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Meditation the Nootropic


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#1 mentatpsi

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 11:09 PM


Background
Throughout much of my recent years i have really valued meditation, i have always seen it as a solution to whatever problem i seemed to be having... whether this is depression, or mental limitations... it has always benefited me in one way or another. It is safe, simple, and extremely effective for something that is so readily available... the only thing required is patience and discipline. Throughout much of my practice of it i have seen a major decrease in ADHD type behavior, maximizing the amount of concentration i can place on any given activity. Effects i have seen are increasing photographic memory, lucid imagination, better control over body, destruction of most comfort inducing beliefs, increasing rationality, and simply enjoying and exploring life more. The list goes on and there is no negative effects i have seen with it.

I have recently started adderall, which has tainted my progress but recent circumstances don't allow for other choices... but my overall preference in nootropics has to be a combination of herbs and meditation, since it allows for consistency, with the occasional as needed synthetic nootropic blend.

The preference on nootropics and focusing on mainly the biological factors (yes, i know, mind is biological, but it is an input-output device) doesn't account for multi dimensional problems (e.g. the psychological conditions of your mental state). This deep seated belief that our culture is attaining that all problems must be solved immediately and with a pill taken every day is very silly, with the exception of the severe mental impairments. As i have said earlier i am not against nootropics, i quite frankly enjoy consciousness enhancements, i just believe that we are much more capable of change than we think and should explore every avenue of progression we can. There's also the issue that some of these things we're told to take every day we do not have enough information to know for certain how the combination will effect us later on in life, something very pertinent to life extension and better well being.

Research
Long-term meditators self-induce high-amplitude gamma synchrony during mental practice

Dana Foundation: Meditation May Change the Brain

Applied Psychophysiology & Biofeedback (aapb) Volume 32, number 3 Fall, 2004: Meditation: Elevating Consciousness, Improving Health
The article above looks a bit biased (and new agey in appearance) but is done by many PhD holders and is filled with references to actual scientific research regarding the brain.

Discussion
The main purpose of this thread is to have a public discussion for anyone that is interested in Meditation, has applied it to their lives and would like to share their experiences. I will add more research for those interested... google scholar stopped working so i have to delay additional links till later.

Edited by mysticpsi, 31 March 2008 - 11:11 PM.

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#2 OneScrewLoose

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 11:29 PM

I been mediating for a year now, and although it is slow going, nothing has more consistently changed my life. When I started I was taking 60mg of Adderal at a time, smoking 3-5 ciggs a day and injesting in one form or another 1g+ of caffeine a day. Now I do not take Adderal, do not smoke, have only a few cups of tea a day and take piracetam for my cognitive enhancement.

If you meditate a lot, I highly recommend meditating on a high dose of Bacopa. It is a very interesting experience and allows (me) to see things from a different perspective.

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#3 mentatpsi

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Posted 03 April 2008 - 03:52 AM

I been mediating for a year now, and although it is slow going, nothing has more consistently changed my life. When I started I was taking 60mg of Adderal at a time, smoking 3-5 ciggs a day and injesting in one form or another 1g+ of caffeine a day. Now I do not take Adderal, do not smoke, have only a few cups of tea a day and take piracetam for my cognitive enhancement.

If you meditate a lot, I highly recommend meditating on a high dose of Bacopa. It is a very interesting experience and allows (me) to see things from a different perspective.


How is the combination of Piracetam and Meditation?

I'll have to try out bacopa for meditation, i've done it before but never at a high dosage with meditation. How would you define high dose and how would you describe this different perspective.

#4 liorrh

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Posted 03 April 2008 - 08:26 AM

Thanks for this thread. is there any substance that will allow better muscle relaxation during meditation that will not affecting cognition and focus? I have a hip injury and the common meditation position are very hard for me.

#5 yoyo

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Posted 03 April 2008 - 10:26 PM

I'm still meditating but i have not noticed anything during the 10 months or so i've done it.

#6 Shepard

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Posted 03 April 2008 - 11:59 PM

Thanks for this thread. is there any substance that will allow better muscle relaxation during meditation that will not affecting cognition and focus? I have a hip injury and the common meditation position are very hard for me.


Meaning sitting upright in a chair or the cross-legged TV show kind of position? I don't really think the position is that important as long as it doesn't hinder breathing, but I could very well be wrong. I do the cheap Americanized version.

#7 mentatpsi

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Posted 06 April 2008 - 07:42 AM

First off i don't want to sound like an expert... i'm not... but i'll try to answer questions if i think i have answers :)

I'm still meditating but i have not noticed anything during the 10 months or so i've done it.


What are your methods for meditation... part of the method is to engage in any type of relaxing activity... this typically involves holding attention on some form of consistent pattern... such as the breath... and allow all distractions to slip away and simply become an observer to external and internal "chaos"... gradually as you observe this chaos, your emotional investment in this chaos will diminish and calmness will follow. That is pretty much the ideal, this observer stance allows you to reflect on your absolutes, find limits inherent in your thinking pattern, maintain emotional stability... etc etc... hope that helps at all

Thanks for this thread. is there any substance that will allow better muscle relaxation during meditation that will not affecting cognition and focus? I have a hip injury and the common meditation position are very hard for me.


Welcome, hopefully it helps and knowledge is distributed, i'd really like to learn more about other people's meditation efforts ;)...

In yoga there is a savasana pose which is pretty much laying on the back... whatever allows you to stay focused on the pattern (e.g the breath) and maintain an observer stance on your external and internal reality is really all that counts (in my opinion). If you find that you're more comfortable on a bed, meditate on your bed... just make sure that this environment, which is saturated with memories traces of sleep, doesn't promote sleep instead of meditation :p. As far as pain, you should probably be careful as far as interactions with any medications... i don't really know of any herbal formula that will help ease pain without altering cognition and focus... regular pain killers might do the job since most of the herbs i can think of alter focus (e.g Valerian, Kava, Chamomile).

Best of luck.

Edited by mysticpsi, 06 April 2008 - 07:45 AM.


#8 Yearningforyears

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Posted 08 April 2008 - 10:43 PM

I been mediating for a year now, and although it is slow going, nothing has more consistently changed my life. When I started I was taking 60mg of Adderal at a time, smoking 3-5 ciggs a day and injesting in one form or another 1g+ of caffeine a day. Now I do not take Adderal, do not smoke, have only a few cups of tea a day and take piracetam for my cognitive enhancement.

If you meditate a lot, I highly recommend meditating on a high dose of Bacopa. It is a very interesting experience and allows (me) to see things from a different perspective.



Wow. So you´ve benefited from the bacopa too? This is... there are no words for this. How can something so, by our medical culture, complex phenomenon as mental illness have such an easy solution... This forum has a lot of, forgive my somewhat grandiose statement, wisdom and pioneership in it. Share the wisdom and the world will become a better place. What a wonderful simple "truth". I have not taken bacopa for several days now, yet this newly found insight is still with me.
I almost feel sorry for the drug industry ;)
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#9 yoyo

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Posted 09 April 2008 - 01:48 AM

First off i don't want to sound like an expert... i'm not... but i'll try to answer questions if i think i have answers :p

I'm still meditating but i have not noticed anything during the 10 months or so i've done it.


What are your methods for meditation... part of the method is to engage in any type of relaxing activity... this typically involves holding attention on some form of consistent pattern... such as the breath... and allow all distractions to slip away and simply become an observer to external and internal "chaos"... gradually as you observe this chaos, your emotional investment in this chaos will diminish and calmness will follow. That is pretty much the ideal, this observer stance allows you to reflect on your absolutes, find limits inherent in your thinking pattern, maintain emotional stability... etc etc... hope that helps at all



i mostly try to do zazen, or identify the three marks of existance in my thoughts as they occur

#10 luv2increase

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Posted 09 April 2008 - 04:10 AM

I believe meditation and/or deep prayer is great for the body and mind. I wish I could meditate, but my tinnitus prohibits me from doing so.

#11 Yearningforyears

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Posted 09 April 2008 - 04:15 PM

I think there are ways of temporarily overcoming the distraction, which tinnitus creates, by maybe using a pair of headphones with tinnitus sounds (something else, that masks it).
When there is "tinnitus balance" in the ears, the mind will probably not percieve it as hostile and will find it easier to relax.
I sound a bit foggy here, but for example: If you have tinnitus in one ear you become very much aware of that ear. If there is tinnitus in both ears then it still is very annoying, but a bit more logical for the mind to tackle. "so the left ear is broken... ah... yes... and so is the right". (two eyes, two feet, two tinnitus)
If creating a tinnitus tone via an external source, identical in frequency to the one you are hearing, then chances are that you will manage to do a bit of tinnitus de-drama. Your tinnitus in headphones might cut you enough slack, to better be able to meditate. Could be worth trying =)

I don´t think everyone knows what meditation really is, and neither do I. There are a lot of different branches, and just lying in bed not thinking is relaxation, but not necessarily meditation.
"see your thoughts, but do not let them blind you". My way of describing it. Could be "wrong" also :p

#12 tepol

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Posted 11 April 2008 - 03:58 AM

I think there are ways of temporarily overcoming the distraction, which tinnitus creates, by maybe using a pair of headphones with tinnitus sounds (something else, that masks it).
When there is "tinnitus balance" in the ears, the mind will probably not percieve it as hostile and will find it easier to relax.
I sound a bit foggy here, but for example: If you have tinnitus in one ear you become very much aware of that ear. If there is tinnitus in both ears then it still is very annoying, but a bit more logical for the mind to tackle. "so the left ear is broken... ah... yes... and so is the right". (two eyes, two feet, two tinnitus)
If creating a tinnitus tone via an external source, identical in frequency to the one you are hearing, then chances are that you will manage to do a bit of tinnitus de-drama. Your tinnitus in headphones might cut you enough slack, to better be able to meditate. Could be worth trying =)

I don´t think everyone knows what meditation really is, and neither do I. There are a lot of different branches, and just lying in bed not thinking is relaxation, but not necessarily meditation.
"see your thoughts, but do not let them blind you". My way of describing it. Could be "wrong" also :p



Hello,

I started various typed of meditation back in 97 but havent been able to do it all since 99 sue to chronic health problems which have only gotten worse - something I find quite difficult given how much I got out of it.

Tinnitus is one of my more problems , iornically from trying to treat the neuropathy like symptoms in my legs that put a halt on meditation .

The only thing I found that has worked very well in dealing with that is pscliocybin ( something that helps cluster heaches too apparently ).

The other thing I had that helped was tmj shots using anaesthetic .

tepol

#13 Alpha-Frequency

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Posted 25 May 2008 - 12:43 AM

I find it interesting that you have had success with Bacopa and Meditation. I too find that this combination induces an optimal learning state.

#14 mentatpsi

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Posted 25 May 2008 - 02:16 AM

how much bacopa did you guys find was a sufficient amount to promote meditative states?

#15 Surrealist

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Posted 25 May 2008 - 03:30 AM

I think there are ways of temporarily overcoming the distraction, which tinnitus creates, by maybe using a pair of headphones with tinnitus sounds (something else, that masks it).
When there is "tinnitus balance" in the ears, the mind will probably not percieve it as hostile and will find it easier to relax.
I sound a bit foggy here, but for example: If you have tinnitus in one ear you become very much aware of that ear. If there is tinnitus in both ears then it still is very annoying, but a bit more logical for the mind to tackle. "so the left ear is broken... ah... yes... and so is the right". (two eyes, two feet, two tinnitus)
If creating a tinnitus tone via an external source, identical in frequency to the one you are hearing, then chances are that you will manage to do a bit of tinnitus de-drama. Your tinnitus in headphones might cut you enough slack, to better be able to meditate. Could be worth trying =)

I don´t think everyone knows what meditation really is, and neither do I. There are a lot of different branches, and just lying in bed not thinking is relaxation, but not necessarily meditation.
"see your thoughts, but do not let them blind you". My way of describing it. Could be "wrong" also :)



Hello,

I started various typed of meditation back in 97 but havent been able to do it all since 99 sue to chronic health problems which have only gotten worse - something I find quite difficult given how much I got out of it.

Tinnitus is one of my more problems , iornically from trying to treat the neuropathy like symptoms in my legs that put a halt on meditation .

The only thing I found that has worked very well in dealing with that is pscliocybin ( something that helps cluster heaches too apparently ).

The other thing I had that helped was tmj shots using anaesthetic .

tepol


For your Tinnitus you may try listening to Binaural beats, http://en.wikipedia..../Binaural_beats for more information. I've never tried them for meditation but have tried them for "power napping" and its hard to say if it works or not. YMMV

you can generate a audio file to use with an ipod or whatever you have with this java applet: http://gnaural.sourceforge.net/

#16 tunt01

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Posted 12 May 2009 - 10:42 PM

http://www.scienceda...90512134655.htm

Meditation May Increase Gray Matter

ScienceDaily (May 12, 2009) — Push-ups, crunches, gyms, personal trainers — people have many strategies for building bigger muscles and stronger bones. But what can one do to build a bigger brain?

Meditate.

That's the finding from a group of researchers at UCLA who used high-resolution magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) to scan the brains of people who meditate. In a study published in the journal NeuroImage and currently available online (by subscription), the researchers report that certain regions in the brains of long-term meditators were larger than in a similar control group.

Specifically, meditators showed significantly larger volumes of the hippocampus and areas within the orbito-frontal cortex, the thalamus and the inferior temporal gyrus — all regions known for regulating emotions.

"We know that people who consistently meditate have a singular ability to cultivate positive emotions, retain emotional stability and engage in mindful behavior," said Eileen Luders, lead author and a postdoctoral research fellow at the UCLA Laboratory of Neuro Imaging. "The observed differences in brain anatomy might give us a clue why meditators have these exceptional abilities."

Research has confirmed the beneficial aspects of meditation. In addition to having better focus and control over their emotions, many people who meditate regularly have reduced levels of stress and bolstered immune systems. But less is known about the link between meditation and brain structure.

In the study, Luders and her colleagues examined 44 people — 22 control subjects and 22 who had practiced various forms of meditation, including Zazen, Samatha and Vipassana, among others. The amount of time they had practiced ranged from five to 46 years, with an average of 24 years.

More than half of all the meditators said that deep concentration was an essential part of their practice, and most meditated between 10 and 90 minutes every day.

The researchers used a high-resolution, three-dimensional form of MRI and two different approaches to measure differences in brain structure. One approach automatically divides the brain into several regions of interest, allowing researchers to compare the size of certain brain structures. The other segments the brain into different tissue types, allowing researchers to compare the amount of gray matter within specific regions of the brain.

The researchers found significantly larger cerebral measurements in meditators compared with controls, including larger volumes of the right hippocampus and increased gray matter in the right orbito-frontal cortex, the right thalamus and the left inferior temporal lobe. There were no regions where controls had significantly larger volumes or more gray matter than meditators.

Because these areas of the brain are closely linked to emotion, Luders said, "these might be the neuronal underpinnings that give meditators' the outstanding ability to regulate their emotions and allow for well-adjusted responses to whatever life throws their way."

What's not known, she said, and will require further study, are what the specific correlates are on a microscopic level — that is, whether it's an increased number of neurons, the larger size of the neurons or a particular "wiring" pattern meditators may develop that other people don't.

Because this was not a longitudinal study — which would have tracked meditators from the time they began meditating onward — it's possible that the meditators already had more regional gray matter and volume in specific areas; that may have attracted them to meditation in the first place, Luders said.

However, she also noted that numerous previous studies have pointed to the brain's remarkable plasticity and how environmental enrichment has been shown to change brain structure.

Other authors of the study included Arthur Toga, director of UCLA Laboratory of Neuro Imaging; Natasha Lepore of UCLA; and Christian Gaser of the University of Jena in Germany. Funding for the study was provided by the National Institutes of Health. The authors report no conflicts of interest.
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#17 jackinbox

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Posted 13 May 2009 - 12:15 AM

I think there are ways of temporarily overcoming the distraction, which tinnitus creates, by maybe using a pair of headphones with tinnitus sounds (something else, that masks it).
When there is "tinnitus balance" in the ears, the mind will probably not percieve it as hostile and will find it easier to relax.
I sound a bit foggy here, but for example: If you have tinnitus in one ear you become very much aware of that ear. If there is tinnitus in both ears then it still is very annoying, but a bit more logical for the mind to tackle. "so the left ear is broken... ah... yes... and so is the right". (two eyes, two feet, two tinnitus)
If creating a tinnitus tone via an external source, identical in frequency to the one you are hearing, then chances are that you will manage to do a bit of tinnitus de-drama. Your tinnitus in headphones might cut you enough slack, to better be able to meditate. Could be worth trying =)

I don´t think everyone knows what meditation really is, and neither do I. There are a lot of different branches, and just lying in bed not thinking is relaxation, but not necessarily meditation.
"see your thoughts, but do not let them blind you". My way of describing it. Could be "wrong" also :)



Hello,

I started various typed of meditation back in 97 but havent been able to do it all since 99 sue to chronic health problems which have only gotten worse - something I find quite difficult given how much I got out of it.

Tinnitus is one of my more problems , iornically from trying to treat the neuropathy like symptoms in my legs that put a halt on meditation .

The only thing I found that has worked very well in dealing with that is pscliocybin ( something that helps cluster heaches too apparently ).

The other thing I had that helped was tmj shots using anaesthetic .

tepol


Psilocybin helps with your tinnitus? Does it helps at sub-psychedelic dosage or you have to be completely stone?

#18 wooty

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Posted 15 May 2009 - 05:09 PM

It seems like the last time I tried Bacopa that it was slightly overstimulating, perhaps I should try it at a lower dosage. I've always found that Gotu Kola was an excellent meditation supplement.

#19 tepol

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 04:42 AM

I think there are ways of temporarily overcoming the distraction, which tinnitus creates, by maybe using a pair of headphones with tinnitus sounds (something else, that masks it).
When there is "tinnitus balance" in the ears, the mind will probably not percieve it as hostile and will find it easier to relax.
I sound a bit foggy here, but for example: If you have tinnitus in one ear you become very much aware of that ear. If there is tinnitus in both ears then it still is very annoying, but a bit more logical for the mind to tackle. "so the left ear is broken... ah... yes... and so is the right". (two eyes, two feet, two tinnitus)
If creating a tinnitus tone via an external source, identical in frequency to the one you are hearing, then chances are that you will manage to do a bit of tinnitus de-drama. Your tinnitus in headphones might cut you enough slack, to better be able to meditate. Could be worth trying =)

I don´t think everyone knows what meditation really is, and neither do I. There are a lot of different branches, and just lying in bed not thinking is relaxation, but not necessarily meditation.
"see your thoughts, but do not let them blind you". My way of describing it. Could be "wrong" also ;)



Hello,

I started various typed of meditation back in 97 but havent been able to do it all since 99 sue to chronic health problems which have only gotten worse - something I find quite difficult given how much I got out of it.

Tinnitus is one of my more problems , iornically from trying to treat the neuropathy like symptoms in my legs that put a halt on meditation .

The only thing I found that has worked very well in dealing with that is pscliocybin ( something that helps cluster heaches too apparently ).

The other thing I had that helped was tmj shots using anaesthetic .

tepol


Psilocybin helps with your tinnitus? Does it helps at sub-psychedelic dosage or you have to be completely stone?


Well when I took it , I was beyond stoned .. I basically had a very intense scary trip

#20 john16

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 04:57 AM

wow, I am glad this topic was brought back to life because meditation is something im becoming interested in. If the OP is still around, what type of meditation were/are you practicing?

#21 mentatpsi

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 06:00 AM

wow, I am glad this topic was brought back to life because meditation is something im becoming interested in. If the OP is still around, what type of meditation were/are you practicing?


I haven't meditated in awhile though I do keep intending to. If anyone else has experiences I too would be interested in reading them.

#22 brian101

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Posted 05 June 2010 - 04:27 AM

I have to say that I love meditating and try to do 10-15 minutes a day. Usually I have my back straight and my legs crossed and I look in a mirror. Then I close my eyes and breath through my nose and concentrate on my breathing. During this time randomly things will cross my mind and I will think about them intensely. One thing that I enjoy during meditation after so long different parts of my body start to go numb or tingle. Its really a nice feeling. Plan to meditate whenever I get a chance from now on. Truly a great nootropic to say the least.

#23 outsider

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Posted 05 June 2010 - 08:43 AM

Bacopa and Gotu kola are both called brahmi and have been used since thousands of years to aid in meditation. Brahmi is named after one of the highest states of consciousness (Brahman or God Consciousness) and is thus revered as one of the most powerful and spiritual herbs in Ayurveda.

The first time I used bacopa I noticed something on the top of my head and found that intriguing. I later found out that bacopa develops the crown chakra. In my experience Gotu kola is even more pronounced, but YMMV.

#24 bobman

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Posted 05 June 2010 - 05:07 PM

Background
Throughout much of my recent years i have really valued meditation, i have always seen it as a solution to whatever problem i seemed to be having... whether this is depression, or mental limitations... it has always benefited me in one way or another. It is safe, simple, and extremely effective for something that is so readily available... the only thing required is patience and discipline. Throughout much of my practice of it i have seen a major decrease in ADHD type behavior, maximizing the amount of concentration i can place on any given activity. Effects i have seen are increasing photographic memory, lucid imagination, better control over body, destruction of most comfort inducing beliefs, increasing rationality, and simply enjoying and exploring life more. The list goes on and there is no negative effects i have seen with it.

I have recently started adderall, which has tainted my progress but recent circumstances don't allow for other choices... but my overall preference in nootropics has to be a combination of herbs and meditation, since it allows for consistency, with the occasional as needed synthetic nootropic blend.

The preference on nootropics and focusing on mainly the biological factors (yes, i know, mind is biological, but it is an input-output device) doesn't account for multi dimensional problems (e.g. the psychological conditions of your mental state). This deep seated belief that our culture is attaining that all problems must be solved immediately and with a pill taken every day is very silly, with the exception of the severe mental impairments. As i have said earlier i am not against nootropics, i quite frankly enjoy consciousness enhancements, i just believe that we are much more capable of change than we think and should explore every avenue of progression we can. There's also the issue that some of these things we're told to take every day we do not have enough information to know for certain how the combination will effect us later on in life, something very pertinent to life extension and better well being.

Research
Long-term meditators self-induce high-amplitude gamma synchrony during mental practice

Dana Foundation: Meditation May Change the Brain

Applied Psychophysiology & Biofeedback (aapb) Volume 32, number 3 Fall, 2004: Meditation: Elevating Consciousness, Improving Health
The article above looks a bit biased (and new agey in appearance) but is done by many PhD holders and is filled with references to actual scientific research regarding the brain.

Discussion
The main purpose of this thread is to have a public discussion for anyone that is interested in Meditation, has applied it to their lives and would like to share their experiences. I will add more research for those interested... google scholar stopped working so i have to delay additional links till later.


I think also that the combination of herbs and meditation allows for consistency, whereas the use of novel, synthesized compounds - of which nootropics are probably the most benign - muddies the waters and makes reaching your potential several times more difficult. That being said, up until ~June 2009 I used quite a bit of aniracetam, and it changed my mind in some ways that I think are useful. However, I would not consider saying that I made overall progress, it is too up and down, the differences in mental state between use and no use are too great. You encode memories and thought processes while on nootropics - and to a greater extent medications like adderall - that are almost inaccessible when you are clean. For whatever reason medicinal herbs, even ones that carry effect of equal or greater magnitude to synthetic cognitive enhancers do not have this problem. It is like eating food which, if you have a good diet contains components of medicinal substances. I think using herbal extracts is a bit more like the use of nootropics, while whole herbs are milder and completely unobtrusive. Yet there is some research that suggests that long term use can confer a significant, competitive advantage against those who do not take them. These herbs, such as turmeric, gotu kola, polygonum multiflorum, bacopa monnieri, possibly astragalus (also clitoria ternatea, which has really fantastic animal studeis behind it, but it seems impossible to find) are rejuvenatory, brain health maintaining, and proliferation enhancing (so enhancing encoding as well), but meditation (or at the least strong mental activity, like in demanding creative jobs, and especially in difficult university) makes the far larger difference in actually achieving that potential. The herbs/foods enhance the structure, but meditation fills it with brick, mortar, and allows for a beautiful design. This is the wall of text, hope you can read through.

Edited by bobmann, 05 June 2010 - 05:16 PM.

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#25 kertel

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 11:19 PM

I too have had great experiences with meditation. I remember after having finished a 1-week vipassana, that every sensory aspect of reality was enhanced. Visually, everything was very crisp and beautiful. Living in the moment was much more intense. Food tasted much better etc.

When I came home and had to do some studying, it was like the easiest task ever. Information was absorbed in a fast and natural feeling kind of way. It was great, and I felt great mentally. While doing sports (I practice capoeira) , everything I did was so natural, well coordinated and authentic. Sadly the effects slowly waned off after a week. (mainly because of procrastinating, and alcohol at parties - I'm a student in university)

I recently found this forum, and find nootropics very interesting. Last week I experimented with piracetam + cdp choline, and found that it had some really good effects. Mood elevation, better focus, and sharper vocally. I also did some meditating. This time it was Kundalini Yoga meditation, specifically the "Kirtan Kriya". It was fantastic.

It was much more intense, deep, focused and I felt absolutely great afterwards.

I strongly believe that the combination of nootropics and meditation can do wonders for my life.
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#26 kache

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Posted 08 May 2011 - 01:03 AM

Extremely interesting topic.
I did some meditation myself a couple of years ago, but, except from emotional control, I didn't get real nootropic advantages from it.
Though, meditating while on piracetam did help me achieve a better calm and focus later, so I guess it depends on the person and on the stack.

#27 GoingPrimal

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Posted 23 August 2011 - 09:08 PM

Great posts everyone.

I actually came upon this website while researching nootropics to enhance meditation and life in general. Of the nootropics I've tried so far, piracetam, aniracetam and phenibut, I can say they are great for cognitive enhancement but make my mind a bit too "different" for meditation. Subtler herbs like ashwagandha, gotu kola and especially tulsi have been of great help to my meditation however. The herbs are more subtle and aid in meditation while the big boys help me stay sharp on my feet at work.

I agree with the OP, that meditation really is the best nootropic. For anyone interested the book Mastering the Core Teachings of the Buddha is an excellent book on how to meditate, with instructions and maps on the progress of samatha (concentration) and vipassana (insight) meditation. It's available to read online in a pdf format , but of course it's always nice to be generous and buy a copy to support the author.

#28 Introspecta

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Posted 24 August 2011 - 05:01 PM

Piracetam is the best for meditation. I don't do much sitting meditation but i do more of a contemplation and staying in the moment throughout my day, especially at work when i don't need to think and can just do. Piracetam has definetly helped quiet my mind and makes it more enjoyable to feel the peace of silence. It also increases color brightness so it adds to viewing pleasure. I find meditation much more easier when i am taking piracetam, which somewhat scares me because i don't want to be dependent on a drug for my awareness so it good practice, to practice meditation without the piracetam.

#29 nito

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Posted 24 August 2011 - 11:32 PM

I have to say that I love meditating and try to do 10-15 minutes a day. Usually I have my back straight and my legs crossed and I look in a mirror. Then I close my eyes and breath through my nose and concentrate on my breathing. During this time randomly things will cross my mind and I will think about them intensely. One thing that I enjoy during meditation after so long different parts of my body start to go numb or tingle. Its really a nice feeling. Plan to meditate whenever I get a chance from now on. Truly a great nootropic to say the least.


why do u look in a mirror then close your eyes?
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#30 nito

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Posted 24 August 2011 - 11:35 PM

Background
Throughout much of my recent years i have really valued meditation, i have always seen it as a solution to whatever problem i seemed to be having... whether this is depression, or mental limitations... it has always benefited me in one way or another. It is safe, simple, and extremely effective for something that is so readily available... the only thing required is patience and discipline. Throughout much of my practice of it i have seen a major decrease in ADHD type behavior, maximizing the amount of concentration i can place on any given activity. Effects i have seen are increasing photographic memory, lucid imagination, better control over body, destruction of most comfort inducing beliefs, increasing rationality, and simply enjoying and exploring life more. The list goes on and there is no negative effects i have seen with it.

I have recently started adderall, which has tainted my progress but recent circumstances don't allow for other choices... but my overall preference in nootropics has to be a combination of herbs and meditation, since it allows for consistency, with the occasional as needed synthetic nootropic blend.

The preference on nootropics and focusing on mainly the biological factors (yes, i know, mind is biological, but it is an input-output device) doesn't account for multi dimensional problems (e.g. the psychological conditions of your mental state). This deep seated belief that our culture is attaining that all problems must be solved immediately and with a pill taken every day is very silly, with the exception of the severe mental impairments. As i have said earlier i am not against nootropics, i quite frankly enjoy consciousness enhancements, i just believe that we are much more capable of change than we think and should explore every avenue of progression we can. There's also the issue that some of these things we're told to take every day we do not have enough information to know for certain how the combination will effect us later on in life, something very pertinent to life extension and better well being.

Research
Long-term meditators self-induce high-amplitude gamma synchrony during mental practice

Dana Foundation: Meditation May Change the Brain

Applied Psychophysiology & Biofeedback (aapb) Volume 32, number 3 Fall, 2004: Meditation: Elevating Consciousness, Improving Health
The article above looks a bit biased (and new agey in appearance) but is done by many PhD holders and is filled with references to actual scientific research regarding the brain.

Discussion
The main purpose of this thread is to have a public discussion for anyone that is interested in Meditation, has applied it to their lives and would like to share their experiences. I will add more research for those interested... google scholar stopped working so i have to delay additional links till later.


so what kind of meditation do you do? Like just breath in and out? Please let us know :)




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