uridine. Guys from AOR and NOW foods, wake up!
Another one we need to get is methylene blue. Hurry up, for God's sake, before our brains rust...


for uridine ı think we must drink beer, not a bad idea. And our brains are supposed to get better with nootropics why they rust?

#20 meursault

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Posted 15 March 2009 - 11:07 PM

I wonder why no supplement producer is selling uridine. Guys from AOR and NOW foods, wake up!
Another one we need to get is methylene blue. Hurry up, for God's sake, before our brains rust...


Citicoline is metabolized into choline and uridine.

#21 sdxl

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Posted 16 March 2009 - 12:37 AM

I wonder why no supplement producer is selling uridine. Guys from AOR and NOW foods, wake up!
Another one we need to get is methylene blue. Hurry up, for God's sake, before our brains rust...


Citicoline is metabolized into choline and uridine.

Shouldn't that be choline an cytidine?

#22 Lufega

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Posted 16 March 2009 - 02:17 AM

http://www.dr-bob.or...sgs/481903.html

This page has a good discussion from 2005 on this same topic. Seems Orotic acid is a precursor to uridine.

Maybe this finally explains why I get an anti-depressant and mood lifting effect from 1 tablespoon molasses. It's pretty impressive actually. I thought it was the mineral content or something.

Edited by Lufega, 16 March 2009 - 02:21 AM.


#23 sdxl

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Posted 16 March 2009 - 08:07 AM


Citicoline is metabolized into choline and uridine.

Shouldn't that be choline an cytidine?

It appears cytidine is metabolized to uridine in humans.

#24 meursault

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Posted 16 March 2009 - 07:00 PM

The following study confirms that CDP-Choline increases plasma levels of uridine significantly at 500mg and 2000mg dose ranges. :|w

Attached Files



#25 Jacovis

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Posted 22 March 2009 - 11:48 AM

adec's mom suffers from some kind of mitochondrial dysfunction I believe so keep that in mind when reading the below anecdote on Triacetyluridine treatment...

http://spacedoc.net/...opic.php?t=1290
adec (September 7, 2008):
"...Now here are some personal anecdotes.

I had actually stumbled upon the power of uridine while in synergy with other supplements. Any decent choline source should have the ability to raise uridine levels. I originally used Alpha GPC to increase cholinergic brain cells and the number of acetylcholine receptors. This was an attempt to increase brain function. Eventually I started using alpha-GPC as an effective way to raise bioavailability of various supplements requiring choline. It was at this moment fairly amazing things started to occur. I only fairly recently have figured out precisely what though.

By the way, another great source of choline would be CDP-choline, as the anabolic precursor of choline and cytidine. Alpha-GPC is considered the catabolic predigested product of choline, stripped of its fatty acids for easier assimilation - especially by neurons. It appears to me that Alpha GPC is not only cheaper but more effective, with much reduced sides. Although, alpha-GPC and CDP-choline should similarly raise blood uridine levels. Of course, another side benefit is an increase in blood dopamine and receptors, which also leads to increased levels of HGH.

There was a recent study showing that: DHA in combination with uridine and choline decreased symptoms of depression. Of course, who wouldn't be depressed with poor brain and mitochondrial function. Although uridine supplementation can do so much more in helping reversing autoimmune and neurodegenerative diseases.

Uridine also does many wonderful things besides just improve mitochondrial function. As an overall neuroprotective, uridine greatly decreases neurotoxicity to drugs and chemicals (such as statin drugs,) has anti-tumor affects, greatly increases BDNF or Brain-derived neurotrophic factor (directly related to nerve growth factor.) Acetylcholine itself is also necessary for activating REM sleep, and helps keep neural membranes healthy and complete -- instead of brittle and fractured. It would also help prevent an excess build-up of amyloid protein. This is similar to the promise of methylene blue, while perhaps being safer and more biologically plausible. I'm not completely certain yet. +Although, I received an email from a registered pharmacist stating 58mcg daily should be fine.+
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Now for the good part.

Apparently there's a substance created by Repligen that has received orphan drug status called PN401 or triacetyluridine. This is basically triacetylated uridine through a patented process. My mom has been using this product for over two months. Triacetyluridine increases uridine biosynthesis 5-10x better than ordinary uridine, much better than any combination of substances. This is great for anyone tired of using many supplements in synergy for mitochondrial regeneration.

I had already been using a sometimes 2x daily combination of 600mg of alpha-GPC, 100mg of orotic acid, sometimes magnesium orotate, 500mg of DHA on my mom. It was very extremely effective in clearing any residual statin-induced symptoms. Up until recently, I had always felt we were only hitting the periphery of the recovery problem. I have pretty much tried every plausible theory within reason, some even documented on the forum. In my estimation, this is the first time we have truly hit the bulls-eye. Triacytleuridine intensified her regimen and allowed for a more remarkable transformation.

Speaking of orotic acid, also considered (by some) vitamin B13... orotic acid is another good way to increase uridine, being as its chemical makeup is almost identical to that of uracil. However, orotic acid alone would be inefficiently diffused into the cells. Yet orotic acid bound to another element would act as an efficient transporter along the pentose phosphate pathway. For instance a chemically charged orotate, such as magnesium orotate, would not only help a neutrally charged orotic acid better entrance into the cell, but uracil and the bound magnesium as well. This makes orotic acid itself a fairly exciting and effective mitochondrial pathway reviver and transporter.

For those suffering from mitochondrial diseases, the most uniform complaint seems to be about gastric intolerances, or polygenic and genetotropic diseases: such as IBS and GI dysmotility. These appear to be compounded in part due to improper mitochondrial lipid, protein, amino, sugar digestion. Uridine or triacyteluridine helps promote the very mitochondrial pathways needed to release energy from lipids and carbs. In my mom's case, I'm talking about an improvement upon a sometimes tri-weekly bout of annoying bloating, gas, and diarrhea or loose bowels. While her long-term memory problems have now subsided, per se, difficulties in learning new short-term tasks or information (especially under duress) remained. This has also now diminished greatly with triacytleuridine treatment. Her memory recall and response times have also greatly quickened to even the most mundane or ordinary questions. Shortness of breath under mild exertion or a shuffling gate under great physical exertion has also greatly reduced. Does this sound similar? How many of those in statin recovery still complain about all these symptoms?

I would be more excited at the discovery though, if not for being so exhausted. We're talking about the very heart of DNA synthesis. Uridine nucleotides are directly coupled to the respiratory chain. In a state of lactic acidosis, the mitochondria begin to use glucose instead of oxygen. Oxygen is obviously required for proper energy production.... with hypoxia being the main cause for cellular death (both apoptosis and necrosis,) cancers, or more importantly mutations in mtDNA. For instance, a slowing DNA synthesis creates large immature red blood cells incapable of carrying oxygen and dividing. Heme would also play a role here. Purine and pyrimidine metabolism is then greatly reduced along the pentose phosphate pathway. This would further limit ribose synthesis, or the energy needed for ATP production."

#26 Jacovis

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Posted 11 April 2009 - 04:59 AM

The following study confirms that CDP-Choline increases plasma levels of uridine significantly at 500mg and 2000mg dose ranges. :)


While much of the research on CDP Choline is very positive, it does seem to have negative reactions to it in some people like increased nervousness, increased perceived stress, lower mood, increase rumination and thought intensity, worse sleep, etc...

http://www.dr-bob.or...sgs/706836.html
"...I tried the CDP choline (citicholine)to boost uridine as a result of that research but only took it a few times as it made me feel more nervous and stressed.

JL"

http://lyndonian.liv...com/2008/07/03/
"...CDP-choline, another, much cheaper source, splits into choline and uridine in the blood, but depressives are sensitive to choline...
Nevertheless, since I have tried the CDP-choline + fish oil approach a couple times and I believe the choline was bad for my depression, I would gladly try UMP [uridine monophosphate] or TAU [triacetyluridine] with my fish oil.
Perhaps I could drink baby formula in the interim. (It's okay, my mood has been good these last few days... I'm not desperate...)..."


http://www.imminst.o...p;hl=rumination
graatch (September 17, 2008):
"I take citicoline, 500-1000mg in the morning and 500mg 6 hours later. It rocks. Certainly, personally, my favorite out of the cholinergics I've tried. Taking it later in the day very noticeably messes up my sleep, both induction and quality.

I notice a very substantial increase in rumination and thought "intensity", loops and threads of cognition, if you will.

It is very helpful if I am focused to direct it, as I now am, successfully medicated with memantine and dextroamphetamine. Previously, in my inattentive depressed state, it was perhaps not so helpful, even depressiogenic if the intense thought process ended up being applied to unpleasant feelings.
If you will. Speaking of consciousness here ... it requires some metaphor. ;-)

Although, citicoline was less problematic in that way than choline citrate or galantamine was. I never noticed much effect from alpha-GPC, personally.

But yeah, now very helpful. The intensified thought-process is applied to deepening my understanding, everything thinking is good for, yadda yadda.

I also notice an increased desire for nicotine. This is not problematic for me (besides cost), as I use nicotine lozenges and enjoy them as a neuroprotective supplement.


QUOTE
well a lot of people recomend taking DMAE before sleep because its a slow releasing choline.
i been taking it before sleep and in the morning for 10 months now


I agree with brotherx, you probably should not do that. See the abstract linked to in Rags847's post -- "A reason to not take choline precursors at night" for an example."

http://www.imminst.o...showtopic=23355
graatch (October 6, 2008):
"...I talked a bit about the effects I get from citicoline in your Choline Precursors thread. Rumination is stimulated ... I'm not sure about creativity or emotion..."

Edited by Visionary7903, 11 April 2009 - 05:00 AM.


#27 Patrick Arnold

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Posted 14 May 2009 - 04:55 PM

i am starting TAU today at 12 grams a day (i am a chemist so i can make personal supply for reasonable cost). I take fish oil regularly as well. If anything interesting happens I will let you know.

#28 bgwithadd

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Posted 14 May 2009 - 09:47 PM

What is the process to make us? How reasonable would it be for someone who's not a chemist to make it safely? Let us know of any results.

#29 lynx

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Posted 15 May 2009 - 02:47 AM

I wonder why no supplement producer is selling uridine. Guys from AOR and NOW foods, wake up!
Another one we need to get is methylene blue. Hurry up, for God's sake, before our brains rust...

LEF Cognitex has Uridine + CDP

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#30 spaceistheplace

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Posted 15 May 2009 - 02:59 AM

I wonder why no supplement producer is selling uridine. Guys from AOR and NOW foods, wake up!
Another one we need to get is methylene blue. Hurry up, for God's sake, before our brains rust...

LEF Cognitex has Uridine + CDP


sadly though it also has vinpocetine.




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