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Piracetam/Choline Dosages and Effects


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Poll: What quantity of piracetam and choline do/did you take daily? (116 member(s) have cast votes)

Piracetam Dosage Per Day:

  1. <500mg (2 votes [1.72%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.72%

  2. 500mg-1g (22 votes [18.97%])

    Percentage of vote: 18.97%

  3. >1g-2g (40 votes [34.48%])

    Percentage of vote: 34.48%

  4. >2g (52 votes [44.83%])

    Percentage of vote: 44.83%

Choline Dosage Per Day:

  1. <250mg (9 votes [7.76%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.76%

  2. 250mg-300mg (22 votes [18.97%])

    Percentage of vote: 18.97%

  3. >300mg-500mg (26 votes [22.41%])

    Percentage of vote: 22.41%

  4. >500mg (39 votes [33.62%])

    Percentage of vote: 33.62%

  5. No choline supplementation undertaken. (12 votes [10.34%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.34%

  6. Method of supplementation not applicable to poll options. (8 votes [6.90%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.90%

Did Increased Quantity of Dosage Result in Increased Nootropic Effect?

  1. Yes. (32 votes [27.59%])

    Percentage of vote: 27.59%

  2. No. (23 votes [19.83%])

    Percentage of vote: 19.83%

  3. Uncertain/Did not differ dosage. (61 votes [52.59%])

    Percentage of vote: 52.59%

How Many Times Per Day Did You Take Piracetam?

  1. Once per day. (25 votes [21.55%])

    Percentage of vote: 21.55%

  2. Twice per day. (60 votes [51.72%])

    Percentage of vote: 51.72%

  3. Three times a day. (29 votes [25.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 25.00%

  4. More than three times a day. (2 votes [1.72%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.72%

How Would You Characterize The Overall Effects Of Piracetam Upon You?

  1. Positive. (71 votes [61.21%])

    Percentage of vote: 61.21%

  2. Negative. (3 votes [2.59%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.59%

  3. Both positive and negative. (23 votes [19.83%])

    Percentage of vote: 19.83%

  4. Indeterminate, ineffable or negligible. (19 votes [16.38%])

    Percentage of vote: 16.38%

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#1 dumbdumb

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Posted 08 June 2008 - 06:40 PM


Hello!

Well, I know full well that the widely divergent answers to these various questions are "out there" on the forum - but the point is that they're not in one place, organized and clearly counted. I couldn't find any thread that addressed those specific deficient qualities, so I thought a thread undertaken for that purpose would prove quite useful for everyone, (especially newbies like myself) ergo...

Please post your responses to the poll and describe your experience. If you experimented with different dosages, then please respond to the poll's options according to the dosages and practices that you feel worked best for you.

As for me, I've only been on it about two weeks. The effect has been subtle - but successively greater, "wider" in terms of effects and more distinctly felt. I am taking about 1g, once per day, in the morning, about thirty minutes after taking 250mg of CDP-Choline. The greatest immediate effect was felt upon first taking piracetam. In days following the first experience, the effect seemed to ebb - but now it's gradually returning, with a sense of staying power rather than a "quick boost." I seem much more perceptive, and make decisions more quickly, an am better able to read and study - but I do notice that I tend more often now to speak (or even type) ill-chosen words or words that are phonetically similar to what I intended to voice. This is occurring with lessening frequency, however.

Edited by dumbdumb, 08 June 2008 - 06:41 PM.


#2 dopamine

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Posted 11 June 2008 - 03:00 AM

Hello!

Well, I know full well that the widely divergent answers to these various questions are "out there" on the forum - but the point is that they're not in one place, organized and clearly counted. I couldn't find any thread that addressed those specific deficient qualities, so I thought a thread undertaken for that purpose would prove quite useful for everyone, (especially newbies like myself) ergo...

Please post your responses to the poll and describe your experience. If you experimented with different dosages, then please respond to the poll's options according to the dosages and practices that you feel worked best for you.

As for me, I've only been on it about two weeks. The effect has been subtle - but successively greater, "wider" in terms of effects and more distinctly felt. I am taking about 1g, once per day, in the morning, about thirty minutes after taking 250mg of CDP-Choline. The greatest immediate effect was felt upon first taking piracetam. In days following the first experience, the effect seemed to ebb - but now it's gradually returning, with a sense of staying power rather than a "quick boost." I seem much more perceptive, and make decisions more quickly, an am better able to read and study - but I do notice that I tend more often now to speak (or even type) ill-chosen words or words that are phonetically similar to what I intended to voice. This is occurring with lessening frequency, however.


I'm taking 2.4 g Piracetam with 500 mg choline bitartrate and 250 mg Citicholine (CDP-Choline), and I believe there is a synergy (though I can't discount a placebo effect). One of the commons myths surrounding Piracetam is that it somehow "depletes" choline levels, and that a choline source is "necessary" in piracetam use, especially if side-effects appear. James South's article on Piracetam was conflated from a possible synergy to an absolute necessity in positive effects with respect to the use of a choline source with piracetam.

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#3 jokerthief

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Posted 12 June 2008 - 12:20 AM

I'm taking 2.4 g Piracetam with 500 mg choline bitartrate and 250 mg Citicholine (CDP-Choline), and I believe there is a synergy (though I can't discount a placebo effect). One of the commons myths surrounding Piracetam is that it somehow &quot;depletes&quot; choline levels, and that a choline source is &quot;necessary&quot; in piracetam use, especially if side-effects appear. James South's <a href="http://www.smart-nut...-piracetam.htm" target="_blank">article</a> on Piracetam was conflated from a possible synergy to an absolute necessity in positive effects with respect to the use of a choline source with piracetam.


Why do you take both CDP and bitarate ? I just got my shipment of CDP today and was planning on just ceasing to take the bitarate.

Edited by chrono, 25 August 2010 - 03:52 PM.
formatting


#4 dopamine

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Posted 12 June 2008 - 01:20 AM

Why do you take both CDP and bitarate ? I just got my shipment of CDP today and was planning on just ceasing to take the bitarate.


Choline is a good nutrient, and in some cases is synergistic with substances like ALCAR. CDP-choline is a nucleotide with a number of functions on neuronal cells and is reported to have a choline-sparing effect on stores of existing choline. Taking both seems to be cover the bases, so to speak, of metabolic choline and phosphatidylcholine levels, but certainly isn't an absolute necessity.

#5 jokerthief

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Posted 12 June 2008 - 02:08 AM

Choline is a good nutrient, and in some cases is synergistic with substances like ALCAR. CDP-choline is a nucleotide with a number of functions on neuronal cells and is reported to have a choline-sparing effect on stores of existing choline. Taking both seems to be cover the bases, so to speak, of metabolic choline and phosphatidylcholine levels, but certainly isn't an absolute necessity.


I was taking 500 mg of the bitarate but was planning on just taking 250 mg of CDP. Is 250 mg enough CDP or would 500 mg be better?

Edited by jokerthief, 12 June 2008 - 02:10 AM.


#6 dopamine

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Posted 12 June 2008 - 04:02 AM

Choline is a good nutrient, and in some cases is synergistic with substances like ALCAR. CDP-choline is a nucleotide with a number of functions on neuronal cells and is reported to have a choline-sparing effect on stores of existing choline. Taking both seems to be cover the bases, so to speak, of metabolic choline and phosphatidylcholine levels, but certainly isn't an absolute necessity.


I was taking 500 mg of the bitarate but was planning on just taking 250 mg of CDP. Is 250 mg enough CDP or would 500 mg be better?


250 mg/day is what I do, and I think it's plenty. You'll need a lot less citicholine than choline bitartrate if you're replacing one with the other.

#7 dopamine

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Posted 26 June 2008 - 03:17 AM

Not that I mind, but why does my last post in this thread keep getting bumped up?

Edit: nevermind, I imagine that poll threads are bumped up each time voting takes place.

Edited by dopamine, 26 June 2008 - 03:20 AM.


#8 bgwithadd

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Posted 16 August 2008 - 06:12 AM

oxi 800 2x
pir 1000 2x
ani 500 2x
+ several grams of choline sources

If I take a lot of ani then I get kind of like I want to shout "BOOYAH!". Other than that, no obvious effect from taking any of it, but I am having some cognitive improvement over time but I take several meds and oter supplements so I am not sure what's doing what. Ones my meds stabilize I will try adding and removing more methodically to test my results better.

#9 Advanc3d

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Posted 18 August 2008 - 10:14 PM

i take 4g of piracetam in 2 divided doses perday
with 4g of Choline Bitartrate + B5 and some ALCAR

#10 Ben

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Posted 19 August 2008 - 02:55 AM

Piracetam 2.4 grams; and
CDP-Choline 500mg,
Both with food and in the morning.

Lunch:

Piracetam 800mg
CDP-Choline 250mg

750mg of choline throughout the day.

Probably too much.

#11 andyr300

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Posted 21 August 2008 - 09:44 PM

Piracetam - 800mg 3x
Choline Citrate - 350mg 3x

I've taken Piracetam on and off since march. It's always up and down although I have not been consistent on my doses. The up parts are when I take time off of them and dig in on a dose. The down parts are when I'm on the wrong side of the inverted U, which always happens when I stay on it for a moderate period of time. While on that period, each day goes by feeling worse than the day before.

Some days I take it, I feel tired then great on its after-life period. I've also tried lowering the Piracetam dose (sometimes the choline as well) when I start feeling tired, which helped until that dose made me tired (as low as 100mg/3x).

I've tried another source of choline, Alpha GPC, which did little to nothing for me compared to the Citrate. Might try to stay consistent with a low dose and see how it goes (ex. Piracetam: 300mg/3x, Choline Citrate: 100mg/3x).

Another note, Aniracetam was great when I first tried it (700mg), then made me genuinely angry after subsequent uses. Might try it again with lower doses.

#12 health_nutty

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 10:32 PM

I've just noticed that i'm no longer sensitive to Piracetam once I upped my ALCAR dosage to 4g a day. Previously doses larger than 400mg would make me irritable (noticeable and 800mg and bad anything above). At 1.6g of Piracetam twice a day with 4G of ALCAR i'm finally noticing some positive results. Focus is improved, I feel like i'm in the "zone". Lets hope this continues

#13 Duster

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 01:10 AM

20 year old, 160lb, male. Physically and mentally above average (physically fit from non-stop involvement in sports since age 7, 36 ACT, National Merit Scholar, etc..)

I started out with:
Piracetam 1.5g twice a day
Vitamin B5 250mg once a day (was taking before and noticed nice improvement in energy, but 500mg doses didn't let me sleep)

The first dose was like a good dose of ritalin (seems to happen to most people). I took the doses 5 hours apart. Subsequent doses made me really sleepy, so I cut it down to:
Piracetam 800mg twice a day
B5 250mg once a day


After a couple days I started getting headaches and became tired again, so I threw in DMAE which helped the tiredness and headaches. I started taking 200mg with each dose (400mg per day), but this gave me a bit of insomnia too, so I cut it down to 100mg with each dose:
Piracetam 800mg twice a day
DMAE 100mg twice a day
B5 250mg once a day

I wanted to continue being a bit sharper later into the evening, so I added a third dose of piracetam another 5 hours after the second (no DMAE with this one for fear of insomnia). I also recently started taking 1g of ALCAR twice daily, in the same pattern as the DMAE for the same reason.

Final stack:
Piracetam 800mg thrice a day
DMAE 100mg twice a day
ALCAR 1g twice a day
B5 250mg once a day
(multivitamin and omega 3 as well; don't count those)

I feel like piracetam has improved my sensory ability a bit (slightly sharper images, more vivid smells), though it has had some funny effects too, like increased sensitivity to bass for some reason (all music is a bit more vivid, but I've had to turn down my subwoofer as well as turning down the bass dial in my car stereo).

I can think faster and can focus for longer periods of time, but this focus can be hard to control. A more accurate word could be momentum. For instance, when I am browsing forums, I open up a bunch of topics in separate tabs then go through them. I can actually sit and stare at the screen for hours on end if I just keep grinding through articles and posts. But as soon as there is a natural breaking point (run out of tabs, get to a new chapter in a book), I am a lot more likely to get distracted and stay distracted. My daydreams are just too cool to ignore now lol

One of the best parts is increased energy. The B5 was rather nice for this, and the piracetam seems to help a bit too. Even after the toughest karate classes, I feel like I could go for another. I'm doing a bit of weight lifting for the summer, and after I started taking these two, I've had to start bumping up the weight a bit more often. I feel like a god at the end of a workout. The ALCAR gives me a bit more energy too, but this is only from what I have seen from taking it for a few days with little physical activity.

However, piracetam has made me more irritable too. I have a habit of looking down on others, but I know I can learn a lot from people and have some fun with them too, so I was usually very tolerant. After I started taking piracetam, every once in a while I get legitimately angry at someone. This is usually when they directly get in the way of my goals, but getting mad rarely helps matters, so even this is too much by my standards. Also, I used to rarely worry about anything, but (after starting P) sometimes I find myself disturbingly anxious if I have several deadlines coming up (self imposed or otherwise).

I think both of these things can be remedied with a bit of self control (I'm a big supporter of mental discipline in lieu of meds, especially after seeing so many lazy friends going for ADD pills instead of learning to focus), but the ALCAR seems to be helping quite a bit. I've been taking care of my little (single digits) cousins for the past few days; these kids are a giant pain in the butt as far as time and energy drains go, but I haven't gotten mad even once. Some people on the board have reported that ALCAR remedies their need for a choline source; the next step would be to try to phase out DMAE.

#14 rvdvaart

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 02:42 AM

Is it too much choline or piracatem that makes you mildly depressed? I've been taking Piracetam and CDP-Choline for about 2 weeks now and I notice that I'm starting to feel a little bit moody/depressed. I think I'll remove the choline source and see what happens.

#15 health_nutty

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Posted 11 August 2010 - 04:04 PM

Still having good results at 1.6g of Piracetam twice a day with 4G of ALCAR.

#16 Animal

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Posted 03 September 2010 - 08:14 PM

Is it too much choline or piracatem that makes you mildly depressed? I've been taking Piracetam and CDP-Choline for about 2 weeks now and I notice that I'm starting to feel a little bit moody/depressed. I think I'll remove the choline source and see what happens.


Typically it's too much choline, but Piracetam always had the effect of depressing mood for me.

#17 RubyAnn

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 06:26 AM

Does anyone use Jarrow Neuro Optimizer or a similar product to supplement their Piracetam?
http://www.iherb.com...psules/350?at=0

I'm wondering if it would be sufficient and I'd really like it to be as it also includes ALCAR (hmm and ALA actually.. would this affect the ALCAR in it negatively?)

#18 chrono

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 09:48 PM

^^ It should work. It has 300mg CDP-choline, 100mg Phosphatidylserine, and 500mg ALCAR in 4 caps. I would get a headache from that combination of ALCAR and CDP, but some people are fine with it. I would recommend trying ALCAR and maybe choline bitartrate separately, so you can adjust them as needed. It will almost certainly be cheaper, as well.

#19 BlueCloud

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 11:03 PM

Choline has never helped with the increased brainfog i get from Piracetam. I tried everything , Alpha-GPC , CDP , lecithin , eggs , in various dosages and it never made a single difference. In the end, i dropped the choline and simply lowered the dose of Piracetam , wich also lowered the brainfog , although it never really goes away . I take around 400 to 800 mg a day. I must say however that i never took piracetam on a regular basis , just experimenting a couple of days here and then. I will start taking it regularly soon, maybe the brainfog will subside by itself.

#20 owls

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Posted 29 March 2011 - 04:53 AM

has anyone been on piracetam for extended periods of time, say years? also, when using racetams daily do you ever find it necessary to cycle?

#21 kache

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Posted 06 May 2011 - 05:36 PM

has anyone been on piracetam for extended periods of time, say years? also, when using racetams daily do you ever find it necessary to cycle?

I've been on Piracetam+Lecithine for 2 years (6 months on - 6 months off - 6 months on - 6 months off).
What do you mean with "necessary to cycle"?

#22 Neurotik

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Posted 30 July 2011 - 08:57 PM

has anyone been on piracetam for extended periods of time, say years? also, when using racetams daily do you ever find it necessary to cycle?

I've been on Piracetam+Lecithine for 2 years (6 months on - 6 months off - 6 months on - 6 months off).
What do you mean with "necessary to cycle"?


It looks like that's what you've been doing, more or less. Though your cycles are fairly extended.

#23 Mikael Llerena

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Posted 26 October 2011 - 11:01 PM

I actually have a question regarding dosages for these things: Are there any adverse effects from taking too much choline, or are the negative effects limited to taking too little??

#24 JChief

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Posted 28 October 2011 - 12:17 PM

Lots of people report choline making them feel somewhat depressed. I wouldn't worry about taking ANY choline with your racetams unless you develop a bad headache. But if you eat eggs regularly then you are already doing OK on choline I'd think. I used to think choline was the "fuel" for those racetams to burn. But I haven't ever had a headache when taking piracetam at 2.4g 2-3 times per day with no choline. Now I do eat eggs regularly so I should note that. I starting taking Alpha GPC (great choline source but a bit pricey) because it has a nootropic action for me plus it support GH (I life weights). I take 500mg per day of it. But if you do take Alpha GPC I would recommend the pure form (99%). Douglas Labs sells a great form of it as does Cerebral Health. Choline bitartrate is the cheapest and least effective form of choline. Choline citrate would be a better bet (Perque brand is a good choice). But as I said earlier I'm convinced choline for most is probably just a waste of money.

Edited by JChief, 28 October 2011 - 12:22 PM.


#25 JChief

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Posted 28 October 2011 - 12:24 PM

Is it too much choline or piracatem that makes you mildly depressed? I've been taking Piracetam and CDP-Choline for about 2 weeks now and I notice that I'm starting to feel a little bit moody/depressed. I think I'll remove the choline source and see what happens.


That's exactly what I'd recommend. Choline just isn't the necessity that many people assume IMHO.

#26 adiosameobas

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Posted 29 October 2011 - 03:14 AM

20 year old, 160lb, male. Physically and mentally above average (physically fit from non-stop involvement in sports since age 7, 36 ACT, National Merit Scholar, etc..)


However, piracetam has made me more irritable too. I have a habit of looking down on others, but I know I can learn a lot from people and have some fun with them too, so I was usually very tolerant. After I started taking piracetam, every once in a while I get legitimately angry at someone. This is usually when they directly get in the way of my goals, but getting mad rarely helps matters, so even this is too much by my standards. Also, I used to rarely worry about anything, but (after starting P) sometimes I find myself disturbingly anxious if I have several deadlines coming up (self imposed or otherwise).

I think both of these things can be remedied with a bit of self control (I'm a big supporter of mental discipline in lieu of meds, especially after seeing so many lazy friends going for ADD pills instead of learning to focus), but the ALCAR seems to be helping quite a bit. I've been taking care of my little (single digits) cousins for the past few days; these kids are a giant pain in the butt as far as time and energy drains go, but I haven't gotten mad even once. Some people on the board have reported that ALCAR remedies their need for a choline source; the next step would be to try to phase out DMAE.



i have noticed this 'looking down' phenomenon while using piracetam.... today i almost lost it on a few people because they did something i now consider to be almost inconceivably stupid....literally something work related that has nothing to do with anything in real life. i had to literally step aside and cool myself down. normally im not this snappy. i take ALCAR too and i feel this helps with my mood for the most part, but i feel as my mental faculties are accelerating, (which is not just my own internal observation, it's been noted by several others over the past few months), during the course of the ALCAR, piracetam, armodafinil, Choline, supplementation. a high protein diet, and exercise and no alcohol or illegal drugs probably help too.... but i digress.
I find myself often saying, 'everyone else needs to be more like me, they are all so stupid!' but then realizing what im saying and telling my self to shut up and then snicker about it. I do feel that the piracetam helps me, I have sworn off amphetamines and other ADD meds, as i was fed them from a young age and feel they rotted some of my brain, now more and more of these 'idiots' are turning to them, and Shire can't even supply enough amphetamines to keep up with the demand! what is this?! glad i got off that train.

anyways, just my 2.

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#27 Mikels

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 12:00 AM

I become irritable too if i take the large dose of piracetam.
But if taken together with lecithin(choline doesn't work for this) - i am good to go)




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